Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[keyboard warrior]

New Sell-Attack?

It's only gone down a tiny bit. Unless it's at least a thousand dollar movement I barely notice it.

[RoomBot]

dump cripplecorebitshitcoin for the real bitcoin (BCH)

[jojo69]

bidding for "cripplecorebitshitcoin.com" now

[RoomBot]

Segwit is not being adopted. And LN will be largely a niche gimmick. We need something that works across the board, something that, unlike segwit, is NOT OPTIONAL.

Make non Segwit opt out and there's most of it cleared up. Same as organ donation. They flipped that from opt in to opt out recently in the UK. I expect many more people will be sliced up and glued into other people in future and rightfully so.

people getting forked?

[Gab0]

Which is why Bitcoin should be considered a decentralized, deflationary crypto asset like digital gold, that also happens to be exchangeable for goods and services like a currency. Notice I said "like a currency" because it is clear that that attribute is not its primary function nor its strength.

The word "crytocurrency" is a complete misnomer. It should have been called a "cryptoasset" from the beginning.

And once again ... Satoshi was wrong.
Good to have geniuses like your Torque. Thank you for enlightening us with your wisdom.
Now ... if Satoshi was so wrong, why do not we just rewrite the white paper?

Announcing version 0.3 of Bitcoin, the P2P cryptocurrency!  Bitcoin is a digital currency using cryptography and a distributed network to replace the need for a trusted central server.  Escape the arbitrary inflation risk of centrally managed currencies!  Bitcoin's total circulation is limited to 21 million coins.  The coins are gradually released to the network's nodes based on the CPU power they contribute, so you can get a share of them by contributing your idle CPU time.

[...]

Oh! Stupid Satoshi, you were so wrong.

[JimboToronto]

Old coins are now worth $19951USD/$24766CAD (Coinmarketcap).

ok searched a bit and i still cant figure out what this means.. what are "old coins" and why are they worth more?

Unsplit BTC still with a BCH, and possibly other forkcoins, inside.

For the sake of simplicity, I only include the 3 most valuable... real Bitcoin, AltcoinCash and AltcoinGold.

If any other forkcoin achieves a significant value, I'll include it too.

I include this in my daily greeting/recap primarily for investors (long-term holders) rather than traders. Many of us keep the majority of our coins in cold storage, untouched for years. Having a single figure to represent the total worth of each coin makes it easier to quickly assess the total value of our holdings.

[fluidjax]

Which is why Bitcoin should be considered a decentralized, deflationary crypto asset like digital gold, that also happens to be exchangeable for goods and services like a currency. Notice I said "like a currency" because it is clear that that attribute is not its primary function nor its strength.

The word "crytocurrency" is a complete misnomer. It should have been called a "cryptoasset" from the beginning.

And once again ... Satoshi was wrong.
Good to have geniuses like your Torque. Thank you for enlightening us with your wisdom.
Now ... if Satoshi was so wrong, why do not we just rewrite the white paper?

Announcing version 0.3 of Bitcoin, the P2P cryptocurrency!  Bitcoin is a digital currency using cryptography and a distributed network to replace the need for a trusted central server.  Escape the arbitrary inflation risk of centrally managed currencies!  Bitcoin's total circulation is limited to 21 million coins.  The coins are gradually released to the network's nodes based on the CPU power they contribute, so you can get a share of them by contributing your idle CPU time.

[...]

Oh! Stupid Satoshi, you were so wrong.

If you want dogma, go worship at Ver's church, if you want to be part of a journey to find the solution stay with Bitcoin.

[gentlemand]

For the sake of simplicity, I only include the 3 most valuable... real Bitcoin, AltcoinCash and AltcoinGold.

If any other forkcoin achieves a significant value, I'll include it too.

One interesting thing about the forks is that you'd need to be bleedin' loaded to get a significant amount of them for free now.

I'm not sure whether that helps or hinders them.

[conspirosphere.tk]

And once again ... Satoshi was wrong.

Just because he thought that using "decentralized crypto-asset" was lame does not mean that he wanted an alternative payment system for a coffee.
Now would you please fuck off?

[Torque]

And once again ... Satoshi was wrong.
Good to have geniuses like your Torque. Thank you for enlightening us with your wisdom.
Now ... if Satoshi was so wrong, why do not we just rewrite the white paper?

.....

Oh! Stupid Satoshi, you were so wrong.

Quit being a trite tool. It's the reason people here don't take you seriously and many have you on ignore.

It doesn't matter what Satoshi originally envisioned as Bitcoin's proposed/intended usage, it only matters how the people that buy it actually use it. It saw almost nil usage as a currency even back when transaction fees were low. Disregarding transaction fees and long confirmation times, it's deflationary nature alone, combined with all the hoop jumping required just to acquire it, nearly kills it as a daily currency. It functions much better as a decentralized digital asset that stores value. That's a fact and nothing you can allude to wrt "Satoshi's original vision" can change that.

Even pre-teens and teens use paper currencies around the world on a daily basis, but hell they can't even purchase Bitcoin without being 18+ yrs old and having a drivers license and a bank account first. How about that fkn irony, Satoshi? Should we add an addendum in the white paper for that too?

Grow the fk up and quit making tool statements.

[player99]

Possible "dividend" shit forks for hodlers, what a list...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bitcoin_forks

[Ibian]

Segwit is not being adopted. And LN will be largely a niche gimmick. We need something that works across the board, something that, unlike segwit, is NOT OPTIONAL.

Make non Segwit opt out and there's most of it cleared up. Same as organ donation. They flipped that from opt in to opt out recently in the UK. I expect many more people will be sliced up and glued into other people in future and rightfully so.

There are three things you don't take from people: Life, food, and dignity. That's barbaric and will lead to a backlash.

[Ibian]

I do not consider increasing blocks a good solution. It does not scale while the negative consequences for decentralisation are unclear. Since Bitcoin’s only true value lies in ‘decentralisation’, I support not hastily moving away from this core concept just to solve a current - perceived as immediate - issue. There is too much at stake.

Big data centers will always do better than hobby miners no matter what the code looks like. This whole fear of mining centralization is not only unfounded as it has been happening from day one, and will continue to do so, it is stupid.

[bitserve]

Oh! Stupid Satoshi, you were so wrong.

No me nades en la superficie... adéntrate, sumérgete en la profundidad del planteamiento que te quiero transmitir: El futuro está en la capa 2.

[Ibian]

BIG BLOCKER nutjobs REEEEEEEEE!

Suggest a better (implementable in the real world) alternative for getting more throughput. Any of you.

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

Just replace Safety with Throughput.

Be patient, people! The scaling problem will be solved, and it will be solved in the right way, and for the long term. Nobody wants a temporary "patch" that requires a hard fork and compromises decentralization. When there are valid reasons to increase the block size, it will be done.

Except that's not even an analogy, that's just replacing one word with another in an unrelated sentence.

Also define "valid reason". We dislike sophism around here.

[gentlemand]

There are three things you don't take from people: Life, food, and dignity. That's barbaric and will lead to a backlash.

It's already in place in many countries and you have the option to say no. Personally I couldn't give a shit what happens to my carcass apart from use in porno unless my black and puffy face is covered up. And my tattoos.

[Ibian]

There are three things you don't take from people: Life, food, and dignity. That's barbaric and will lead to a backlash.

It's already in place in many countries and you have the option to say no. Personally I couldn't give a shit what happens to my carcass apart from use in porno unless my black and puffy face is covered up. And my tattoos.

It's not about you.

[gentlemand]

It's not about you.

And you can say no any time.

[Torque]

I do not consider increasing blocks a good solution. It does not scale while the negative consequences for decentralisation are unclear. Since Bitcoin’s only true value lies in ‘decentralisation’, I support not hastily moving away from this core concept just to solve a current - perceived as immediate - issue. There is too much at stake.

Big data centers will always do better than hobby miners no matter what the code looks like. This whole fear of mining centralization is not only unfounded as it has been happening from day one, and will continue to do so, it is stupid.

So let's all just use PayPal and be done with Bitcoin. It already performs much better as a currency system, yeah?

I'll go on record to say that if Bitcoin's transactions are restricted to on-chain only, then regardless of block size, PayPal will ALWAYS be faster, cheaper, and more efficient. But inflate that block size to your heart's desire.

[Ibian]

I do not consider increasing blocks a good solution. It does not scale while the negative consequences for decentralisation are unclear. Since Bitcoin’s only true value lies in ‘decentralisation’, I support not hastily moving away from this core concept just to solve a current - perceived as immediate - issue. There is too much at stake.

Maybe you are right, bigger blocks do not scale. But increasing the current size is a requirement for climbing. Check the LN white paper and note the block size needed so that each person can open and close a channel once a year using segwit.

There are already 2 different solutions ready for implementation (they might be already in the test stage, for all I know) to bundle multiple channel opening transactions into a single blockchain event - similar to what CoinJoin does. The fee would get split among the openers. The more you're willing to wait for a larger pool of channel openers, the less you pay. The same mechanism can be used to fund channels with exhausted capacity. This seems an excellent way to go for the time being. I'm confident more sophisticated stuff will come along.

That sounds like an excellent idea, depending how big the overall effect would be.

Now what we should really do is force the big actors to embrace segwit, so LN can flourish. Like, some heavy user lobbying on Coinbase. Of course, more variety and competition in the exchange market can't hurt.

Am I understanding it correctly that LN only works with segwit?