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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 864942 times)
Bicknellski
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April 08, 2014, 01:22:47 AM
 #8861

Ok so let's speculate a bit before sleeping.

1) they have money to waste
2) they want to waste money
3) they "pre-ordered" it 6 months ago and couldn't get a refund, didn't want to show up with angry customers around. Mediabistro proposed a voluntary refund and release agreement and they signed it. Mediabistro hasn't stop laughing since then.

-2 to the texan hearing! Smiley
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #A1pWaiywvCz0v2n2

I'd assume #3 but that be poetic justice no?

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Don't let the nam-shub in your operating system.


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April 08, 2014, 02:24:48 AM
 #8862

3) they "pre-ordered" it 6 months ago and couldn't get a refund, didn't want to show up with angry customers around. Mediabistro proposed a voluntary refund and release agreement and they signed it. Mediabistro hasn't stop laughing since then.

I'm hearing for the other mining companies that they've missed the last 2 conferences, Texas was the last time they were seen.

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April 08, 2014, 04:52:33 AM
 #8863

3) they "pre-ordered" it 6 months ago and couldn't get a refund, didn't want to show up with angry customers around. Mediabistro proposed a voluntary refund and release agreement and they signed it. Mediabistro hasn't stop laughing since then.

I'm hearing for the other mining companies that they've missed the last 2 conferences, Texas was the last time they were seen.


They probably made the Austin conference because Joe and the other paid their own way, because they wanted to hang around at SXSW the week after. To look for new employers.
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April 08, 2014, 07:20:18 PM
 #8864

http://www.woodlaw.com/sites/default/files/casedocs/2014-04-04 Complaint.pdf

Quote
15. Defendant BF Labs, Inc. was formed July 2011. The majority of stock in Defendant was and continues to be held or controlled by Mr. Sonny Vleisides.

16. At the time of the formation of Defendant through the present, Mr. Vleisides was serving a term of supervised release for a felony conviction for Mail Fraud, in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 1341, in the United States District Court for the Central

Quote
37. Defendant has utilized the funds from customer’s pre-payments for:
(a) the paid in full, unfinanced purchase of a residence in Leawood,
Kansas for Mr. Sonny Vleisides;
(b) an automobile for Mr. Sonny Vleisides; and
(c) hundreds of thousands dollars in loans to shareholders of
Defendant.

Waiting for HF not to be there tomorrow.


Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #c2KmcjQkQ1z0DAr2

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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April 09, 2014, 04:19:38 AM
 #8865

Just met one of the guys in the TRO suit at Inside Bitcoin.  Good guys...

So this was the HashFast booth, right up front where a silver spoon should be....


Dunno why I read "a silver spoon" in your comment. Sounded appropriate.

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April 09, 2014, 04:30:09 AM
 #8866

Here is a copy of what i received.

VOLUNTARY REFUND REQUEST AND RELEASE
 
Hashfast Technologies LLC (“Hashfast”)
100 Bush Street, Suite 650
San Francisco, California 94104 United States
 
Order Number(s):
DATE:
 
 
 
 
Equipment List:
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
(“Buyer”)
 
[Name]
[Company Name]
[Street Address]
[City, Street, ZIP Code]
[Country]
[Phone]
WIRE INFORMATION
Account names must be the same as the Buyer’s name
 
Bank Name:
Bank Address:
Bank Routing Number:
Account Number:
 
BITCOIN WALLET INFORMATION
 
Wallet Address:
 
 
 
 
I, the Buyer, have chosen to execute this Voluntary Refund Request and Release Agreement (this “Agreement”) with
Hashfast Technologies LLC (referred to as “Hashfast” or “Company”). Hashfast will process this request under the terms
and conditions that follow.
 
Please select and check ONLY ONE of the following:
 
 I hereby cancel all of my Batch __ order and request a prompt refund in the amount shown above, paid to me
in United States Dollars (USD).
 
- OR -
 
 I hereby cancel all of my Batch __ orders and request a USD equivalent refund to be paid in BITCOIN at the
exchange rate quoted by Bitstamp on the day Hashfast provides such Bitcoins. I hereby attest that it is legal for me
to receive Bitcoin under the applicable laws of my jurisdiction.
 
Hashfast will process this request no later than 30 days after the receipt of this refund request, indicated by a returned,
Hashfast signed copy to the Buyer.
 
 
Page 1 BUYER INITIALS: VOLUNTARY REFUND REQUEST AND RELEASE Page 2 BUYER INITIALS:
IN ADDITION. If you have opted to voluntarily cancel your order and receive a refund, in addition to the refund amount,
Hashfast will designate you as a Batch __ Special Customer and provide you with a credit worth 5% of the refunded
amount that you may use if you decide to purchase Hashfast products again. As a Batch __ Special Customer, you will also
get air shipping to anywhere in the world for free on your next order. If Hashfast is providing the refund by check, we will
send the check to you by courier, request overnight or two-day delivery, and pay the delivery fee.
 
 
GENERAL RELEASE
 
1. Release. In consideration of the refund, and the separate and additional consideration described in the paragraph with
the heading titled “In Addition” that Buyer acknowledges Buyer would not otherwise be entitled to receive, Buyer (on
its own behalf and on behalf of Buyer’s parent companies, subsidiaries and affiliates, and each of their officers,
directors, equity owners, agents, staff, employees, representatives and attorneys, each in their individual and
corporate capacities) hereby fully, forever, irrevocably and unconditionally releases, remises and discharges Hashfast
Technologies LLC (referred to as “Hashfast” or “Company”), its parent companies, subsidiaries and affiliates, and each
of their officers, directors, equity owners, agents, staff, employees, representatives and attorneys (each in their
individual and corporate capacities) (hereinafter, the "Released Parties") from any and all actions, claims, charges,
complaints, demands, causes of action, suits, rights, debts, sums of money, costs, accounts, reckonings, covenants,
contracts, agreements, promises, doings, omissions, damages, executions, obligations, liabilities, damages, injuries,
consequences, and expenses (including attorneys’ fees and costs), of every kind and nature which Buyer ever had or
now has against the Released Parties (the “Claims”).
 
2. It is further understood and agreed that the general release referred to in Section 1 above a are a full and final release
and shall apply to all unknown and unanticipated Claims, including, without limitation, those resulting from or based
upon or in any way connected with the matters referred to herein as well as those now known or disclosed. Buyer
hereby agrees that all rights under Section 1542 of the California Civil Code are hereby waived. Such section reads as
follows: “A general release does not extend to claims which a creditor does not know of or suspect to exist in his favor
at the time of executing the release which if known by him must have materially affected his settlement with the
debtor.”
 
3. Authority to Enter Agreement. Buyer represents and warrants that it is the buyer of the equipment under the order
numbers set forth above. Buyer represents and warrants that it has full authority to enter into this Agreement, grant
the release hereunder, and to perform the obligations assumed hereunder, and that this Agreement, when executed
by Buyer, represents Buyer’s valid and binding obligation, enforceable against it in accordance with its terms, subject to
certain general legal enforceability exceptions.
 
4. Assignment and Transfer. Buyer represents and warrants that Buyer has not heretofore assigned or transferred any
Claim released herein. Buyer further agrees to indemnify and hold the Company Releases, and each of them,
harmless and defend the Company Releases, and each of them, against any such Claim based on any such transfer or
assignment or purported transfer or assignment.
 
5. No Reliance; No Admissions. Buyer acknowledges and agrees that in making its decision to cancel its order that Buyer
is not relying on any representations, assurances, statements or promises made by any of the Released Parties. It is
understood and agreed that this is a compromise settlement of disputed claims, and that nothing herein shall be
construed as an admission of liability or previous obligation of Company to Buyer.
 
6. Non-Disparagement. Buyer agrees that Buyer shall disparage, libel, or criticize the Company or publish any statement
concerning the other that this is critical. Buyer likewise shall keep confidential the fact of the settlement, the terms of
this Agreement, and the fact and amount of the consideration paid or to be paid hereunder and shall not release or
disseminate any information concerning such matters or the terms hereof to any third party without the express
written consent of the other parties hereto, except (a) to a party’s attorney or accountant or where disclosure is
required by regularly issued judicial process, (b) to the extent such information is publically known through no fault of
Buyer. This obligation of confidentiality shall survive the release hereunder. VOLUNTARY REFUND REQUEST AND RELEASE Page 3 BUYER INITIALS:
7. Attorneys' Fees. In the event that Buyer commences litigation or arbitration based on one or more Claims, Company
shall be entitled to recover reasonable attorneys' fees, expenses and court and arbitration costs as it may incur in
connection with such litigation.
 
8. GOVERNING LAW AND ARBITRATION. ANY CLAIM, DISPUTE OR CONTROVERSY (WHETHER IN CONTRACT, TORT OR
OTHERWISE, WHETHER PRE-EXISTING, PRESENT OR FUTURE, AND INCLUDING STATUTORY, CONSUMER PROTECTION,
COMMON LAW, INTENTIONAL TORT) BETWEEN BUYER AND HASHFAST, its agents, employees, principals, successors,
assigns, affiliates, subsidiaries, arising from or relating to the purchase of Hashfast products, this Agreement, its
interpretation or the breach, termination or validity thereof, (each, a “Dispute”) SHALL BE RESOLVED EXCLUSIVELY AND
FINALLY BY BINDING ARBITRATION. Any Dispute shall be governed by the laws of the State of California and the
F e d e r a l Laws of the U.S.A., each without regard to conflicts of law. The parties agree that the UN Convention for the
International Sale of Goods will have no force or effect on this Agreement.
8.1. THE ARBITRATION WILL BE CONDUCTED IN IN SANTA CLARA COUNTY, CALIFORNIA, U.S.A.
8.2. The arbitrator shall have exclusive authority to resolve any dispute relating to arbitrability or enforceability of this
arbitration provision including any unconscionability challenge or any other challenge that the arbitration
provision or this Agreement is void, voidable or otherwise invalid. The arbitration shall be administered by the
American Arbitration Association (AAA) or JAMS (or a substitute forum if both are unavailable). Arbitration
proceedings shall be governed by this provision and the applicable procedures of the selected arbitration
administrator, including any applicable procedures for consumer-related disputes, in effect at the time the claim
is filed. The arbitrator(s) will not have the jurisdiction or power to award punitive damages, treble damages or
any other damages which are not compensatory, even if permitted under the laws of the California or any other
applicable law. Unless otherwise directed by the arbitrator(s), the parties will bear their own costs and expenses
that are reasonable and necessary to participate in such arbitration, including attorneys’ fees.
8.3. NEITHER BUYER NOR HASHFAST SHALL BE ENTITLED TO JOIN OR CONSOLIDATE CLAIMS BY OR AGAINST OTHER
BUYERS, OR ARBITRATE OR OTHERWISE PARTICIPATE IN ANY CLAIM AS A CLASS REPRESENTATIVE, CLASS MEMBER
OR IN A PRIVATE ATTORNEY GENERAL CAPACITY.
8.4. The arbitrator shall be empowered to grant whatever relief would be available in court under law or in equity.
This transaction shall be governed by the Federal Arbitration Act 9 U.S.C. sec. 1-16 (FAA). Any award of the
arbitrator(s) shall be final and binding on each of the parties, and may be entered as a judgment in any court of
competent jurisdiction.
8.5. Notwithstanding any other provision in this Section 8 to the contrary, either party will at all times be entitled to
seek and obtain injunctive relief in relation to infringement or threatened infringement of its intellectual property
rights, in in relation to misappropriation of its trade secrets, in any court having jurisdiction.
9. CHOICE OF FORUM IN LIEU OF ARBITRATION. IF ARBITRATION CANNOT BE COMPELLED UNDER THE TERMS SET FORTH
IN SECTION 8, OR IF SECTION 8.3 IS NOT ENFORCEABLE, BUYER AND COMPANY AGREE AND IRREVOCABLY CONSENT TO
SUBMIT TO THE EXCLUSIVE JURISDICTION AND VENUE OF THE FEDERAL AND STATE COURTS LOCATED IN THE COUNTY
OF SANTA CLARA COUNTY, CALIFORNIA, U.S.A. FOR ALL DISPUTES ARISING OUT OF OR RELATING TO THIS AGREEMENT.
10. Contract Construction. In the event that any provision(s) of this Agreement shall be held invalid or unenforceable by a
court of competent jurisdiction or by any future legislative or administrative action, such holding or action shall not
negate the validity or enforceability of any other provisions hereof. The word “or” as used in this Agreement has the
meaning equivalent to “and/or”. The terms ‘include’, ‘includes’ and ‘including’ will be deemed to be immediately
followed by the phrase “without limitation.” If a party is the subject of a sentence, then the word “will” expresses an
obligation, and deemed equivalent to “shall”. The parties agree the rules contract interpretation that would otherwise
require ambiguities to be construed against the drafting party will not apply to this Agreement. These Terms are in the
English language only, which language will be controlling in all respects. Any versions of this Agreement in any other
language will be for accommodation only and will not be binding upon either party. All communications and
documentation to be furnished under this Agreement will be in the English language.
11. Waiver. The failure on the part of either party to exercise, or any delay in exercising, any right or remedy shall not
operate as a waiver thereof unless expressly stated herein.
12. Acknowledgment. Buyer and Company certify and acknowledge that both have carefully read all of the provisions of
this Agreement and understand and will fully and faithfully comply with such provisions. Buyer and Company certify VOLUNTARY REFUND REQUEST AND RELEASE Page 4 BUYER INITIALS:
and acknowledge that each has had the opportunity to review this Agreement with legal counsel, has either reviewed this
Agreement with legal counsel, or has decided not to seek such counsel.
13. Electronic Signatures. All parties (a) agree that electronic signatures to this Agreement are binding, and (b) agree to
the provisions of the U.S. E-SIGN Act (i.e., the Electronic Signatures in Global and National Commerce Act - ESIGN,
Pub.L. 106-229, 14 Stat. 464, enacted June 30, 2000, 15 U.S.C. ch.96). Nevertheless, Company may require Buyer to
sign this Agreement manually depending on the jurisdiction of Buyer.
 
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties have entered into this Voluntary Refund and Release Agreement as of the date
first written above.
 
 
BUYER:
Customer Signature Email
 
 
Printed Name Phone
 
 
Title Fax
 
 
Company Name
 
 
 
{SIGNATURE PAGE OF HASHFAST TECHNOLOGIES LLC}
 
 
 
 
HASHFAST TECHNOLOGIES LLC:
 
Signature:
Name:
Title:
Signature:
Email:

Is this legal? They will not give us refunds for our pre-orders unless we agree to their terms?
You don't have to agree to any arbitrary terms they give you when requesting your refunds. You simply need to notify them of your cancellation.

Lots of smart folks threw their agreement to the trash and simply requested the refunds without the extra terms they tried to "tack on".

It is probably part of the reason why HashFast is on it's knees and begging for help. (in my distorted perception perhaps?)

=========================

It was all PG's fault for giving people good advice on not accepting refunds willy nilly. PG did allow them to take that scammy step in their favor. Instead choosing to educating those customers about their enforceable [consumer] rights.

Lets all point our wagging finger at PG and say that he alone took down HashFast...that evil guy.

I hear he also gave BFL some trouble with "PayPal" when he stated they could all "double tap" the refund window. Such an evil person indeed!

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April 09, 2014, 03:18:16 PM
 #8867

Here is a copy of what i received.

VOLUNTARY REFUND REQUEST AND RELEASE
 
Hashfast Technologies LLC (“Hashfast”)
100 Bush Street, Suite 650
San Francisco, California 94104 United States
 
GENERAL RELEASE
 
1. Release. In consideration of the refund, and the separate and additional consideration described in the paragraph with
the heading titled “In Addition” that Buyer acknowledges Buyer would not otherwise be entitled to receive, Buyer (on
its own behalf and on behalf of Buyer’s parent companies, subsidiaries and affiliates, and each of their officers,
directors, equity owners, agents, staff, employees, representatives and attorneys, each in their individual and
corporate capacities) hereby fully, forever, irrevocably and unconditionally releases, remises and discharges Hashfast
Technologies LLC (referred to as “Hashfast” or “Company”), its parent companies, subsidiaries and affiliates, and each
of their officers, directors, equity owners, agents, staff, employees, representatives and attorneys (each in their
individual and corporate capacities) (hereinafter, the "Released Parties") from any and all actions, claims, charges,
complaints, demands, causes of action, suits, rights, debts, sums of money, costs, accounts, reckonings, covenants,
contracts, agreements, promises, doings, omissions, damages, executions, obligations, liabilities, damages, injuries,
consequences, and expenses
(including attorneys’ fees and costs), of every kind and nature which Buyer ever had or
now has against the Released Parties (the “Claims”).
 
right from the get-go this is the most rediculous set of terms I have seen. They are clearly trying to make you sign off on anything and everything that would otherwise be used to demonstrate thier breach of contract.

dont sign this.

24" PCI-E cables with 16AWG wires and stripped ends - great for server PSU mods, best prices https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=563461 also selling 6" M-F-M PCIe splitters and PCIe-PCIe
No longer a wannabe - now an ASIC owner!
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April 09, 2014, 04:55:16 PM
 #8868

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

tips    1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
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April 09, 2014, 04:56:58 PM
 #8869

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?


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raskul
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April 09, 2014, 05:00:49 PM
 #8870

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?

 Roll Eyes

do mangos ripen on the tree?
/m
i'll stand under that tree for as long as it takes, and hope that a mango drops into my hand before someone else comes along and picks it
chances are though, someone else will be eating my mango before my hand is filled.

tips    1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
cedivad
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April 09, 2014, 05:03:55 PM
 #8871

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?
There must be a reason i couldn't find the message you quoted, it's in my ignore list... Composed of one person as of now.
Let's skip the spam for scams with this poor marketing techniques, shall we?

I keep thinking about the people that signed the refund and release and are now complaining that they have not received their refund... I mean, have they read it before signing it?

Apart from that, it's 12:00 in texas, I'm curious to hear from the hearing. "plaintiff never purchased" Cheesy
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #gfkXpp4tFXMPEO7v

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
raskul
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April 09, 2014, 05:06:47 PM
 #8872

^^ as everyone gets tarred with the same brush.
of course, it's clearly my fault that hashfast failed us.

so much for 'community' it seems that some of us just want to pick a fight.

tips    1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
solarion
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April 09, 2014, 05:08:47 PM
 #8873

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?

 Roll Eyes

do mangos ripen on the tree?
/m
i'll stand under that tree for as long as it takes, and hope that a mango drops into my hand before someone else comes along and picks it

So that's a no then? Roll Eyes

You won't have me competing for the mangoes falling from the tree.

How many lying, stealing, slimebag pre-order distributors do we need in this space before people stop placing pre-orders? No thanks, being robbed by hashfast was enough for me.


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cedivad
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April 09, 2014, 05:10:57 PM
 #8874

No thanks, being robbed by hashfast was enough for me.
But you get a 10% discount!
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #kPwK8d4JRo3J0gTr

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
raskul
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April 09, 2014, 05:14:24 PM
 #8875

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?

 Roll Eyes

do mangos ripen on the tree?
/m
i'll stand under that tree for as long as it takes, and hope that a mango drops into my hand before someone else comes along and picks it

So that's a no then? Roll Eyes

You won't have me competing for the mangoes falling from the tree.

How many lying, stealing, slimebag pre-order distributors do we need in this space before people stop placing pre-orders? No thanks, being robbed by hashfast was enough for me.

man you really are hurt... sorry. still no need to tar everyone with the same brush.

tips    1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
solarion
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April 09, 2014, 05:16:02 PM
 #8876

No thanks, being robbed by hashfast was enough for me.
But you get a 10% discount!
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #kPwK8d4JRo3J0gTr

yay

Ordered from bitmain yesterday...shipped today with tracking number.


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solarion
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April 09, 2014, 05:18:17 PM
 #8877

for those of us who have cash tied up in preorders, including hashfast, spondoolies-tech are offering 10% discount.
i've ordered a small rig from them and just needed to send them proof of my refund request.
my babyjet should have been hashing by now, just glad to have another option to allow me to keep mining.

Is spondoolies selling in hand gear yet?

 Roll Eyes

do mangos ripen on the tree?
/m
i'll stand under that tree for as long as it takes, and hope that a mango drops into my hand before someone else comes along and picks it

So that's a no then? Roll Eyes

You won't have me competing for the mangoes falling from the tree.

How many lying, stealing, slimebag pre-order distributors do we need in this space before people stop placing pre-orders? No thanks, being robbed by hashfast was enough for me.

man you really are hurt... sorry. still no need to tar everyone with the same brush.

I asked a simple question. I don't know what spondoolies is doing, because I haven't checked their thread in some time. Instead of a simple yes or no I get some snotty crap about fruit trees. Welcome to ignore.

Is there something unreasonable about expecting these companies to actually have something to sell before paying for products?


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Inaba
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April 09, 2014, 07:24:32 PM
 #8878

Yes actually. When you make a pre-order and then expect immediate shipping you are being unreasonable. If you want immediate shipping, don't pre-order. It's simply amazing how many people fail to understand how to do that.

No one has ever been forced to pre-order mining gear. If you don't like it and everything it implies, don't do it. Easy.

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
RoadStress
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April 09, 2014, 07:39:20 PM
 #8879

Yes actually. When you make a pre-order and then expect immediate shipping you are being unreasonable. If you want immediate shipping, don't pre-order. It's simply amazing how many people fail to understand how to do that.

No one has ever been forced to pre-order mining gear. If you don't like it and everything it implies, don't do it. Easy.

Don't you have a lawsuit to attend because we all know that nobody forced you to give some unreal deadlines.

iCEBREAKER is a troll! He and cypherdoc helped HashFast scam 50 Million $ from its customers !
H/w Hosting Directory & Reputation - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=622998.0
greenbtc
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April 09, 2014, 07:50:00 PM
 #8880

Yes actually. When you make a pre-order and then expect immediate shipping you are being unreasonable. If you want immediate shipping, don't pre-order. It's simply amazing how many people fail to understand how to do that.

No one has ever been forced to pre-order mining gear. If you don't like it and everything it implies, don't do it. Easy.

Don't you have a lawsuit to attend because we all know that nobody forced you to give some unreal deadlines.

I'll +1 that.
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