Heh. I should have qualified my statement. I don't trade on MtSux any more, so it's possible on that exchange, but not likely on BTC-e.
who still use mtgox anyway ? but it is still the market mover  |
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[trolling] wow this is dangerous  [/trolling] |
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good morning guys, who see bitcoin hitting $1000+ this weekend ? |
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we should never put too much trust on one individual, Satoshi nakomoto designed the Bitcoin protocol so the trust is distributed among all miners and not one single pool/organization/individual, what is happening is a potential risk no matter how trustworthy the operator is.... otherwise I would not count on Ghash.IO because they are not trustworthy, what miners are not aware of is that this same pool tried to double spend few months ago when they had only 23% of the network hashpower and there is nothing stopping them from doing it again, especially now when they control this amount of power. for reference https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=327767.0please explain to me, why they have 0% fee ? what is the point ? now that they are being a big risk why didnt they do something about it ? the only effort they did is to release a statement that once they reach 51% that they will give the chance for people buying power there to point their miners to other pools but then it will be too late.... it seems that all effort we are doing doesn't count for anything, and it seems that miners doesn't give a flying fuck about the network security, and it seems that each time we talk about this risk is like we do them a free advertisement because their hash rate keep growing ever since. you miners are the only ones that can change this, so please start acting responsibly.  |
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From what I understand, 51%'ing a network does no harm unless the pool operator has bad intentions.
Are you really wiling to bet the value of of your (and mine and everyone else's) bitcoins to the intention of any single anonymous pool op ? It doesn't make sense why they would. They are hurting their own cash cow too otherwise. we should never put too much trust on one individual, Satoshi nakomoto designed the Bitcoin protocol so the trust is distributed among all miners and not one single pool/organization/individual, what is happening is a potential risk no matter how trustworthy the operator is.... otherwise I would not count on Ghash.IO because they are not trustworthy, what miners are not aware of is that this same pool tried to double spend few months ago when they had only 23% of the network hashpower and there is nothing stopping them from doing it again, especially now when they control this amount of power. for reference https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=327767.0please explain to me, why they have 0% fee ? what is the point ? now that they are being a big risk why didnt they do something about it ? the only effort they did is to release a statement that once they reach 51% that they will give the chance for people buying power there to point their miners to other pools but then it will be too late.... it seems that all effort we are doing doesn't count for anything, and it seems that miners doesn't give a flying fuck about the network security, and it seems that each time we talk about this risk is like we do them a free advertisement because their hash rate keep growing ever since. you miners are the only ones that can change this, so please start acting responsibly. |
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this is called horse shit, they did double spend @ 23% and nothing is preventing them from doing so now, they shouldn't have more than 33% ( read the selfish miner) neither any other pool no mater how honest the operator is, you never put trust on any individual it must be distributed equally among everyone on the network.. the is what Bitcoin as concept came to solve... you fucking noobs don't get it right ? you really piss me off !! "it is ok" , "it is not 51% yet" "they are honest" "who would destroy their business model" well I guess you think the same about your banks, it is now that we do something about it or it is too late.... The problem is that regular miners are attracted by 0% fees. You can do nothing unless you have enough BTC to incentive the half of the ghash.io miners to switch to your pool which also has 0% fees and you have enough resources to maintain such a pool. Edit: or, well, all their miners as ghash.io states that 55% is the external miners and 45% - internal ghash.io hashing resources. this is exactly what is worrying, it means that the regular miners has no clue neither cares about the network health, most of new comers try "generating free money" when just introduced to Bitcoin and this means they doesn't take any effort of understanding how Bitcoin protocol works.... I am really pissed off.... I wish I could change things.... nothing changed since I posted about this matter, in fact the hash rate keeps increasing, it is like we are doing them free advertisement instead of bringing awareness |
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I am really really pissed off, I cant believe how much ignorant this community has became really, I was expecting a drop in the hash power of that pool when I woke up, just to see that they are calmed down and everything is the same all because of an "official statement" from Ghash.IO "don't worry we wont fuck your wives and kids when we reach 51%"
this is called horse shit, they did double spend @ 23% and nothing is preventing them from doing so now, they shouldn't have more than 33% ( read the selfish miner) neither any other pool no mater how honest the operator is, you never put trust on any individual it must be distributed equally among everyone on the network.. the is what Bitcoin as concept came to solve...
"it is ok" , "it is not 51% yet" "they are honest" "who would destroy their business model" well I guess you think the same about your banks, it is now that we do something about it or it is too late....
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this is called horse shit, they did double spend @ 23% and nothing is preventing them from doing so now, they shouldn't have more than 33% ( read the selfish miner) neither any other pool no mater how honest the operator is, you never put trust on any individual it must be distributed equally among everyone on the network.. the is what Bitcoin as concept came to solve... you fucking noobs don't get it right ? you really piss me off !! "it is ok" , "it is not 51% yet" "they are honest" "who would destroy their business model" well I guess you think the same about your banks, it is now that we do something about it or it is too late.... |
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even if the obliviousness of speculators involved in cex.io really does result in a tragedy of the commons scenario, the returns are self-limiting. if they threaten the integrity of the whole project, no one profits, and the scheme collapses. i doubt bitcoin will be utterly destroyed, or even close, at this point, and so the worst that could happen would be a short period of blockchain instability that will be resolved after the panic dissolves the mining majority. Traders who have spent their whole careers speculating with other people's money don't care about the long term viability of anything. All they care about is whether they can sell anything they just bought for more than they paid for it. That is literally the only question that exists in their world. These people can cause a lot of damage. When they're given access to unlimited taxpayer money (overtly or covertly) they can destroy the world's financial system. Eventually Bitcoin will siphon away their ability to do this, assuming it survives through the short term. I just signed in to CEX.IO to tell people on chat about the threat, and no wonder that this is happening when people say "Ghash.IO have only 4 terahashs of Ghashs", and " you are spreading FUD to buy Ghs" holy fuck, they trashed me right away, these people have no Idea what they are doing, if they knew what they were doing they would simply buy a physical miner and mine at home and save half of what they are paying now!!! but as you said before they don't give a shit, they are just speculators, I can even bet that they even don't understand how the fuck Bitcoin Protocol works... |
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but now, who knows? right? GHASH COULD BE DOUBLE SPENDING AS WE SPEAK dun dun dunnn...
am i doing it right, guys? the whole panic thing?
lol  in all seriousness, i do recognize that it's a major issue, but i'm confident in the bitcoin community as a whole and the incentives built into the protocol. there is far too much at stake for miners to really be that oblivious and shortsighted to simply not reorganize themselves in order to SAVE BITCOIN (!), and even if they don't, as many have pointed out, outside of some third-party conspiracy against the project, GHASH isn't going to sabotage their own reputation and profits -- the incentives just don't line up. that being said, the alternating waves of panic and euphoria in this thread are almost frightening in their magnitude... --arepo I know, which makes me more confident about this community  , the sub Reddit looks like this now  |
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but now, who knows? right? GHASH COULD BE DOUBLE SPENDING AS WE SPEAK dun dun dunnn...
am i doing it right, guys? the whole panic thing?
--arepo ah ! no, the panic thing is so overused, no one will fall for it again, people think smarter today .... but seriously forget about speculation, how the F$#%& people keep buying into CEX.IO and others even join the pool ? does this new miners even spend time to get educated about the mechanism and concept of Bitcoin's protocol ? |
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I saw those post but come on we all know some thing else caused the drop , Huobi didn't even budge.
Just someone decided to sell those BTC1200? I don't know, but the volume on stamp was 737btc in one minute. The two minutes before is were 80 and 100btc. The minutes before it were 20btc, 4btc, <4btc. So I think somebody sold arount 750-900btc. Why do people do that? Why at once? because they can... |
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 this is how it looks now, the community have to do something about it |
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this is how it looks now, the community have to do something about it |
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this is how it looks like now.... it is really really not ok anymore..... move your miners to P2pool or other small pools |
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this is not safe.... |
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well I dunno how badly many will want to commit a double spend as it may ruin the value of their stashes
I completely agree that if GHash.IO achieved >50% for a period of time that it would very likely be a non-issue. Like many people have pointed out, they are incentivized to follow the rules; if they double-spend and orphan a bunch of long chains, we'll all find out and it would hurt their BTC holdings and mining reputation. But I must admit that I'd be happier if all pools had < 25%. really! what makes you think so? if they did double spend when they had 25% they will most likely do it again, refer to this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=327767.0they did double spend against Betcoin few months ago and we pointed that out, but no one cared, now it is time to give attention.... |
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Is GHash.IO primarily independent miners pointing their hashpower this way, or is mostly internal to GHash (e.g., hardware at cex.io, etc)?
both Hmm, I understand GHash does merged mining with alt coins and is thus more appealing to some miners. But I wonder why more aren't moving to Elegius or another smaller pool giving the current situation and potential (temporary) loss of confidence should something "funny" happen. Is this a "tragedy of the commons" or is it a case of "meh, whatever"? most new comers jumping into bitcoin first think about mining thinking of the "free money" they can get from mining, they doesn't fully understand how Bitcoins works so they doesn't care or/and doesn't spend much time understanding the protocol and this is the biggest problem... |
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Is GHash.IO primarily independent miners pointing their hashpower this way, or is mostly internal to GHash (e.g., hardware at cex.io, etc)?
both |
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