ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[Anotheranonlol]

Speaking of BitFury: http://dcmagnates.com/bitfury-secures-20m-in-funding-half-from-gcf/

and they are seeking to acquire other bitcoin mining companies , maybe shareholders here can cross fingers for a buyout

Are you so sure?

See here: http://www.sec.gov/News/PressRelease/Detail/PressRelease/1370541972520#.U44_ImeKDmg

Bitfury used Picostocks/100 TH/s as a cover to get funding on their chip production. The difference here is while AM IPO investors got their money back, there are still LOTS of IPO investors screwed over from their 100 TH/s IPO. Will the VC's still stick around if the SEC starts digging and finds something rotten beneath the covers?

Heck, the SEC is even offering potential 10-30% reward of any reported scams over $1,000,000....

also chief executive of Bitfury have former affiliations with "Marketplaces that Facilitate Global Piracy and Counterfeiting"

http://www.ustr.gov/about-us/press-office/press-releases/2012/december/ustr-announces-results-special-301

I don't think these investor will care, they turn $20 million into $250 million as if by magic, so those things can sometimes get 'glossed over' . Bitfury's goal is to work towards going public on US stock markets

but maybe you can send a tip off for a nice payday and everything will be cancelled?

[Another User]

also chief executive of Bitfury have former affiliations with "Marketplaces that Facilitate Global Piracy and Counterfeiting"

http://www.ustr.gov/about-us/press-office/press-releases/2012/december/ustr-announces-results-special-301

I don't think these investor will care, they turn $20 million into $250 million as if by magic, so those things can sometimes get 'glossed over' . Bitfury's goal is to work towards going public on US stock markets

but maybe you can send a tip off for a nice payday and everything will be cancelled?

Well I don't care but the 100 TH/s IPO investors would. Their money was used on chip production and they even haven't received the mine that they were entitled to (as listed in the IPO contract, which was supposed to be mining by July 2013). And now Bitfury, who took their money, now receives $20 million and they're left with jack? I'm sure that will go over well on the "public US stock markets." VC's don't like any surprises...

Why would I send in a tip? That would be cheating  

But if you found out that someone scammed money from you and they were able to turn that money into $20 million for a "$250 million company" and you could prove it a court of law (they're a U.S. based company btw), would you really just walk away?

[Another User]

Well I don't care but the 100 TH/s IPO investors would. Their money was used on chip production and they even haven't received the mine that they were entitled to (as listed in the IPO contract, which was supposed to be mining by July 2013). And now Bitfury, who took their money, now receives $20 million and they're left with jack? I'm sure that will go over well on the "public US stock markets." VC's don't like any surprises...

Why would I send in a tip? That would be cheating  

But if you found out that someone scammed money from you and they were able to turn that money into $20 million for a "$250 million company" and you could prove it a court of law (they're a U.S. based company btw), would you really just walk away?

Let's check out a few things, shall we?

100 TH/s IPO shares - 518271 @ .04 BTC/share = 20730.84 BTC collected

"IPO Business Plan" - Claims to start mining by July '13 -> Actually doesn't start mining until Sept '13 because of "delays"

Meanwhile, Buzzdave is pimping Bitfury sales hard in the Mining hardware subforum here on July 7th 2013.

As we all know, Bitfury dumps TH/s onto the network last fall.

Meanwhile, IPO investors are getting daily div payments of 0.00001512 since Sept '13. It might take awhile to hit 0.04, huh? That's about 7 years if the difficulty doesn't change (LOL!).

Yep, I'd be a happy investor too. I OBVIOUSLY WOULDN'T TAKE ANY LEGAL RECOURSE AGAINST THEM EITHER, RIGHT ANOTHERANONLOL?!  

Mining companies that take money but fail to produce something is one thing, but a mining company that takes money from you, becomes successful, and then SCREWS the investors that made it possible...?

Yep, I think they would still be happy and not say a word. I mean, what's 10-30% of the collected fines from "$250 million dollar company" right? It's all sunshine and rainbows for Bitfury...  

[kaerf]

Well I don't care but the 100 TH/s IPO investors would. Their money was used on chip production and they even haven't received the mine that they were entitled to (as listed in the IPO contract, which was supposed to be mining by July 2013). And now Bitfury, who took their money, now receives $20 million and they're left with jack? I'm sure that will go over well on the "public US stock markets." VC's don't like any surprises...

Why would I send in a tip? That would be cheating  

But if you found out that someone scammed money from you and they were able to turn that money into $20 million for a "$250 million company" and you could prove it a court of law (they're a U.S. based company btw), would you really just walk away?

Let's check out a few things, shall we?

100 TH/s IPO shares - 518271 @ .04 BTC/share = 20730.84 BTC collected

"IPO Business Plan" - Claims to start mining by July '13 -> Actually doesn't start mining until Sept '13 because of "delays"

Meanwhile, Buzzdave is pimping Bitfury sales hard in the Mining hardware subforum here on July 7th 2013.

As we all know, Bitfury dumps TH/s onto the network last fall.

Meanwhile, IPO investors are getting daily div payments of 0.00001512 since Sept '13. It might take awhile to hit 0.04, huh? That's about 7 years if the difficulty doesn't change (LOL!).

Yep, I'd be a happy investor too. I OBVIOUSLY WOULDN'T TAKE ANY LEGAL RECOURSE AGAINST THEM EITHER, RIGHT ANOTHERANONLOL?!  

Mining companies that take money but fail to produce something is one thing, but a mining company that takes money from you, becomes successful, and then SCREWS the investors that made it possible...?

Yep, I think they would still be happy and not say a word. I mean, what's 10-30% of the collected fines from "$250 million dollar company" right? It's all sunshine and rainbows for Bitfury...  

OT:
FYI, the 100TH mine paid back dividends totaling the 0.04 BTC/share on Dec 27th 2013 (https://picostocks.com/docs/index/19). Note: it was the 100TH mine not 500TH mine...Tytus did not have to provide 5X the original promised hash rate but did. Initial investors were not shafted....now if you bought during the crazy spikes that's a different story.

Back on topic.

The fact that BF has raised $20M indicates they are going to aggressively expand. AM's growth is limited by how much money it is willing to spend vs payout in divs. If we want divs, then we have to give up growth...conversely, if we want growth we have to give up divs (and/or get outside funding).

EDIT: fixed repetitive sentence

[mc_lovin]

Back on topic.

The fact that BF has raised $20M indicates they are going to aggressively expand. AM's growth is limited by how much money it is willing to spend vs payout in divs. If we want growth, then we have to give up divs...conversely, if we want growth we have to give up divs (and/or get outside funding).

agreed.  if divs are hurting the company we should be able to hang tight without dumping shares the next day.  most companies don't pay divs often. 

but also let's get some cash flowing through, it's not the dividends that are hurting us, it's the huge waits.. january 20th was supposed to be tapeout and it was overdue back then. 

I hope AM can really pump out the chips, completely flood the market.  do that all year and pay us at christmas time, that I'd like to see.

[Chris_Sabian]

These times are merely a test of faith.

LOL

That was a well needed good laugh.

[Swordsoffreedom]

These times are merely a test of faith.

Bows down
I'm hanging around with Jesus Christ on the Bitcointalk forum
Woot Woot

A well needed laugh indeed

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

Anyone know how long direct share transfers take?

[skitchen]

Anyone know how long direct share transfers take?

How long will it take to repay those you stole from? (Yeah, me included)

[dhenson]

Anyone know how long direct share transfers take?

The actual tradefortress wouldn't have asked this question... no point in berating the guy, it's not him.

[skitchen]

Anyone know how long direct share transfers take?

The actual tradefortress wouldn't have asked this question... no point in berating the guy, it's not him.

Good point, what a bizarre situation.

[Ozziecoin]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

[RoadStress]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

[raskul]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

he is, in essence; succeeding so far... ploughing other peoples dividends into a long... yellow brick road and giving no update or explanation as to why he thinks this is prudent.

"I had your dividends, but I spent them." is as much as I can decipher so far, from this particular debacle.

[Ozziecoin]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

he is, in essence; succeeding so far... ploughing other peoples dividends into a long... yellow brick road and giving no update or explanation as to why he thinks this is prudent.

"I had your dividends, but I spent them." is as much as I can decipher so far, from this particular debacle.

I have never personally met the man, yet I trust him more than anyone else I've met in bitcoin land or anywhere else. It's strange even to me. Judge a man by his actions, not his words.

[raskul]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

he is, in essence; succeeding so far... ploughing other peoples dividends into a long... yellow brick road and giving no update or explanation as to why he thinks this is prudent.

"I had your dividends, but I spent them." is as much as I can decipher so far, from this particular debacle.

I have never personally met the man, yet I trust him more than anyone else I've met in bitcoin land or anywhere else. It's strange even to me. Judge a man by his actions, not his words.

and if there are no words, is that not a silent action? not that it really matters, at the end of the day, an investment is an investment; hadn't there been dates announced as to when dividends would start moving? or was that date announcements to tell you there would be date announcements (confusing inasmuch as the actions (not words) served nothing but to merely have caused confusion.)

[Ozziecoin]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

he is, in essence; succeeding so far... ploughing other peoples dividends into a long... yellow brick road and giving no update or explanation as to why he thinks this is prudent.

"I had your dividends, but I spent them." is as much as I can decipher so far, from this particular debacle.

I have never personally met the man, yet I trust him more than anyone else I've met in bitcoin land or anywhere else. It's strange even to me. Judge a man by his actions, not his words.

and if there are no words, is that not a silent action? not that it really matters, at the end of the day, an investment is an investment; hadn't there been dates announced as to when dividends would start moving? or was that date announcements to tell you there would be date announcements (confusing inasmuch as the actions (not words) served nothing but to merely have caused confusion.)

Mate, you sound, act, behave like a Wall St analyst. In bitcoin, there is no regulation. All you have is a man's reputation. I honestly can't see anyone here refund a $200k transaction fee.

[101111]

These times are merely a test of faith.

Bows down
I'm hanging around with Jesus Christ on the Bitcointalk forum
Woot Woot

A well needed laugh indeed

Tell us about turning wafer into mine.

[IPO Magic]

...I have never personally met the man, yet I trust him more than anyone else I've met in bitcoin land or anywhere else...

Amen Brother!  Let me hear you testify!

[arousedrhino]

My board contact says FC intends to flood market.

Let's see if he succeeds with last years power consumption chips.

he is, in essence; succeeding so far... ploughing other peoples dividends into a long... yellow brick road and giving no update or explanation as to why he thinks this is prudent.

"I had your dividends, but I spent them." is as much as I can decipher so far, from this particular debacle.

I have never personally met the man, yet I trust him more than anyone else I've met in bitcoin land or anywhere else. It's strange even to me. Judge a man by his actions, not his words.

and if there are no words, is that not a silent action? not that it really matters, at the end of the day, an investment is an investment; hadn't there been dates announced as to when dividends would start moving? or was that date announcements to tell you there would be date announcements (confusing inasmuch as the actions (not words) served nothing but to merely have caused confusion.)

Can you read?? The May 27th div date was a miscommunication from a board member to the thread. He later corrected it by posting part of the board meeting. FC never set a div date and the aggressive dividends were mentioned by another board member. FC just proposed a split.

See this quote.

Gentlemen,

don't get carried away by speculating on the quality of communication by friedcat. As pointed out multiple times, due to the nature of the operation there is little incentive to do extensive IR, other than the necessary accounting and communication through shareholder representatives (board). Instead the focus is on the core business. Friedcat decided to not pass the statements by the board first, but instead releasing them to the public directly.

Regarding the often quoted "aggressive dividends":
Let me take the blame here, because these are not friedcats words. Also I think there is massive confusion about what "aggressive" actually means. Thus let me remove any ambiguity by posting the text from the respective communication:

Code:

(BoardMember1) so I underatand that the next payments to the shareholders shoudl happen in May....
(BoardMember2) regarding dividends, do you have a target for retained earnings vs. dividends?
(BoardMember2) if retained earnings is high we need to consider the security mechanisms for the company treasury.
(FC) At most 1:2. Most retained are for short-time spendings (license, wafer/components order). There are no long-time plan of retaining since we won't buy land/bond/etc.
(BoardMember2) Alternatively AM could get "invested" in related businesses
(BoardMember2) If no opportunities exist I agree to an aggressive dividend schedule

As you can see there is no determination of timing other than FC's statement that short-term spendings need to be covered. The "aggressiveness" describes the overall split between retaining and paying out. That said, even board members assumed that dividends would resume in May with a 1:2 split of retained:payout.

Finally, I am shocked by the amount of outrage caused by what could be considered an uneducated interpretation of some raw data. The resemblance of this being a deliberate attempt to prey on the lack of insight and patience of new investors is strong. As pointed out previously, the financials are hard to read without context and further explanations.

I am committed to provide further information as it becomes available. However, some of the information which is important for company valuation is actually also crucial to pricing sales and thus falls within the realm of confidential information. Thus you cannot expect that this kind of information be released to the public. Anything else would be a level of transparency which is rather uncommon in these industries.