NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[swartzfeger]

Does anybody know where the source code for doge tipbot is

https://github.com/mohland/dogetipbot

There's also this, a Facebook doge tip bot:

https://github.com/brutalhonesty/fb-doge

I'd rather eat a bag of hair than socialize on fB, but I'm sure some would find NXT tipping to be useful.

[jl777]

Does anybody know where the source code for doge tipbot is

https://github.com/mohland/dogetipbot

OK, somebody here must be able to use this and weselyh's code to deal with NXT payments and make a quick 20,000+ NXT

Anybody? You dont have to cooperate if you dont want to, I would just like to know whenever somebody starts on a project so I can go from recruiting mode to checking status mode for that project

James

[jl777]

Does anybody know where the source code for doge tipbot is

https://github.com/mohland/dogetipbot

There's also this, a Facebook doge tip bot:

https://github.com/brutalhonesty/fb-doge

I'd rather eat a bag of hair than socialize on fB, but I'm sure some would find NXT tipping to be useful.

5000 NXT bonus if we also get facebook tipping

[opticalcarrier]

ok im gonna bring it up again, I forgot who it was before but I cant believe it wasnt wanted more...

I think we should integrate some error correcting code into addresses.  Yes, a client software function/method can do this, and that is well and god, but what happens if (when) memory in a server that processes TONS of transactions starts to go bad?

Is it reasonable to just ignore this issue?  Come on I mean we are talking about overtaking BTC and hitting 1000's of transactions per second here, why not add another layer of protection?

Last I heard, NxtChg (and ricot?) had already finished libraries for it in multiple languages. This is to make it easier for client devs to use.

EDIT: https://forums.nxtcrypto.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=524&start=190

Isnt what they are implemeting a client-side only deal that only deals with user-typos?  Im talking about the scenario were a client is experiencing memory issues and puts the wrong destination address into a transission, and having a forging node being able to detect invalid addresses from transactions it receives fro that client and to reject them.

[Zahlen]

What's the purpose behind minimizing the # of different instructions?

Every instruction needs to be implemented and tested. Fewer instructions means less work and faster time to market

Mmm, but you'll need to test the higher-level instructions built on top of the lower-level instructions too right? Or will we be leaving that for third parties to figure out what higher-lev instructions they want?

[Zahlen]

ok im gonna bring it up again, I forgot who it was before but I cant believe it wasnt wanted more...

I think we should integrate some error correcting code into addresses.  Yes, a client software function/method can do this, and that is well and god, but what happens if (when) memory in a server that processes TONS of transactions starts to go bad?

Is it reasonable to just ignore this issue?  Come on I mean we are talking about overtaking BTC and hitting 1000's of transactions per second here, why not add another layer of protection?

Last I heard, NxtChg (and ricot?) had already finished libraries for it in multiple languages. This is to make it easier for client devs to use.

EDIT: https://forums.nxtcrypto.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=524&start=190

Isnt what they are implemeting a client-side only deal that only deals with user-typos?  Im talking about the scenario were a client is experiencing memory issues and puts the wrong destination address into a transission, and having a forging node being able to detect invalid addresses from transactions it receives fro that client and to reject them.

Yeah, theirs is client-side only. NxtChg was the one who brought up the memory issues (see? One reason why he should be around). I haven't heard anything about ECC at the protocol level, other than CfB saying "We can't".

EDIT: My bad, not accurate. CfB was saying "We can't" with respect to using extra bits in the address space for ECC/error detection. Could still be possible at the protocol level through other means. ANd I should have read your first post more carefully :X

[jl777]

What's the purpose behind minimizing the # of different instructions?

Every instruction needs to be implemented and tested. Fewer instructions means less work and faster time to market

Mmm, but you'll need to test the higher-level instructions built on top of the lower-level instructions too right? Or will we be leaving that for third parties to figure out what higher-lev instructions they want?

The key is that we can start testing the higher level instructions (which already exist) in parallel with development of the lower level.

Instead of longer dev time for 28 instructions, we have (presumably) shorter dev time for 1 instruction and while that is being done simultaneously test the higher lever instructions and C compiler and C library functions. Not that most C library functions will be used as it will be expensive, but I figure if relatively complicated C library functions works based on a single opcode (which we can test right now!), then it bodes well for Turing scripts to function properly

I am optimizing time to market by splitting the projects into pieces that can be developed in parallel. Maybe not the perfect split, so always open to improvements as measured by quicker expected time to market

James

[jl777]

Does anybody know where the source code for doge tipbot is

https://github.com/mohland/dogetipbot

There's also this, a Facebook doge tip bot:

https://github.com/brutalhonesty/fb-doge

I'd rather eat a bag of hair than socialize on fB, but I'm sure some would find NXT tipping to be useful.

5000 NXT bonus if we also get facebook tipping

I'll match this also. 5k.

Hey! It feels like we are playing poker. How many aces do you have?

[TwinWinNerD]

Bounty: Reddit.com Tip-Bot

https://forums.nxtcrypto.org/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=710&p=3403#p3403

http://www.reddit.com/r/NXT/comments/1wyi9j/looking_at_doge_i_really_think_we_need_a_reddit/

Donation address: NXTcommunityfund (jl777) 13776816462073143763
Write a PM to jl777 --> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=pm;sa=send;u=177323  
and tell him that you want to dedicate the donation to the reddit tip-bot.

Write a PM to me and let me know how much you sent to jl777 so i can keep this post uptodate!

List of Donations until now:
100 NXT TwinWinNerD
507 NXT gs02xzz
100 NXT swartzfeger
100 NXT VanBreuk
10.000 NXT Community Funds
10.000 NXT buybitcoinscanada
(100-500 NXT Zahlen, but direct donation after finshed work)


Total: 20.807 NXT

We really need this bot going to increase our publicity on reddit!

Bounty #2: Facebook Tip-Bot

List of Donations until now:
5.000 NXT Community Funds
5.000 NXT buybitcoinscanada
50 NXT swartzfeger

Total: 10.050 NXT

[Zahlen]

(I dunno server stuff, so maybe I'm talking out my ass here)

What if future versions of the server supported stuff like http://localhost:7874/nxt?requestType=sendMoney&secretPhrase=123&recipient=[RS encoded address]&amount=5000&fee=1&deadline=32767 ?

That way we could just use the libraries ricot and NxtChg wrote. Would this still require changes at the protocol level to accomodate?

[Malibusparky]

Am I the only one that feels a tip bot for nxt is a terrible idea? Copying what worked for doge is like BMW putting giant hamsters in their commercials because it sold cars

for Kia. Isn't Nxt's 2nd gen features and sophistication going to look played down if we "tip" with it? Also, people tip with doge because it was worthless and there were billions

of them. Even with the recent price surge they are still fractions of a penny in value. Nxt is currently valued at 6-7 cents and will be a lot higher soon. Will you tip

with them just because some tween made a funny meme? Ha ha Dos Equis guy said Chuck Norris doesn't do push ups he pushes the earth down. Here's 50 Nxt.

I love each of my Nxt, no wanna tip with. Wanna marry thems. Please explain to me why I am wrong or misunderstand. I obviously am not getting it or missed something. Thanks

[jl777]

Competitive update:

etherium was struck a potentially lethal blow today, CfB said "lets do it" to implementing Turing complete scripts. I stumbled onto a single opcode Turing complete machine code (no joke) and it even has C compiler. There is bounty to start the testing of said C compiler and libraries. I reached out to the developers of the subleq project, no word yet

emunie is in a heap of trouble: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=439045.msg4930738#msg4930738

I still have not gotten any answers to some pretty important questions that I have asked over and over: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=439045.msg4943552#msg4943552

However, in spite of all these issues, emunie still might actually do some pretty cool things, so need to keep an eye on it. It supposedly can handle 1000TPS, but now that it is a UK ltd company we are looking at ripple without VC backing and no staff.

Have some homework to read the mastercoin thread, but my plan for dealing with mastercoin is to help XCP as much as possible. [disclosure: I am guilty of burning BTC] XCP already does what mastercoin promises to do and while XCP is currently where NXT was right after genesis, XCP is where NXT was right after genesis.

DOGE probably doesnt have to worry too much about the NXT tipbot yet, but soon someone will take the 30,000+ NXT bounty.

Do I need to bother with Protoshares? Last I heard, key guys jumped ship.

While technically XCP is competitive to NXT at some level, I really see the XCP community as being most similar to the NXT community. No big corporate games going on, lots of open activity and since they are built on top of BTC blockchain, the overlap is really not that big. I am working on ways where both NXT and XCP can help each other. Even though I had a NXT tagline, they welcomed me graciously and I felt right at home.

James

P.S. I can really use some help here. Working night and day on some pretty complex stuff and you have to remember I am supposed to have low competence level with tech, so please guys with actual tech skills, step up. If not for the bounties, so that we can all make NXT more valuable

[Zahlen]

What's the purpose behind minimizing the # of different instructions?

Every instruction needs to be implemented and tested. Fewer instructions means less work and faster time to market

Mmm, but you'll need to test the higher-level instructions built on top of the lower-level instructions too right? Or will we be leaving that for third parties to figure out what higher-lev instructions they want?

The key is that we can start testing the higher level instructions (which already exist) in parallel with development of the lower level.

Instead of longer dev time for 28 instructions, we have (presumably) shorter dev time for 1 instruction and while that is being done simultaneously test the higher lever instructions and C compiler and C library functions. Not that most C library functions will be used as it will be expensive, but I figure if relatively complicated C library functions works based on a single opcode (which we can test right now!), then it bodes well for Turing scripts to function properly

I am optimizing time to market by splitting the projects into pieces that can be developed in parallel. Maybe not the perfect split, so always open to improvements as measured by quicker expected time to market

James

Thanks! Besides time to market, what other factors do we need to consider? CfB mentioned memory, I guess execution speed is also a factor? subleq supports (and maybe encourages?) a lot of jumping around in memory, though the operations performed on the memory contents (subtraction, comparison of first bit (i.e <= 0 or not)) are fast.

I'm playing around with subleq right now, so I'm curious about all this.

EDIT: I might be able to help here. I know something about general computability theory (e.g. Turing completeness, halting problem concerns), algorithmic complexity analysis. But don't have experience with software testing (at industry standards).

[jl777]

Am I the only one that feels a tip bot for nxt is a terrible idea? Copying what worked for doge is like BMW putting giant hamsters in their commercials because it sold cars

for Kia. Isn't Nxt's 2nd gen features and sophistication going to look played down if we "tip" with it? Also, people tip with doge because it was worthless and there were billions

of them. Even with the recent price surge they are still fractions of a penny in value. Nxt is currently valued at 6-7 cents and will be a lot higher soon. Will you tip

with them just because some tween made a funny meme? Ha ha Dos Equis guy said Chuck Norris doesn't do push ups he pushes the earth down. Here's 50 Nxt.

I love each of my Nxt, no wanna tip with. Wanna marry thems. Please explain to me why I am wrong or misunderstand. I obviously am not getting it or missed something. Thanks

DOGE has trained people to tip. It becomes not such a hard thing to do. Maybe tip amounts will be 5 NXT or 2 NXT, the key is to get more people using NXT. That is always good.

We can always tip milli-NXT when that is there.

In general, if it is not hard to do, it makes sense to copy what has met success elsewhere. Also, the more people that earn NXT by doing projects, the more people we have that are familiar with programming for NXT. That is most definitely a good thing, even if what they are doing might not be as valuable as we hope.

James

[jl777]

What's the purpose behind minimizing the # of different instructions?

Every instruction needs to be implemented and tested. Fewer instructions means less work and faster time to market

Mmm, but you'll need to test the higher-level instructions built on top of the lower-level instructions too right? Or will we be leaving that for third parties to figure out what higher-lev instructions they want?

The key is that we can start testing the higher level instructions (which already exist) in parallel with development of the lower level.

Instead of longer dev time for 28 instructions, we have (presumably) shorter dev time for 1 instruction and while that is being done simultaneously test the higher lever instructions and C compiler and C library functions. Not that most C library functions will be used as it will be expensive, but I figure if relatively complicated C library functions works based on a single opcode (which we can test right now!), then it bodes well for Turing scripts to function properly

I am optimizing time to market by splitting the projects into pieces that can be developed in parallel. Maybe not the perfect split, so always open to improvements as measured by quicker expected time to market

James

Thanks! Besides time to market, what other factors do we need to consider? CfB mentioned memory, I guess execution speed is also a factor? subleq supports (and maybe encourages?) a lot of jumping around in memory, though the operations performed on the memory contents (subtraction, comparison of first bit (i.e <= 0 or not)) are fast.

I'm playing around with subleq right now, so I'm curious about all this.

EDIT: I might be able to help here. I know something about general computability theory (e.g. Turing completeness, halting problem concerns), algorithmic complexity analysis. But don't have experience with software testing (at industry standards).

10000 NXT bounty for methodical playing around

There should be publicly available testing suites for standard C libraries, hopefully someone can post it.

I doubt execution speed will be an issue at all, since it will be small programs most likely to fit in CPU cache. The OSIC machine model seems to be pretty simple, they implemented it on an FPGA and it got some decent performance.

Since CfB said the script cant access anything external, I think they will execute as fast as you can load it from the blockchain, unless it infinite loops. Not sure how CfB will deal with that sort of thing, kill -9

James

[Zahlen]

Isn't Nxt's 2nd gen features and sophistication going to look played down if we "tip" with it? Also, people tip with doge because it was worthless and there were billions of them.

I don't think so. It may not be /r/dogecoin style tipping, it could be used for when people feel someone else has done something worthwhile for them, or something worth commending. Not much RL tipping in my country, but from what I hear, tipping can be a sign of sophistication.

Instead of comparing it with /r/dogecoin tipping, maybe compare it with gifting Reddit gold?

(Disclosure: I've been tipped non-trivial amounts of nxt I do believe people are generous, when they see good things.)


EDIT:

10000 NXT bounty for methodical playing around

See? Woohoo!!

[Anon136]

What's the purpose behind minimizing the # of different instructions?

Every instruction needs to be implemented and tested. Fewer instructions means less work and faster time to market

Mmm, but you'll need to test the higher-level instructions built on top of the lower-level instructions too right? Or will we be leaving that for third parties to figure out what higher-lev instructions they want?

The key is that we can start testing the higher level instructions (which already exist) in parallel with development of the lower level.

Instead of longer dev time for 28 instructions, we have (presumably) shorter dev time for 1 instruction and while that is being done simultaneously test the higher lever instructions and C compiler and C library functions. Not that most C library functions will be used as it will be expensive, but I figure if relatively complicated C library functions works based on a single opcode (which we can test right now!), then it bodes well for Turing scripts to function properly

I am optimizing time to market by splitting the projects into pieces that can be developed in parallel. Maybe not the perfect split, so always open to improvements as measured by quicker expected time to market

James

Thanks! Besides time to market, what other factors do we need to consider? CfB mentioned memory, I guess execution speed is also a factor? subleq supports (and maybe encourages?) a lot of jumping around in memory, though the operations performed on the memory contents (subtraction, comparison of first bit (i.e <= 0 or not)) are fast.

I'm playing around with subleq right now, so I'm curious about all this.

EDIT: I might be able to help here. I know something about general computability theory (e.g. Turing completeness, halting problem concerns), algorithmic complexity analysis. But don't have experience with software testing (at industry standards).

Correct me if im wrong but wouldn't we need a sandbox built into the nxt client?

[TwinWinNerD]

I just wrote to the creator of the opensource DOGE bot:


Hi mohland!

I am writing to you as a mod from /r/NXT and a NXT/BTC/DOGE enthusiast. 

Our community put a bounty on the creation of a smooth working reddit NXT tip-bot. The current bounty is 20800 NXT (1500$~). It is up for grabs for anyone that can make it work with our currency.

The NXT is not a clone of BTC so i think it is a bit harder to implement than a normal altcoin but it should be worth it considering the 1500$ bounty (and rising!).

Could you look into this? You made the DOGE bot really awesome and this would be amazing!

Regards,
Paul

Hey,

Yup -- it is a bit harder to implement -- it doesnt adhere to the standard JSON-RPC API that bitcoin/altcoins have, so none of the existing libraries for python work with it.

Not impossible, but will require some more work. dogetipbot is taking up most of my time, but I'd be happy to answer any questions over there for you.

--mohland

[swartzfeger]

Please explain to me why I am wrong or misunderstand. I obviously am not getting it or missed something. Thanks

No, you're not 'wrong', and I agree with a lot of your analogies.

Still, it's an easy way to send NXT. It gets the community involved. It gets NXT moving from one hand to another. Anything that does this (sans cute Shiba meme) is a good thing.

As it stands now, we're ostensibly the most advanced crypto with arguably the most fucked up, un-user friendly client ever. A simple way to tip NXT will relieve some of the pressure until all of the various service providers are up and running.

And I guess like anything we don't like, we can simply choose not to participate.

[jl777]

I just wrote to the creator of the opensource DOGE bot:


Hi mohland!

I am writing to you as a mod from /r/NXT and a NXT/BTC/DOGE enthusiast. 

Our community put a bounty on the creation of a smooth working reddit NXT tip-bot. The current bounty is 20800 NXT (1500$~). It is up for grabs for anyone that can make it work with our currency.

The NXT is not a clone of BTC so i think it is a bit harder to implement than a normal altcoin but it should be worth it considering the 1500$ bounty (and rising!).

Could you look into this? You made the DOGE bot really awesome and this would be amazing!

Regards,
Paul

Hey,

Yup -- it is a bit harder to implement -- it doesnt adhere to the standard JSON-RPC API that bitcoin/altcoins have, so none of the existing libraries for python work with it.

Not impossible, but will require some more work. dogetipbot is taking up most of my time, but I'd be happy to answer any questions over there for you.

--mohland

At least we have support of orig dev, so now someone can ask some questions about how best to splice in wesleyh's NXT payment module, which I think is in python

For someone with experience in this stuff, it should be easy money

James