Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[death_wish]

Awesome shot.

To put things in perspective, the number of Bitcoin private keys that can ever exist is approximately 10⁵³ times the number of stars in the known universe. In other words, if each star in the universe corresponded to one Bitcoin private key, then the entire universe would only be able to contain...

0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001%
of all possible Bitcoin private keys.

Put in another way, it would take...

100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
universes to fit all possible Bitcoin private keys.

As you can see, OOM, your post is totally on-topic! 

Nit:  Although this is technically correct, and awe-inspiring in itself, I suggest always making sure to base such discussions on Bitcoin’s notional 128-bit security level.

This seems ridiculously pedantic to note in this context—until one experiences too many technical threads based on people thinking in terms of bruteforce.  Educating people in these terms tends to form that mindset.  The number of all possible Bitcoin private keys has no direct relevance to Bitcoin’s security:  Any real-world attacker will attack the public key with an ECDLP solver, which will crack the key on the order of 10³⁸ times faster than bruteforce.

What people need to understand is that Bitcoin has astronomically-huge security.  You are literally talking about astronomically-huge-squared.

[modrobert]

https://www.blockchain.com/it/btc/address/1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa

For a signature, or to “move his stash” as you said?  The Genesis coinbase itself can’t be moved; it is not sent to that address, but rather, in P2PK to a public key that people convert to that P2PKH address as an anachronism.

18.53375545 BTC (as of writing) from that address can be moved, if you have the wallet (private key) of Satoshi.

The correct (movable) amount is listed by Block Stream Explorer (note how the 50 BTC mining reward transaction is not listed here for the same address):
https://blockstream.info/address/1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa

I almost said as much, but then cut it as an unnecessary tangent.  I try to prevent my posts from being too long.

If I know that people are converting the Genesis coinbase P2PK key to a P2PKH address (an arcane detail that few realize), I obviously know that idiots have been sending money there, and how much of it, and that it can be moved.  Should I now embark on the long tangent I had in mind about why sending money there is a bad idea?

The point from which I do not want to distract with this irrelevant tangent:  Moving money around not the right way to ask Satoshi to prove his identity.  signmessage exists, and it works.  Satoshi has a PGP key; I linked to this forum’s copy of it, and I provided the fingerprint.  The threshold test for any Satoshi claimant is to sign an appropriate message with a known Satoshi key.

You avoided the first part of my original post...

If you were Satoshi, what would be the benefit of claiming that in public (think it through at least twice before replying)?

...assuming you didn't think twice about it yet.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[death_wish]

https://www.blockchain.com/it/btc/address/1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa

For a signature, or to “move his stash” as you said?  The Genesis coinbase itself can’t be moved; it is not sent to that address, but rather, in P2PK to a public key that people convert to that P2PKH address as an anachronism.

18.53375545 BTC (as of writing) from that address can be moved, if you have the wallet (private key) of Satoshi.

The correct (movable) amount is listed by Block Stream Explorer (note how the 50 BTC mining reward transaction is not listed here for the same address):
https://blockstream.info/address/1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa

I almost said as much, but then cut it as an unnecessary tangent.  I try to prevent my posts from being too long.

If I know that people are converting the Genesis coinbase P2PK key to a P2PKH address (an arcane detail that few realize), I obviously know that idiots have been sending money there, and how much of it, and that it can be moved.  Should I now embark on the long tangent I had in mind about why sending money there is a bad idea?

The point from which I do not want to distract with this irrelevant tangent:  Moving money around not the right way to ask Satoshi to prove his identity.  signmessage exists, and it works.  Satoshi has a PGP key; I linked to this forum’s copy of it, and I provided the fingerprint.  The threshold test for any Satoshi claimant is to sign an appropriate message with a known Satoshi key.

You avoided the first part of my original post...

If you were Satoshi, what would be the benefit of claiming that in public (think it through at least twice before replying)?

...assuming you didn't think twice about it yet.

No, I did not avoid it.  I dismissed it.  I immediately understood what you were saying, but it is unimportant.  You are not as clever as you believe, and you evidently do not read carefully.

By “authentication”, I mean signing a message with substance similar to this:

Code:

2022-06-26: I, [name of claimant], am Satoshi Nakamoto.

I don’t ask someone’s motives before demanding that.  If the claimant refuses (as Craig Wright has), then his motives are obvious:  He is an imposter.

The real Satoshi could potentially have various motives to step forward at some point—various benefits he may wish to attain.  (If he is still alive.)  The real Satoshi also would or could have many obvious motives never to appear publicly again—much less to dox himself.

Instead of attempting to exercise my psychic powers predicting the behaviour of an anonymous person, or projecting onto him what I think I would or wouldn’t want or do, I deem it wiser to put all Satoshi-claimants to a simple, objective test at the threshold.  If anyone ever passes that test, then I will evaluate the individual as he is, in the circumstance as it is.  Those who fail that test are immediately dismissed as imposters.

[empowering]

and if half the conversations are one mad man talking to himself (I am kinda kidding)

I recall that nullius said similarly.  I could look around and find it in his prolific wall-of-words post history.  Are you nullius?

https://web.archive.org/web/20120712200425/http://cryptome.org/2012/07/gent-forum-spies.htm

You want this:

https://web.archive.org/web/20120712200425/http://cryptome.org/2012/07/gent-forum-spies.htm

Actually, everybody on the forum should read that (and a few like things).

The Gentleperson's Guide To Forum Spies

https://cryptome.org/2012/07/gent-forum-spies.htm



(Reminder)

I also found a nully quote substantively similar to empowering’s statement quoted at the top; but this string of quotes will get too long here.

By the standards of some leading DT members, that is 100% CONCLUSIVE PROOF that empowering is a nully alt.  Any contradiction of this proof shall only strengthen the proof to 1000% conclusiveness, with pretzel-logic that puts you in a classic Kafkatrap.^*  Denial of an allegation proves the allegation.  Refusal to answer equals denial, and therefore proves the allegation.  @empowering, you must confess, as if you are on trial for witchcraft...

(Hey, nully was infamous for his sympathies with witches.)

It is well-known that at trial for witchcraft, the witch will deny or even refuse to answer to witchcraft charges.

...and this is of critical importance because—um, I dunno.  You/nullius are not accused of any fraud based on scamming people with multiple identities, or of any other multi-account abuses.  There is no rational reason to make an issue of the possibility that you may or may not be nullius.  Frankly, it is nobody’s business if you are.  But for whatever reason, the most important issue in the world is to make you admit your nullianity right now, on the spot, on-demand.  If you don’t, that also proves that nullius is a deeply dishonest and untrustworthy person.

Now, empowering, since I have PROVED that you are nullius and you had better well damn confess, I must wonder:  “empowering” was created in 2013.  “nullius” was created in 2017.  Have I discovered nully’s “main account”?  Or is there an older one?

Nullius' knowledge about blockchain science and cryptography is a dead giveaway....  He could even be Satoshi.  

nullius is lauda. That is very clear. Anyone who does not see this is simply closing their eyes.

nullius is cthulhu. That is very clear. Anyone who does not see this is simply closing their eyes.

^* “Kafkatrap” is a coin termed by ESR in 2010 for an informal fallacy, in which denial of an accusation is taken as evidence that the accusation is true.  It is a disturbingly common fallacy.  And once you are in a Kafkatrap, the harder you struggle to prove your denial, the worse you are lying to cover up and evade the truth.

 

Bastard.... you have done it again, you made me laugh.

Amusing post

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[OutOfMemory]

Hey Bros, i'm in a hurry, so here's that promised photo from NGC7000 (North America Nebula). Seond try, because my lens fogged in the humid air of the night.
Details: 200mm lens on a H-Alpha modified DSLR, 100x25 sec frames for the stars, 20x60 sec frames for the nebula.

 
Thanks a ton for the sMerit shower 

I was out last night to take another one, from a different region of the milky way, more zoomed out than the one i posted yesterday.
There were some thin clouds in the first half and distant lightnings illuminating (light-polluting) the sky in the second half of the session, but since i captured more than 4 hours worth of light data, it would be a waste to just move the files to the recycle bin (aka. /dev/null) before even trying to get a nice astrophoto out of them.
A dedicated astro camera plus filters would be delivering much finer resolutions, but i'll have to rip out my laser eyes ($100k, sure y'all remember) to be ready to spend so much money on a little piece of electronics in a housing as big as half a pepsi can.
Gonna take some time to regain lost sleep and backread the WO, right after grandmother-in-law's funeral has gone by this evening.
So much to do, so little time 

Good day!
And behave, will you, ChartBuddy?! 

[death_wish]

[...]

[Edit: I was mistaken about cAPSLOCK; I could go only on what I had or hadn’t seen him post, and it seems that I significantly misunderstood him.  I retract and apologize for the statements at this paragraph, which were correct in principle but way off the mark when said about him.]

[...]

I doubt that I need to defend cAPSLOCK because he can stand up for his lil selfie.

He can do better than that:  He can be a Bitcoin gentleman who actually has supported Core.  Financially and otherwise.  Then, I need to hurry up and apologize to him—as I immediately did, in the post that you quoted—and I need to applaud him!

Have anonymously donated to both Bitcoin Development as well as another project along the way.  Both my own money and my time in the form of community contributions and merged pull requests on both projects.

He is generally reputable, and there is some subtlety there that most people will not catch.  So...  By criticizing him, I wound up praising him.  That’s how it’s done.

I follow quite a few forum threads, but I cannot recall seeing one specifically aimed at various ways to fund devs.. or even funding lighting devs.

Bitcoin is so decentralized that funding is also decentralized.  Here is an overview of how Core development actually gets paid for:

https://polylunar.com/bitcoin-grants-tracker/

https://bitcoinwords.github.io/grants/

https://blog.bitmex.com/who-funds-bitcoin-development/

As I mentioned before, Blockstream employees some key developers; so does MIT DCI, which was pretty much founded for that purpose.  BitMEX makes many grants.  So does Square, as you can see in those lists...

Square and Jack Dorsey has also been pretty good at funding Devs..

Yes.

Gemini also shows up several times in those lists.  Also OKCoin, and some others.  Who does not show up at all:  Coinbase, Binance, FTX...

Private donations are also listed.  I am guessing that there are probably private donations which do not show up on these lists—“private” being the operative word.

and if you know so much on the topic,

I don’t.  That’s why I have failed before to connect money who wanted developers with developers who wanted money.  But it seems I know a little bit more than some people.  I have also been involved in informal discussions about making a better way to approach this; that was not on my initiative, and it was probably entirely my fault that it went nowhere.

then maybe you can start a thread or even start your own fund?

Is that your suggestion, Jay?

Wait you don't have hardly no BTC, so people might be skeptical of your motives, no?

You mean like how skeptical people are should be of Dabs, the habituated beggar, who has made a career of running allegedly charitable threads, and of doing escrow?  What do you suggest we should do about that?  Don’t think that I have forgotten about it; wait for approximately tomorrow, for whatever reason.  Beggars SHOULD NOT be running public “charities” and handling escrows—much less those who sneak around begging on the sly.

Jay, I am no Dabs.  It is manifestly unfair of you to cast such aspersions on my motives.  I have not expressed any desire to take up a collection to support Core development.  You are making up an idea, then punching down your own idea as a strawman in a way that is wrongful towards me.  I have never cheated, begged, mooched, or shown even the slightest inclination to do so.  If I hypothetically wished to handle such a type of project, my personal financial condition in and of itself would not disqualify me from handling money that I would not misappropriate, even if I were literally starving.  It assuredly does not disqualify me from discussing the fact that Bitcoin developers need to be paid.

A life protip for you:  It is possible for a poor person to be friends with a rich person, if the former has the pride never to be a beggar, a mooch, or a cheater.  I learned this when young:  By a peculiar circumstance, I had lunch with a businessman.  He was impressed that when lunch was done, I pulled out my wallet and picked up my part of the tab.  I was a youth working odd jobs for low wages.  He was rich, and accustomed to people trying to mooch off of him.  We became fast friends.

Although I have had my ups and downs, I am still the same man.  I have friends who are wealthier than I am.  I have never abused their friendship—not even at times when I was personally in much worse desperation than I am now.  Because I never abuse their friendship, they respect me as their equal—even if I am flat broke.  I have nothing but contempt for the bent of your strawman.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[marcus_of_augustus]

I was leaving the Casino ~2am following 2 SUV's around a bend when we hit a fog bank and I'm not completely sure if the visor fogged up as well as it was so instant but I went to zero visibility in a corner and had nothing to gauge where I was heading besides the taillights of the vehicle directly in front of me. I pulled in the clutch and started to brake as quickly as possible while following the taillights in front of me only to have the SUV Brake hard and veer off to the left only to notice that there was grass under the SUV instead of pavement. As I tried to follow the bike slid out from under me on the wet grass and mud not unlike a hydroplaning effect and while the bike slid off to the side into a chain link fence I hit the ground and rolled into a telephone pole. We were doing about 45 Mph.

[Hamza2424]

 last year, on 27 June

$BTC = $32,186.28
$ETH = $1,829.24

Good day!
And behave, will you, ChartBuddy?!  

Naah He can't

[vapourminer]

Yeah, The Doc said I was pretty lucky all the bones are lined up so they didn't have to pin them but I'm pretty sure thats because I got up and aligned them while leaning on the dude that pulled over. LOL

Funny thing is the guy who finally stopped ended up being someone I played against all night.

*Also they were giving me fentanol injections so I asked the doc if he was trying to OD me?

glad youre on the mend. and man that sounded pretty bad. i tend to only break one, maybe bones at at times when doing "hold my beer" types of things. ive since slowed down those moments, lucky for me.

that fentanyl though. spent a couple dark years back in the day hooked on that, 100 microgram patches and 800 microgram lollipops. would not recommend. but sure felt grand at the time. quitting cold turkey, not so much.

anyway keep up the healing bro.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[AnotherAlt]

I don't know if they were daydreaming. Of course, BTC can potentially go $250K or more in the future. That doesn't mean it will Boom in a few months. LOL.

Eventually, sure. And probably sooner than most would think. We're in the doldrums for at least another year though, I think. Healing is needed, bad memories need to fade, confidence needs to return.

Nothing is going to happen before the next halving which is scheduled for May-June 2024.
Do not have any false hopes like those Crypto guys on Twitter.

I agree with you. But, the Majority of the Market depends on FUDs now.
In my early days, I saw tweets like this coin would give you xxx% profit in xx months. You know what? I trusted them at that time and bought those shitcoins. I never did any research before doing it. I believe most other newbies do the same. Slowly but surely, They will understand their mistakes like me, and they will understand the market. I know it's unpredictable. But, .........

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[aysg76]

So again posting back in WO thread after small break to cope up with my mates 

Whenever bitcoin is down I go to the past stats to motivate myself and hold on to my investment knowing how people call it ponzi scheme and still it recovered from all the crashes and still the number one coin in the market.

This one particular video of Andreas explaining people the importance of bitcoin when it was just around $100 but see the empty room states how many people missed the opportunity to gain something financial revolutionary at such prices

https://twitter.com/DocumentingBTC/status/1541738949185527809?t=CBlafEBQVYZXhFf4Mu0zTg&s=19

This man has been great source for bitcoin growth and spreading information about it like his book Mastering Bitcoin is must read and you will understand how bitcoin is so valuable and deflationary in nature with control over your funds.

Another chart showing the optimistic growth of bitcoin for different countries is sign of increased adoption in developing nations :



So buy if you can and it's not a financial advice 

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[348Judah]

Whenever bitcoin is down I go to the past stats to motivate myself and hold on to my investment knowing how people call it ponzi scheme and still it recovered from all the crashes and still the number one coin in the market.

For sure lot had been talked about on bitcoin to be this and that as a result of the down trend moves in price speculations but nothing about it bern a digital currency exchange, it's still the best and most available option for an investment with much security and safety, holding on the our coins is the best solution for now while we await the week to land it's judgement by tomorrow on weather to remain within the $20k or step up abit ahead that by Wednesday.

[cAPSLOCK]

A to my railing against ZCash, you are right, though I had heard about them moving to the non trusted new tech I have not followed closely to see that they had.  That's a plus.  But there are many minuses still for me.  And with life being how it currently is for me ([...personal details...]) I have not had time to respond to much here.

[...]

Have anonymously donated to both Bitcoin Development as well as another project along the way.  Both my own money and my time in the form of community contributions and merged pull requests on both projects.

My sympathies for your family situation.  (Snipped from the quote, just in case it’s too much information.)  I hope that your people will be ok.

Based on your statements in this post, I edited another recent post of mine with an apology for and retraction of some aspersions cast on your character.

I can guess that you refer to That Other Privacy Coin.  The one with a community fund.  I am familiar with both projects, I weigh pros and cons of each—you’re right, it is off-topic for WO in itself.  I only wanted to discuss technology I have been yearning to see in Bitcoin for about the past nine years.  It got into a tangent because, hey, it is salutary to remind people that Core development gets paid for somehow.

A to my railing against ZCash, you are right, though I had heard about them moving to the non trusted new tech I have not followed closely to see that they had.  That's a plus.  But there are many minuses still for me.
[...]
That said, I have several complaints about that project.  Do not agree with the Dev tax argument, though I am sympathetic.

Many pluses and minuses for me, too.  I insinuated somewhere, perhaps a bit too subtly, that they could have better manged the “dev tax” money; this type of issue has sometimes caused controversy and alienation in the Zcash community.  I was speaking only to the principle of the matter, by way of pointing out that Bitcoiners need to support Core.  Beyond that, the only part of my Zcash criticisms relevant to WO is that I am very worried by their announced plans to switch to POS, which seem to me a matter of smooth-talking VC-types putting the hard-sell on naïve crypto-nerds who are sad about their coin’s price performance.

POS is eating the world.  Old-school POW alts first:  It is strategic to isolate Bitcoin as a big consumer of energy and to set more POS-switch precedents, as anti-POW propaganda ramps up.  In addition to my fears as a longtime Zcasher, I see this ultimately as an attack on Bitcoin—the ultimate target.

I do try to keep on-topic here.  Anything that I’ve said about Zcash is ancillary to discussion of Bitcoin, and not reasonably avoidable for that.  If I wanted to praise or critique Zcash in itself, that would be a different post—and it would come off much differently.  By the way, if I wanted to discuss That Other Privacy Coin, I would discuss its decentralization and its community strengths (and RandomX) in addition to critiquing its privacy technology.  What I really want is to have it all in one place:  In Bitcoin.

I agree NFT's might end up useful tech for just the thing you are mentioning (titles, other single certificate type uses) but I think the best implementation would be a federated sidechain.  I think cities, counties, states and the federal government, title companies etc. could be members of the sidechain, and others could subscribe.  It would be hash-anchored to bitcoin, but maintained by the federation.

Ultimately, I think that a better trustless, or trust-minimized Bitcoin sidechain implementation is needed to support numerous use cases:  Scaling, zero-knowledge proof privacy (the original Zerocoin and Zerocash ideas were for BTC on Bitcoin sidechains!), smart contracts/on-chain programmability (wtf am I doing on POS chains? need the features), the non-scam parts of defi, non-idiotic NFTs, etc.

I am very strictly against spamming the Bitcoin mainnet (e.g., check post history re so-called “burner addresses”).  But I am cautious about discussing sidechains:  I know that many ideas have undesirable security risks.

I am aware of RSK, but an EthVM clone is not exactly my cup of tea.  I do like that it is merge-mined with Bitcoin.  I am very much in favour of merge-mining sidechains (or altcoins) with Bitcoin.


^^^ The discussion of sidechains incited a brainstorm.  Of something else that could be done with ZKP on mainnet; another non-privacy application thereof, in addition to the idea I had in the Development forum a few weeks ago.  Sat here a long time thinking about it...  Need to post this; to be continued somewhere/sometime.

Thanks for the sympathies and retractions of curses, though i do not mind.  Similarly i apologize for being a jerkass back there...  My recent stress has damaged a lot of my filters. 

I am a reluctant Maxi.  I think there is room for other blockchain projects to flourish (not 10,000 that's for sure), though I also think we will most likely gravitate to one central chain, and I think I know what it will be. Ha.  And I have a very sort of strict ethos for what I do, and do not like to see in a project, and can get overly passionate and sometimes heated about things.  ZCash puts a particular burr in my saddle.  Also, I should not speak as I did about the Winklevosses, though I also see them as just another couple shitcoin casino owners.  But there is a continuum, and they are more on the Kraken side of that continuum for me than the Coinbase/FTX side.

Plus, I can take the heat... you and I can go back and forth about alts somewhere else or in PMs if you want to, though my time is not very abundant right now.

[Franctoshi]

Grayscale reports 99% of SEC comment letters support spot Bitcoin ETF.
https://cointelegraph.com/news/grayscale-reports-99-of-sec-comment-letters-support-spot-bitcoin-etf

The major concern here should be what moves would Grayscale make should SEC denies its application ( ETF proposal) come July 6th .
What could be the reaction of that event in the market?, could that cause more panic?, and how is it gonna impact the market generally.
 
However , That will not mean dead for Bitcoin in my opinion if that doesn't get approved ,But in the case of positive outcome and the Bitcoin ETFs got approved by SEC, I do think in my opinion that this could lead to Bitcoin to eventually bottoming out from here anytime soon or in coming months ahead and that will mean so much for the entire market and give investors more confidence.