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Author Topic: [Payout Updates] Bitcoinica site is taken offline for security investigation  (Read 145691 times)
Raoul Duke
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June 08, 2012, 01:28:36 AM
 #341

I know as much as Zhoutong really.

That's pretty disturbing.  While zhoutang not being privy to everything that is going on behind the scenes is understandable, it's hard to think of any positive reasons why you would be excluded from the loop.  

Who the hell does know what is happening and when are they going to announce how user funds will be returned?  This appalling lack of communication isn't just damaging the image of Bitcoinica - it's raising serious doubts about the competence of "The Intersango Guys" in general and tarnishing the reputations of their other business ventures.

@repentance: you seem to be pretty versed in court matters. PLEASE contact us by PM. Perhaps you can help us build our legal framework.

@Maria: I will be happy to work with you, and any other investor been owned a substantial amount.

We will go after the legal structures, and the individuals involved. I think it is time to bring some sort of accountability to the bitcoin world. It is not even about the money at this point, and those familiar with our company know we have the deep pockets and the infrastructure to make it happen.

I have already received 8 private messages from people interested in joining forces with us. Many of these are very well known Bitcoin players and companies. I will be having a series of meetings with the board this and next week to start putting the gears in motion.

Just a heads up, you should probably verify each account owner's integrity before you take any actions. Maria didn't even submit a claim. Working with people like that will only delay your legal process.

Do you have a database backup to "backup" your statement?
In other words, can you deny that youramoron@gmail.com had an account with bitcoinica?

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Vladimir
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June 08, 2012, 01:52:43 AM
 #342

Now as if we had not enough our own home grown trolls here, SA trolls are visiting too.

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bulanula
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June 08, 2012, 02:18:44 AM
 #343

Quote from: Maria
refunding so please Roberto, you have my full support.

Last, your unsecured claims process gives me a bad feeling of distrust. Consider my claim here public. Where is my money?

Who is Roberto ?

I thought Maria and Leo from coinexchanger were scammers but seems I am wrong Huh
Raoul Duke
aka psy
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June 08, 2012, 02:24:55 AM
 #344

Quote from: Maria
refunding so please Roberto, you have my full support.

Last, your unsecured claims process gives me a bad feeling of distrust. Consider my claim here public. Where is my money?

Who is Roberto ?

I thought Maria and Leo from coinexchanger were scammers but seems I am wrong Huh

Nah... How can maria be a scammer? "She" had 6k BTC and 50k USD in Bitcoinica Roll Eyes
Chump change, compared with the 200k USD I had on there.
Consider my claim made here in this public forum. I also find the claim form insecure(that SSL warning freaks me out) and I trust this MtGox hosted forum more than Bitcoinica

zhoutong
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June 08, 2012, 02:31:48 AM
 #345

I know as much as Zhoutong really.

That's pretty disturbing.  While zhoutang not being privy to everything that is going on behind the scenes is understandable, it's hard to think of any positive reasons why you would be excluded from the loop.  

Who the hell does know what is happening and when are they going to announce how user funds will be returned?  This appalling lack of communication isn't just damaging the image of Bitcoinica - it's raising serious doubts about the competence of "The Intersango Guys" in general and tarnishing the reputations of their other business ventures.

@repentance: you seem to be pretty versed in court matters. PLEASE contact us by PM. Perhaps you can help us build our legal framework.

@Maria: I will be happy to work with you, and any other investor been owned a substantial amount.

We will go after the legal structures, and the individuals involved. I think it is time to bring some sort of accountability to the bitcoin world. It is not even about the money at this point, and those familiar with our company know we have the deep pockets and the infrastructure to make it happen.

I have already received 8 private messages from people interested in joining forces with us. Many of these are very well known Bitcoin players and companies. I will be having a series of meetings with the board this and next week to start putting the gears in motion.

Just a heads up, you should probably verify each account owner's integrity before you take any actions. Maria didn't even submit a claim. Working with people like that will only delay your legal process.

Do you have a database backup to "backup" your statement?
In other words, can you deny that youramoron@gmail.com had an account with bitcoinica?

Yes. We have three different backups, all with a complete list of all users with balance and position.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
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June 08, 2012, 02:33:20 AM
 #346

Quote from: Maria
refunding so please Roberto, you have my full support.

Last, your unsecured claims process gives me a bad feeling of distrust. Consider my claim here public. Where is my money?

Who is Roberto ?

I thought Maria and Leo from coinexchanger were scammers but seems I am wrong Huh

Nah... How can maria be a scammer? "She" had 6k BTC and 50k USD in Bitcoinica Roll Eyes
Chump change, compared with the 200k USD I had on there.
Consider my claim made here in this public forum. I also find the claim form insecure(that SSL warning freaks me out) and I trust this MtGox hosted forum more than Bitcoinica

LOL. Please send an email or submit your claim. No claims on forums will be accepted.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
Raoul Duke
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June 08, 2012, 02:36:13 AM
 #347

Some accounts like mine for example have not had any significant transactions for many weeks. What is the problem with verifying those? Do you have any backups at all, even if two month old?

There were no backups.


Yes. We have three different backups, all with a complete list of all users with balance and position.

You guys need to tell the same story or else it doesn't stick Wink

LOL. Please send an email or submit your claim. No claims on forums will be accepted.

Like I said, the SSL warning freaks me out. No way, Jose... (also: what is email?)

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June 08, 2012, 03:07:19 AM
 #348

Like I said, the SSL warning freaks me out. No way, Jose... (also: what is email?)
GPG encrypt it to genjix, and mention that you GPG encrypted it to genjix in the plaintext side of the email. That is the only actually secure method of submitting a claim.

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June 08, 2012, 03:45:05 AM
 #349

I'm going to try this for a third time, for I feel it's an important issue.

@Zhou Tong: Have you personally, or while in capacity of Bitcoinia, traded bitcoins at/on Mt Gox, being that the TOS of said exchange forbids anybody under the age of 18 to trade/register on their platform.

Thank you, bud. I now look forward to your reply.

~Bruno~
Maria
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June 08, 2012, 03:53:03 AM
 #350

I'm going to try this for a third time, for I feel it's an important issue.

@Zhou Tong: Have you personally, or while in capacity of Bitcoinia, traded bitcoins at/on Mt Gox, being that the TOS of said exchange forbids anybody under the age of 18 to trade/register on their platform.

Thank you, bud. I now look forward to your reply.

~Bruno~

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.msg522863#msg522863

Quote from: stsbrad on September 13, 2011, 03:05:41 AM
I hate to say it but once again are people trusting their money with a service that came out of the blue three days ago? when will people ever learn. I'm not saying you are up to no good running this but there has been way too much fraud already. if people are trading money through someone who is 17 I see serious concerns. do you even have an llc or corporation setup? does anyone know your name and can verify your identity? I just can't grasp it.

If you want to identify all these, you can easily find out.

But unfortunately you didn't want to do so.

Bitcoinica was under xWaylab Inc. My name is Zhou Tong. I have submitted my passport and bank statement to Mt. Gox and waiting for their approval.

You can search topics about Bitcoinica on this forum. I have posted a lot of background information here and there.

If you really want to know, you can easily find out. We don't want to show testimonials. But established forum members have also shared their recommendation.

Lastly, every project has its start. If no people are trusting ANY new service because of fraud, there won't be any new service around.

I greatly appreciate everyone's trust, and I show my appreciation by developing the best product and providing the best service.
Raoul Duke
aka psy
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June 08, 2012, 03:57:43 AM
 #351

I'm going to try this for a third time, for I feel it's an important issue.

@Zhou Tong: Have you personally, or while in capacity of Bitcoinia, traded bitcoins at/on Mt Gox, being that the TOS of said exchange forbids anybody under the age of 18 to trade/register on their platform.

Thank you, bud. I now look forward to your reply.

~Bruno~

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.msg522863#msg522863

Quote from: stsbrad on September 13, 2011, 03:05:41 AM
I hate to say it but once again are people trusting their money with a service that came out of the blue three days ago? when will people ever learn. I'm not saying you are up to no good running this but there has been way too much fraud already. if people are trading money through someone who is 17 I see serious concerns. do you even have an llc or corporation setup? does anyone know your name and can verify your identity? I just can't grasp it.

If you want to identify all these, you can easily find out.

But unfortunately you didn't want to do so.

Bitcoinica was under xWaylab Inc. My name is Zhou Tong. I have submitted my passport and bank statement to Mt. Gox and waiting for their approval.

You can search topics about Bitcoinica on this forum. I have posted a lot of background information here and there.

If you really want to know, you can easily find out. We don't want to show testimonials. But established forum members have also shared their recommendation.

Lastly, every project has its start. If no people are trusting ANY new service because of fraud, there won't be any new service around.

I greatly appreciate everyone's trust, and I show my appreciation by developing the best product and providing the best service.

Oh... Mega LOL. MtGox broke its own terms. What will the DEA think? Huh

Maria
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June 08, 2012, 04:05:13 AM
 #352

Mr. Mark Karpeles, Mtgox, MagicalTux

If young Zhou still has open an account with you, I suggest you close and freeze immediately all funds in his account.
 
Phinnaeus Gage
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June 08, 2012, 04:06:45 AM
 #353

I'm going to try this for a third time, for I feel it's an important issue.

@Zhou Tong: Have you personally, or while in capacity of Bitcoinia, traded bitcoins at/on Mt Gox, being that the TOS of said exchange forbids anybody under the age of 18 to trade/register on their platform.

Thank you, bud. I now look forward to your reply.

~Bruno~

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.msg522863#msg522863

Quote from: stsbrad on September 13, 2011, 03:05:41 AM
I hate to say it but once again are people trusting their money with a service that came out of the blue three days ago? when will people ever learn. I'm not saying you are up to no good running this but there has been way too much fraud already. if people are trading money through someone who is 17 I see serious concerns. do you even have an llc or corporation setup? does anyone know your name and can verify your identity? I just can't grasp it.

If you want to identify all these, you can easily find out.

But unfortunately you didn't want to do so.

Bitcoinica was under xWaylab Inc. My name is Zhou Tong. I have submitted my passport and bank statement to Mt. Gox and waiting for their approval.

You can search topics about Bitcoinica on this forum. I have posted a lot of background information here and there.

If you really want to know, you can easily find out. We don't want to show testimonials. But established forum members have also shared their recommendation.

Lastly, every project has its start. If no people are trusting ANY new service because of fraud, there won't be any new service around.

I greatly appreciate everyone's trust, and I show my appreciation by developing the best product and providing the best service.

Oh... Mega LOL. MtGox broke its own terms. What will the DEA think? Huh

Here's my problem. Why would I or anybody else, for that matter, deal with an entity that doesn't even abide by its own TOS? I also have proof that Zhou Tong was registered at Mt Gox prior to the formation of Bitcoinia--when he was only 16 years old. Anybody care to see that proof?

~Bruno~
repentance
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June 08, 2012, 04:11:03 AM
 #354


Here's my problem. Why would I or anybody else, for that matter, deal with an entity that doesn't even abide by its own TOS? I also have proof that Zhou Tong was registered at Mt Gox prior to the formation of Bitcoinia--when he was only 16 years old. Anybody care to see that proof?

~Bruno~


If the account belonged to xWaylab Inc, then that was the legal entity with which Mt Gox was dealing rather than zhoutong personally.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
Raoul Duke
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June 08, 2012, 04:11:17 AM
 #355

Here's my problem. Why would I or anybody else, for that matter, deal with an entity that doesn't even abide by its own TOS? I also have proof that Zhou Tong was registered at Mt Gox prior to the formation of Bitcoinia--when he was only 16 years old. Anybody care to see that proof?

~Bruno~


Spill the beans, Bruno. You know we're dying for it lol

If the account belonged to xWaylab Inc, then that was the legal entity with which Mt Gox was dealing rather than zhoutang personally.

Just like the Singapore bank account belonged to xWaylab Inc. ?

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June 08, 2012, 04:18:31 AM
 #356

Here's my problem. Why would I or anybody else, for that matter, deal with an entity that doesn't even abide by its own TOS? I also have proof that Zhou Tong was registered at Mt Gox prior to the formation of Bitcoinia--when he was only 16 years old. Anybody care to see that proof?

~Bruno~


Spill the beans, Bruno. You know we're dying for it lol

If the account belonged to xWaylab Inc, then that was the legal entity with which Mt Gox was dealing rather than zhoutang personally.

Just like the Singapore bank account belonged to xWaylab Inc. ?

Damn you guys! Can't the suspense go on a tad longer? And it's not xWaylad, but in the name of Zhou Tong. Chances are, though, I've be offering up the info within the hour. In the meantime, if this is true, wouldn't there be some type/kind of legal ramifications involved in regards to Mt Gox, i.e., having minors trading on their platform?

~Bruno~
Raoul Duke
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June 08, 2012, 04:21:14 AM
 #357

Damn you guys! Can't the suspense go on a tad longer? And it's not xWaylad, but in the name of Zhou Tong. Chances are, though, I've be offering up the info within the hour. In the meantime, if this is true, wouldn't there be some type/kind of legal ramifications involved in regards to Mt Gox, i.e., having minors trading on their platform?

~Bruno~


The LAW doesn't apply to DEA snitches.

repentance
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June 08, 2012, 04:27:28 AM
 #358

In the meantime, if this is true, wouldn't there be some type/kind of legal ramifications involved in regards to Mt Gox, i.e., having minors trading on their platform?

~Bruno~


Who knows - you're talking about someone resident in Singapore trading with a company based in Japan.  Often contracts made with minors aren't enforceable by the other party, although minors can be bound by certain types of contracts in some places and other types are absolutely illegal in some jurisdictions.

Just show us the money shot.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
zhoutong
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June 08, 2012, 05:39:33 AM
 #359

I'm going to try this for a third time, for I feel it's an important issue.

@Zhou Tong: Have you personally, or while in capacity of Bitcoinia, traded bitcoins at/on Mt Gox, being that the TOS of said exchange forbids anybody under the age of 18 to trade/register on their platform.

Thank you, bud. I now look forward to your reply.

~Bruno~

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.msg522863#msg522863

Quote from: stsbrad on September 13, 2011, 03:05:41 AM
I hate to say it but once again are people trusting their money with a service that came out of the blue three days ago? when will people ever learn. I'm not saying you are up to no good running this but there has been way too much fraud already. if people are trading money through someone who is 17 I see serious concerns. do you even have an llc or corporation setup? does anyone know your name and can verify your identity? I just can't grasp it.

If you want to identify all these, you can easily find out.

But unfortunately you didn't want to do so.

Bitcoinica was under xWaylab Inc. My name is Zhou Tong. I have submitted my passport and bank statement to Mt. Gox and waiting for their approval.

You can search topics about Bitcoinica on this forum. I have posted a lot of background information here and there.

If you really want to know, you can easily find out. We don't want to show testimonials. But established forum members have also shared their recommendation.

Lastly, every project has its start. If no people are trusting ANY new service because of fraud, there won't be any new service around.

I greatly appreciate everyone's trust, and I show my appreciation by developing the best product and providing the best service.

Oh... Mega LOL. MtGox broke its own terms. What will the DEA think? Huh

Here's my problem. Why would I or anybody else, for that matter, deal with an entity that doesn't even abide by its own TOS? I also have proof that Zhou Tong was registered at Mt Gox prior to the formation of Bitcoinia--when he was only 16 years old. Anybody care to see that proof?

~Bruno~


When I registered at Mt. Gox, they didn't have that TOS. When the TOS came out, all Bitcoinica's assets had already been transferred to a new account owned by a corporation which has no relation with me. I still operate a personal Mt. Gox account with minimal funds. Mt. Gox is welcome to freeze it until August 24, 2012.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
Phinnaeus Gage
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June 08, 2012, 05:40:51 AM
 #360

In the meantime, if this is true, wouldn't there be some type/kind of legal ramifications involved in regards to Mt Gox, i.e., having minors trading on their platform?

~Bruno~


Who knows - you're talking about someone resident in Singapore trading with a company based in Japan.  Often contracts made with minors aren't enforceable by the other party, although minors can be bound by certain types of contracts in some places and other types are absolutely illegal in some jurisdictions.

Just show us the money shot.

I may need to apology to psy, kinda, for I stated that xwaylab.com was not the name, for I didn't double check his provided email address prior to claiming otherwise. I still stand my position, though, that the account was/is under the name of Zhou Tong with him giving xwaylab.com as the email address ONLY. As you can clearly see below, the account in question was established prior to the leak, possible late May of last year at the very latest, making him only 16 years old at the time, regardless. Now, if owning a website excuses the age requirement expressed on Mt Gox's TOS, then I'm going to have my 10 year old nephew sign up to Mt Gox with his website iliketurtlebutter.com (currently in development). He's going to be selling Turtle Butter and only accept Bitcoin as payment. Since he's to young to open his own bank account without an adult co-signer, he wishes to put his funds in a safe place, coupled with the ability to trade them. The kid is a fuckin' genus, BTW, for he came up with the Turtle Butter idea on his own while on a 4 day holiday at Wally World. I may have to check to see if it's legal for him to register a domain name in his name, though, since he is under age. First, I'm going to have to help him get a credit card so that he can do that, too.

Quote
5125,zhoutong,ryan@xwaylab.com,$1$...

Now, I'm going to ask again: If this is the case, were any laws broken, or is there no age requirement to trade on a commodity exchange?

~Bruno~
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