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Bonam
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September 03, 2014, 08:56:11 PM |
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That is an absurd argument. What matters for the company is building value, not satisfying some speculators in the secondary market.
What you should care as an investor is that the long term growth is sustainable, and if a solid proposition for growth exists, you should be happy that the company has the chance of reinvesting profits to fuel its growth.
That means, no dividends for shareholders.
If you don't know the difference between stock price and value, you better stay away from investments.
In the bitcoin universe, where the overwhelming majority of possible investments are scams or failures, it's important to continually demonstrate that one does not fit into that category. As for value... sure, I believe in value investing and use this strategy with my USD denominated investments. Tell me, what is the P/E for Asicminer? What is the Return on Capital? What is the fair value per share based on your estimates? Truth is, there is no recent hard info out there, and the last (outdated) financial report that is out there does not paint a particularly positive picture. In a marketplace where trust is limited and accountability is non-existent, generating a continual revenue stream for investors is important to demonstrate legitimacy, even if that sacrifices a portion of the profits that could otherwise have been re-invested in growth opportunities. |
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stompysteve
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September 03, 2014, 08:57:24 PM |
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I don't get all this talk like it is possible we hav. We know there are o't sold or deployed anything. Remember that giant farm everyone was talking about last week? The one that had 5% of the network and was only ~2/3 completed. The one that you could clearly tell from the pictures was filled with Hashratio devices built with BE200s. That facility alone will be eating a minimum of 15 PH of AM chips when finished. That is one facility, one customer. The article wasn't even clear that the 5% figure was for the entire site, and not just one building, that makes it possible (if not likely) that site may wind up being 40 PH+ installed.
we know there are other partners. We know there are direct sales. We know there is self mining. This generation of chips is obvioualy a disappointment, but it isn't like the company is about to go under. Everybody need to take a couple deep breaths and chill. Or don't, I'll buy some more shares at .12.
I wish I had more available btc to put walls up and accumulate shares If only I had some divs....  jk I'm fine with waiting |
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bitsalame
Donator
Hero Member
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Activity: 714
Merit: 510
Preaching the gospel of Satoshi
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September 03, 2014, 09:08:45 PM
Last edit: September 03, 2014, 09:37:16 PM by bitsalame |
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That is an absurd argument. What matters for the company is building value, not satisfying some speculators in the secondary market.
What you should care as an investor is that the long term growth is sustainable, and if a solid proposition for growth exists, you should be happy that the company has the chance of reinvesting profits to fuel its growth.
That means, no dividends for shareholders.
If you don't know the difference between stock price and value, you better stay away from investments.
In the bitcoin universe, where the overwhelming majority of possible investments are scams or failures, it's important to continually demonstrate that one does not fit into that category. As for value... sure, I believe in value investing and use this strategy with my USD denominated investments. Tell me, what is the P/E for Asicminer? What is the Return on Capital? What is the fair value per share based on your estimates? Truth is, there is no recent hard info out there, and the last (outdated) financial report that is out there does not paint a particularly positive picture. In a marketplace where trust is limited and accountability is non-existent, generating a continual revenue stream for investors is important to demonstrate legitimacy, even if that sacrifices a portion of the profits that could otherwise have been re-invested in growth opportunities. It is a startup, no matter what universe you are living in. All of us are actually angel investors, regardless of the fancy IPOing term they might have used for their crowdfunding. If you don't want to deal with risks, go put your money in hedge funds and play in etrade. If you want to support a growing company, do fucking support it. |
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NotLambchop
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September 03, 2014, 09:17:52 PM |
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...
What you should care as an investor is that the long term growth is sustainable, and if a solid proposition for growth exists, you should be happy that the company has the chance of reinvesting profits to fuel its growth.
That means, no dividends for shareholders.
In that case, I can make you the happiest investor alive: You're unlikely to ever see any dividends. No need to thank me. If you don't know the difference between stock price and value, you better stay away from investments.
Value: What bagholders would like you to believe the stock is worth. Price: What the last share actually sold for, usually a fraction of "value." @Bonam: Now that you know, stay away from investing in Bitcoin securities regardless (unless you're into humiliation/losing coin). Not a single offering on Havelock, for instance, is trading above its initial listing price. Not. A. One. ~Happy trading! |
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Mabsark
Legendary
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Activity: 826
Merit: 1004
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September 03, 2014, 09:24:59 PM |
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If you don't know the difference between stock price and value, you better stay away from investments.
It's pretty crazy how many people don't seem to understand this difference and think that the share price represents the value of AM. It's even more mind boggling considering that the majority of shares are not even available on exchanges. |
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Bonam
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September 03, 2014, 09:48:16 PM |
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It's pretty crazy how many people don't seem to understand this difference and think that the share price represents the value of AM. It's even more mind boggling considering that the majority of shares are not even available on exchanges.
So what is the value of AM? Got an estimate? |
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stompysteve
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September 03, 2014, 11:15:38 PM |
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It's pretty crazy how many people don't seem to understand this difference and think that the share price represents the value of AM. It's even more mind boggling considering that the majority of shares are not even available on exchanges.
So what is the value of AM? Got an estimate? |
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Bonam
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September 03, 2014, 11:36:21 PM |
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As I'm sure you are aware, that thread does not provide an accurate or reasonable recent valuation of AM. |
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jimmothy
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September 03, 2014, 11:42:09 PM |
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As I'm sure you are aware, that thread does not provide an accurate or reasonable recent valuation of AM. Not sure what you're expecting. Nobody here has the insider info to give you an "accurate or reasonable" valuation. (Besides FC) |
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troc
Newbie
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Merit: 0
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September 03, 2014, 11:47:23 PM |
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As I'm sure you are aware, that thread does not provide an accurate or reasonable recent valuation of AM. At least it is the right place to speculate, estimate or opine on such valuation |
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stompysteve
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September 03, 2014, 11:51:53 PM |
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As I'm sure you are aware, that thread does not provide an accurate or reasonable recent valuation of AM. At least it is the right place to speculate, estimate or opine on such valuation That's what I was getting at, if you asked over there you wouldn't get a real answer either |
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jjdub7
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September 04, 2014, 03:10:54 AM |
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It's pretty crazy how many people don't seem to understand this difference and think that the share price represents the value of AM. It's even more mind boggling considering that the majority of shares are not even available on exchanges.
So what is the value of AM? Got an estimate? More than CFIG, regardless of the current market caps. That I can say with >95% confidence. |
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jjdub7
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September 04, 2014, 11:03:43 AM |
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Is friedcat trading BTC in the fiat markets? Not necessarily with AM's funds, but maybe his own personal money? It would explain why he's been mute on addressing his forward guidance on dividends (RE: August). His trading would have an impact on the markets and which depending on the timing, could have a heavy effect on AM's profitability this quarter.
Edit - and also, since he holds a large stake and he already has projections for scheduling divs, he's essentially entitled to take his share of the profit distribution early...
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stompysteve
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September 04, 2014, 12:23:23 PM |
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Is friedcat trading BTC in the fiat markets? Not necessarily with AM's funds, but maybe his own personal money? It would explain why he's been mute on addressing his forward guidance on dividends (RE: August). His trading would have an impact on the markets and which depending on the timing, could have a heavy effect on AM's profitability this quarter.
Edit - and also, since he holds a large stake and he already has projections for scheduling divs, he's essentially entitled to take his share of the profit distribution early...
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NotLambchop
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September 04, 2014, 01:11:41 PM |
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^If I understand him correctly, jjdub7 is suggesting that, on top of managing AM, Friedcat is also taking care of our Bitcoin--by keeping as much of it out of your hands (and, consequently, off the market) as he can.
Not being invested in AM, I applaud that (if true).
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ensurance982
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September 04, 2014, 03:17:01 PM |
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Ha, really, FC effectively holding the BTC hostage so we can't cash them out prematurely really is a stretch  It's a joke of course, still a funny thought! People who are weak anyways, are going to sell their shares and lose even more |
We Support Currencies: BTC, LTC, USD, EUR, GBP
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Chris_Sabian
Legendary
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Activity: 896
Merit: 1001
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September 04, 2014, 03:34:07 PM |
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Either you believe in FC and AM or you don't. That's it.
Don't waste everyone's time by speculating on what is/can/will happening.
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xhomerx10
Legendary
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Activity: 4242
Merit: 9854
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September 04, 2014, 03:56:09 PM |
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Ha, really, FC effectively holding the BTC hostage so we can't cash them out prematurely really is a stretch It's a joke of course, still a funny thought! People who are weak anyways, are going to sell their shares and lose even more For the sake of all that is profane! Investing is not about strength or balls or masculinity!! Many weak and yes even weak-minded people have invested profitably and many of the world's strongest and brightest have lost more than you can fathom in markets. GIVE IT A REST! |
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webbrowser
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September 04, 2014, 04:20:02 PM |
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Due to the effectiveness of this campaign, we will add 20 slots for Hero Member.The pay is 0.1BTC per month. PM me if you want to join in the campaign.
1. Paging aahzmundus & Mabsark. 2. Go forth and spread the good word. 3. I guess it's good news that the campaign is very effective? Though I don't know how that's measured. |
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aahzmundus
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September 04, 2014, 05:56:30 PM |
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Due to the effectiveness of this campaign, we will add 20 slots for Hero Member.The pay is 0.1BTC per month. PM me if you want to join in the campaign.
1. Paging aahzmundus & Mabsark. 2. Go forth and spread the good word. 3. I guess it's good news that the campaign is very effective? Though I don't know how that's measured. It is probably just a way to quell my legitimate complaint... either way I am happy and responded to a PM I got. Thank you for the notice! At least we can see AM is active and doing things, that is a positive sign. |
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