[Payout Updates] Bitcoinica site is taken offline for security investigation

[tbcoin]

I, for one, am happy that positions will be liquidated around $5. That was the price when this shit happened, so it's reasonable. Plus, I have a short there

Obviously you took a bad position so fuck you hahaha, just kidding

Long should be liquidate NOW at market price and shorts at a convenient time ($ 5)

[XVacant]

I, for one, am happy that positions will be liquidated around $5. That was the price when this shit happened, so it's reasonable. Plus, I have a short there

Obviously you took a bad position so fuck you hahaha, just kidding

Long should be liquidate NOW at market price and shorts at a convenient time ($ 5)

Zhoutong's opinion was "all short positions can liquidate at 4.94".
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=81045.msg897877#msg897877

[kokjo]

I, for one, am happy that positions will be liquidated around $5. That was the price when this shit happened, so it's reasonable. Plus, I have a short there

Obviously you took a bad position so fuck you hahaha, just kidding

Long should be liquidate NOW at market price and shorts at a convenient time ($ 5)

Zhoutong's opinion was "all short positions can liquidate at 4.94".
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=81045.msg897877#msg897877

Current positions will all be liquidated at a settlement price. We haven't decided the price yet, but my personal estimate is 4.98 / 4.94. (All long positions can liquidate at 4.98 and all short positions can liquidate at 4.94, we pay the spread for you.) All unrealized P/L will be settled in USD. If you don't have sufficient USD balance, we will use your BTC to settle, with the mid-point exchange rate (again, we pay the spread).

[zhoutong]

I, for one, am happy that positions will be liquidated around $5. That was the price when this shit happened, so it's reasonable. Plus, I have a short there

Obviously you took a bad position so fuck you hahaha, just kidding

Long should be liquidate NOW at market price and shorts at a convenient time ($ 5)

Zhoutong's opinion was "all short positions can liquidate at 4.94".
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=81045.msg897877#msg897877

Current positions will all be liquidated at a settlement price. We haven't decided the price yet, but my personal estimate is 4.98 / 4.94. (All long positions can liquidate at 4.98 and all short positions can liquidate at 4.94, we pay the spread for you.) All unrealized P/L will be settled in USD. If you don't have sufficient USD balance, we will use your BTC to settle, with the mid-point exchange rate (again, we pay the spread).

I suggested the team to pay spread to customers to make everyone happy. At that time the highest-lowest difference was 4 cents. Now it's 1 dollar. So I'm really not sure how the liquidation will be handled.

[cryptoanarchist]

Almost 40 pages of bovine excrement. Where are the usual trolls calling for a "scammer" tag? Pretty sure bitscalper wasn't given this much time to make things right.

And why are you even still commenting here, Zhou? Since supposedly you have no liability you should probably just stfu and let whoever does do the explaining.

I'm glad I peeped out how fake Bitcoinica was before all of this - you guys can keep my .9 BTC that I left over there.

[muyuu]

I, for one, am happy that positions will be liquidated around $5. That was the price when this shit happened, so it's reasonable. Plus, I have a short there

LOL

I, for one, am happy that the sharks are left out in the cold now that the market is hot. Plus, I had no funds there

heh 

[Mushoz]

Almost 40 pages of bovine excrement. Where are the usual trolls calling for a "scammer" tag? Pretty sure bitscalper wasn't given this much time to make things right.

And why are you even still commenting here, Zhou? Since supposedly you have no liability you should probably just stfu and let whoever does do the explaining.

I'm glad I peeped out how fake Bitcoinica was before all of this - you guys can keep my .9 BTC that I left over there.

Hey, shut up please. I for one love the updates Zhoutong is giving us, since the Bitcoin Consultancy is lacking in the update department.

[Mushoz]

Positions will be liquidated around 5 +/- 0.1 depending on the exact math (a close price that's a suitable middle ground between longs and shorts).

I could have hedged my position, but with the lack information you pretty much screwed me out of quite a bit of money. Thanks.

[Jointops420]

I have $100 USD with them as a try out, glad I never dropped the thousand I was thinking about.
Have gone through basically what everyone else has, my faith is at the same levels as the information given back.
I feel for you folk who have lost lots so far but such is the new frontier.

[cryptoanarchist]

Almost 40 pages of bovine excrement. Where are the usual trolls calling for a "scammer" tag? Pretty sure bitscalper wasn't given this much time to make things right.

And why are you even still commenting here, Zhou? Since supposedly you have no liability you should probably just stfu and let whoever does do the explaining.

I'm glad I peeped out how fake Bitcoinica was before all of this - you guys can keep my .9 BTC that I left over there.

Hey, shut up please. I for one love the updates Zhoutong is giving us, since the Bitcoin Consultancy is lacking in the update department.

I wouldn't have said anything else because there is nothing else to really say, so your comment is pretty pointless. The reality is that if Zhou isn't the one responsible, he shouldn't be the one giving updates.

The other reality is that people should have known better after the first "hack" - if that's what it really was.

[ninjarobot]

Not sure if this has already appeared in the thread but from the bitcoinica.com page,

"Claims which have been internally identified as reasonably accurate based on records and for which the ownership of the claim has been determined will receive an initial payment of 50%"

50%? This is different from the earlier 80% plan:

30 May 23:30: We're going to proceed with payouts of the few people we have verified hopefully tomorrow for 80% of their claims (the remaining 20% will be refunded later). A more lengthy process will be applied to everyone else.

• Why the change of plans?
• When will the 50% refund start? Give us a date and stick to it. (The 80% refund was supposed to start May 31...)
• Will this include the customers that were unable to password verify? (but did go through manual verification)
• How will refunds work? And in the case of wire transfers, who will bear the cost of the transfer, esp if refunds will happen in multiple installments?

[ninjarobot]

• Who is acting as directors for the Bitcoinica LP general partner at the moment? (And who is the General partner currently?)
• Did you supply the NZ Companies office with valid docs to reflect your director status?
• Did Tihan's fund decide you have abandoned your legal obligations? If so, is this the reason that CORE CREDIT LIMITED became BITCOINICA CONSULTANCY LIMITED on May 30?
• Who was the acting CEO or MD of Bitcoinica LP when the Rackspace hack occurred. Who is the current CEO or MD of Bitcoinica LP?
• I assume Bitcoinica LP is not treating this incident as Force Majeure? If not, how is Bitcoinica LP treating it?
• Why did Bitcoinica LP not sign up with a Dispute Resolution Scheme & Did Bitcoinica seek legal advice in this matter, if so what was the outcome?

I am not the correct person to answer your questions. I have messaged the correct person.

Any answers from the 'correct person' yet?

[cryptoanarchist]

Any answers from the 'correct person' yet?

lol..don't hold your breath

[genjix]

I was told this:
"I would suggest that the communication should be strictly about payments progress. Daily factual one-liners as in: "Today we verified 20 balances." or "We expect payments to begin on Friday", or "We're working on a secure system for issuing MtGox codes.""

If you send me a message to genjix@riseup.net then I'll forward you on to them.

[cryptoanarchist]

I was told by a higher up at Bitcoinica that they're all full of it, but I can't tell you their name.

[LoupGaroux]

So in effect:

"Today we paid another day's worth of lip service, created some interesting new numbers, and did not return one single penny or satoshi to the people that entrusted us with thousands."

Thanks for the clarification, feel free to just copy the above line and post it each day to save the effort of creating new descriptions. That will free up critical time to create new disagreements between the owners, find new agencies that you haven't licensed with, but will eventually, and generally pass the buck endlessly, other people's bucks that is.

[genjix]

"Today we paid another day's worth of lip service, created some interesting new numbers, and did not return one single penny or satoshi to the people that entrusted us with thousands."

Except we already did make some payments for confirmed people.

I support paying the initial round of people marked as 'accurate', but the process is not under my control. And I can understand why there is a need for more thorough checking. There is no database, a huge mass of data (much of it useless) and a number of false claims that could push out legitimate claims.

[Vod]

I support paying the initial round of people marked as 'accurate', but the process is not under my control. And I can understand why there is a need for more thorough checking. There is no database, a huge mass of data (much of it useless) and a number of false claims that could push out legitimate claims.

So then how are you verifying anybody at all?  Just people you like, or what?

[ninjarobot]

Except we already did make some payments for confirmed people.

Ah, of course - the 'round 0' people.

If you have started payments why have you not announced that on the first post of this thread. Seems like relevant info to me.

EDIT1: nevermind - I see that the 1st post has been updated to this effect 30 mins ago :)
EDIT2: Would be great if some of these people that received 50% refunds can confirm in this thread.

[elux]

Zhoutong's opinion was "all short positions can liquidate at 4.94".
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=81045.msg897877#msg897877

Current positions will all be liquidated at a settlement price. We haven't decided the price yet, but my personal estimate is 4.98 / 4.94. (All long positions can liquidate at 4.98 and all short positions can liquidate at 4.94, we pay the spread for you.) All unrealized P/L will be settled in USD. If you don't have sufficient USD balance, we will use your BTC to settle, with the mid-point exchange rate (again, we pay the spread).

I suggested the team to pay spread to customers to make everyone happy. At that time the highest-lowest difference was 4 cents. Now it's 1 dollar. So I'm really not sure how the liquidation will be handled.

I have a proposal for an amicable solution to the liquidation price dispute:

Close all open positions at the exact value they were placed. No loss for open positions.

If you opened a long position at 4.30, your position is closed at 4.30.
If you opened a short position at 5.30, your position is closed at 5.30.

Using this approach, the only loss for customers will be opportunity cost. Sounds reasonable?