Bitcoin XT - Officially #REKT (also goes for BIP101 fraud)

[MbccompanyX]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Why did Mike Hearn meet with the banks today? (self.Bitcoin) submitted 3 hours ago by xt_throwaway

Today, Mike was spotted attending a meeting in Shoreditch, London with 4 high level executives from the top banks in the UK. I have always found Mike's approach to Bitcoin core to be more than a little dictatorial and, while he is free to meet whomever he chooses, the lack of transparency and his general hubris and gungho 'my way or the highway' attitude to development has been bothering me for a long time.
Reaching consensus is frustrating, but it's not supposed to be easy when no one voice gets to shout loudest... And if those voices can't agree, the solution is to build a better consensus model that casts a wider net of opinions, not shrink the powerbase down to even fewer people.
Right now, coinbase are securing blockchain related patents and, in tandem, pushing hard for XT adoption... Those two factors alone should ring alarm bells.

I can't help but join the dots and consider the unsettling notion of a possible future scenario that sees there being only one 'legal' blockchain (XT) and development orchestrated by a straight-jacketed corporate dev team as opposed to freedom loving hackers.
The end result would be a blockchain that is heavily monitored, regulated and controlled by the same elitists that maintain the current system, levying the same kind of restrictions in trade and capital flow as we have right now.
With central banks moving towards banning physical cash, once can certainly see how the above scenario might usher in a very dark future indeed. Imagine Blockchain and financial privacy for 'them' whilst the majority of the population find themselves subjected to the most robust financial surveillance dragnet ever conceived of.

Hi-jacking the core development (and consensus model) of bitcoin would be the only way Dimon and his ilk could achieve their objectives of a fully regulated blockchain, especially if miners are forced at a later date to adopt only the 'legal' chain.
XT, alongside Coinbase with their 51 MTM licences, a pocketful of patents, and former Goldman Sachs exec. as founder, are poised to perform such a coup with Hearn right there at the helm.
And that's exactly what happens when men, drunk on power, think they know better than the crowd.

Who gets to decide the winner?

Government officials (in general) aren't against the nerds move to a decentralised world without banks, but it is clear the 0.1% with vested interests in maintaining the status quo won't go down without a fight (just see JP Morgan's attempts to patent blockchain tech).
But governments are not in charge of this revolution: this is a battle between true freedom-loving nerds and the money lenders of the old world. Government will side with whoever wins this last phase.

A call to arms

Instead of 'forking' this bitcoin reddit and trying to gain exposure for AMA's on a substandard forum with zero community, Roger Ver and others (who are supposedly invested in the idea of bitcoin because of its long term potential benefits for market freedom and propensity to end war and poverty) would do well to consider investing their time, money and energy into helping core devs build a robust consensus based platform that's available to the entire bitcoin ecosystem, and entering to clear dialogue on here so that we may get consensus on bitcoin core.
We all require patience at this stage, rushing into supporting XT over core at the expense of consensus and transparency in decision making, simply because it will solve short term scaling problems, is akin to opening pandora's box.
It's incumbent on all of us to get involved.

I don't think that the XT devs will merge into core, if they are making all this mess is because they want money, and we saw how they try to get attention even if they have 0 real fans

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[Lauda]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

[hdbuck]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

lel i applause your debunking efforts lauda

seemed to me at first you were a bit more in between, consensually smoothing the edges, but now you fully fell for teh dark side ^^

[muyuu]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

I didn't post it. Wish I knew Mikey was in Shoreditch before, but I didn't.

[Zarathustra]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

It's open source, you blockstream shill.

[notbatman]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

Well we know what happened to the last Bitcoin CEO... 

[yayayo]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

It's open source, you blockstream shill.

Yeah, the malevolent idiocy is very much open source.

ya.ya.yo!

[hdbuck]

^ nice sig! (may want to add meono, veritassapere, and peter 'charlatan' r)

h.d.buck!

[Zarathustra]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3s70xw/why_did_mike_hearn_meet_with_the_banks_today/

Look at the XT shills defending him there. Maybe he was just going to lunch with his uncle or friend.    I'm expecting similar idiotic excuses here as well. However, they can't downvote your post here. This is fishy behavior at best. Peter troll presenting papers and Hearn trying to become the CEO of Bitcoin; what a time to live in.

It's open source, you blockstream shill.

Yeah, the malevolent idiocy is very much open source.

ya.ya.yo!

ya.ya.yo! You blockstreamCoin shills will have to enjoy big blocks next year.

[tvbcof]

ya.ya.yo! You blockstreamCoin shills will have to enjoy big blocks next year.

I'll be enjoying your big blocks next year when I split my bitcoins and dump the bloatcoin competent.  Bring it on!

[Zarathustra]

[–]Noosterdam 4 Punkte vor 34 Minuten

It wasn't a mistake. Gavin did the right thing by exerting exit pressure (XT) rather than voice pressure (staying in Core), because having one monolithic implementation has already become Bitcoin's weak point. People think XT needs to reach 75% of mining power for it to succeed, but it doesn't. It just needs to hang over Core's head. Exit pressure is stronger than voice pressure, and it helps crack the centralization weak point of Core. Short term, we suffer some pain due to delayed blocksize increase, but long term we are spared greater pain by entering billion or trillion dollar market caps without the millstone of centralized development.


   
[–]Noosterdam 4 Punkte vor 30 Minuten

No matter the case, the economic majority can always avoid any such depredations by forking. That's why those in control of Core must frame forking as dangerous and messy. Forking is the only final way for the economic majority to convey its will. By keeping the conversation focused on Voice, they hope to hide from you the easy sidestep of Exit. If you discover Exit, you will be falsely told you are exiting the ledger rather than just the protocol ("XT is an altcoin!"), and if you still don't comply you will be silenced and neutered through "moderation."

 
[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

[tvbcof]

...
[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."
...

Oh goodie, Free Money!  What's not to love?

[brg444]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

[notbatman]

<sub>[–]Noosterdam 4 Punkte vor 34 Minuten

It wasn't a mistake. Gavin did the right thing by exerting exit pressure (XT) rather than voice pressure (staying in Core), because having one monolithic implementation has already become Bitcoin's weak point. People think XT needs to reach 75% of mining power for it to succeed, but it doesn't. It just needs to hang over Core's head. Exit pressure is stronger than voice pressure, and it helps crack the centralization weak point of Core. Short term, we suffer some pain due to delayed blocksize increase, but long term we are spared greater pain by entering billion or trillion dollar market caps without the millstone of centralized development.


   
[–]Noosterdam 4 Punkte vor 30 Minuten

No matter the case, the economic majority can always avoid any such depredations by forking.</sub> That's why those in control of Core must frame forking as dangerous and messy. <sub>Forking is the only final way for the economic majority to convey its will. By keeping the conversation focused on Voice, they hope to hide from you the easy sidestep of Exit. If you discover Exit, you will be falsely told you are exiting the ledger rather than just the protocol ("XT is an altcoin!"), and if you still don't comply you will be silenced and neutered through "moderation."

 
[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."</sub>

Forking is dangerous and messy, I remember when DOGE hard forked and the guys at BTCe were sleeping, what a mess!

[Zarathustra]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

[brg444]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

Millions of customers with a grand total of 1M (maybe) BTC in between them.

Such economic majority  

Did we forget Bitpay was on the verge of bankruptcy 1 month ago?

[Zarathustra]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

Millions of customers with a grand total of 1M (maybe) BTC in between them.

Such economic majority  

Did we forget Bitpay was on the verge of bankruptcy 1 month ago?

To have Millions of customers (coinbase, bitpay, blockchain.info) is better than having no customers (blockstream).
That's the reason why the companies with the customers will win the race.
"It's the economy, stupid!"

[hdbuck]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

Millions of customers with a grand total of 1M (maybe) BTC in between them.

Such economic majority  

Did we forget Bitpay was on the verge of bankruptcy 1 month ago?

To have Millions of customers (coinbase, bitpay, blockchain.info) is better than having no customers (blockstream).
That's the reason why the companies with the customers will win the race.
"It's the economy, stupid!"

Bitcoin have millions of users.





not customers.

[Zarathustra]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

Millions of customers with a grand total of 1M (maybe) BTC in between them.

Such economic majority  

Did we forget Bitpay was on the verge of bankruptcy 1 month ago?

To have Millions of customers (coinbase, bitpay, blockchain.info) is better than having no customers (blockstream).
That's the reason why the companies with the customers will win the race.
"It's the economy, stupid!"

Bitcoin have millions of users.


not customers.

Fiat has billions of users. But "it's the economy, stupid!"

[brg444]

[–]justusranvier [Bewertung versteckt] vor 11 Minuten

Bitcoin is - for good or for ill - going to follow those who produce the majority of the economic value.

Whether we like it or not, Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have a lot of power because when they exit they can convince more people to follow them because of positive economics:

"Follow me and I'll give you the things that you want: access to liquidity, merchants, and users."

The 1MB side can't do that because they don't have a positive economic value to offer, or at least what they're selling doesn't have many customers.

All they can offer is negative economics:

"Follow me and I'll refrain from verbally abusing you."

I see justusranvier doing his best to stoop to new lows everyday. At this point I can only believe he's getting paid for his opinion.

Coinbase, Bitpay & Bc.info the "economic majority"?

This is all sorts of hilarious.

Blockstream has some shills, but no customers. Coinbase, Bitpay and Blockchain.info have millions of customers. That's the difference.

Millions of customers with a grand total of 1M (maybe) BTC in between them.

Such economic majority  

Did we forget Bitpay was on the verge of bankruptcy 1 month ago?

To have Millions of customers (coinbase, bitpay, blockchain.info) is better than having no customers (blockstream).
That's the reason why the companies with the customers will win the race.
"It's the economy, stupid!"

Bitcoin have millions of users.


not customers.

Fiat has billions of users. But "it's the economy, stupid!"

and XT has 426 nodes as well as 0 blocks out of the last 1000 mined.

what "economic majority" are you speaking of ?