Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[droizs]

time to slow down a bit... this is too fast for my taste

[JayJuanGee]

More scandal shakeup in China's bond market:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-01-27/china-s-bond-market-has-a-forgery-problem

Thx for sharing.

The debt was “a junk bond sold to individual investors,” says He Xuanlai, a Singapore-based credit analyst at Commerzbank. “Nobody would’ve bought it without that letter of guarantee from Guangfa Bank.”

This will not end very well, i've seen this nasty dirty trick before. That was the foundation of the last credit crisis.

^looks like we are going for 2mb hard limit!    *Bitcoin classic will break LN?*

Gravin? Classic? Classic will break LN?    

Are you stoned, drunk ore high? I dont mind if you're a Classic supporter but Gravin's Classic is history, we will get Segwit+LN.

^honestly i think Gavin is getting back in the saddle :-D  *stay tuned*

SPOILER ALERT!!!!

Gavin will be coming out as "the real" Satoshi...  hahahahaha

[Ted E. Bare]

Morning Jimbo! We're back.

[r0ach]

point me to the central authority which governs bitcoin TX, or stfu.

Point you to the central authority?  Probably the same central authority that shut down Liberty Reserve:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?  I told you exactly what's going to happen already.  The government will create a fixed address alias system wrapper that goes around bitcoin and force you to use it or be considered a criminal launderer, similar to how they tried with chain anchor already.  After everyone is onboarded, they will then divorce the system away from the native bitcoin unit and into their own "government coin" where they can automatically pillage any money they want.  It also helps them ban cash in the process.

This is why you see them going nuts trying to suppress metals at all costs while they don't care at all if bitcoin goes up.  They want you to use bitcoin because they know how easy it is for them to co-opt it or ban it.  When you use Coinbase right now they threaten to delete your account for sending bitcoin to a gambling site.  They track where all the money goes.  Not using Coinbase doesn't help.  Bitcoin isn't fungible while also being totally traced and monitored, so that kind of police state is going to happen no matter how and where you attempt to use bitcoin.  

I kinda figured being completely traceable bitcoin would have that type of fate someday in the future but I thought it would be years from now.  In reality, the bitcoin police state is already here.  Mixing in the future will also be a crime known as "laundering".  I'm aware nobody in this thread actually cares about anything besides trying to make money in pump and dumps, but Ted Kaczynski was right and increasing implementation of technology always leads to loss of freedom.  If you actually wanted freedom you would be using metals.

[JimboToronto]

Morning Jimbo! We're back.

Top of the morning to you too Ted.

We're almost back. We just have to get to $966.3 at Stamp to be all the way back to where we started the year.

We still have almost 6 hours to get 'er done. Might already be there if it hadn't been for that one crazy market sale at Stamp.

Looks like we're on the rise again. Hopefully this time we plow through.

Yes, we're going up perhaps a little too quickly, but it would be nice to turn both the monthly and yearly candles green again.

[jbreher]

... Bitcoin Unlimited [users] got destroyed yesterday with that huge mistake and BU...

Well, no. But thanks for playing. We've got a lovely consolation prize for you on your way out.

One BU miner lost out on the gains they would have made, due to their otherwise solved block being orphaned. Absolutely nobody else experienced any untoward effects. As for me, my BU node remains chugging away, happily, as always.

[Wolf Rainer]

We finally see some movement. Again China leading the up trend but this time with a much lower volume, just buy order almost none sells. Bitcoin is going to test the $1000 level again, and if the market holds we will try the 1200 levels with a new ATH, but it depends on the shorters and they rush to cash out the profits.

[Ibian]

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?

Yes. We have been over this literally years ago. Why try to reopen closed topics?

[r0ach]

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?

Yes. We have been over this literally years ago. Why try to reopen closed topics?

Yea, no.

November 7, 2008: "Yes, [we will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography,] but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years" - Satoshi

Notice it says "several years" and not decades or "forever" and that was already 8 years ago.

It's really a binary outcome.  An anonymous, fungible currency would probably cause the collapse of the state, while one that isn't fungible or anonymous would likely be utilized as a tool to create a police state.

[Ibian]

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?

Yes. We have been over this literally years ago. Why try to reopen closed topics?

Yea, no.

November 7, 2008: "Yes, [we will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography,] but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years" - Satoshi

Notice it says "several years" and not decades or "forever" and that was already 8 years ago.

Satoshi is an engineer, and a brilliant one. That is why he did not call himself Nostradamus.

You think of the state as others do their preferred god. As a stateist, explain to me how "the state" will do what you have prophetized they will do, on a global basis.

[r0ach]

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?

Yes. We have been over this literally years ago. Why try to reopen closed topics?

Yea, no.

November 7, 2008: "Yes, [we will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography,] but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years" - Satoshi

Notice it says "several years" and not decades or "forever" and that was already 8 years ago.

Satoshi is an engineer, and a brilliant one. That is why he did not call himself Nostradamus.

You think of the state as others do their preferred god. As a stateist, explain to me how "the state" will do what you have prophetized they will do, on a global basis.

Please, spare me the bullshit.  The "state" banned gold use in America for a long ass time and Bitcoin is far easier for the state to ban or co-opt.  It's the easiest target in the world for the state to take over or demolish.  Stopping the use of metals is a far more monumental task and they were even able to accomplish that.  People pretending bitcoin is immune to the state are the biggest fucking fools in the world.

[Ibian]

Please, spare me the bullshit.

Feel free to follow your own advice. Come back when you are ready to do so.

[r0ach]

Please, spare me the bullshit.

Feel free to follow your own advice. Come back when you are ready to do so.

Bitcoin's value isn't even currently derived from point of sale being a settlement layer and all since it doesn't scale to point of sale use, meaning it's value is entirely derived from how much you can dump it for at an exchange.  So just by shutting down a few exchanges you can already kill the value of bitcoin in current state.  Yes, LN is supposed to change that, but whether LN will work or not in a decentralized manner is another topic.

[Ibian]

Please, spare me the bullshit.

Feel free to follow your own advice. Come back when you are ready to do so.

Bitcoin's value isn't even currently derived from point of sale being a settlement layer and all since it doesn't scale to point of sale use, meaning it's value is entirely derived from how much you can dump it for at an exchange.  So just by shutting down a few exchanges you can already kill the value of bitcoin in current state.

The value is whatever people are willing to pay for it. This is true no matter how the price is determined. The only way to stop a global price from being agreed on is to literally close the entire internet. Good luck with that.

[r0ach]

Please, spare me the bullshit.

Feel free to follow your own advice. Come back when you are ready to do so.

Bitcoin's value isn't even currently derived from point of sale being a settlement layer and all since it doesn't scale to point of sale use, meaning it's value is entirely derived from how much you can dump it for at an exchange.  So just by shutting down a few exchanges you can already kill the value of bitcoin in current state.

The value is whatever people are willing to pay for it. This is true no matter how the price is determined. The only way to stop a global price from being agreed on is to literally close the entire internet. Good luck with that.

Yea, just like it's "impossible" to stop people from using gold, right?  Sounds "impossible" to do so on paper, right?  Well, they were able to do it, and bitcoin is far easier to stop.  

[Ibian]

Please, spare me the bullshit.

Feel free to follow your own advice. Come back when you are ready to do so.

Bitcoin's value isn't even currently derived from point of sale being a settlement layer and all since it doesn't scale to point of sale use, meaning it's value is entirely derived from how much you can dump it for at an exchange.  So just by shutting down a few exchanges you can already kill the value of bitcoin in current state.

The value is whatever people are willing to pay for it. This is true no matter how the price is determined. The only way to stop a global price from being agreed on is to literally close the entire internet. Good luck with that.

Yea, just like it's "impossible" to stop people from using gold, right?  Sounds "impossible" to do so on paper, right?  Well, they were able to do it, and bitcoin is far easier to stop.

Claims without proof can be rejected without proof. Explain HOW.

[JayJuanGee]

Morning Jimbo! We're back.

Top of the morning to you too Ted.

We're almost back. We just have to get to $966.3 at Stamp to be all the way back to where we started the year.

We still have almost 6 hours to get 'er done. Might already be there if it hadn't been for that one crazy market sale at Stamp.

Looks like we're on the rise again. Hopefully this time we plow through.

Yes, we're going up perhaps a little too quickly, but it would be nice to turn both the monthly and yearly candles green again.

I had never seen a chart with a yearly candle, and the only one that I know that does monthly candles is Tradeview.


https://www.tradingview.com/chart/?symbol=BITSTAMP:BTCUSD

Monthly candles do provide another perspective, that is for sure... and it does appear that the monthly tradeview candle will be closing within 5 hours (as I type).. because it does appear to start over at the end of the calendar month (UT).... so, yeah, you seem to be correct also that we are currently red on the monthly, but within a few dollars of green.. ..

Whether it matters if the candle is borderline green or borderline red and trips one way or another?  may be another question.  

[JayJuanGee]

We finally see some movement. Again China leading the up trend but this time with a much lower volume, just buy order almost none sells. Bitcoin is going to test the $1000 level again, and if the market holds we will try the 1200 levels with a new ATH, but it depends on the shorters and they rush to cash out the profits.

Aren't the shorters a bit more handicap than they were in recent months, because there are fewer vehicles in which they can short.  I am not a shorter, so I don't really know what are the options and strategies, but I thought that after the Bitfinex "hack" they closed some of their shorting options (for USA customers) and certainly, the chinese exchanges (OK Coin, Huobi and BTCC) have discontinued most (if not all) of their shorting options.  Am I missing something?

[JayJuanGee]

Do you really think bitcoin transcends all form of national govt?

Yes. We have been over this literally years ago. Why try to reopen closed topics?

Yea, no.

November 7, 2008: "Yes, [we will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography,] but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years" - Satoshi

Notice it says "several years" and not decades or "forever" and that was already 8 years ago.

Satoshi is an engineer, and a brilliant one. That is why he did not call himself Nostradamus.

You think of the state as others do their preferred god. As a stateist, explain to me how "the state" will do what you have prophetized they will do, on a global basis.

Please, spare me the bullshit.  The "state" banned gold use in America for a long ass time and Bitcoin is far easier for the state to ban or co-opt.  It's the easiest target in the world for the state to take over or demolish.  Stopping the use of metals is a far more monumental task and they were even able to accomplish that.  People pretending bitcoin is immune to the state are the biggest fucking fools in the world.

I think that you may be creating a strawman by suggesting that people (suggesting a large number of people) really believe that bitcoin is immuned from the state.  Sure there are different strategies that the state can take in respect to bitcoin, and there are a lot of smart, savvy folks in various states, but at the same time, there are difficulties too, because bitcoin is a fairly complex vehicle with all kinds of developments going on and a variety of tools that are in varying states of development, including other cryptos that could either complement bitcoin or be run as side chains - and even seg wit is going to seem to bring (if it is ever implemented) some more robust and multi-faceted tools and options for people that are going to be difficult for state actors to control and monitor in ways that you are suggesting to be their grand scheme.

[Karartma1]

All I care now is that we are going up no matter what the gov does
I use Bitcoin off the grid and I will trying to do that as much as I can