[Payout Updates] Bitcoinica site is taken offline for security investigation

[zhoutong]

Ok, well, here's where you should send my coins:

16pDN85h2aVq7oRMw4pt9kvstmYL4Qscbz

K, thnx.

Just send everything to the email verify@bitcoinica.com.

At least I keep all copies of the email securely. Also I have indexes so it's easy and fast to search all the claim emails.

...and you think we believe that!

My email is secure (with 2-factor) and never compromised, and so are your passport uploads (both web uploads and emails, web uploads are AES-256 encrypted in S3).

[Maria]

I can only provide some highly redacted screenshots. The gist is, there's no point to cheat for claims. Bitcoinica has almost everything.

You stated yesterday that there are 3 accounting records. Also we know they are incomplete and outdated.

From what I see:

* One of the records provides postions up to 6/05/12 (recent)
* The other record shows USD and BTC balances but there are only a few 2012 records in the screenshot suggesting this document might only cover a period up to Jan/Feb. (outdated)
* The 3rd record is unknown.

So the big questions is: Which accounting records do you have and up to which date are these records current?

I am concerned that there might be major blindspots in the data. For example I only committed significant funds to Bitcoinica after April 24 when it became a licensed financial service provider and provided a ToS. Also I came for the interest on deposits, so did not have any positions. I'm sure I am not unique in this respect.

The data from the screenshots suggest that accurate information for late users with significant deposits but no positions might not be present in either of the documents you presented. This worries me.

We still have Mt. Gox account logs, deposit and withdrawal emails, etc. We are unable to disclose exact dates of these reports (not May 6, I just showed two recent ones, but the date is more recent than that.) If someone made a large withdrawal after that date and didn't claim it, we can still find the evidence in the email. (So far no one could disable withdrawal email due to a bug preventing mass assignment of the options.)

Breach of trust will be heavily penalized, I guess. So just be careful with the claims and you should be fine.

EDIT: If someone submits claim at this stage, 99% it's fake without valid explanation of the delay. So send an email of explanation to verify@bitcoinica.com if you didn't manage to submit within the first week.

This is my suggestion though. I'm just trying to help the team (so that everyone can get funds back faster).

Are you saying my claim is 99% Fake? All because I did not submit a claim form during the first week of this mess?

I explained to you why I patiently waited behind the scenes like others because we had faith in you and your service.

Very Briefly, We do NOT TRUST you anymore so we will NOT submit passports or any Identification to you.  We have been doing business with you since the beginning and you NEVER ask me for any type of ID. You were content with my HUGE deposits and trading activity and I'm sure you didn't want to bother with little stuff like that. Now you are starting to bother me Zhou Tong.

Maria.

Until today, you still haven't told Bitcoinica even your username or email address. And I can't find anything with "Maria". What do you want?

You should sue Bitcoinica LP and feed your lawyer well.

Zhou Tong please read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.0

Notice how you never asked me for my username or password, yet you was able and fast in finding my account. Not only did you find my account, you looked into the problem and sent the money fast as well. This is why I loved you and your service. That is how our relationship was born. Now you deny my existence and make me jump hurdles to get my money back? Zhou, you have change into somebody else and I feel nothing but embarrassment for you.

Maria.

[rjk]

Zhou Tong please read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.0

Notice how you never asked me for my username or password, yet you was able and fast in finding my account. Not only did you find my account, you looked into the problem and sent the money fast as well. This is why I loved you and your service. That is how our relationship was born. Now you deny my existence and make me jump hurdles to get my money back? Zhou, you have change into somebody else and I feel nothing but embarrassment for you.

Maria.

That was then, and this is now - that post was made in the first week of operation, and we can assume that your account was easy to identify based on you being one of the first users and knowing the balance from your screenshots. Now, with over 5000 accounts, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.

[Maria]

Zhou Tong please read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.0

Notice how you never asked me for my username or password, yet you was able and fast in finding my account. Not only did you find my account, you looked into the problem and sent the money fast as well. This is why I loved you and your service. That is how our relationship was born. Now you deny my existence and make me jump hurdles to get my money back? Zhou, you have change into somebody else and I feel nothing but embarrassment for you.

Maria.

That was then, and this is now - that post was made in the first week of operation, and we can assume that your account was easy to identify based on you being one of the first users and knowing the balance from your screenshots. Now, with over 5000 accounts, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.

And not having a database to confirm it makes that haystack much bigger.

[zhoutong]

I can only provide some highly redacted screenshots. The gist is, there's no point to cheat for claims. Bitcoinica has almost everything.

You stated yesterday that there are 3 accounting records. Also we know they are incomplete and outdated.

From what I see:

* One of the records provides postions up to 6/05/12 (recent)
* The other record shows USD and BTC balances but there are only a few 2012 records in the screenshot suggesting this document might only cover a period up to Jan/Feb. (outdated)
* The 3rd record is unknown.

So the big questions is: Which accounting records do you have and up to which date are these records current?

I am concerned that there might be major blindspots in the data. For example I only committed significant funds to Bitcoinica after April 24 when it became a licensed financial service provider and provided a ToS. Also I came for the interest on deposits, so did not have any positions. I'm sure I am not unique in this respect.

The data from the screenshots suggest that accurate information for late users with significant deposits but no positions might not be present in either of the documents you presented. This worries me.

We still have Mt. Gox account logs, deposit and withdrawal emails, etc. We are unable to disclose exact dates of these reports (not May 6, I just showed two recent ones, but the date is more recent than that.) If someone made a large withdrawal after that date and didn't claim it, we can still find the evidence in the email. (So far no one could disable withdrawal email due to a bug preventing mass assignment of the options.)

Breach of trust will be heavily penalized, I guess. So just be careful with the claims and you should be fine.

EDIT: If someone submits claim at this stage, 99% it's fake without valid explanation of the delay. So send an email of explanation to verify@bitcoinica.com if you didn't manage to submit within the first week.

This is my suggestion though. I'm just trying to help the team (so that everyone can get funds back faster).

Are you saying my claim is 99% Fake? All because I did not submit a claim form during the first week of this mess?

I explained to you why I patiently waited behind the scenes like others because we had faith in you and your service.

Very Briefly, We do NOT TRUST you anymore so we will NOT submit passports or any Identification to you.  We have been doing business with you since the beginning and you NEVER ask me for any type of ID. You were content with my HUGE deposits and trading activity and I'm sure you didn't want to bother with little stuff like that. Now you are starting to bother me Zhou Tong.

Maria.

Until today, you still haven't told Bitcoinica even your username or email address. And I can't find anything with "Maria". What do you want?

You should sue Bitcoinica LP and feed your lawyer well.

Zhou Tong please read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=42680.0

Notice how you never asked me for my username or password, yet you was able and fast in finding my account. Not only did you find my account, you looked into the problem and sent the money fast as well. This is why I loved you and your service. That is how our relationship was born. Now you deny my existence and make me jump hurdles to get my money back? Zhou, you have change into somebody else and I feel nothing but embarrassment for you.

Maria.

So a request for username and email becomes a "hurdle" for you?

[guruvan]

So, I'm not terribly wild about the idea of sending you guys my ID. I noted this on my claim form.

I would be much more comfortable with a skype session or some such to confirm my identity (which is readily confirmable in so many other ways, I feel it's unnecessary, and seems like it's an unnecessary risk to take - I do NOT want you to store my passport data in any way shape or form.

I'll post my OTC key on my website and on my Google Profiles. (it should be as simple as googling my nick)

But, AFAIK, you guys aren't imminently returning any funds, so there's not any need to send any ID anytime soon.

Please contact me when you will need this.

[Vladimir]

That "maria" is on ignore for some and I wish you guys stopped quoting her full posts here.

[Maria]

I want my money Zhou. When I signed up you were the only owner and my money was placed in your hands with trust. Then you sell the company without letting me know. I do not know who is Tihan or Genjix or Donald. if you would have told me you were selling your company 2 things could have happenef.

1- i would offered you a substantial amount of money and bought it from you.

2- I would have cash out all my bitcoins and USD until the owner change was complete.

You deceived me and others in pretending you still owned bitcoinica and taking credit for refunding losses out of your own pocket.


6325 + 9449 = 15,774 BTC

Current Mtgox Price is 5.60

USD 53,244  = 9449 BTC

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

[bulanula]

I want my money Zhou. When I signed up you were the only owner and my money was placed in your hands with trust. Then you sell the company without letting me know. I do not know who is Tihan or Genjix or Donald. if you would have told me you were selling your company 2 things could have happenef.

1- i would offered you a substantial amount of money and bought it from you.

2- I would have cash out all my bitcoins and USD until the owner change was complete.

You deceived me and others in pretending you still owned bitcoinica and taking credit for refunding losses out of your own pocket.


6325 + 9449 = 15,774 BTC

Current Mtgox Price is 5.60

USD 53,244  = 9449 BTC

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

Nice trolling ! I am also owed 18K BTC at address 17upZsFjg6DKbHMwLpzyzqf2H9JAWTWFSC right now or I sue you !

[kokjo]

I want my money Zhou. When I signed up you were the only owner and my money was placed in your hands with trust. Then you sell the company without letting me know. I do not know who is Tihan or Genjix or Donald. if you would have told me you were selling your company 2 things could have happenef.

1- i would offered you a substantial amount of money and bought it from you.

2- I would have cash out all my bitcoins and USD until the owner change was complete.

You deceived me and others in pretending you still owned bitcoinica and taking credit for refunding losses out of your own pocket.


6325 + 9449 = 15,774 BTC

Current Mtgox Price is 5.60

USD 53,244  = 9449 BTC

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

STFU bitch! we all want our money. i think they are working on it.

[zhoutong]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?

Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

[disclaimer201]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

Touché! Laughing out loud =)

Edit: -----------------------> guy after me didn't get it.

[Ichthyo]

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?

Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

Who the hell is "Ryan"
Who is posting here as "zoutong"?
Did you quote from somewhere? please clarify!

[Maria]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?
 
Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

My husband happens to be very cautious when it comes to database backups so he pulled up your account Zhou Tong:
   
ID    Name    Email                          USD    BTC   Last Login               Confirmed    Account Blocked    Account Status    Actions
62    zhoutong    ryan@xwaylab.com    0    0    11/13/2011 06:06:30 AM    Yes    Not    Open    Close Account | Delete

When and how did you make this deposit Zhou? Please post proof of your 100K BTC Deposit. The shame you must feel must be unbearable.

Maria.

[zhoutong]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?
 
Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

My husband happens to be very cautious when it comes to database backups so he pulled up your account Zhou Tong:
   
ID    Name    Email                          USD    BTC   Last Login               Confirmed    Account Blocked    Account Status    Actions
62    zhoutong    ryan@xwaylab.com    0    0    11/13/2011 06:06:30 AM    Yes    Not    Open    Close Account | Delete

When and how did you make this deposit Zhou? Please post proof of your 100K BTC Deposit. The shame you must feel must be unbearable.

Maria.

I have records too. But what's your username?

I'm not going to go through 5000+ usernames and see which one is yours.

[repentance]

Are you saying my claim is 99% Fake? All because I did not submit a claim form during the first week of this mess?

I explained to you why I patiently waited behind the scenes like others because we had faith in you and your service.

Very Briefly, We do NOT TRUST you anymore so we will NOT submit passports or any Identification to you.  We have been doing business with you since the beginning and you NEVER ask me for any type of ID. You were content with my HUGE deposits and trading activity and I'm sure you didn't want to bother with little stuff like that. Now you are starting to bother me Zhou Tong.

Maria.

Why not spend some of that money which you would have used to buy Bitcoinica (*cough*) on a lawyer to file for injunctive relief?  After all, you claim that they owe you ~$140,000 and you claim not to trust them - with all of your accurate records it shouldn't be a problem for you to get a court order preventing the from moving "your" funds until your claim can be properly heard.  It would be more productive than getting into a pissing match on a message board and mean that you don't have to trust Bitcoinica at all.

[Maria]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?
 
Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

My husband happens to be very cautious when it comes to database backups so he pulled up your account Zhou Tong:
   
ID    Name    Email                          USD    BTC   Last Login               Confirmed    Account Blocked    Account Status    Actions
62    zhoutong    ryan@xwaylab.com    0    0    11/13/2011 06:06:30 AM    Yes    Not    Open    Close Account | Delete

When and how did you make this deposit Zhou? Please post proof of your 100K BTC Deposit. The shame you must feel must be unbearable.

Maria.

I have records too. But what's your username?

I'm not going to go through 5000+ usernames and see which one is yours.

That was then, and this is now - that post was made in the first week of operation, and we can assume that your account was easy to identify based on you being one of the first users and knowing the balance from your screenshots. Now, with over 5000 accounts, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.

You know EXACTLY who am I. Stop playing games and keep your word. Crack open that cassacius 1000 Gold Bar and your personal Mtgox Account and start refunding now.  i do not care about anybody else you blame, because in my eyes YOU deceived ME. You Lied, You Sold and you took advantage of everybody else here in the community because we all believed you were the owner and in control. How do you sell peoples private documents without consulting them first??!

Hey guys, Im selling the site to this Tihan guy with all of your verified documents. He happens to be a con-artist who sells fake passports to russian mobsters...

How about You, and all of the other owners submit some ID here on the forum?

That makes way more sense. I again suggest you Pay me via MTGOX CODES Today.

Maria.

[zhoutong]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?
 
Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

My husband happens to be very cautious when it comes to database backups so he pulled up your account Zhou Tong:
   
ID    Name    Email                          USD    BTC   Last Login               Confirmed    Account Blocked    Account Status    Actions
62    zhoutong    ryan@xwaylab.com    0    0    11/13/2011 06:06:30 AM    Yes    Not    Open    Close Account | Delete

When and how did you make this deposit Zhou? Please post proof of your 100K BTC Deposit. The shame you must feel must be unbearable.

Maria.

I have records too. But what's your username?

I'm not going to go through 5000+ usernames and see which one is yours.

That was then, and this is now - that post was made in the first week of operation, and we can assume that your account was easy to identify based on you being one of the first users and knowing the balance from your screenshots. Now, with over 5000 accounts, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.

You know EXACTLY who am I. Stop playing games and keep your word. Crack open that cassacius 1000 Gold Bar and your personal Mtgox Account and start refunding now.  i do not care about anybody else you blame, because in my eyes YOU deceived ME. You Lied, You Sold and you took advantage of everybody else here in the community because we all believed you were the owner and in control. How do you sell peoples private documents without consulting them first??!

Hey guys, Im selling the site to this Tihan guy with all of your verified documents. He happens to be a con-artist who sells fake passports to russian mobsters...

How about You, and all of the other owners submit some ID here on the forum?

That makes way more sense. I again suggest you Pay me via MTGOX CODES Today.

Maria.

Tihan couldn't touch any IDs ever, not anyone else other than me.
The ownership transfer to Bitcoinica Consultancy was announced by both parties, and that was part of the Bitcoinica acquisition. The responsible party is from me to Bitcoinica Consultancy directly, not me -> Tihan -> Consultancy.
I don't know who you are, unfortunately. Tihan saved some records of high value accounts days before the hack and I didn't see anyone with balance close to that amount.
If you are willing to provide your username I may be able to help you. If not I'll not respond to your posts any more.

[stochastic]

Send My Money To: 1HJc5VLMpFCQJg2maP9wGuCo3NAgwaCJQj

Maria.

What's your username and email?

By the way, last time I deposited 100,000 BTC in CoinExchanger and I forgot to take out. Now it says "Final touches on the chess platform". Where's my money?
 
Please send 100K BTC to 12HF626t6VicTAkoUFvzE39oGiaJDRotRt

Ryan.

My husband happens to be very cautious when it comes to database backups so he pulled up your account Zhou Tong:
   
ID    Name    Email                          USD    BTC   Last Login               Confirmed    Account Blocked    Account Status    Actions
62    zhoutong    ryan@xwaylab.com    0    0    11/13/2011 06:06:30 AM    Yes    Not    Open    Close Account | Delete

When and how did you make this deposit Zhou? Please post proof of your 100K BTC Deposit. The shame you must feel must be unbearable.

Maria.

I have records too. But what's your username?

I'm not going to go through 5000+ usernames and see which one is yours.

That was then, and this is now - that post was made in the first week of operation, and we can assume that your account was easy to identify based on you being one of the first users and knowing the balance from your screenshots. Now, with over 5000 accounts, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.

You know EXACTLY who am I. Stop playing games and keep your word. Crack open that cassacius 1000 Gold Bar and your personal Mtgox Account and start refunding now.  i do not care about anybody else you blame, because in my eyes YOU deceived ME. You Lied, You Sold and you took advantage of everybody else here in the community because we all believed you were the owner and in control. How do you sell peoples private documents without consulting them first??!

Hey guys, Im selling the site to this Tihan guy with all of your verified documents. He happens to be a con-artist who sells fake passports to russian mobsters...

How about You, and all of the other owners submit some ID here on the forum?

That makes way more sense. I again suggest you Pay me via MTGOX CODES Today.

Maria.

Tihan couldn't touch any IDs ever, not anyone else other than me.
The ownership transfer to Bitcoinica Consultancy was announced by both parties, and that was part of the Bitcoinica acquisition. The responsible party is from me to Bitcoinica Consultancy directly, not me -> Tihan -> Consultancy.
I don't know who you are, unfortunately. Tihan saved some records of high value accounts days before the hack and I didn't see anyone with balance close to that amount.
If you are willing to provide your username I may be able to help you. If not I'll not respond to your posts any more.

I hope you have plans to delete those IDs.

[bitlane]

What interest rate will be provided to users who have been without access to their USD for the last month ?

At this point, if users are not fairly compensated, as USD holdings were never at risk nor were they affected by the security breach, failing to compensate USD accounts with proper interest should be considered nothing more than a SCAM since this entire time, the Bitcoinica Consultancy has been using their users USD to help get out of the hole that they are in.

This HAS to be embarrassing at this point for them, as the original 'Bitcoin Consultancy' was supposed to be a positive force in the Bitcoin community and has turned out to be nothing more than a larger scale scam in comparison to past scams.

I guess it's safe to say that they will simply have to put a price on their future credibility in this community and repay it to the USD accounts that they have profited from for the last near-month.

What a joke.