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Author Topic: [BETA]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading  (Read 136684 times)
unclescrooge
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April 12, 2013, 01:38:41 PM
 #781

Hello everyone,

We haven't had the time to update you before, but here as the latest news. During last night Mtgox outage, 6000 btc has been exchanged on our site. I am also glad that the price did hold on more than on other exchanges where it fell more. Maybe it was because of "short squeeze" (short users trying to exit their positions), or maybe it was because you panicked less, either way that's a good thing Smiley.

Some lenders asks us how do we do? We are doing fine. It has been a long sleepless night, but I'm actually proud of the way we handled it. There was very few liquidity on our platform, but it was still responsive and there has still been a lot of good trade opportunities. We didn't experienced a lot of forced execution as actually most of the long positions are in the hand of one trader who covered his margin properly.

I understand our "insurance" deposit raises questions. We will try to answer them as much as we can before putting it live, and be as transparent as we always are.

Let me know if you have any questions.
Raphael
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PRab
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April 12, 2013, 02:11:42 PM
 #782

Any thoughts/timeline on adding additional exchanges? I would like to see at least one more exchange (perhaps bitfloor or bitstamp) added to improve liquidity when MtGox is down.
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April 12, 2013, 05:33:16 PM
 #783

MtGox lag is kinda destroying Bitcoin isn't it?

Every time there is action on the exchanges it all just stops, and recently with all this crashing and MtGox doing cooling off periods. MtGox is the worst aspect to Bitcoin at the moment and they jeopardize so many companies including Bitfinex.

And the other Bitcoin exchanges all fall to pieces, bitfloor, BTC-24 all just crumbled down.

I hope everything gets better in Bitcoin world, its all looking a little dark at the moment.
Sukrim
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April 12, 2013, 06:27:54 PM
 #784

As I track my earnings from lending out USD and BTC on bitfinex.com and I like numbers, I created the following spreadsheet + charts on Google docs:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjDrki5tpdL3dFlYaU53cVozazJiYWo2S1ZQMHZiRWc#gid=5

It is filled with bogus data, but it's anyways to be used as template by you, simply create a copy yourself, delete the explanation sheet (after reading it) and enter your own data.
I hope this helps a few people to better track their earnings and maybe there are even some improvements to be made on this (eventually for example I plan to have some kind of ledger sheet and then weekly/monthly/yearly reports + charts) that I didn't think of yet.

As usual: No warranties, don't start plotting your plan on world domination with this sheet and always stay a bit critical towards stuff posted on the net!

I created a seperate thread as well, please direct questions about this project there: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=174968.0

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
superbit
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April 12, 2013, 08:23:18 PM
 #785

As I track my earnings from lending out USD and BTC on bitfinex.com and I like numbers, I created the following spreadsheet + charts on Google docs:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjDrki5tpdL3dFlYaU53cVozazJiYWo2S1ZQMHZiRWc#gid=5

It is filled with bogus data, but it's anyways to be used as template by you, simply create a copy yourself, delete the explanation sheet (after reading it) and enter your own data.
I hope this helps a few people to better track their earnings and maybe there are even some improvements to be made on this (eventually for example I plan to have some kind of ledger sheet and then weekly/monthly/yearly reports + charts) that I didn't think of yet.

As usual: No warranties, don't start plotting your plan on world domination with this sheet and always stay a bit critical towards stuff posted on the net!

I created a seperate thread as well, please direct questions about this project there: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=174968.0

Thanks, you could use "iferror" instead of if statements to fix the Div/0 error and not bloat anything.

https://bitfinex.com/?refcode=UInJLQ5KpA <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with the refcode
My feedback thread: Forum thread
Sukrim
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April 12, 2013, 08:40:06 PM
 #786

Fixed, thanks! Smiley

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
superbit
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April 12, 2013, 09:11:42 PM
 #787

I know there is a ton of things you guys are working on but here are a couple of other tweaks:

1.) On the lending page don't center the smaller table in the middle of the larger one.  Have them both start at the top, avoids constantly scrolling to try and match the closest offers.

2.) Have a total for lenders of the money available to be lent "NOT" currently in an offer.


https://bitfinex.com/?refcode=UInJLQ5KpA <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with the refcode
My feedback thread: Forum thread
Elwar
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April 12, 2013, 09:12:02 PM
 #788

Just started using your site.

Interesting. I am glad that I can get some interest on my bitcoins that would have otherwise just been sitting somewhere.

But I tried some margin trading and after borrowing some dollars to then trade I put in the order and it just sat there. I put it in at market and the price kept dropping and the order never went through.

Either way, I will just stick with lending for now.

http://www.bitpools.com
Pool your bitcoins with others. Vote on solutions using the Bitcoin blockchain. Keep your bitcoins in your cold storage until you find a solution you like.
Links and Reviews of useful every day places to spend bitcoins: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=943143.0
myself
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April 12, 2013, 10:19:04 PM
 #789

Just started using your site.

Interesting. I am glad that I can get some interest on my bitcoins that would have otherwise just been sitting somewhere.

But I tried some margin trading and after borrowing some dollars to then trade I put in the order and it just sat there. I put it in at market and the price kept dropping and the order never went through.

Either way, I will just stick with lending for now.
if mtgox is lagging it will take some time :/

Los desesperados publican que lo inventó el rey que rabió, porque todo son en el rabias y mas rabias, disgustos y mas disgustos, pezares y mas pezares; si el que compra algunas partidas vé que baxan, rabia de haver comprado; si suben, rabia de que no compró mas; si compra, suben, vende, gana y buelan aun á mas alto precio del que ha vendido; rabia de que vendió por menor precio: si no compra ni vende y ván subiendo, rabia de que haviendo tenido impulsos de comprar, no llegó á lograr los impulsos; si van baxando, rabia de que, haviendo tenido amagos de vender, no se resolvió á gozar los amagos; si le dan algun consejo y acierta, rabia de que no se lo dieron antes; si yerra, rabia de que se lo dieron; con que todo son inquietudes, todo arrepentimientos, tododelirios, luchando siempre lo insufrible con lo feliz, lo indomito con lo tranquilo y lo rabioso con lo deleytable.
simonk83
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April 13, 2013, 12:24:22 AM
 #790

Is anyone else's interest payment a bit short today?   Mine seems to be about $80 less than I worked it out to be...

I've had the same loan out at the same rate for at least the last 24 hours, so the calculation isn't too difficult.   Bitfinex guys, let me know if I need to email your support address.
Sukrim
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April 13, 2013, 12:41:34 AM
 #791

I got 1/3 of yesterday's high-roller rates (270% instead of ~800%)... Sounds a bit low to me too, especially considering that ~1/2 of my loans still exist (at 800%+ rates - even with 10% fees and if half of my funds were not lent out (they were!) I should have gotten ~350% returns today), but on the other hand it's not really possible from the data I have to calculate anything as I don't know how long and often positions were actually taken.

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
simonk83
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April 13, 2013, 12:44:27 AM
 #792

I sent them an email anyway.   Mine are fairly easy to work out (at least the one that were open since the last interest payment, but I had several other loans open and close during that time so the payment should be even more).   I assume there's just an issue with their system at the mo.

EDIT:  Hmm, something's definitely screwy.  I'm not able to lend out my interest payment, even though it appears in the Lendable Balance section.   It's telling me "Insufficient Balance".
Ichthyo
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April 13, 2013, 01:04:19 AM
 #793

Just started using your site.

Interesting. I am glad that I can get some interest on my bitcoins that would have otherwise just been sitting somewhere.

But I tried some margin trading and after borrowing some dollars to then trade I put in the order and it just sat there. I put it in at market and the price kept dropping and the order never went through.

Hello Elwar, just some random ideas from another user here:

Whenever you start trading, make sure you understand how to limit the rate of the loans. Whenever you actually open a position, you also take a loan. And the rate is limited by the settings at the left side of the trading form.

Since you want to lend your bitcoins, you should consider that in the last weeks the demand for USD was way higher than the demand for bitcoins. Thus you get the really interesting rates only for USD. One possibility is to sell some of your BTC in the integrated exchange and then transfer the USD you get into the "deposit" wallet. Of course this means that from the moment you have sold you're no longer participating in any gains/losses due to the BTC/USD rate movement.
Sukrim
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April 13, 2013, 01:08:04 AM
 #794

EDIT:  Hmm, something's definitely screwy.  I'm not able to lend out my interest payment, even though it appears in the Lendable Balance section.   It's telling me "Insufficient Balance".
Mine got in an offer via auto-lend just fine. Try with one cent less (123.45 available = 123.44 offer), sometimes rounding is a bitch...

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
simonk83
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April 13, 2013, 01:09:18 AM
 #795

EDIT:  Hmm, something's definitely screwy.  I'm not able to lend out my interest payment, even though it appears in the Lendable Balance section.   It's telling me "Insufficient Balance".
Mine got in an offer via auto-lend just fine. Try with one cent less (123.45 available = 123.44 offer), sometimes rounding is a bitch...

Yeah I tried that (actually tried knocking $10 off it as well), but no dice.   Odd.  Perhaps it has something to do with the interest payment being wrong.

EDIT:  Seems to have decided to work Smiley   Just need to wait for them to look at the interest payment now, but perhaps they're sleeping (not sure what time zone they're in).
Sukrim
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April 13, 2013, 01:13:53 AM
 #796

Meh, Raphy shall have his beauty sleep and enjoy a session pondering over database logs on a nice Saturday morning! Tongue

On different news, people seem to buy coins again like crazy currently.

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
urwhatuknow
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April 13, 2013, 01:14:55 AM
 #797

I sent them an email anyway.   Mine are fairly easy to work out (at least the one that were open since the last interest payment, but I had several other loans open and close during that time so the payment should be even more).   I assume there's just an issue with their system at the mo.

EDIT:  Hmm, something's definitely screwy.  I'm not able to lend out my interest payment, even though it appears in the Lendable Balance section.   It's telling me "Insufficient Balance".


Cool down guys

Raphael is sleeping now and tomorrow he will sort everything as usual, supposed there is a real problem.
Please keep in mind that after the breakdown on MtGox last night something could have gone wrong in the forced liquidations and for this reason some recalculation must have happened.
What is sure on the other hand is the fact that a lot of leveraged traders closed their positions and this caused a drop in today's interest rate.
Having said that I'm always amazed how easy is to get used to interest rates that must be considered as a "spike" phenomenon and therefore limited in time.
The fact that your interest payment today was much lower than yesterday is perfectly understandable if you think about all I've said and if I were you I would think twice before using the word "screwy" again.
Seriously, I believe you should show some respect and gratitude for what we at Bitfinex are all doing for you.
In other words, if you have better options feel free to exercise them.

Giancarlo
Customers Relations
The Bitfinex Group  

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simonk83
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April 13, 2013, 01:18:58 AM
 #798



Having said that I'm always amazed how easy is to get used to interest rates that must be considered as a "spike" phenomenon and therefore limited in time.
The fact that your interest payment today was much lower than yesterday is perfectly understandable if you think about all I've said and if I were you I would think twice before using the word "screwy" again.
Seriously, I believe you should show some respect and gratitude for what we at Bitfinex are all doing for you.
In other words, if you have better options feel free to exercise them.

Giancarlo
Customers Relations
The Bitfinex Group  

Ok, relax, I'm more trying to help you guys than anything.  I'm just pointing out that the system is doing some strange things this morning.  

As far as the interest payment being lower, it shouldn't apply, as I have had the same three loans out for about 3 days straight now.  They weren't closed at all, so have been accruing full interest for the full 24 hours between payouts.   Just the amount is wrong.

With regards to the screwyness, I wasn't able to lend out any of my interest payment for a few hours, so I'd say that's an issue.  Again, I'm just pointing it out to you guys so you can take a look.  I'm not shouting, and I'm not panicking.   I appreciate your work, and your fast responses to any issues I've had so far.  If we don't report issues, then you aren't able to fix them.

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April 13, 2013, 01:30:47 AM
 #799

Same for me, and also as I pointed out my lending positions are still showing up as taken and active since more than 1 day, so either this is a display issue with my loans or something went wrong in the calculation. With the data I have in my history tab I simply can't help by calculating that myself, so I just wanted to say that there seems to be something going on that might hint at a bug (maybe only actively used loans in open positions give interest?).

Same with VIR jumping wildly between 800% and 400-200%. This is something that happened before (and actually caused quite a crash in the lending market for 1 day on March 29th as someone managed to manipulate VIR to a few million% or so) and since then "myself" or Raphael said they implemented some smoothing by averaging over the last 30 days instead of just the current loans. Still there were some serious jumps, only this time downwards, not up. This could hint at errors or still some issues - if the next time this jumps up again suddenly instead, it might again force liquidate all VIR positions... far worse than me not earning a handful of dollars, so that's why I report that stuff.

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
myself
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April 13, 2013, 02:12:53 AM
 #800

Still there were some serious jumps, only this time downwards, not up. This could hint at errors or still some issues - if the next time this jumps up again suddenly instead, it might again force liquidate all VIR positions...
it went down because of the volume

800k versus 200k is quite allot so when ppl took 400k in loans below vir that did pull down the VIR

Los desesperados publican que lo inventó el rey que rabió, porque todo son en el rabias y mas rabias, disgustos y mas disgustos, pezares y mas pezares; si el que compra algunas partidas vé que baxan, rabia de haver comprado; si suben, rabia de que no compró mas; si compra, suben, vende, gana y buelan aun á mas alto precio del que ha vendido; rabia de que vendió por menor precio: si no compra ni vende y ván subiendo, rabia de que haviendo tenido impulsos de comprar, no llegó á lograr los impulsos; si van baxando, rabia de que, haviendo tenido amagos de vender, no se resolvió á gozar los amagos; si le dan algun consejo y acierta, rabia de que no se lo dieron antes; si yerra, rabia de que se lo dieron; con que todo son inquietudes, todo arrepentimientos, tododelirios, luchando siempre lo insufrible con lo feliz, lo indomito con lo tranquilo y lo rabioso con lo deleytable.
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