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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 877762 times)
gmaxwell
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January 29, 2014, 09:10:52 PM
 #7901

No, you are wrong. If BTC fell from $100 to $50, buying BTC still would have been the better investment.
You would buy a BJ for 60 coins, and earn back, lets say, 10 coins. You spent ~$5750 and ended up with $500.
If you had bought BTC, you'd have 60 BTC, and at the end it would be worth $3000. Still the better investment.
Yup. Unless you get into touchy feelies soft valuations of your contribution to the Bitcoin network security (which you probably shouldn't unless you're running and mining on your own node), there is no scenario where a miner which produces less in Bitcoin than you could have had instead is to your advantage.

Bitcoin will not be compromised
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aneutronic
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January 29, 2014, 09:43:25 PM
 #7902

this^
even if hf ships 1600 ghs mpp at the end of Feb (lol) he will still only get ~6BTC per machine in 6 months, not even close to the 61BTC he could have bought for the usd cost of each machine. I'm no investment expert but a 90% loss is not a good investment no matter which way you try to paint it.
I feel sorry for those that don't understand this.   Sad

Not quite.

Not buying something is not the same as taking a loss.


*facepalm*

yes, quite, just as the last 2 posts state.

I'm not a day trader, I believe in BTC and I'm invested for the long term.
I lost my ass in BTC betting on 2 scamming miner manufacturers, and I use that term very loosely, and now I'm done.
I've contributed all I can afford to the security of the network so no more miners for me, I will buy BTC whenever possible and hodl.

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January 29, 2014, 11:08:28 PM
 #7903

No, you are wrong. If BTC fell from $100 to $50, buying BTC still would have been the better investment.

You would buy a BJ for 60 coins, and earn back, lets say, 10 coins. You spent ~$5750 and ended up with $500.

If you had bought BTC, you'd have 60 BTC, and at the end it would be worth $3000. Still the better investment.

Not necessarily. ASIC miner hardware would have been cheaper as a result of bitcoin being cheaper, but not that much cheaper. The price still has a floor that is controlled by the hardware manufacturing process. So you'd be able to sell a 400ghs miner for let's say $3500 on ebay (as opposed to getting ~ $7000 today).

So buy a miner for 60 BTC, sell it for $3500 and then buy 70 BTC with it.

Of course that wasn't the case, so this is speculation.

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dbbit
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January 29, 2014, 11:20:31 PM
 #7904

Yup. Unless you get into touchy feelies soft valuations of your contribution to the Bitcoin network security (which you probably shouldn't unless you're running and mining on your own node), there is no scenario where a miner which produces less in Bitcoin than you could have had instead is to your advantage.

I'm not saying that it was the more advantageous trade. I'm saying that a missed opportunity is not the same as a loss.


At the time DPR got arrested I thought BTC was more likely to hit $50 than $1000. So I decided to leverage and stay with USD and not invest in BTC. I was totally wrong of course, BUT I didn't lose any money. I can sell (or refund) my BabyJet now for more than I paid for it, and probably also still mine more than I paid for it.

You guys however decided that investing in BTC was a great idea at that time, and you were right. However, you lost money.

Funny how that works out.


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Jutarul
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January 29, 2014, 11:53:26 PM
 #7905

....
Of course that wasn't the case, so this is speculation.
I am seeing people making a lot of messed up arguments about how spending money on mining equipment is a form of speculation and how it depends on Bitcoin price. It's a straw man which distracts from the real issue:

HashFast sold hardware based on an october delivery which resulted in yield projection based on a 2 PetaHash network. They failed to deliver by a significant time-span and the network is now 20 PetaHash and the yield projection is down to 10%. That right there, gentlemen, is the damage done and the only way HashFast can possibly compensate for those yield losses is by eating into their previous, current and future profit margins.

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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January 29, 2014, 11:58:17 PM
 #7906

HashFast sold hardware based on an october delivery which resulted in yield projection based on a 2 PetaHash network. They failed to deliver by a significant time-span and the network is now 20 PetaHash and the yield projection is down to 10%. That right there, gentlemen, is the damage done
Agreed.
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January 30, 2014, 12:05:13 AM
 #7907

Yup. Unless you get into touchy feelies soft valuations of your contribution to the Bitcoin network security (which you probably shouldn't unless you're running and mining on your own node), there is no scenario where a miner which produces less in Bitcoin than you could have had instead is to your advantage.
How's the lawsuit going?

[OVER] RIDDLES 2nd edition --- this was claimed. Look out for 3rd edition!
I won't ever ask for a loan nor offer any escrow service. If I do, please consider my account as hacked.
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January 30, 2014, 12:07:06 AM
 #7908

....
Of course that wasn't the case, so this is speculation.
I am seeing people making a lot of messed up arguments about how spending money on mining equipment is a form of speculation and how it depends on Bitcoin price. It's a straw man which distracts from the real issue:

HashFast sold hardware based on an october delivery which resulted in yield projection based on a 2 PetaHash network. They failed to deliver by a significant time-span and the network is now 20 PetaHash and the yield projection is down to 10%. That right there, gentlemen, is the damage done and the only way HashFast can possibly compensate for those yield losses is by eating into their previous, current and future profit margins.

In my best guess HF will only do what BFL did at best and offer customers a discount on a new pre-order for a new product range.  Like BFL did with the Monarch for their 65nm pre-order customers.  Which they first promised for delivery last October and are now say late March delivery at the earliest IIRC  Roll Eyes

Jutarul
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January 30, 2014, 12:09:53 AM
 #7909

In my best guess HF will only do what BFL did at best and offer customers a discount on a new pre-order for a new product range.  Like BFL did with the Monarch for their 65nm pre-order customers.  Which they first promised for delivery last October and are now say late March delivery at the earliest IIRC  Roll Eyes
Every customer is free to make their own decisions. But given their track record, any further deal with HashFast in which you as a customer have to extend trust first would fall into the category of what Einstein called the definition of insanity.

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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January 30, 2014, 12:16:41 AM
 #7910

Every customer is free to make their own decisions. But given their track record, any further deal with HashFast in which you as a customer have to extend trust first would fall into the category of what Einstein called the definition of insanity.
As you're an AM board member, any post of yours here should be discarded. (even though I might agree with you).
Please keep your interventions within what is morally acceptable.

[OVER] RIDDLES 2nd edition --- this was claimed. Look out for 3rd edition!
I won't ever ask for a loan nor offer any escrow service. If I do, please consider my account as hacked.
dbbit
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January 30, 2014, 12:29:53 AM
 #7911

what Einstein called the definition of insanity.

Misattribution. Einstein never said that.

The first sources of the quote came from somewhere between 1979 and 1983, by both Narcotics Anonymous & Rite Mae Brown. It's unsure who of them came up with it first, but it sure wasn't Einstein.

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ninjarobot
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January 30, 2014, 12:42:41 AM
 #7912

In my best guess HF will only do what BFL did at best and offer customers a discount on a new pre-order for a new product range.  Like BFL did with the Monarch for their 65nm pre-order customers.  Which they first promised for delivery last October and are now say late March delivery at the earliest IIRC  Roll Eyes

If I remember correctly, BFL first jacked the prices of their miners by 100% and then gave pre-order customers a 25% discount voucher for future purchases to compensate for the delays. Also, the voucher would expire ~30 days after issuance...

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January 30, 2014, 01:08:42 AM
 #7913

In my best guess HF will only do what BFL did at best and offer customers a discount on a new pre-order for a new product range.  Like BFL did with the Monarch for their 65nm pre-order customers.  Which they first promised for delivery last October and are now say late March delivery at the earliest IIRC  Roll Eyes

If I remember correctly, BFL first jacked the prices of their miners by 100% and then gave pre-order customers a 25% discount voucher for future purchases to compensate for the delays. Also, the voucher would expire ~30 days after issuance...



Yeah, and I never fell for it and luckily put our coins on KNC instead.  The only reason I even put money down on BFL was because for nearly a year they were the only bitcoin ASIC manufacturer with anything public you could put money down on.  I wouldn't trust HF again if I was a pre-order customer either after what they've done too.  Although CT I might still trust so far as they let December pre-order customers move into cheaper January pre-orders at very late notice.  Although it currently looks like January CT pre-order customers are going to take a big loss in bitcoin ROI.

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January 30, 2014, 01:22:25 AM
 #7914

The only reason I even put money down on BFL was because for nearly a year they were the only bitcoin ASIC manufacturer with anything public you could put money down on.
BFL's ASIC was announced summer 2012. Avalon's ASIC September 2012.
Am i wrong?

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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January 30, 2014, 01:59:24 AM
 #7915

No, you are not wrong.
Friedcat was the last one to announce working on asic after bASIC, but is the first one to market.

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January 30, 2014, 02:04:08 AM
 #7916

John Skrodenis emailed me and asked me to specify that the notification I received was not for shipping for batch two, but rather just to check my mailing address.

Apparently a lot of B1 customers are upset and he wanted me to clarify this.

Code:
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January 30, 2014, 02:24:10 AM
 #7917

The only reason I even put money down on BFL was because for nearly a year they were the only bitcoin ASIC manufacturer with anything public you could put money down on.
BFL's ASIC was announced summer 2012. Avalon's ASIC September 2012.
Am i wrong?

But as far as the put money down thing, Avalon didn't take 1st batch orders until Jan 2013. Which filled up damn quick as did batch 2 in Feb (?) and then the full crazy happened by the third.

TL;DR See Spot run. Run Spot run. .... .... Freelance interweb comedian, for teh lulz >>> 1MqAAR4XkJWfDt367hVTv5SstPZ54Fwse6

Bitcoin Custodian: Keeping BTC away from weak heads since Feb '13, adopter of homeless bitcoins.
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January 30, 2014, 02:29:21 AM
 #7918

John Skrodenis emailed me and asked me to specify that the notification I received was not for shipping for batch two, but rather just to check my mailing address.

Apparently a lot of B1 customers are upset and he wanted me to clarify this.

B2 customers are upset also. Did he clarify when B2 would start shipping?

BTC Scotch fund: 1GFZos2WGknCeVgDtjpHwo3jeJ4tSLVrXS
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January 30, 2014, 02:46:04 AM
 #7919

John Skrodenis emailed me and asked me to specify that the notification I received was not for shipping for batch two, but rather just to check my mailing address.

Apparently a lot of B1 customers are upset and he wanted me to clarify this.

B2 customers are upset also. Did he clarify when B2 would start shipping?

no

Code:
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dbbit
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January 30, 2014, 03:03:52 AM
 #7920

John Skrodenis emailed me and asked me to specify that the notification I received was not for shipping for batch two, but rather just to check my mailing address.

Apparently a lot of B1 customers are upset and he wanted me to clarify this.

Also, if you get a UPS shipping notification - ignore it. Apparently HashFast just prints out a shipping label for fun and then they sit on it without actually delivering the package to UPS.

Now poor UPS has to send me an update every day apologizing for why they haven't delivered it yet.

I receive literally 1000s of packages every year - I didn't even know UPS would do this.  Just shows you how far off into lala-land HashFast has gone.


I keep wanting to go over to the HashFast-is-a-scam camp, but when they then manage to pull of such extraordinary feats of idiocy with so much consistency, they pull me back into the HashFast-is-spectacularly-incompetent camp.

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