Why do people hate islam?

[GregH37]

I am here to just say one thing? Why do YOU hate islam? and you should really give a valid reason not a shitty one that says 'Because media'
and Yes, I am a muslim for those who ask, just tell me, come out of your shell and say why you HATE it, and I could be here to clarify things to you.
Also here is something that most people mistake about islam is that "Islam hates other religions" for this I say, Islam does not hate ANY religion, but it suggests to 'invite' them to islam, as slowly, and peacefully, even if they refuse, you can try and try, until it's their choice, you stop. and for all the wars that happened, it's because the other religions decided to come into war on Islam.

If you need anything clarified, I am here to answer you, don't be scared, I won't be offended by anyone, also haters, you can reply, I won't care

 


A lot of country,a lot of people who are dying every day. Why ISIS kill people every day? How do you explain this? There are many reasons why people hate Islam, one of the biggest is ISIS . I 'm not sure that this is just politics. Isis does it all planned out, and nobody responsible for these acts. Worst of all is that your religion allows this, and they all work in the name of Allah . It's fascinating , and after wondering why people hate Islam?

For your kind information ISIS is not an Islamic organization.They are not muslims.Islam is against killing of people whether he/she is a muslim or non muslim so dear this is not a valid reason... Give another reason ?

[BADecker]

I am here to just say one thing? Why do YOU hate islam? and you should really give a valid reason not a shitty one that says 'Because media'
and Yes, I am a muslim for those who ask, just tell me, come out of your shell and say why you HATE it, and I could be here to clarify things to you.
Also here is something that most people mistake about islam is that "Islam hates other religions" for this I say, Islam does not hate ANY religion, but it suggests to 'invite' them to islam, as slowly, and peacefully, even if they refuse, you can try and try, until it's their choice, you stop. and for all the wars that happened, it's because the other religions decided to come into war on Islam.

If you need anything clarified, I am here to answer you, don't be scared, I won't be offended by anyone, also haters, you can reply, I won't care

 


A lot of country,a lot of people who are dying every day. Why ISIS kill people every day? How do you explain this? There are many reasons why people hate Islam, one of the biggest is ISIS . I 'm not sure that this is just politics. Isis does it all planned out, and nobody responsible for these acts. Worst of all is that your religion allows this, and they all work in the name of Allah . It's fascinating , and after wondering why people hate Islam?

For your kind information ISIS is not an Islamic organization.They are not muslims.Islam is against killing of people whether he/she is a muslim or non muslim so dear this is not a valid reason... Give another reason ?

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

[GregH37]

I am here to just say one thing? Why do YOU hate islam? and you should really give a valid reason not a shitty one that says 'Because media'
and Yes, I am a muslim for those who ask, just tell me, come out of your shell and say why you HATE it, and I could be here to clarify things to you.
Also here is something that most people mistake about islam is that "Islam hates other religions" for this I say, Islam does not hate ANY religion, but it suggests to 'invite' them to islam, as slowly, and peacefully, even if they refuse, you can try and try, until it's their choice, you stop. and for all the wars that happened, it's because the other religions decided to come into war on Islam.

If you need anything clarified, I am here to answer you, don't be scared, I won't be offended by anyone, also haters, you can reply, I won't care

 


A lot of country,a lot of people who are dying every day. Why ISIS kill people every day? How do you explain this? There are many reasons why people hate Islam, one of the biggest is ISIS . I 'm not sure that this is just politics. Isis does it all planned out, and nobody responsible for these acts. Worst of all is that your religion allows this, and they all work in the name of Allah . It's fascinating , and after wondering why people hate Islam?

For your kind information ISIS is not an Islamic organization.They are not muslims.Islam is against killing of people whether he/she is a muslim or non muslim so dear this is not a valid reason... Give another reason ?

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Terrorists are not Muslims. if they look like muslims and they said we are muslims then plz don't believe them. They are just terrorist not more than that. If you want to know Muslims then read translation of Quran, Read life history of Muhammad (SAW) not these stupid organization like ISIS..GOt it ??

[Buffer Overflow]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

[Spendulus]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

So, looking at the prior question (which the resident Muslims do not want to answer)...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?

I would not care to promote any of those.  It is indeed most curious, that while claiming knowledge of a moral and ethical code which governs minute details of their life, they cannot simply state which of these persons or organizations is or is not Muslim.

[Biomech]

I dn't know about cat steven but i just he is a singer so i dnt like him because singing is prohibited in Islam. Those who don't follow Islam, i dnt have any concern with them.
Ok May Allah increase your love with Cat stevens

Singing is prohibited? Can you back that with scripture?

I threw Yusef Islam (Cat Stevens) in that list because I thought he'd be the LEAST controversial in this discussion, as he has been a man of peace for his entire life, long before his conversion to Islam. Yet of all the people I listed as potentially true muslims, he's the one you deny.

And frankly, it is anti human to prohibit singing. In my own case, ceasing to sing would be denying the very essence of who I am. I am and have been since my earliest days a singer. Anything that denied me that is, to me, anathema of the lowest sort.

So, since you obviously have read what I said, and the only man you deny is Muslim is the one man in my list who has spent his ENTIRE adult life as an advocate of peace, I have to assume that you DO consider the others to be Muslim. Which is prima facie evidence that your other claims are false.

[Muhammed Zakir]

I dn't know about cat steven but i just he is a singer so i dnt like him because singing is prohibited in Islam. Those who don't follow Islam, i dnt have any concern with them.
Ok May Allah increase your love with Cat stevens

Singing is prohibited? Can you back that with scripture?

I threw Yusef Islam (Cat Stevens) in that list because I thought he'd be the LEAST controversial in this discussion, as he has been a man of peace for his entire life, long before his conversion to Islam. Yet of all the people I listed as potentially true muslims, he's the one you deny.

And frankly, it is anti human to prohibit singing. In my own case, ceasing to sing would be denying the very essence of who I am. I am and have been since my earliest days a singer. Anything that denied me that is, to me, anathema of the lowest sort.

So, since you obviously have read what I said, and the only man you deny is Muslim is the one man in my list who has spent his ENTIRE adult life as an advocate of peace, I have to assume that you DO consider the others to be Muslim. Which is prima facie evidence that your other claims are false.

Islam mainly prohibits music but it does not prohibit signing completely.

Widely agreed:

1. The kinds of singing which are unequivocally prohibited are those which contain the celebration of the material world and includes sexual connotation and that which is also inappropriate in speaking, e.g., swearing, sexually expletive language, and the like. In Fiqh this is usually referred to as Tarab.

2. The kinds of singing which are also unequivocally prohibited, are those that remove a person away from the worship and appropriate presence with Allah, e.g., leading a person to be involved with cross-gender mixing, lazing around (rather than taking a short break to relax from exhaustion. In such cases, as we will see below, there is permission to listen to musical matters that glorify Allah and praise the Prophet), ignoring one's rights and responsibilities, and the like.

3. Those kinds of singing which are unequivocally permitted are those which glorify Allah and praise the Prophet. Much can be said about this, but it will be a whole book! So in summary, this is usually taken to be permissible as a respite rather than the norm of "iPod in the ear 24/7". It is also permissible to have such appropriate singing of happiness (rather than directly about Allah and His Messenger) that soothe the heart in a Halal manner for festivals and weddings. These kinds of singing are usually referred to as inshad and sama'.

4. Those kinds of singing which are general, and are neither prohibited nor specifically about goodness and happiness (but may be e.g., about politics or environment, etc), the majority of Scholars hold that it is permissible only in its context rather than a habit to listen and enjoy. If it is habituated and leads an individual to ignore their rights and responsibilities, then it is not permitted.

About your "potentially true muslims": are you talking about the list of a few people which you posted when talking to GregH37? If you want, I can tell my opinion about 'em but the problem is some of the aspects of my opinion will be, like almost all, media-influenced -- which obviously is a mix of lie and truth.

[GregH37]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

So, looking at the prior question (which the resident Muslims do not want to answer)...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?

I would not care to promote any of those.  It is indeed most curious, that while claiming knowledge of a moral and ethical code which governs minute details of their life, they cannot simply state which of these persons or organizations is or is not Muslim.

ISIS is not an Islamic organiization..Imam Khomeni was a Muslim and i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

[GregH37]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

So, looking at the prior question (which the resident Muslims do not want to answer)...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?

I would not care to promote any of those.  It is indeed most curious, that while claiming knowledge of a moral and ethical code which governs minute details of their life, they cannot simply state which of these persons or organizations is or is not Muslim.

Qadafi
Gaddafi was a devout Muslim with his own take on Islam.
Ayatullah Khomeni
Political and Religious Leader

When Ha'iri died in the 1930s, the Ayatollah Boroujerdi succeeded him as the most important Islamic figure in Qom. As a result, Boroujerdi gained Khomeini as a follower. It is interesting to note that both Ha'iri and Boroujerdi believed that religion should not involve itself with government affairs. So, while the leader of Iran, Reza Shah, weakened the powers of religious leaders and promoted a more secularized country, the most powerful religious figures in Iran remained silent and encouraged their followers to do the same.

Moreover, the same deference was encouraged when Reza Shah's son, Mohammed Reza Pahlavi, turned to the U.S. for help quelling protests for democratic reforms in Iran's capital, Tehran, in the 1950s. One of those who were muted by the beliefs of the senior religious leaders was Khomeini.

Unable to speak out against what he saw as a country leaving its Islamic roots and values behind, Khomeini turned his efforts toward teaching. He began to cultivate a group of dedicated pupils who became his staunchest supporters during his days as an Islamic revolutionary. On March 31, 1961, Ayatollah Boroujerdi died and Khomeini was in a position to take up the mantle left by the late religious leader. After publishing his writings on Islamic science and doctrines, many Shi'ite Iranians began to see Khomeini as Marja-e Taqlid (a person to be imitated).

In 1962, Khomeini began protesting the intentions of the Shah in earnest. His first act of defiance was to organize the ulama (religious leaders) against a proposed law of the Shah's that would effectively end the requirement for elected officials to be sworn in on the Qu'ran. This action was just the beginning in a long string of events that would change Iranian politics forever.

In June 1963, Khomeini made a speech suggesting that if the Shah did not change the political direction of Iran, the populace would be happy to see him leave the country. As a result, Khomeini was arrested and held in prison. During his incarceration, people took to the streets with cries for his release, and were met by the government with military force. Even so, it was nearly a week before the unrest was resolved. Khomeini was held in prison until April 1964, when he was allowed to return to Qom.

The Shah continued to cultivate close ties with the United States, and to be what Khomeini considered "soft" on Israel. This prompted Khomeini to pronounce his belief that Jews would take over Iran and that the U.S. considered all Iranians to be little more than slaves to America's Western ideals. After delivering another inflammatory speech in the fall of 1964, Khomeini was arrested and deported to Turkey. Prevented by Turkish law from wearing the traditional clothes of a Shi'ite cleric and scholar, Khomeini took up residence in Najaf, Iraq in September 1965. He remained there for 13 years.

[BADecker]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

So, looking at the prior question (which the resident Muslims do not want to answer)...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?

I would not care to promote any of those.  It is indeed most curious, that while claiming knowledge of a moral and ethical code which governs minute details of their life, they cannot simply state which of these persons or organizations is or is not Muslim.

ISIS is not an Islamic organiization..Imam Khomeni was a Muslim and i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

Come on and put your thinking cap on. Who is a greater Muslim? The one who obeys only part of the Quran? Or one who obeys all of it?

The Quran dictates violence at times and peace at other times. Most of the violence is dictated against those who are not Muslim, or those who turn away from Islam. Most of the peace is dictated towards the Muslim brotherhood.

Now you tell me. Are peaceful Muslims following the Quran if they do no violence against non-Muslims? Maybe, somewhat. But they aren't the strong Muslims.

ISIS members are the strong Muslims because they do the violence directives found in the Quran, against non-Muslims, and against Muslims who fall away from the Islamic faith by not obeying the words of the Quran. They also uphold peace towards fellow, faithful Muslims, as well as towards those non-Muslims who are likely to convert to Islam.

It's you peaceful Muslims who are not truly Muslims. Or if you are, you are just barely so. Even if some great and popular Muslim holy people and leaders do not pick up the violence directives ordered in the Quran, they are weak Muslims.

Wake up about your religion.

[Spendulus]

... i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

Well known musician, he has been around since the 1970s...

Here is one of his well known works..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0TInLOJuUM

[saturn643]

I don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture,  also there are many more islamic kooks out there than christian though there are plenty of those, jewish, buddhist or whatever kooks. i don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture, but it's just true.

[Biomech]

... i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

Well known musician, he has been around since the 1970s...

Here is one of his well known works..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0TInLOJuUM

I think for this thread, Peace Train would be more appropriate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_X9eqYa6CQ

[Spendulus]

I don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture,  also there are many more islamic kooks out there than christian though there are plenty of those, jewish, buddhist or whatever kooks. i don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture, but it's just true.

That's actually very perceptive.  But maybe the Islamics think the same of us?  "Hey, look at all those Western kooks!  Look at the American kooks?"

I do not doubt that....

It's a question that could be explored in interesting ways, for example.  Who has more druggie and alcohol kooks?  Who has fanatical soccer fan kooks?  Which religion or culture has more bad driver kooks?

LOL...

[kuroman]

I am here to just say one thing? Why do YOU hate islam? and you should really give a valid reason not a shitty one that says 'Because media'
and Yes, I am a muslim for those who ask, just tell me, come out of your shell and say why you HATE it, and I could be here to clarify things to you.
Also here is something that most people mistake about islam is that "Islam hates other religions" for this I say, Islam does not hate ANY religion, but it suggests to 'invite' them to islam, as slowly, and peacefully, even if they refuse, you can try and try, until it's their choice, you stop. and for all the wars that happened, it's because the other religions decided to come into war on Islam.

If you need anything clarified, I am here to answer you, don't be scared, I won't be offended by anyone, also haters, you can reply, I won't care

 


A lot of country,a lot of people who are dying every day. Why ISIS kill people every day? How do you explain this? There are many reasons why people hate Islam, one of the biggest is ISIS . I 'm not sure that this is just politics. Isis does it all planned out, and nobody responsible for these acts. Worst of all is that your religion allows this, and they all work in the name of Allah . It's fascinating , and after wondering why people hate Islam?

Wait what? euh Islam doesn't allow killing, the only exception is self defense and death penalty by "Taer".

Maybe you don't know but the people that ISIS kills everyday are 99% Muslims.

A lot of ISIS recruits are not remotely muslims heck some of these Psychopaths don't even speak a work of arabic, but they come for the huge salaries (thousands of $ each months) and the free killing card

[Biomech]

I don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture,  also there are many more islamic kooks out there than christian though there are plenty of those, jewish, buddhist or whatever kooks. i don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture, but it's just true.

That's actually very perceptive.  But maybe the Islamics think the same of us?  "Hey, look at all those Western kooks!  Look at the American kooks?"

I do not doubt that....

It's a question that could be explored in interesting ways, for example.  Who has more druggie and alcohol kooks?  Who has fanatical soccer fan kooks?  Which religion or culture has more bad driver kooks?

LOL...

My thoughts have actually long gone down this path. I believe that some people are just going to be violent assholes. call it a defect, whatever. But certain polities, whether religious or otherwise, give them sanction, or at least appear to, and that exacerbates the problem.

Another problem endemic to relgion is the inconsistency of the holy writ. When a Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that they believe in a religion of peace, the odds are very high that they are not lying. When A Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that their scriptures call for the death of unbelievers, they STILL aren't lying. It's when they say one and deny the other that they are lying. Because according to their scriptures, both are true. Orwell shined a bright light on doublethink, he didn't invent the concept.

The Q'uran, in my limited reading of it, seems more internally consistent than either the Christian Bible or the Talmud, but not by a lot. I again maintain that the vast majority of religious people are good people, in spite of their religion. It's hard to trust people who are able to hold contradictory views as if they weren't, but I don't trust easily anyway. But the observable truth is that MOST religious people are not evil, even when at times their religion calls upon them to be. In a way I envy them. the fairy tales are comforting. But for me, the contradictions and doublethink proved impossible.

[GregH37]

Oh sure. If you look at the Islamic holy writings, you find plenty of directives to kill. It is the Muslims who are peaceful who are not following all the Islamic directives. You have to violent at times and peaceful at other times, just like ISIS, if you want to be a TRUE Muslim.

Telling muslims on here they can only be a true muslim if they act like ISIS, is not a good idea. It might be interpreted your promoting ISIS. You could find yourself in some serious hot water.

Just saying.

So, looking at the prior question (which the resident Muslims do not want to answer)...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?

I would not care to promote any of those.  It is indeed most curious, that while claiming knowledge of a moral and ethical code which governs minute details of their life, they cannot simply state which of these persons or organizations is or is not Muslim.

ISIS is not an Islamic organiization..Imam Khomeni was a Muslim and i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

Come on and put your thinking cap on. Who is a greater Muslim? The one who obeys only part of the Quran? Or one who obeys all of it?

The Quran dictates violence at times and peace at other times. Most of the violence is dictated against those who are not Muslim, or those who turn away from Islam. Most of the peace is dictated towards the Muslim brotherhood.

Now you tell me. Are peaceful Muslims following the Quran if they do no violence against non-Muslims? Maybe, somewhat. But they aren't the strong Muslims.

ISIS members are the strong Muslims because they do the violence directives found in the Quran, against non-Muslims, and against Muslims who fall away from the Islamic faith by not obeying the words of the Quran. They also uphold peace towards fellow, faithful Muslims, as well as towards those non-Muslims who are likely to convert to Islam.

It's you peaceful Muslims who are not truly Muslims. Or if you are, you are just barely so. Even if some great and popular Muslim holy people and leaders do not pick up the violence directives ordered in the Quran, they are weak Muslims.

Wake up about your religion.

A better Muslim is,  who obeys Quran as well as Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH). Quran says if your land is no safe from non muslims then fight against non muslims that is called JIHAD.

A peaceful muslim follow both Quran and Sunnah and they only fight for Islam if there is fight needed and their is no option except war.

ISIS members are not muslims. They said we are Muslims hten dont believe because Islam against this type of so called Jihad.

Kindly read what Islam is about..

[GregH37]

... i dnt know who is cat stevens and  i listen his name from your mouth...

Well known musician, he has been around since the 1970s...

Here is one of his well known works..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0TInLOJuUM

Cat Stevens was a well known Musician so what can i do..??
What is the purpose of his name here in this thread

[Spendulus]

I don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture,  also there are many more islamic kooks out there than christian though there are plenty of those, jewish, buddhist or whatever kooks. i don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture, but it's just true.

That's actually very perceptive.  But maybe the Islamics think the same of us?  "Hey, look at all those Western kooks!  Look at the American kooks?"

I do not doubt that....

It's a question that could be explored in interesting ways, for example.  Who has more druggie and alcohol kooks?  Who has fanatical soccer fan kooks?  Which religion or culture has more bad driver kooks?

LOL...

My thoughts have actually long gone down this path. I believe that some people are just going to be violent assholes. call it a defect, whatever. But certain polities, whether religious or otherwise, give them sanction, or at least appear to, and that exacerbates the problem.

Another problem endemic to relgion is the inconsistency of the holy writ. When a Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that they believe in a religion of peace, the odds are very high that they are not lying. When A Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that their scriptures call for the death of unbelievers, they STILL aren't lying. It's when they say one and deny the other that they are lying. Because according to their scriptures, both are true. Orwell shined a bright light on doublethink, he didn't invent the concept.

The Q'uran, in my limited reading of it, seems more internally consistent than either the Christian Bible or the Talmud, but not by a lot. I again maintain that the vast majority of religious people are good people, in spite of their religion. It's hard to trust people who are able to hold contradictory views as if they weren't, but I don't trust easily anyway. But the observable truth is that MOST religious people are not evil, even when at times their religion calls upon them to be. In a way I envy them. the fairy tales are comforting. But for me, the contradictions and doublethink proved impossible.

All good comments, but we are still not approaching clarification of the question...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?


I agree with you regarding what is "Not lying."  But still, if someone claims their religion dictates the very minutae of their personal behavior and life but cannot  or will not answer the above simple question, this is problematic.  It creates the impression literally of their inability to state what is and is not a muslim in practical real world terms.  This casts severe doubt on their claim that "Koran is perfect," "Islam is a religion of peace" and others.

Still, even when acknowledging a search for internal consistency and clarity in Islam is futile, a reluctance from the resident Muslim community to answer this question is unacceptable.

[GregH37]

I don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture,  also there are many more islamic kooks out there than christian though there are plenty of those, jewish, buddhist or whatever kooks. i don't know if it has to do with the religion or culture, but it's just true.

That's actually very perceptive.  But maybe the Islamics think the same of us?  "Hey, look at all those Western kooks!  Look at the American kooks?"

I do not doubt that....

It's a question that could be explored in interesting ways, for example.  Who has more druggie and alcohol kooks?  Who has fanatical soccer fan kooks?  Which religion or culture has more bad driver kooks?

LOL...

My thoughts have actually long gone down this path. I believe that some people are just going to be violent assholes. call it a defect, whatever. But certain polities, whether religious or otherwise, give them sanction, or at least appear to, and that exacerbates the problem.

Another problem endemic to relgion is the inconsistency of the holy writ. When a Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that they believe in a religion of peace, the odds are very high that they are not lying. When A Christian or a Jew or a Muslim say that their scriptures call for the death of unbelievers, they STILL aren't lying. It's when they say one and deny the other that they are lying. Because according to their scriptures, both are true. Orwell shined a bright light on doublethink, he didn't invent the concept.

The Q'uran, in my limited reading of it, seems more internally consistent than either the Christian Bible or the Talmud, but not by a lot. I again maintain that the vast majority of religious people are good people, in spite of their religion. It's hard to trust people who are able to hold contradictory views as if they weren't, but I don't trust easily anyway. But the observable truth is that MOST religious people are not evil, even when at times their religion calls upon them to be. In a way I envy them. the fairy tales are comforting. But for me, the contradictions and doublethink proved impossible.

All good comments, but we are still not approaching clarification of the question...

Is ISIS muslim?
Was Sayyid Qutb muslim?
Is the Muslim Brotherhood muslim?
Is Hamas Muslim?
Was Khadaffi a muslim?
Was Khomeini a muslim?
Is Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam a muslim?
Was Yasser Arafat a muslim?
Are the members of the House of Saud Muslims? (and if not, why are they charged with the protection of Mecca and Medina?)

Would you then be saying the True Muslims should act like Khadaffi, Khomeini, and Arafat but not ISIS?


I agree with you regarding what is "Not lying."  But still, if someone claims their religion dictates the very minutae of their personal behavior and life but cannot  or will not answer the above simple question, this is problematic.  It creates the impression literally of their inability to state what is and is not a muslim in practical real world terms.  This casts severe doubt on their claim that "Koran is perfect," "Islam is a religion of peace" and others.

Still, even when acknowledging a search for internal consistency and clarity in Islam is futile, a reluctance from the resident Muslim community to answer this question is unacceptable.

Khomeni did right !! Have you ever know what is the condition of Iran before Khomeni. Adultery, Alcohol, Gambling become a norm of the day. This is all against Islam and in my opinion Khomeni did right and if muslim land is no safe then Muslims have option of jihad.