Health and Religion

[akram143]

Anybody has thoughts about life after death?

Most people believe the judgement day but scientifically once we died its the end.

[af_newbie]

Let me guess, God is not part of everything and you know this because someone like CoinCube told you. Lol.

You guys are comedians. You make shit up as you go.

The reverse is true actually. I learned about most of these concepts because someone like BADecker told me. I rejected them for a very long time until I could no longer deny their inherent rationality and truth.

I don't make anything up. I make rational arguments and highlight the assumptions I make in those arguments. I may occasionally speculate but when I do I clearly identify the idea as speculation and advise the reader to think about the topic and reach their own conclusion not simply rely on my musings.

The concept of an infinite God's necessary distance to allow a finite creation to exist is actually a very deep one. However, you won't appreciate it because you don't believe in God. To be honest its not a topic I fully grasp. However for those interested in the topic here is an interesting article on it. A brief excerpt below full article at link.

Tzimtzum: A Kabbalistic Theory of Creation by Dr. Sanford Drob
http://thejewishreview.org/articles/?id=121

An article in a recent issue of U.S. News and World Report begins with what would seem at first to be a rather odd question for one of our nation's major news weeklies. How, the article asks, did the universe begin and it proceeds to provide the following by way of an answer:

"In the beginning, there was no time, no matter, not even space. Then in some unfathomable way, a universe emerged from a dimensionless point of pure energy (U.S. News and World Report, March 26, 1990)."

This, the article assures us, is as close to a description of 'the beginning' as science can currently provide, and it is to probe deeper into the questions of cosmic origins that the National Aeronautics and Space Administration plans, on April 12, 1990, to place the 1.5 billion dollar Hubble Space Telescope into earth orbit on the most sophisticated scientific satellite ever constructed.

As I pondered the news weekly's description of creation, I was struck by what appears to be at least a superficial similarity to the account of creation provided in the Kabbalah. Indeed, the description reads almost as if it were a translation from a passage in the opening pages of Chayim Vital's Sefer Etz Chayyim, the classic exposition of the Kabbalah of the Ari, Rabbi Isaac Luria. Rabbi Luria, starting from completely different assumptions and operating in a universe of discourse which is, to use an unusually precise metaphor, light years away from the Hubble telescope, arrived at the very same conclusion: that the universe emerged from a dimensionless point which gave rise to a world of matter, space, and time. Only, for the kabbalists, that dimensionless point is not so much an impenetrable beginning, but is rather the end result of a process occurring within God Himself. This process, known as tzimtzum (divine contraction or concealment) is, according to the Lurianic scheme, the very essence of creation; it is the means by which an infinite unified God "makes room," so to speak, for a finite, pluralistic world. Through an understanding of the doctrine of tzimtzum we may, without ever turning our gaze upon the astronomical heavens, gain some genuine insight into how a universe of matter, space and time could emerge from a single point in a metaphysical void.

The kabbalistic account of creation is, to the uninitiated, a very strange, difficult and perhaps even disturbing notion. However, it is a notion which gives expression to a series of paradoxical, but deeply profound ideas. Amongst them is the notion that the universe as we know it is the result of a cosmic negation. The world, according to Lurianic kabbalah, is not so much a something which has been created from nothing, but rather a genre of nothingness resulting from a contraction or concealment of the only true reality, which is God. A closely related notion is the idea that it is the very unfathomability and unknowability of God and His ways which is the sine qua non of creation itself. Creation, the doctrine of tzimtzum implies, is, in its very essence, "that which does not know."

One cannot be expected to understand or accept such notions without some significant and serious explanation. In this essay I offer a philosophical exposition, commentary, and in some respects, elaboration of the concept of tzimtzum as it appears in the kabbalistic system of Rabbi Isaac Luria (1534‑1572) and his disciples such as Rabbi Chayim Vital and later, Rabbi Schneur Zalman of Lyadi. In addition, I offer an idealist and rationalist philosophical context in which these ideas can, I believe, be best understood.

Good going, taking advise from a guy who thinks the evolution is a hoax and Earth is less than 10,000 years old.

You know that you just assigned an attribute (infinite) to something that you yourself said cannot be defined (God). I guess reason is not your friend.

Like I said, you make shit up as you go.  Making excuses for your delusion.

Let me use your logic to say, God is undefined and non-existent.  See, I just assigned a new property just as valid as any of yours, badecker’s or notbatman’s.

I just realized that I might be talking to a real schizophrenic.  So please excuse me, I have to leave this ward.

[Astargath]

Do you think god is all powerful and knows everything? Because if you do, your logic is seriously fucked, like really fucked.

Please elaborate.

It's fairly easy, if you think god is all powerful and knows everything, the bible can be logically disproved. An all powerful, all knowing god would not get mad and kill everyone because he 'failed', he can't fail, he can't be mad, he can't have our feelings.

[CoinCube]

Good going, taking advise from a guy who thinks the evolution is a hoax and Earth is less than 10,000 years old.

You know that you just assigned an attribute (infinite) to something that you yourself said cannot be defined (God). I guess reason is not your friend.

Like I said, you make shit up as you go.  Making excuses for your delusion.

Let me use your logic to say, God is undefined and non-existent.  See, I just assigned a new property just as valid as any of yours, badecker’s or notbatman’s.

I just realized that I might be talking to a real schizophrenic.  So please excuse me, I have to leave this ward.

Again it would be helpful if you actually read what I wrote before replying. I did not hear about these ideas from BADecker but someone like him a resolute believer if you will. BADecker and I probably disagree about the age of the earth and some aspects of evolution. That is ok and the difference in interpretation is not worth debating at least not here where there are more important fundamental disputes under discussion.

I have highlighted how we can mathematically deduce The incompleteness of the universe and logically conclude that whatever is outside the universe must be boundless, immaterial, indivisible and an uncaused cause.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1373864.msg23796852#msg23796852

Of the very limited logical options on what could exist outside of the universe I would argue the best logical solution is that of an infinite creator. The monotheistic conceptualization of God is consistent with what we can mathematically deduce.

Your are correct another faith can be chosen.  You can choose a faith in nothingness or non-existence. An infinity of nothingness is still nothing. Everyone is free to do as you have and choose emptiness and concurrently define yourself as your own god.

The universe is structured in such a way that you are not compelled in the choice. You are free.

You appear to suffer from a profound inability to understand any perspective other then your own. I assume that is why you insist on calling everyone who disagrees with you insane.

[CoinCube]

It's fairly easy, if you think god is all powerful and knows everything, the bible can be logically disproved. An all powerful, all knowing god would not get mad and kill everyone because he 'failed', he can't fail, he can't be mad, he can't have our feelings.

God can’t fail we can. We can fail because we have been given freedom. Our choices are not compelled.

This article had a nice summary on this topic.

God’s Anger
by Caleb Colley Ph.D.
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=12&article=1462

[Astargath]

It's fairly easy, if you think god is all powerful and knows everything, the bible can be logically disproved. An all powerful, all knowing god would not get mad and kill everyone because he 'failed', he can't fail, he can't be mad, he can't have our feelings.

God can’t fail we can. We can fail because we have been given freedom. Our choices are not compelled.

This article had a nice summary on this topic.

God’s Anger
by Caleb Colley Ph.D.
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=12&article=1462

''God’s anger is rationally retributive. His anger is His direct, calculated response to sin.''

Actually, his 'anger' is nothing but rational. Consider this example, you know everything, you can do anything. A rock falls on your friend and kills him, do you get mad? Of course not because you could have prevented it, you allowed it to happen and you already knew thousands of years ago that it would happen so there is simply no logical reason to get mad. I understand humans have free will, so what? God created them that way and knew what would happen so again, no reason to be mad.

Also big logical inconsistencies, god wanted us to have free will but he himself killed millions.

[CoinCube]

God’s Anger
by Caleb Colley Ph.D.
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=12&article=1462

''God’s anger is rationally retributive. His anger is His direct, calculated response to sin.''

Actually, his 'anger' is nothing but rational. Consider this example, you know everything, you can do anything. A rock falls on your friend and kills him, do you get mad? Of course not because you could have prevented it, you allowed it to happen and you already knew thousands of years ago that it would happen so there is simply no logical reason to get mad. I understand humans have free will, so what? God created them that way and knew what would happen so again, no reason to be mad.

Also big logical inconsistencies, god wanted us to have free will but he himself killed millions.

The overwhelming majority of human suffering is human caused either via direct malevolence or indirect negligence. It could only be averted by removing human free will and making us slaves or the long hard path of gradual planetwide moral perfection.

Your example of a rock falling on someone is an exception suffering caused by a combination of human ignorance of nature (lack of awareness that a rock will fall) and general human frailty. Both of these lessor causes of suffering are self limited. They are things that we will gradually and naturally outgrow with technological progress if we can get control of our self induced harm.

Now you could argue that a loving God would set up the universe in such a way that ignorance alone would not end us. He would step in and make sure that life was not over for us when we foolishly stepped under falling rocks or when our natural bodies give out on us because we lack the knowledge to keep them functional and regenerated past the age of 80.

The Christian worldview holds that this is exactly what he has done. You just need to apologize for foolishly walking under falling rocks on a regular basis genuinely try to stop doing that and ask him to save you and he will preserve you and elevate you to a state where that ignorance and frailty do not exist. He is not just the friend who pushes you out from under the falling rock so that you can die of old age in 20 years he is the friend who brings you back to life and in such a way that falling rocks and old age will never threaten you again.

The Christian view requires faith, however, not a faith in nothingness but a faith in God. Free will necessitates honoring the choices we make in this world. If we choose to define ourselves as our own gods as independent entities apart from detached and unbeholden to God I suspect that choice would have to be honored. To do anything else would be to trample on free will.

[af_newbie]

God’s Anger
by Caleb Colley Ph.D.
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=12&article=1462

''God’s anger is rationally retributive. His anger is His direct, calculated response to sin.''

Actually, his 'anger' is nothing but rational. Consider this example, you know everything, you can do anything. A rock falls on your friend and kills him, do you get mad? Of course not because you could have prevented it, you allowed it to happen and you already knew thousands of years ago that it would happen so there is simply no logical reason to get mad. I understand humans have free will, so what? God created them that way and knew what would happen so again, no reason to be mad.

Also big logical inconsistencies, god wanted us to have free will but he himself killed millions.

The overwhelming majority of human suffering is human caused either via direct malevolence or indirect negligence. It could only be averted by removing human free will and making us slaves or the long hard path of gradual planetwide moral perfection.

Your example of a rock falling on someone is an exception suffering caused by a combination of human ignorance of nature (lack of awareness that a rock will fall) and general human frailty. Both of these lessor causes of suffering are self limited. They are things that we will gradually and naturally outgrow with technological progress if we can get control of our self induced harm.

Now you could argue that a loving God would set up the universe in such a way that ignorance alone would not end us. He would step in and make sure that life was not over for us when we foolishly stepped under falling rocks or when our natural bodies give out on us because we lack the knowledge to keep them functional and regenerated past the age of 80.

The Christian worldview holds that this is exactly what he has done. You just need to apologize for foolishly walking under falling rocks on a regular basis genuinely try to stop doing that and ask him to save you and he will preserve you and elevate you to a state where that ignorance and frailty do not exist. He is not just the friend who pushes you out from under the falling rock so that you can die of old age in 20 years he is the friend who brings you back to life and in such a way that falling rocks and old age will never threaten you again.

The Christian view requires faith, however, not a faith in nothingness but a faith in God. Free will necessitates honoring the choices we make in this world. If we choose to define ourselves as our own gods as independent entities apart from detached and unbeholden to God I suspect that choice would have to be honored. To do anything else would be to trample on free will.

Children born with birth defects or HIV did not have much choice, didn't they?  What sin did the newborns commit?

You make as much sense as a hippopotamus explaining Shakespeare.

[CoinCube]

Children born with birth defects or HIV did not have much choice, didn't they?  What sin did the newborns commit?

You make as much sense as a hippopotamus explaining Shakespeare.

Newborns clearly have not sinned. They may suffer however do to the choices made outside of their control. Children born with HIV are suffering because of the choices of the elder generation usually their father or mother. Human choices do harm the innocent.

Children with cancer are dying because a part of them has broken away and defected. It no longer acts in its assigned role for the greater good but instead strengths itself over the short run via unrestrained growth. Left unchecked that growth will eventually disrupt the delicate balance necessary for life and will end in death.

[Astargath]

Children born with birth defects or HIV did not have much choice, didn't they?  What sin did the newborns commit?

You make as much sense as a hippopotamus explaining Shakespeare.

Newborns clearly have not sinned. They may suffer however do to the choices made outside of their control. Children born with HIV are suffering because of the choices of the elder generation usually their father or mother. Human choices do harm the innocent.

Children with cancer are dying because a part of them has broken away and defected. It no longer acts in its assigned role for the greater good but instead strengths itself over the short run via unrestrained growth. Left unchecked that growth will eventually disrupt the delicate balance necessary for life and will end in death.

There is no reason why a loving god would allow that, there is no point for a baby to be alive for only a few days just to die, it's just suffering for no reason and god could prevent it without tampering with free will, he doesn't because he doesn't exist.

''It could only be averted by removing human free will and making us slaves'' Are you talking about going to heaven here? Because that's what has to happen if god wants to prevent evil there.

[af_newbie]

Children born with birth defects or HIV did not have much choice, didn't they?  What sin did the newborns commit?

You make as much sense as a hippopotamus explaining Shakespeare.

Newborns clearly have not sinned. They may suffer however do to the choices made outside of their control. Children born with HIV are suffering because of the choices of the elder generation usually their father or mother. Human choices do harm the innocent.

Children with cancer are dying because a part of them has broken away and defected. It no longer acts in its assigned role for the greater good but instead strengths itself over the short run via unrestrained growth. Left unchecked that growth will eventually disrupt the delicate balance necessary for life and will end in death.

If you follow that regression of fault, you will end up at God, he who is responsible for everything.

According to your twisted logic, parents suffer having a baby with birth defects, not only by the choices they make or don't make, but by the choices of their parents (as did the baby), and so on, all the way to God.

All your "blame the victim's parents" logic leads you to your main character.

Remind me who created and then punished Adam and Eve?

[CoinCube]

If you follow that regression of fault, you will end up at God, he who is responsible for everything.

According to your twisted logic, parents suffer having a baby with birth defects, not only by the choices they make or don't make, but by the choices of their parents (as did the baby), and so on, all the way to God.

All your "blame the victim's parents" logic leads you to your main character.

Remind me who created and then punished Adam and Eve?

Birth defects are caused by many things they can be a result of genetics, lifestyle choices and behaviors, exposure to certain medications and chemicals, infections during pregnancy, a combination of these factors, ect.

Many of these drug use, alcohol consumption, smoking during pregnancy, inadequate prenatal care,
untreated bacterial infections can be traced to deliberate human action or inaction. Others like family history of birth defects or other genetic disorders are currently outside the realm of human choice. These are hopefully problems of ignorance and will be resolvable in the near future with our increasing knowledge.

You are correct that you can trace the ultimate cause of all events good and bad to God.  
So why did God create a universe where evil, horror, and suffering exist? The problem of evil is a deep question. Here is a short video on the subject I agree with.

Why Does God Allow Evil?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAexl_loCfg

[Astargath]

If you follow that regression of fault, you will end up at God, he who is responsible for everything.

According to your twisted logic, parents suffer having a baby with birth defects, not only by the choices they make or don't make, but by the choices of their parents (as did the baby), and so on, all the way to God.

All your "blame the victim's parents" logic leads you to your main character.

Remind me who created and then punished Adam and Eve?

Birth defects are caused by many things they can be a result of genetics, lifestyle choices and behaviors, exposure to certain medications and chemicals, infections during pregnancy, a combination of these factors, ect.

Many of these drug use, alcohol consumption, smoking during pregnancy, inadequate prenatal care,
untreated bacterial infections can be traced to deliberate human action or inaction. Others like family history of birth defects or other genetic disorders are currently outside the realm of human choice. These are hopefully problems of ignorance and will be resolvable in the near future with our increasing knowledge.

You are correct that you can trace the ultimate cause of all events good and bad to God.  
So why did God create a universe where evil, horror, and suffering exist? The problem of evil is a deep question. Here is a short video on the subject I agree with.

Why Does God Allow Evil?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAexl_loCfg

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

[BADecker]

Children born with birth defects or HIV did not have much choice, didn't they?  What sin did the newborns commit?

You make as much sense as a hippopotamus explaining Shakespeare.

Newborns clearly have not sinned. They may suffer however do to the choices made outside of their control. Children born with HIV are suffering because of the choices of the elder generation usually their father or mother. Human choices do harm the innocent.

Children with cancer are dying because a part of them has broken away and defected. It no longer acts in its assigned role for the greater good but instead strengths itself over the short run via unrestrained growth. Left unchecked that growth will eventually disrupt the delicate balance necessary for life and will end in death.

If you follow that regression of fault, you will end up at God, he who is responsible for everything.

According to your twisted logic, parents suffer having a baby with birth defects, not only by the choices they make or don't make, but by the choices of their parents (as did the baby), and so on, all the way to God.

All your "blame the victim's parents" logic leads you to your main character.

Remind me who created and then punished Adam and Eve?

If you follow that regression of thought, you will end up with people, who are attempting to thwart the good God does, by not accepting Him.

So you see, it is the ungodly who are using their freedom to cause all the pain and trouble in the world, because the greatest evil is to be against God, if only by not acknowledging Him.

[BADecker]

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

It works like this:

At the time God made everything, there was no evil. There was only good and better.

God works in everything, because none of it would work at all if God did not work it. Since there wasn't any evil originally, there was no reason for God to NOT move in full force with the thing He was doing... bringing to birth children.

Then evil entered through the children and the devil selecting evil rather than good. But God was already moving in the direction of maintaining all things. You don't simply tell God to put on the brakes when He does something with His strength. The thing He did with His strength was to maintain everything... some of it with free choice, some of it evil, and some good.

The thing that God is doing to get rid of evil is, God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter. This present universe will crash, and once it does, there will be no remembrance of either the good or evil here. So, God is destroying the evil in His own way, even though a few people must live in pain for a hundred years here. When it is done, there will be no remembrance that it even happened.

God will take the people who are on His side - in favor of Him - to the new universe. The others will be destroyed in Hell, because they are the evil that God is getting rid of. Of course, because of the kind of beings people are, it will take all eternity for them to be destroyed. But they asked for it.

[Astargath]

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

It works like this:

At the time God made everything, there was no evil. There was only good and better.

God works in everything, because none of it would work at all if God did not work it. Since there wasn't any evil originally, there was no reason for God to NOT move in full force with the thing He was doing... bringing to birth children.

Then evil entered through the children and the devil selecting evil rather than good. But God was already moving in the direction of maintaining all things. You don't simply tell God to put on the brakes when He does something with His strength. The thing He did with His strength was to maintain everything... some of it with free choice, some of it evil, and some good.

The thing that God is doing to get rid of evil is, God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter. This present universe will crash, and once it does, there will be no remembrance of either the good or evil here. So, God is destroying the evil in His own way, even though a few people must live in pain for a hundred years here. When it is done, there will be no remembrance that it even happened.

God will take the people who are on His side - in favor of Him - to the new universe. The others will be destroyed in Hell, because they are the evil that God is getting rid of. Of course, because of the kind of beings people are, it will take all eternity for them to be destroyed. But they asked for it.

''God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter.'' Then why didn't he make this one like that to begin with LOL, how illogical can you guys be??

[BADecker]

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

It works like this:

At the time God made everything, there was no evil. There was only good and better.

God works in everything, because none of it would work at all if God did not work it. Since there wasn't any evil originally, there was no reason for God to NOT move in full force with the thing He was doing... bringing to birth children.

Then evil entered through the children and the devil selecting evil rather than good. But God was already moving in the direction of maintaining all things. You don't simply tell God to put on the brakes when He does something with His strength. The thing He did with His strength was to maintain everything... some of it with free choice, some of it evil, and some good.

The thing that God is doing to get rid of evil is, God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter. This present universe will crash, and once it does, there will be no remembrance of either the good or evil here. So, God is destroying the evil in His own way, even though a few people must live in pain for a hundred years here. When it is done, there will be no remembrance that it even happened.

God will take the people who are on His side - in favor of Him - to the new universe. The others will be destroyed in Hell, because they are the evil that God is getting rid of. Of course, because of the kind of beings people are, it will take all eternity for them to be destroyed. But they asked for it.

''God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter.'' Then why didn't he make this one like that to begin with LOL, how illogical can you guys be??

How in the world dumb are you? God made it this way so that people could prove to themselves what their free will would do. How did they prove it to themselves? By the way they used it.

Oh sure. God could have just let them be what they wanted to be. And then they would wake up in H or H and wonder why they were there. But this way they don't have any excuse for the place they go. They can see how they chose it. But once there, there won't be any looking back, because of the pain, or because of the joy.

I mean, if you want freedom to choose the good or the bad, make your choice. And if you don't want the bad, turn the other way and choose the good.

The new universe, or the decaying old (Hell)... is simply the reward for the choice made.

What? You don't want the freedom to choose? So that you don't choose the wrong thing? You of all people have the knowledge to choose the good rather than the bad. And you seem to only want the bad. So, what's the difference for you? You are going where you are going because you chose it.

What? You don't like the idea that some other people don't know how to make the right choice, or don't have an easy time of choosing? Well, make the right choice, and then get out there and help them make the right choice by becoming a preacher yourself. As it is, you are only trying to get them to make the wrong choice. What's the matter? Do you think their presence will matter at all to you once you are in Hell?

[CoinCube]

HOW RELIGION IN THE UNITED STATES AVAILS ITSELF OF DEMOCRATIC TENDENCIES
By Alexis de Tocqueville

"There is hardly any human action, however particular it may be, that does not originate in some very general idea men have conceived of the Deity, of his relation to mankind, of the nature of their own souls, and of their duties to their fellow creatures. Nor can anything prevent these ideas from being the common spring from which all the rest emanates.

Men are therefore immeasurably interested in acquiring fixed ideas of God, of the soul, and of their general duties to their Creator and their fellow men; for doubt on these first principles would abandon all their actions to chance and would condemn them in some way to disorder and impotence.

This, then, is the subject on which it is most important for each of us to have fixed ideas; and unhappily it is also the subject on which it is most difficult for each of us, left to himself, to settle his opinions by the sole force of his reason. None but minds singularly free from the ordinary cares of life, minds at once penetrating, subtle, and trained by thinking, can, even with much time and care, sound the depths of these truths that are so necessary. And, indeed, we see that philosophers are themselves almost always surrounded with uncertainties; that at every step the natural light which illuminates their path grows dimmer and less secure, and that, in spite of all their efforts, they have discovered as yet only a few conflicting notions, on which the mind of man has been tossed about for thousands of years without every firmly grasping the truth or finding novelty even in its errors. Studies of this nature are far above the average capacity of men
...
When the religion of a people is destroyed, doubt gets hold of the higher powers of the intellect and half paralyzes all the others. Every man accustoms himself to having only confused and changing notions on the subjects most interesting to his fellow creatures and himself. His opinions are ill-defended and easily abandoned; and, in despair of ever solving by himself the hard problems respecting the destiny of man, he ignobly submits to think no more about them.

Such a condition cannot but enervate the soul, relax the springs of the will, and prepare a people for servitude. Not only does it happen in such a case that they allow their freedom to be taken from them; they frequently surrender it themselves. When there is no longer any principle of authority in religion any more than in politics, men are speedily frightened at the aspect of this unbounded independence. The constant agitation of all surrounding things alarms and exhausts them. As everything is at sea in the sphere of the mind, they determine at least that the mechanism of society shall be firm and fixed; and as they cannot resume their ancient belief, they assume a master.

For my own part, I doubt whether man can ever support at the same time complete religious independence and entire political freedom. And I am inclined to think that if faith be wanting in him, he must be subject; and if he be free, he must believe."

[af_newbie]

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

It works like this:

At the time God made everything, there was no evil. There was only good and better.

God works in everything, because none of it would work at all if God did not work it. Since there wasn't any evil originally, there was no reason for God to NOT move in full force with the thing He was doing... bringing to birth children.

Then evil entered through the children and the devil selecting evil rather than good. But God was already moving in the direction of maintaining all things. You don't simply tell God to put on the brakes when He does something with His strength. The thing He did with His strength was to maintain everything... some of it with free choice, some of it evil, and some good.

The thing that God is doing to get rid of evil is, God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter. This present universe will crash, and once it does, there will be no remembrance of either the good or evil here. So, God is destroying the evil in His own way, even though a few people must live in pain for a hundred years here. When it is done, there will be no remembrance that it even happened.

God will take the people who are on His side - in favor of Him - to the new universe. The others will be destroyed in Hell, because they are the evil that God is getting rid of. Of course, because of the kind of beings people are, it will take all eternity for them to be destroyed. But they asked for it.

''God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter.'' Then why didn't he make this one like that to begin with LOL, how illogical can you guys be??

How in the world dumb are you? God made it this way so that people could prove to themselves what their free will would do. How did they prove it to themselves? By the way they used it.

Oh sure. God could have just let them be what they wanted to be. And then they would wake up in H or H and wonder why they were there. But this way they don't have any excuse for the place they go. They can see how they chose it. But once there, there won't be any looking back, because of the pain, or because of the joy.

I mean, if you want freedom to choose the good or the bad, make your choice. And if you don't want the bad, turn the other way and choose the good.

The new universe, or the decaying old (Hell)... is simply the reward for the choice made.

What? You don't want the freedom to choose? So that you don't choose the wrong thing? You of all people have the knowledge to choose the good rather than the bad. And you seem to only want the bad. So, what's the difference for you? You are going where you are going because you chose it.

What? You don't like the idea that some other people don't know how to make the right choice, or don't have an easy time of choosing? Well, make the right choice, and then get out there and help them make the right choice by becoming a preacher yourself. As it is, you are only trying to get them to make the wrong choice. What's the matter? Do you think their presence will matter at all to you once you are in Hell?

This bit about the new universe is kind of new information. LOL.

Are you on God's mailing list?  You seem to know a lot about what your God wants and what he did, is doing and will do in the future.

Hmm, are you sure, maybe you are God?

[Astargath]

Crap video. if god can prevent evil in heaven then why hasn't he done it already? Please, a 10 year old would understand how illogical it is.

It works like this:

At the time God made everything, there was no evil. There was only good and better.

God works in everything, because none of it would work at all if God did not work it. Since there wasn't any evil originally, there was no reason for God to NOT move in full force with the thing He was doing... bringing to birth children.

Then evil entered through the children and the devil selecting evil rather than good. But God was already moving in the direction of maintaining all things. You don't simply tell God to put on the brakes when He does something with His strength. The thing He did with His strength was to maintain everything... some of it with free choice, some of it evil, and some good.

The thing that God is doing to get rid of evil is, God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter. This present universe will crash, and once it does, there will be no remembrance of either the good or evil here. So, God is destroying the evil in His own way, even though a few people must live in pain for a hundred years here. When it is done, there will be no remembrance that it even happened.

God will take the people who are on His side - in favor of Him - to the new universe. The others will be destroyed in Hell, because they are the evil that God is getting rid of. Of course, because of the kind of beings people are, it will take all eternity for them to be destroyed. But they asked for it.

''God is making a new universe where evil will not be allowed to enter.'' Then why didn't he make this one like that to begin with LOL, how illogical can you guys be??

How in the world dumb are you? God made it this way so that people could prove to themselves what their free will would do. How did they prove it to themselves? By the way they used it.

Oh sure. God could have just let them be what they wanted to be. And then they would wake up in H or H and wonder why they were there. But this way they don't have any excuse for the place they go. They can see how they chose it. But once there, there won't be any looking back, because of the pain, or because of the joy.

I mean, if you want freedom to choose the good or the bad, make your choice. And if you don't want the bad, turn the other way and choose the good.

The new universe, or the decaying old (Hell)... is simply the reward for the choice made.

What? You don't want the freedom to choose? So that you don't choose the wrong thing? You of all people have the knowledge to choose the good rather than the bad. And you seem to only want the bad. So, what's the difference for you? You are going where you are going because you chose it.

What? You don't like the idea that some other people don't know how to make the right choice, or don't have an easy time of choosing? Well, make the right choice, and then get out there and help them make the right choice by becoming a preacher yourself. As it is, you are only trying to get them to make the wrong choice. What's the matter? Do you think their presence will matter at all to you once you are in Hell?

How will god prevent evil in the new universe though, people will still have free choice, no? Therefore they can still commit crimes there, again, 0 logic. What about children born there once we go there? How will he make sure they are born not evil? Garbage argument.