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Author Topic: [ANN][KMD][dPoW] Komodo - Zcash Zero Knowledge Privacy Secured by Bitcoin  (Read 1087830 times)
Breasal
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September 15, 2016, 01:26:00 PM
 #701

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.260

https://blog.okturtles.com/2016/09/how-to-compromise-zcash-and-take-over-the-world/

http://weuse.cash/2016/06/09/btc-xmr-zcash/

How to handle the trusted setup concern/problem?
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September 15, 2016, 01:48:43 PM
 #702

If to postulate infinite resources are used against anything, well, how can it have a chance?

I prefer to be realistic and trust that the technical competency of the zcash team is high enough that they wont be fooled into running contaminated compilers, which seems to be the main theory of how zcash will be compromised.

https://z.cash/blog/snark-parameters.html

http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bitcoin/snarks/Secure%20sampling%20of%20public%20parameters%20for%20succinct%20zero%20knowledge%20proofs.pdf

There’s a kind of “cryptographic toxic waste”, which if it were to be created and exploited, would allow the attacker to counterfeit currency (although it wouldn’t allow them to violate anyone’s privacy). Our plan to prevent that uses a secure multiparty computation in which a set of well-known people each contribute, in such a way that if any one of them successfully destroys their shard, then the cryptographic toxic waste can never come into existence. We’re also working on other potential long-term defenses against risks like this.


My assessment is that the probability of zcash parameters being compromised are much smaller than ring signatures being deanonymized via brute force statistical correlations.

You need to put things in perspective. Knowing the zcash devs, I put zero probability that ALL of them are govt operatives. And it would require all of them to be cooperating. So, what is required is that all of their systems are compromised without their knowing about it. Now there are not just the average joe computer users, they are arguably the most skilled in the field and all of them will be fooled into using compromised setups?

Please, let us be realistic. Even in this horror of horrors, we end up with a situation that is similar to fiat system where new supply is created without controls. However, anybody with the resources to do this can already print money and the failure mode is not loss of privacy, but loss of control over the money supply.

So, using the logic that an uneconomic attack is not a real attack, I dont worry much about this "attack" vector. By the way, if we ignore uneconomic attacks, all of crypto is vulnerable as you can brute force every single privkey given enough resources, might take a few decades and the entire output of the silicon industry, but when costs dont matter, such details can be ignored

Also, based on the initial market price point we are seeing on bitmex, most people are not overly concerned over this. Basically anybody that is willing to use any centralized system is taking much much greater risks than this "compromise zcash" attack chances

tl:dr I trust daira will not generate params on a compromised setup

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
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September 15, 2016, 05:20:07 PM
 #703

Following this project with interest. Where I can read the whitepaper?

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September 15, 2016, 05:21:44 PM
 #704

Following this project with interest. Where I can read the whitepaper?
very soon!!





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jl777
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September 15, 2016, 06:34:03 PM
 #705

Following this project with interest. Where I can read the whitepaper?
Starting https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1605144.msg16245305#msg16245305 I explain various technical aspects. I submitted draft whitepaper for review already, but not sure how long it will be

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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September 15, 2016, 06:52:27 PM
 #706

Hi all!

Question about BTCD swap:
I understood that all of those 90% of KMD will be sold for BTC/BTCD investors, but how do you guys know how much KMD:s will be given to BTC investors, since you don't know how many BTCD owners will swap in 1 year swapping period? Or do you plan to wait 1 year and then share the percents, when we know how much to give BTC investors and how many to BTCD swappers?

The more BTC gets invested, the higher the percent they get will be. Only after the ICO ends we can calculate how many KMD coins goes to the BTC investors and how many to BTCD investors. Likewise we can calculate the KMD/BTC and KMD/BTCD exchange rates only after the ICO.

Like James already said, we must assume all the BTCD will be swapped and reserve enough KMD tokens for them.

Following this project with interest. Where I can read the whitepaper?

White paper is coming! We recommend joining our newsletter, so you won't miss it!

www.komodoplatform.com <- to join the newsletter
steemit.com/@komodoplatform <- Also follow us on Steemit!

◈▣ KOMODO ● Set Your Ideas Free ▣◈
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September 15, 2016, 07:15:48 PM
 #707

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?

http://heatledger.com LIVE ICO 3.0 GENERATION CRYPTO WITH COMPANY STOCK IPO OPTIONS
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September 15, 2016, 07:44:07 PM
 #708


We have created a Facebook page! Like us!  Kiss

> > Komodo Facebook < <


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September 15, 2016, 07:47:40 PM
 #709

Seems very interesting project. Following this project

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masterbit
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September 15, 2016, 07:51:29 PM
 #710


We have created a Facebook page! Like us!  Kiss

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Tweeted!! https://twitter.com/KomodoPlatform/status/776508192637550592 Wink





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SuperNET.org
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KomodoPlatform
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September 15, 2016, 08:03:09 PM
 #711

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?

SuperNET holds many things, but looks like Zcash is not on the list.

http://www.supernet.org/nav.php


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September 15, 2016, 08:10:36 PM
 #712

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?
There is no ZEC until Oct.28th

I dont count cash settled futures markets

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
LiskEnterprise
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September 15, 2016, 09:02:30 PM
 #713

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?
There is no ZEC until Oct.28th

I dont count cash settled futures markets

Understood.

Did SuperNet invest into Zcash ICO?

SO will something show on coin release?

http://heatledger.com LIVE ICO 3.0 GENERATION CRYPTO WITH COMPANY STOCK IPO OPTIONS
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September 15, 2016, 09:05:44 PM
 #714

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?
There is no ZEC until Oct.28th

I dont count cash settled futures markets

Understood.

Did SuperNet invest into Zcash ICO?

SO will something show on coin release?
There was no ICO for zcash...

and SuperNET wasnt any of the early investors, though I definitely would have if I had been given the chance

So only way to get it is by mining or on the open market, but I expect both of those methods to be quite expensive. The diff on testnet is already quite high and that is for testnet, cant estimate the mining that will be there during the slow start.

I had estimated a 0.1 BTC price for ZEC during the early days, but based on the futures trading today up to .075 I think I will need to revise that upward


http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
LiskEnterprise
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September 15, 2016, 09:19:21 PM
 #715

Does SuperNet NAV hold Zcash?
There is no ZEC until Oct.28th

I dont count cash settled futures markets

Understood.

Did SuperNet invest into Zcash ICO?

SO will something show on coin release?
There was no ICO for zcash...

and SuperNET wasnt any of the early investors, though I definitely would have if I had been given the chance

So only way to get it is by mining or on the open market, but I expect both of those methods to be quite expensive. The diff on testnet is already quite high and that is for testnet, cant estimate the mining that will be there during the slow start.

I had estimated a 0.1 BTC price for ZEC during the early days, but based on the futures trading today up to .075 I think I will need to revise that upward



Ok cool so the best entry to the Zcash tech is right here

http://heatledger.com LIVE ICO 3.0 GENERATION CRYPTO WITH COMPANY STOCK IPO OPTIONS
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September 16, 2016, 05:25:47 AM
 #716

Yes plus all the other tech that will be rolled into it.





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DECENTRALIZED CRYPTOCURRENCY EXCHANGE
Developed to Unite Coin Communities | ✔ SECURE ✔ FREE ✔ VISIBILITY ✔ EASY INTEGRATION |

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September 16, 2016, 11:33:17 AM
 #717

What % of KMD supply is PoW, or is 100% ico from genesis? Is there a tail emission like xmr?
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September 16, 2016, 12:24:31 PM
 #718

What % of KMD supply is PoW, or is 100% ico from genesis? Is there a tail emission like xmr?
After ICO it is half the lifetime emission.

After that, stakes get 5% per year, plus there is a blockreward starting at 3KMD, with halvings.

When coin supply reaches 200 mil, it will just be txfees, but that wont be for over 10 years

There is a backup block generation method using equihash PoW, but this will only be used when there are no notary nodes. In order to allow both methods to coexist, similar to how peercoin allows PoW and PoS to coexist, the notary side will be given priority.

I guess if there is an extremely large amount of hashpower, even in the presence of notary nodes, the PoW could generate a block, but I doubt it would make economic sense unless KMD price goes to much higher levels than expected.

For the hardware/miner peoples, the way to earn KMD is by running one of the 64 notary nodes. Payouts will be calibrated to be around $500 per month per notary node, so in the even the KMD block rewards are not sufficient, payments to the notary nodes will be made in BTC to make up the difference.

Right after the ICO is completed, we will have elections to select the 64 notary node operators. I am currently working on the voting system and this will be the first thing we need to do after genesis. Between genesis and the notary nodes coming online is the only pure PoW period that is expected.


http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
bv68bot
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September 16, 2016, 01:14:38 PM
 #719

What % of KMD supply is PoW, or is 100% ico from genesis? Is there a tail emission like xmr?
After ICO it is half the lifetime emission.

After that, stakes get 5% per year, plus there is a blockreward starting at 3KMD, with halvings.

When coin supply reaches 200 mil, it will just be txfees, but that wont be for over 10 years

There is a backup block generation method using equihash PoW, but this will only be used when there are no notary nodes. In order to allow both methods to coexist, similar to how peercoin allows PoW and PoS to coexist, the notary side will be given priority.

I guess if there is an extremely large amount of hashpower, even in the presence of notary nodes, the PoW could generate a block, but I doubt it would make economic sense unless KMD price goes to much higher levels than expected.

For the hardware/miner peoples, the way to earn KMD is by running one of the 64 notary nodes. Payouts will be calibrated to be around $500 per month per notary node, so in the even the KMD block rewards are not sufficient, payments to the notary nodes will be made in BTC to make up the difference.

Right after the ICO is completed, we will have elections to select the 64 notary node operators. I am currently working on the voting system and this will be the first thing we need to do after genesis. Between genesis and the notary nodes coming online is the only pure PoW period that is expected.



Thanks for comprehensive answer, your model is very well thought out. Will there be some minimum stake required to run a notary node like dash, or is the vote the single determinant? How notary node operators are selected and governed to keep komodo decentralised will be critical, I look forward to more details on that when you have them.
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September 16, 2016, 01:44:50 PM
 #720

What % of KMD supply is PoW, or is 100% ico from genesis? Is there a tail emission like xmr?
After ICO it is half the lifetime emission.

After that, stakes get 5% per year, plus there is a blockreward starting at 3KMD, with halvings.

When coin supply reaches 200 mil, it will just be txfees, but that wont be for over 10 years

There is a backup block generation method using equihash PoW, but this will only be used when there are no notary nodes. In order to allow both methods to coexist, similar to how peercoin allows PoW and PoS to coexist, the notary side will be given priority.

I guess if there is an extremely large amount of hashpower, even in the presence of notary nodes, the PoW could generate a block, but I doubt it would make economic sense unless KMD price goes to much higher levels than expected.

For the hardware/miner peoples, the way to earn KMD is by running one of the 64 notary nodes. Payouts will be calibrated to be around $500 per month per notary node, so in the even the KMD block rewards are not sufficient, payments to the notary nodes will be made in BTC to make up the difference.

Right after the ICO is completed, we will have elections to select the 64 notary node operators. I am currently working on the voting system and this will be the first thing we need to do after genesis. Between genesis and the notary nodes coming online is the only pure PoW period that is expected.



Thanks for comprehensive answer, your model is very well thought out. Will there be some minimum stake required to run a notary node like dash, or is the vote the single determinant? How notary node operators are selected and governed to keep komodo decentralised will be critical, I look forward to more details on that when you have them.
The notary nodes will earn KMD, no KMD is needed to be elected, though it could be the voters will give more preference to known and large KMD stakeholders.

The notary nodes are elected by stake. A somewhat arbitrary division of the geolocation into 4 areas: North America, Europe, Asia, Southern Hemisphere will be used to ensure no over concentration in any specific region of the world.

Each notary operator could run up to 1 node per region, if they win of course. For anybody to try to get more than one spot, they would need to pass the turing test in realtime as the notary operators will actively cooperate with each other and also there will be a certification tests to verify hardware performance.

With 16 notaries in each of the 4 areas, we end up with 4 elections in parallel for the 16 spots. So each voter can vote 4 times, once per region. Of course a person's stake will allow voting for that many spots and this is one of the reasons for a large scale ICO, to ensure as wide of a stakeholder base as possible, without any large concentration of voting power.

However, with the separation of powers, the notary nodes are able to create blocks and earn the block reward and also determine which valid tx are included in a block. However, they wont have any powers to spend any funds that are not theirs. And unless a majority of nodes are compromised, the notary process is not affected. Of course, any misbehaving notary will be detected and soon be replaced.

As with any crypto, any 51% control leads to a failure mode, but with dPoW any such majority control of notaries would be temporary. If somebody is able to accumulate 51% of all KMD, then we assume that they wont have the motivation to damage.



http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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