ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[Lohoris]

Without knowing the extent of jimmothy's alleged trollitude, I'd suggest caution... just because someone is much more bearish or bullish than you doesn't mean their arguments are invalid (case in point).

He may deserve it. Just make sure you're hitting the ignore button for the right reasons.

In this case I'm sure, just read Havelock IPO's thread, he's must definitely a troll.
(or he's so utterly stupid that it makes no difference)

[hammurabi]

Without knowing the extent of jimmothy's alleged trollitude, I'd suggest caution... just because someone is much more bearish or bullish than you doesn't mean their arguments are invalid (case in point).

He may deserve it. Just make sure you're hitting the ignore button for the right reasons.

In this case I'm sure, just read Havelock IPO's thread, he's must definitely a troll.
(or he's so utterly stupid that it makes no difference)

AM share price plummeted
and all-around-love in this thread is gone.

[ft73]

I still would love to know the answer to these questions:

Has any other competitor besides KNC stopped shipping to provide better profits?
Where is the official statement from cointerra stating they are hashing?
But again preorders don't mean diddly squat as BFL taught us.

Well then maybe you should start looking for answers? It's called "research". You shoud try it.

Care not to quote him?
Thank you.

[Zubilica]

In business in general , no news is good news. But in BTC world no news are delays. Right now BTC price is falling a bit , a few ppl are getting out selling shares and BTC. Also there is a huge pressure of selling from ppl who bought SebastianJu's shares.

I see price of AM share dropping by the hour and i do not like it. We all expect news from FC and complete silence is starting to be annoying

[AMuppInTime]

In business in general , no news is good news. But in BTC world no news are delays. Right now BTC price is falling a bit , a few ppl are getting out selling shares and BTC. Also there is a huge pressure of selling from ppl who bought SebastianJu's shares.

I see price of AM share dropping by the hour and i do not like it. We all expect news from FC and complete silence is starting to be annoying

1) We've had an update on Nov 22. friedcat usually posts around the 20 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=49840;sa=showPosts)
2) There are too many who look at ASICminer with blinders. We need more grounding.

I miss the guys who used to run analysis and post graphs/predictions. Did they all leave?

[jimmothy]

In business in general , no news is good news. But in BTC world no news are delays. Right now BTC price is falling a bit , a few ppl are getting out selling shares and BTC. Also there is a huge pressure of selling from ppl who bought SebastianJu's shares.

I see price of AM share dropping by the hour and i do not like it. We all expect news from FC and complete silence is starting to be annoying

1) We've had an update on Nov 22. friedcat usually posts around the 20 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=49840;sa=showPosts)
2) There are too many who look at ASICminer with blinders. We need more grounding.

I miss the guys who used to run analysis and post graphs/predictions. Did they all leave?

I think the only one with blinders on is you. We all know asicminer is working on gen3 hardware to be released 1st quarter of 2014 at the same time or before competitors release their new products. Not surprising. Not news. Just the current plan we have known about for months now.

If you think that imaginating specs for gen3 hardware is "grounding" you are simply wrong. We are going to see the share price dwindle until around February when gen3 is announced and sold which will cause the share price to skyrocket.

So gen3 badass hardware is coming soon. What more info do you want? Made up specs that may or may not be true? Would preorders make you happy?

[apollojmr]

Honestly there are WAY too many obsessed people that cannot see the obviuos and consistently argue about AM and other companies. I have never in my life seen so many people that are DAILY posting bullcrap about speculation and bringing the value of an overnight multimillion dollar company down by speculating and starting rumors. I am ashamed to even have potential investors that WOULD bring the value up look at this thread. STOP acting like bitches and making this companies stock go down and START acting like grown ass adults that could have the capability to run a company. NOT (1) one person posting lately would even have the balls to come out in public and spread the bullshit rumors or say the stuff they say about how bad this company is. I have an idea..........stop whining about how FC never says shit and look at the facts. To quote an actual good post~"There's a lot of complaining in this thread lately, which is understandable, considering large swings in stock prices can cause strong emotions.
I just wanted to put this whole thing in a bit more perspective: about 16 months ago, Bitfountain collected about $100k from investors to complete some chips. Today, they have a large warchest of savings, a steady income stream, and they are working in parallel on the 3rd generation of chips, liquid cooling +++, and the company is "valued" at approximately $100 million (not to mention that investors have already collectively received payouts of about XBT 240k, almost $200 million at today's prices). In light of this, my personal opinion is that we should at least keep the discourse respectful.
From my point of view, the company has plenty of promise and is busy fulfilling the promise. Competition has grown stronger, but anybody surprised by that is a pinhead - it was obvious from the start there would be an ASIC price-war/arms race. But there will be several winners, and AM is well-positioned to be one of them: well-funded, well-located, experienced and (dare I say?) visionary.
I'm not trying to talk the price up or anything (I don't care much about the flavor of the month), I just wanted to point out that, in my humble opinion, AM has delivered magnificently so far, and has staying power for the long term."~Quote from bitfair~

So please quit speculating and whining about this company EVERYDAY and start doing something positive to get the value up.

[razorfishsl]

Actually it is you living in cloud Cookoo land, before you start crying about trolling, companies have a LEGAL responsibility for disclosure. 'secret' and 'non-disclosure' is a BULLSHIT cloud from which 'rip off' and 'con man' operate.

There is something called corporate responsibility, and certainly from my research into operations in Hong Kong, bitcoin operations are nearly always being operated illegally.
Problem is… that WITH A PROPERLY REGISTERED BUSINESS the Government actually indemnifies investors to a certain degree.
But they do demand that a company trading shares meets certain rules are related to accountancy, and in fact any PERSON trading shared in a HK' entity'/ 'instrument'  or indeed giving financial advice without proper regulatory approval can end up with a 5 year jail term, and a money laundering tag/investigation for anyone involved or invested with such companies.
And yes…. Publishing spreadsheets is considered  'giving advice' if the data contained in them has not been correctly audited by a CPA or they do not comply to the accountancy standards of Hong Kong, is also illegal.

Yep … operating out of Kwai Chung in HK does qualify the business to need proper registration AND FULLY COMPLY with HK regulation for disclosure of business details and accountancy standards.

So far I have only seen a couple of correctly registered bit-coin businesses in HK and in both cases the guys are completely open about their dealings.

Bitmit was another example of a bunch of mainland cowboys operating illegally out of HK…..

[jimmothy]

Actually it is you living in cloud Cookoo land, before you start crying about trolling, companies have a LEGAL responsibility for disclosure. 'secret' and 'non-disclosure' is a BULLSHIT cloud from which 'rip off' and 'con man' operate.

There is something called corporate responsibility, and certainly from my research into operations in Hong Kong, bitcoin operations are nearly always being operated illegally.
Problem is… that WITH A PROPERLY REGISTERED BUSINESS the Government actually indemnifies investors to a certain degree.
But they do demand that a company trading shares meets certain rules are related to accountancy, and in fact any PERSON trading shared in a HK' entity'/ 'instrument'  or indeed giving financial advice without proper regulatory approval can end up with a 5 year jail term, and a money laundering tag/investigation for anyone involved or invested with such companies.
And yes…. Publishing spreadsheets is considered  'giving advice' if the data contained in them has not been correctly audited by a CPA or they do not comply to the accountancy standards of Hong Kong, is also illegal.

Yep … operating out of Kwai Chung in HK does qualify the business to need proper registration AND FULLY COMPLY with HK regulation for disclosure of business details and accountancy standards.

So far I have only seen a couple of correctly registered bit-coin businesses in HK and in both cases the guys are completely open about their dealings.

Bitmit was another example of a bunch of mainland cowboys operating illegally out of HK…..

You fail to realize that asicminer is not selling additional shares. Thus there is literally no incentive or obligation for Friedcat to sit on the forums all day of every week pumping up the value of his company. FC owns more than 50% of shares so he is the boss. He has been generous enough to give us details like how tapeout is planned for jan which is all the info he has. He is not going to make up specs on nonexistant hardware to please everyone in this thread who most are probably not even invested in AM.

[Xu]

Seriously, what company on the planet has the CEO making announcements daily or even weekly. I wonder if some of you have ever held stock in any other company ever. Everyone knows communications should be better, but don't be expecting an announcement from FC over every dip in the stock price. I want him focused on GEN3 and the long term prospects.

For what it matters, here is my idea of perfect communications:

1) Every time a dividend is released, there is a brief announcement of what the composition of the dividend is. x from mining, y from franchising, and z from hardware sales. That's about it. Maybe if we were expecting something more a brief mention like "no dividends paid on hardware sales due to whatever".

2) Once a month have board meetings and let the board ask questions, and someone from the board can then post a summary of the meeting.

If we got that much communication, we would have better communications than pretty much any other company.

[empoweoqwj]

Actually it is you living in cloud Cookoo land, before you start crying about trolling, companies have a LEGAL responsibility for disclosure. 'secret' and 'non-disclosure' is a BULLSHIT cloud from which 'rip off' and 'con man' operate.

There is something called corporate responsibility, and certainly from my research into operations in Hong Kong, bitcoin operations are nearly always being operated illegally.
Problem is… that WITH A PROPERLY REGISTERED BUSINESS the Government actually indemnifies investors to a certain degree.
But they do demand that a company trading shares meets certain rules are related to accountancy, and in fact any PERSON trading shared in a HK' entity'/ 'instrument'  or indeed giving financial advice without proper regulatory approval can end up with a 5 year jail term, and a money laundering tag/investigation for anyone involved or invested with such companies.
And yes…. Publishing spreadsheets is considered  'giving advice' if the data contained in them has not been correctly audited by a CPA or they do not comply to the accountancy standards of Hong Kong, is also illegal.

Yep … operating out of Kwai Chung in HK does qualify the business to need proper registration AND FULLY COMPLY with HK regulation for disclosure of business details and accountancy standards.

So far I have only seen a couple of correctly registered bit-coin businesses in HK and in both cases the guys are completely open about their dealings.

Bitmit was another example of a bunch of mainland cowboys operating illegally out of HK…..

If you think AM "PROPERLY REGISTERED AS A BUSINESS" would mean the Chinese / HK government paying us money if FC ran off with all our bitcoins you are living in cloud cuckoo land, sorry.

We chose to trust AM, that's all. One day they may abuse that trust but it hasn't happened yet. Fingers crossed they keep "straight" for another 2-3 years and we will all do well.

Also, about communication. I do want to get more communication from AM, who doesn't. But its not because I'm thinking "he's not communicating, I bet he's planning to run off with all our bitcoins". I just want more info so I can make relatively informed investment decisions, and not the current "virtual vacuum of information" we have now.

Lots of con artists post loads and loads to their "investors" ands then .... poof - never hear from them again 

[jimmothy]

Actually it is you living in cloud Cookoo land, before you start crying about trolling, companies have a LEGAL responsibility for disclosure. 'secret' and 'non-disclosure' is a BULLSHIT cloud from which 'rip off' and 'con man' operate.

There is something called corporate responsibility, and certainly from my research into operations in Hong Kong, bitcoin operations are nearly always being operated illegally.
Problem is… that WITH A PROPERLY REGISTERED BUSINESS the Government actually indemnifies investors to a certain degree.
But they do demand that a company trading shares meets certain rules are related to accountancy, and in fact any PERSON trading shared in a HK' entity'/ 'instrument'  or indeed giving financial advice without proper regulatory approval can end up with a 5 year jail term, and a money laundering tag/investigation for anyone involved or invested with such companies.
And yes…. Publishing spreadsheets is considered  'giving advice' if the data contained in them has not been correctly audited by a CPA or they do not comply to the accountancy standards of Hong Kong, is also illegal.

Yep … operating out of Kwai Chung in HK does qualify the business to need proper registration AND FULLY COMPLY with HK regulation for disclosure of business details and accountancy standards.

So far I have only seen a couple of correctly registered bit-coin businesses in HK and in both cases the guys are completely open about their dealings.

Bitmit was another example of a bunch of mainland cowboys operating illegally out of HK…..

If you think AM "PROPERLY REGISTERED AS A BUSINESS" would mean the Chinese / HK government paying us money if FC ran off with all our bitcoins you are living in cloud cuckoo land, sorry.

We chose to trust AM, that's all. One day they may abuse that trust but it hasn't happened yet. Fingers crossed they keep "straight" for another 2-3 years and we will all do well.

Also, about communication. I do want to get more communication from AM, who doesn't. But its not because I'm thinking "he's not communicating, I bet he's planning to run off with all our bitcoins". I just want more info so I can make relatively informed investment decisions, and not the current "virtual vacuum of information" we have now.

Lots of con artists post loads and loads to their "investors" ands then .... poof - never hear from them again 

Wasn't Labcoin a "properly registered business" in HONG KONG?? Remember how great labcoin PR was until about a month ago?

[empoweoqwj]

Fingers crossed they keep "straight" for another 2-3 years and we will all do well.

Does this ever keep you up nights?  
Every once in a while I get to calculating, and can't let it go  
Dreams of prolific franchised containers full of boiling coolant -  forming 10% of the network. 2 years down the road, bitcoin has 2 more zeros to its valuation. Dividend x BTC x HOW many shares?  Mind=Blown

AM potential is imense. I am very happy to be onboard, regardless of share price.

Lol, no I don't worry at night about AM disappearing. I worry about  things I can control in life. Which isn't a great deal I admit ;-)

The Chinese news is a big deal though. It has put a stop to people actually *using* bitcoin in China to buy things. Baidu have stopped accepting it already. That's bad news for what we hoped would be widespread adoption in potentially the biggest market in the world.

[empoweoqwj]

One thing though ....

when bitcoin has a big rally, everyone comes out with their rationale for why the AM share price drops .... fair enough.

But when bitcoin suffers a "correction", the AM share price also drops.

I don't think we need complicated theories, explanations and discussions for why AM share prices drop both whilst bitcoin is in boom or bust mood.

The only thing we need to know is AM share price is constantly dropping, and has been since July. BTC/$ exchange rate ain't relevant.

I'd buy some more AM shares now, but with another 2-3 months before Gen3 is close to happening ......... I can see some real bargain prices coming up soon

[jimmothy]

Fingers crossed they keep "straight" for another 2-3 years and we will all do well.

Does this ever keep you up nights?  
Every once in a while I get to calculating, and can't let it go  
Dreams of prolific franchised containers full of boiling coolant -  forming 10% of the network. 2 years down the road, bitcoin has 2 more zeros to its valuation. Dividend x BTC x HOW many shares?  Mind=Blown

AM potential is imense. I am very happy to be onboard, regardless of share price.

Lol, no I don't worry at night about AM disappearing. I worry about  things I can control in life. Which isn't a great deal I admit ;-)

The Chinese news is a big deal though. It has put a stop to people actually *using* bitcoin in China to buy things. Baidu have stopped accepting it already. That's bad news for what we hoped would be widespread adoption in potentially the biggest market in the world.

I thought that was sensationalized news and they actually said it cannot be used as currency but can be used at their own risk. Baidu said they stopped accepting bitcoin because they were unsure of the situation.

[empoweoqwj]

I'd buy some more AM shares now, but with another 2-3 months before Gen3 is close to happening ......... I can see some real bargain prices coming up soon

  sshhhhh!

its  alright - there will be another 40 pages of crap to wade through before I get round to buying, and nobody will care (or even read) in January what people said in December. That's the beautiful world of bitcoin

[empoweoqwj]

Fingers crossed they keep "straight" for another 2-3 years and we will all do well.

Does this ever keep you up nights?  
Every once in a while I get to calculating, and can't let it go  
Dreams of prolific franchised containers full of boiling coolant -  forming 10% of the network. 2 years down the road, bitcoin has 2 more zeros to its valuation. Dividend x BTC x HOW many shares?  Mind=Blown

AM potential is imense. I am very happy to be onboard, regardless of share price.

Lol, no I don't worry at night about AM disappearing. I worry about  things I can control in life. Which isn't a great deal I admit ;-)

The Chinese news is a big deal though. It has put a stop to people actually *using* bitcoin in China to buy things. Baidu have stopped accepting it already. That's bad news for what we hoped would be widespread adoption in potentially the biggest market in the world.

I thought that was sensationalized news and they actually said it cannot be used as currency but can be used at their own risk. Baidu said they stopped accepting bitcoin because they were unsure of the situation.

But they have stopped. I don't think Baidu got "sensationalized" because the announcement was made in Chinese and they got the wrong end of the stick because of language difficulties 

[Puppet]

Wasn't Labcoin a "properly registered business" in HONG KONG??

Nope.
I-techpro (or something) was, but the CEO and sole shareholder of that company denied any involvement, responsibility or barely even any knowledge of labcoin.

[Zubilica]

Update

Next Gen Chips
The projected time of taping out of Gen3 is January 20. Power consumption target estimation is <0.2W per G on low power mode and <0.2$ per G on wafer cost. Please notice that the timeline is of course subject to change/adjust, and the estimation on power and cost is also based on software tool/simulation results.

Can anyone estimate after tape out , how much time will pass until chips are hashing in AM farm?

I know KNC said on July 30, 2013, that they did a tape out a some time ago, but they deliver the final product only October so i believe there are at least 3 months from tape out to hashing.

Please tell me if I'm mistaken, but we will see gen3 chips hashing and of April, beginning of May. Assuming everything goes smooth.

[Puppet]

Can anyone estimate after tape out , how much time will pass until chips are hashing in AM farm?

I know KNC said on July 30, 2013, that they did a tape out a some time ago, but they deliver the final product only October so i believe there are at least 3 months from tape out to hashing.

Please tell me if I'm mistaken, but we will see gen3 chips hashing and of April, beginning of May. Assuming everything goes smooth.

2-3 months should be considered a realistic minimum between tape out and deployment for normal production runs (ie without paying extra for hotlots) and assuming no serious issues anywhere with either design or supply chain. Hot lots might shave a few weeks off that, but reality usually adds more.

OTOH, if this chip will be 20nm like KnC's latest announcement, it might be considerbly longer. 20nm mask creation is slower due to the need for double patterning, and the whole process is still very new and not as well understood as mature processes. For a 20nm product anything before early Q3 seems extremely optimistic to me. (That also applies to KnC, Im not buying their Q1/2 claims).

FWIW.