So just thinking on this too

Ion points = coinstand

Ion purchase pool = $20 floor buy back or way to tell people it has support at x level

Masternodes = mini hash stakers

Premine = premine

Ion slack (walled garden) = hashtalk (walled garden)

Am i the only one here feeling that someone took their xmas present and wrapped it back up and regifted it?

It seems like the same play with new clothes on it or a way to market it....

Bitpop head over to ion thread its the future!!!

You can't buy rayguns yet but if you dev a game for them they only take 70% of your profits giving you a generious 30% for all your hard work. 33% of the 70% they take from you adds to the market buys which makes a floor... or is it flaw?

Don't miss out bro!!

What im saying is team ionomy haven't given any real information on anything. Many questions asked here none answered. Im assuming its the same on slack channel as honestly the website doesn't address that.

So do you believe there is enough in depth information from ion for someone to happily invest money?

Gravity release will offer enough information on business model? So you know something we all don't? Tell me what do you think of the business model and how it pays devs. Do you think its a fair model and gives benefits to the dev? If so please explain. You haven't actually addressed any of my questions so far... just answered questions with questions.

It says 1 point per $3. I suspect this has to be at purchase time i.e you can't make portions of points its an all or nothing. You would have to do $900 of exactly $3 purchasese or exact multiples for this to get 300 points. If you buy the 99c or 1.99 packages you don't get a point but team ion get their 33% cut on the pool points etc... They are still making profit and can make the difference up easily. On top of this how many do you think are going to spend $900 on games the right way to get a $300 xbox? Most would just go buy the $300 xbox.

Maybe he wants to collect a paramour in every country! So he can spread his seed and have little bao's everywhere.. In centuries to come he'll be bigger than Ghengis khan gene which is approx 1 in 200 people they think... amusing how our society is governed to help these tossers and encourage them to run away.

Mr Coins said he's not an ion promoter he just retweets stuff from all crypto remember. Just isn't enough coins around to tweet about so he has to do ion 60% of the time.

Incorrect and you should know that... If you don't have enough data its cause they don't need your money,... thats a lie all companies want your money. Are you saying Garza didn't need peoples money? He gave no info where possible. Its because he had no data.... Its possible if no data is provided then there is no chance to make it look bad and hence more of a chance to get people on their own speculations.

On your first point i'd like you to clarify.. Team ion and ionomy give no real information so are you saying that people shouldn't invest?

OK some quick numbers

For each $1 in google app store spent
-> $0.30 goes to google

-> $0.70 goes to dev
then it splits based on ions model
$0.70 becomes
-> $0.231 to the dev (a)
-> $0.231 to the ion purchase pool (b)
-> $0.231 to the ion points system (c)

(a) The dev has lost the 70% profit and is now actually at 23.1%. Thats right you as a dev with all your hard work only now get 1/3 of the profit after all your invested time and effort but that other 2/3 goes to giving money to sellers on the market so basically you become a charity case. With taxes etc don't forget that 23.1% goes down!

- Additionally is team ion taking all the money through their account then paying you? If so thats lame and requires trust to them plus your source code would need to go to them to be compiled and uploaded to store for the verification so you lose your ip.
- Is it an honesty system and paid to them after your take... how do they enforce this?
- Does ionomy pay all relevant taxes? Since if the first case they are technically a licenser and you are the sub licencee.

How does ionomy increase your exposure? I mean the app stores highlight things.. is it just their site listing? Do they charge you for getting advertising out... is it just reliant on their community members? If community im not sure losing 2/3 profit is worth paying for that... there are many app groups that offer advertising on apps you can make it free app of the month etc, pay for advertising packages on game networks etc... better money spent and more control over your product. Ionomy makes no mention of how taking 2/3 of your profit and it is YOUR PROFIT benefits you... so far it seems their focus is to benefit their bagholders.

(b) The ion purchase pool.. it sends 1/3 of the game profit to buy ion at current market price. This is awesome because team ions masternode profits and premine can be sold at some almost promised flow if people buy ingame purchases on the app store!! Now don't forget that as its their market place they can also know trends etc and run their own bots to buy back that ion lower before other orders hit... ie inside trading. Im not saying this WILL happen just that it CAN happen. Its an unethical predicament they put themselves in but matlack is trustable so it probably won't right?

Now second point on this (b) part... when the ion is bought from market where does it go? Is it burned? No that would dilute supply and be silly.... does the dev get the ions? OR does the ion team reclaim the ions to their stash to be able to sell.
-> if dev gets it they would sell to make more money which drives market down
-> if ion team gets it they can hold and dump or slow trickle sell to up their profit... in essence consider that 33% of the app purchase profit to team ion as they get your btc in anycase.

(c) Ion points. Lets look at that xbox one s. Its due out soon and starts at $299... so 300 points $299 its around the same. What do i need to spend to get those 300 ion points? The youtube video says 1 point for every $3 spent. So thats technically $900 to get a $300 xbox. Personally i'd rather say screw ion and go buy that xbox for $299 then spend $600 on xbox one games, they are better than gravity and other likely made games but lets go with it anyway.
-> Its vague on the $3 = 1 point... is it cumulative? Is it for each purchase?
--> If each purchase notice its in the .99 cent barriers. I.e. 0.99c (opps under $1 no point for you), $2.99 (opps no point for you), $5.99 (you get 1 point but just shy of the 2 points). This means that you have to actually spend a lot more than $900 to get the 300 points which means with the $0.231 cents per dollar you end up funding your own xbox one, you aren't actually getting a discount on it with reward points.

Don't forget that since its likely overseas drop shippers warranty etc can become a pain in the ass. They won't be a return point and if they were postage would likely make returns unfeasable. Add on top that with this likely coming from usa you will be responsible for import duty costs etc to release your packages. Then you have devices like xboxes regionalised etc argh... the pain.


So what does the above all show? Well i don't see much benefit in being an ion dev. The norm set by apple in the market was take 30% and give rest to dev... ionomy has flipped this and said basically take 70% give dev 30%. This is shark like practice and is hidden with reward schemes etc that aren't really reward schemes.. they are self funded items. Each purchase only benefits team ion with more free ions and sell potential but will be supported by their ion bagholders as THEY THEMSELVES benefit from market sales. When there are no negatives to it from your side you won't take an unbiased approach to it you'll be selfish.

My advice to people particularly devs is to avoid ionomy. Its basically you do all the work and they take the fame and financials. However good programmers are smart and crafty buggers. They won't fall for the trap so what games are made will end up being copy paste ones from tutorial gaming sites.

Team ion has been deliberatly vague on it and won't answer questions nor show in depth how money with it works. I don't expect them to either.
Kids go to newgrounds the flash games there are free. Head to gamemaker forums and try some more free games and build with the community... its a true one that isn't out to take advantage of you... some very fun games there as well.

Don't like flash games? Spend your $2.99 on the xbox or playstation or nintendo marketplace and get some nice indie apps that have quality.

Korvas, Mr Coins, Wireshark or whatever shark name it was... your replies and counters to this all or does what i post make some sense and hold some merit?

I think this is incorrect. Korvas is trying to say that
- on the app store alone you might get 70% of the price but
- being through ionomy you make more because more exposure more people to drive sales. He's therefore saying that ion based projects will make 3 times as much at least for bulk purchasers.

However this is pure speculation from korvas as the ion team nor him have stated how they actually drive that traffic. This is pure hogwash as they haven't shown a model for such a thing. Their community is small so i don't think 1-100 downloads added if all people download will drive it.

Ion owners don't want to spend money on the games... they want to increase their ion price through OTHERS paying for the game stuff.

Korvas... how is it that ion is driving this 3 x exposure and customers? Is that what you are saying on your margin stuff? That devs will want to do that as it gives them 3x as many downloads?

So how is that ionomy is going to force a dev to pay them? Run all apps through their dev account so they get paid then pay the sub dev? This angle would be sketchy as you rely on ionomy paying you and would have to forfeit your source to them to upload.

An honesty system where dev pays ionomy?

Since ionomy is sub selling are they going to pay all the relevant taxes on behalf of the dev? Is this going to run through the current not public company? Each change opens just so many more questions up and i still believe the shills aren't doing true due dilligence like mr coins says he was. But hey they have and won't share with others cause they want more people to blindly invest rather than share their due dilligence that shows how good it is right?

The dev won't make more margin over full sales to themselves. Its the same app store community that buys regardless.

You are being vague... offering the end user more.. more end user benefit... more sales... what is this offering more you speak of? Actually say what more is not just be vague. Do you mean more fun more ?

You still haven't answered anything.

hmm paul vernon aka bao must be making more money selling sugar pills as cancer cures in his pharmacy chain in china... or does the closing mean china agencys caught up to him and hes coming home to usa?

What? No the model is actually good for everyone BUT the devs of games thats the point. A dev makes a game and gets only 33% of the cut the rest goes to the public. Its just moronic seriously think about this... its a reverse of designing something to make money. You end up working to make others money.

Its stupid... would you yourself make a game and put in all the effort only to take 33% profit instead of 70%? Thats what they are proposing.

Your only cry each time something like this is posted is o you all just hate ion. FFS just read what i posted above... it came from THEIR explanation video and its pretty clean cut. How about you counter it with WHY IT IS good and how devs aren't losing money deving games with ion? Else i can just play your game and recycle your post here... see how easy it is? and it contains no facts

Below is the reverse of you

The hatelove for ION just oozes out of every pour... your gonna build a model based on a video.... shock horrorcrazy awesome your gonna show the model as being badso profitable for everybody but the devs.

Looks like that's gonna be the theme of the next scooby doo episode which always ends with 'Drat you pesky devsfudders!!! You may have gotten away this time but just you wait..... '


Can you please post some benefits to this ion model and system instead of just a silly post again trying to blame fudders and hate and blah blah. Josh Garza did this exact same thing and it didn't help his cause much. What can't be argued is facts and some form of evidence or points for an against. You all seem to not want to do that... its either you don't have these points or realise the others posted are right but don't want to admit it.

So again post something worth reading point wise please? Contrary to what you might believe i would take it onboard and be interested to see it.

I just don't understand the DAO fullstop. Its not truely autonomous as there are humans in it so there is still some required manual work. You can vote etc blah blah fund start ups but you still have to rely on humans its not automated with money flowing in.

Well like everything its risk they paid the price of the risk thats about it.

The most secure of all crypto is bitcoin. Everyone wants bitcoin for their alts and service so what does that tell you? If they had faith in their own wouldn't they not take anything in ico and just award a premine to use.. not sell into btc etc?

Ethereum never had a chance with a central person vitalik running the show calling the shots and able to invent ether out of thin air like the banks. That was the only consideration i needed to stay away.

true but its more likely to be 45+ days. I've never staked at exactly 5 days as in on the dot.

yeah the old lol dao fucks up they shoulda bought ion our team of adam and programmers are so secure blah blah. its basically arrogance at the highest degree. I don't expect anyone thats invested to take it seriously onboard but i'm doing up some numbers again just to show how bad their store money to return is for both someone thats a dev making a game and those that pay for the in game purchases. I'll cover the ion points and junk and show how you are actually buying your own stuff and not actually getting free stuff from team ion. Its actually worse than coinstand... coinstand at least you put in xpy and they gave it at a higher value... this system is just pure pay your own products but make you think its a rewards system.

Guess ion investors are keen to spend more actual money without being able to use the ion and electrons they already have ingame?

Whats the concensus at the slack channel? Its all gawsome? Why go to the moon when you can hang in the ionosphere right?

Incorrect this is a LIE. You do not make $11 per stake. If you buy 1 million you are down 1 million sprouts in btc to start with. If you stake on the 5th day it will take you 50 days (5 day stakes x 10 (since each are 10%) ) to return the 100% you bought. after this your stakes are in profit.

You could stake once and sell the entire balance minus fees and make a slight amount.

However this is all a farce. You cannot buy at 1 sat as there is a queue for this. You need to place your order on the end and it may take 20 days to get to you so thats 70 days to return and thats assuming the coin doesn't deplete the buy side of 1 sat soon. Its not healthy over there.

Mr Fortune Cookie is on it though but its hard when too many shit in their own mouths instead of tending their plants to feed world hunger.

Just imagine how much ion you could buy with that 92btc... thats like so many lives and electrons to use your gun in gravity

Delisting doesn't happen straight away and i think you need to average 0.13btc a day over a week or something but its usually a few months before a delist.

True all altcoins getting slammed atm so maybe bittrex will reflect on that seeing as altcoins make up their business. I see a few possibilities
- pick the high point to cash some btc wait for the drop reinvest take the profit.
- convert to btc to avoid the drop, let it drop take alts back then when it stabilises you take profits

Its a cleansing of sorts... the strong alts survive the weeds die

Yeah i agree it was always planned to have a small community wait 1 year until inflation gets out of control then reduces to 1 sat before moon.. what a cunning plan.