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Question: Who will be the champion in 2023/24 season?
Manchester City - 87 (46%)
Liverpool - 31 (16.4%)
Arsenal - 39 (20.6%)
Chelsea - 7 (3.7%)
Manchester United - 13 (6.9%)
Totenham - 7 (3.7%)
Newcastle - 2 (1.1%)
Other - 3 (1.6%)
Total Voters: 189

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Author Topic: Premier League Prediction Thread 2023/2024  (Read 642339 times)
onecall123
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June 09, 2023, 06:53:54 AM
 #75781

Liverpool FC 2022/23 season didn't go as planned, as they failed to make top four standings. It's disappointing because they lost some games that could have guaranteed Liverpool the top four. As a fan, it's disheartening to accept the fact that we won't be hearing the iconic Champions League anthem at Anfield next season. However, there is still hope as Liverpool will undoubtedly fight hard to win the EPL title in 23/24 season. However, new recruitment is essential. The good news is that Liverpool is already working on this and has signed a new no. 10, Alexis Allister. This signing has certainly put a smile on my face as Alexis is a talented player from Argentina with immense potential. He has all the qualities to become a leading figure in the Liverpool squad and I am excited to see what he can bring to the team next season.

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Iroh
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June 09, 2023, 06:55:42 AM
 #75782


The Premier League is now more competitive than ever. Newcastle's performances this season have surprised everyone. This team played well. And so if Chelsea is aiming to win the title then they need a stronger squad and definitely add more talented players to the squad. Coach Poch is quite experienced. But will he be able to stabilize the Chelsea team? Poch will not be successful. He was not successful with PSG. And so I'd say we shouldn't expect too much from Chelsea.

The EPL is getting more interesting as more clubs are gearing up and becoming more competitive. Newcastle did surprise me in their performance. They played well during the season and came in amongst the top four positions. They’re surely a team to watch out for next season as they’ve shown they’re not to be underestimated. I too think Brighton played pretty well last season and might play more better come next season.
I’m still not sure about Chelsea and can’t say much. Right now, I can only hope their situation gets better next season.
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June 09, 2023, 07:24:35 AM
 #75783


The Premier League is now more competitive than ever. Newcastle's performances this season have surprised everyone. This team played well. And so if Chelsea is aiming to win the title then they need a stronger squad and definitely add more talented players to the squad. Coach Poch is quite experienced. But will he be able to stabilize the Chelsea team? Poch will not be successful. He was not successful with PSG. And so I'd say we shouldn't expect too much from Chelsea.

The EPL is getting more interesting as more clubs are gearing up and becoming more competitive. Newcastle did surprise me in their performance. They played well during the season and came in amongst the top four positions. They’re surely a team to watch out for next season as they’ve shown they’re not to be underestimated. I too think Brighton played pretty well last season and might play more better come next season.
I’m still not sure about Chelsea and can’t say much. Right now, I can only hope their situation gets better next season.
The kick n rush tagline in premier league seems very much applied by eddie howe at newcastle united .. making the fans so satisfy watch their club every single game , the transformation under him with limited transfer fund despite newcastle can be considered as rich were really impressive, they might shop big now.

Chelsea reported looking to sell 15 players include kovacic , the most consistent player at the club , this sounds wrong.

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June 09, 2023, 07:32:59 AM
 #75784

Arteta doesn't have good backup players when the squad feels tired or injured, of course Arteta doesn't have other players to rely on, even though Arsenal could have won the league this season, unfortunately Arteta didn't really manage their players at the end of the season, Arsenal have been around for so long top of the table before but unfortunately at the end of the season they looked tired and inconsistent.
Arteta tried in the just ended season but Arteta those not have much experience that was what stopped him from winning league for Arsenal, how will their be a team and you don’t have back up, toward the ending of the season, from Arsenal performance drop, you will know that those players are tired, how will you keep on using the same squad from the beginning of season till ending, they will get tired and that was what happened to Arsenal, Arteta tried but if am to blame anyone why Arsenal didn’t win the league, then am still going to blame Arteta for that. But am sure he will correct his mistakes before the next season will start, but if he those not, then Arsenal won’t really perform well next season.

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June 09, 2023, 07:50:26 AM
 #75785

Arteta doesn't have good backup players when the squad feels tired or injured, of course Arteta doesn't have other players to rely on, even though Arsenal could have won the league this season, unfortunately Arteta didn't really manage their players at the end of the season, Arsenal have been around for so long top of the table before but unfortunately at the end of the season they looked tired and inconsistent.
Arteta tried in the just ended season but Arteta those not have much experience that was what stopped him from winning league for Arsenal, how will their be a team and you don’t have back up, toward the ending of the season, from Arsenal performance drop, you will know that those players are tired, how will you keep on using the same squad from the beginning of season till ending, they will get tired and that was what happened to Arsenal, Arteta tried but if am to blame anyone why Arsenal didn’t win the league, then am still going to blame Arteta for that. But am sure he will correct his mistakes before the next season will start, but if he those not, then Arsenal won’t really perform well next season.
This was the problem that made Arsenal unable to win the trophy due to lack of back up like you said. Another problem is the players are too young and lack experience on how to tackle big teams when they are on pressure. This was the only opportunity that Arsenal had to lift up the trophy again after so many years but lack of preparation in the long term run messed up their fate.

I believe that Arteta will learn from his mistakes and buy more players which will help the club when some are tired to keep the consistency of the club because Arteta is a good coach,if he could manage these players from the beginning of the season to the end and they became second on the table.

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June 09, 2023, 08:40:31 AM
 #75786

~~~
Although the Gunners failed to win a single title this season, they are on their way to UCL football. Things will be more challenging if the players don't improve their present pattern of game, players enhance their level on the field. More responsibilities for Mikel Arteta; he developed Arsenal and rebuilt them to their former glory; the Gunners only lack a solid winning factor, which is consistency. They're not consistent; despite scoring well this season, we'll see a decline in their performance next season; that's how the club operates; I'm guessing things will be different at Emirates Stadium next season.
Mikel Arteta has built Arsenal a lot better this season and it's been a pretty good process now they just need to add some strengths to the team and make this team even more consistent.
next season Arsenal will play in the UCL and because this requires this team to develop much better so they can compete on the European stage, I see that so far Mikel Arteta has been quite successful in managing Arsenal.
and I'm sure if Mikel Arteta was given more time to manage Arsenal then it is very likely that he will be able to bring the Arsenal team to achievements.

Mikel Arteta has done a fantastic job this season. This is really commendable, if they can maintain the consistency at the end of the season, maybe Arsenal would be the champions of this season. But it was their misfortune that they could not win the championship. As Arsenal will play in the Champions League next season. So they need a stronger squad. The Champions League and Premier League are very competitive. It is much more difficult to maintain consistency in both places. And so in addition to strengthening Arsenal's squad, they must also keep their bench team strong. Otherwise, Arsenal's performance will suffer badly if a key player gets injured.
It is impossible to dispute Mikel Arteta superb management of Arsenal this year. It is regrettable that they were unable to win the tournament even if their constant play offers optimism for eventual championship glory. The difficulty comes from their ability to qualify for the Champions League the following year. A stronger team is necessary given the competition in the Champions League and Premier League. Arsenal must concentrate on having a strong bench team in addition to strengthening their starting group. Key player injuries are a real possibility and without a reliable backup the team performance as a whole could suffer significantly. Therefore in order to properly handle the demands of both tournaments Arteta and the club management must place a high priority on squad depth.

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June 09, 2023, 08:44:15 AM
 #75787

I think Thomas Tuchel was sacked because at some point he wasn't getting wind for the Chelsea team which his boss wasn't comfortable with and having in mind of replacing him with a better coach everything became worse for the Chelsea team. I believe Tochel wasn't sacked because of emotion rather he was sacked because much was expected of him which he couldn't deliver and after all, none of the coaches brought back the lost glory to the Chelsea team
Tuchel had bad relationship with Chelsea director and owner during the last summer. He disagreed with transfers in the club and it continued after the season start. Some bad results during such bad time are enough for Chelsea owner to take advantage of it to sack Tuchel. It could be a decision which comes from individual conflict rather than for the club benefit. After Tuchel, Chelsea made two bad choices with Potter and Lampard and they consequently had very bad results even spending hundreds of $M in this season.
Under new ownership we have three coaches which bring Chelsea from band to worst which is surely surprising with this all mostly are blaming new owners for this all as their interference creating problems which is never been ideal for any team but now as they are doing things with Pochettino is also agreed with all terms and conditions hopefully we will have better results from them because no doubt he has done good job at Tottenham which is never been ideal club for any top coach due to limited sources.

Sacking Thomas Tuchel was surely bad decision from new management, but this all happens due to bad relationship between coach and new management, so now wait for the next season and performance of new coach and team which is going to overhaul in next few weeks.

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June 09, 2023, 08:51:02 AM
 #75788


The Premier League is now more competitive than ever. Newcastle's performances this season have surprised everyone. This team played well. And so if Chelsea is aiming to win the title then they need a stronger squad and definitely add more talented players to the squad. Coach Poch is quite experienced. But will he be able to stabilize the Chelsea team? Poch will not be successful. He was not successful with PSG. And so I'd say we shouldn't expect too much from Chelsea.

The EPL is getting more interesting as more clubs are gearing up and becoming more competitive. Newcastle did surprise me in their performance. They played well during the season and came in amongst the top four positions. They’re surely a team to watch out for next season as they’ve shown they’re not to be underestimated. I too think Brighton played pretty well last season and might play more better come next season.
I’m still not sure about Chelsea and can’t say much. Right now, I can only hope their situation gets better next season.
There's no one who hasn't been surprised by Newcastle's form this season and they've done very well. If we go backwards, Newcastle only managed to finish mid-table to the bottom of the standings and that proves how weak they have been a few seasons ago. However, this season, Eddie Howie proved his capacity after becoming Newcastle coach since season 21/22 and he only needed 2 seasons to bring Newcastle to compete in the top 4 of the standings.

Plus the role of the owner of Newcastle, who is a Middle Easterner, can bring in some of the talented players that coach Eddie Howie wants so that Newcastle can become what it is today. For Brighton they are also a club to watch out for next season and with a strategy concoction from Roberto De Zerbi they have a unique style of play that we rarely encounter. Meanwhile, Chelsea, at least they have to prove their quality next season and don't get mired in the mid-table again because this is very embarrassing for one of the big EPL teams.

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June 09, 2023, 09:09:50 AM
 #75789

The Premier League is now more competitive than ever. Newcastle's performances this season have surprised everyone. This team played well. And so if Chelsea is aiming to win the title then they need a stronger squad and definitely add more talented players to the squad. Coach Poch is quite experienced. But will he be able to stabilize the Chelsea team? Poch will not be successful. He was not successful with PSG. And so I'd say we shouldn't expect too much from Chelsea.
Premier League is one of the best league in world with now competition level is also at his best we have few good positive changes in last season with Liverpool and Chelsea out of the top four, and we have few surprising entries which are creating good competition for the future as well now if any team want to have spot into top four then surely then need to work more than best as well challenge level is also at his best now in this coming season we will have many teams with aim for highest spots but for this all need best players and good mentality as well.

Arsenal and Newcastle United back at the top is surely good thing with now they have another challenge can they keep this momentum, or we will have again few changes so now surely competitiveness is also at his best who is going to stay at the top with consistency.

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June 09, 2023, 09:14:11 AM
 #75790

Checking the place of Manchester United in the league and how they performed after Ten Hag joined this team I can say, they should really thank their coach because after Ferguson left this team they couldn't find a good coach, and usually the managers joined this team couldn't have good performance, even famous people like Ryan Giggs and Jose Mourinho but this time they are on third place of the table and they will have Champions league ticket too.



Manchester United performance is very impressive this season under Erik Ten Hag and if you can recall with me, there was a time Manchester united joined the race to win the league. The only factor that stopped them was that they were playing all the titles and cups such as;
English Premier League,
Emirates FA Cup,
Caraoba Cup,
Europa League
And yet they didn't have good squad depth to play all the matches, at a time they were caught up by fatigue and their best defensive midfielder was red carded twice during this period which made him miss a total of 6 EPL matches and the development wasn't cool for the club to cope.

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June 09, 2023, 09:55:58 AM
 #75791

Checking the place of Manchester United in the league and how they performed after Ten Hag joined this team I can say, they should really thank their coach because after Ferguson left this team they couldn't find a good coach, and usually the managers joined this team couldn't have good performance, even famous people like Ryan Giggs and Jose Mourinho but this time they are on third place of the table and they will have Champions league ticket too.



Manchester United performance is very impressive this season under Erik Ten Hag and if you can recall with me, there was a time Manchester united joined the race to win the league. The only factor that stopped them was that they were playing all the titles and cups such as;
English Premier League,
Emirates FA Cup,
Caraoba Cup,
Europa League
And yet they didn't have good squad depth to play all the matches, at a time they were caught up by fatigue and their best defensive midfielder was red carded twice during this period which made him miss a total of 6 EPL matches and the development wasn't cool for the club to cope.
For a team that is in a slump to be able to get a place in the top 4 of the standings is a good achievement in my opinion, especially this is Erik Ten Hag's first season in charge of Manchester United. With what they have shown this season, it is a belief that maybe they will continue in the next season or even be even better in the previous season. Erik Ten Hag has the potential to do just that.

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June 09, 2023, 09:57:18 AM
 #75792

A stronger team is necessary given the competition in the Champions League and Premier League. Arsenal must concentrate on having a strong bench team in addition to strengthening their starting group. Key player injuries are a real possibility and without a reliable backup the team performance as a whole could suffer significantly. Therefore in order to properly handle the demands of both tournaments Arteta and the club management must place a high priority on squad depth.

I would say Arsenal is a strong team as it is and is still capable of fighting for the title of the EPL. I agree with you on the need to concentrate on having an equally strong squad as substitutes for the starting eleven.  Arsenal witnessed some setback when they had some key players injured and no one suitable enough to fill in the roles of the injured player. Without suitable replacements to fill in these roles when needed, the performance of the team would suffer setback as witnessed by Arsenal.
They would definitely need to make some drastic improvements as they’ve now qualified to be in the race for the title of the UCL. They would meet and play against other top clubs from other leagues.
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June 09, 2023, 10:05:34 AM
 #75793

Arsenals coach Arteta definitely must have learnt a thing or two from the experience gotten last season and I think he would be more reliable to build a team that’s more consistent in their games for the next season.
I think the fact that when their top players were out of action due to injuries and the lot, they suffered some setback cause there wasn’t a reliable or capable replacement. He would need to work on that as well. After all, they’re now in the race for the champions league title next season.
Well now Arsenal are a step higher in terms of reputation in the world of football than in previous seasons. Mikel Arteta must have reaped a lot of credit for this achievement. But the real battle will indeed begin in the coming season. because Arsenal must focus on the Premier League and also in the Champions League. and of course there are many things that must be prepared by the Arsenal manager for the coming season so that they can compete with other giant teams.
There is no doubt Mikel Arteta and his boys done amazing stuff in this season, and now they are going for the Champions League after many years but still we can't judge them from just one season because their reputation is still inconsistent team as they have done in this season as well 33 rounds at the top and then suddenly they dropped which is surely not ideal thing but now if they keep this momentum and have good result again then surely we can give them tag of one of the best club in the world.

With this all they need to bring few suitable replacements which works for them in case of injuries to first choice players because this was surely big concern for them, and they lost many matches just because of having not suitable replacements of their players with now Champions League spot is also achieved so things looking more tricky for them in coming season.

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June 09, 2023, 10:08:28 AM
 #75794

A stronger team is necessary given the competition in the Champions League and Premier League. Arsenal must concentrate on having a strong bench team in addition to strengthening their starting group. Key player injuries are a real possibility and without a reliable backup the team performance as a whole could suffer significantly. Therefore in order to properly handle the demands of both tournaments Arteta and the club management must place a high priority on squad depth.

I would say Arsenal is a strong team as it is and is still capable of fighting for the title of the EPL. I agree with you on the need to concentrate on having an equally strong squad as substitutes for the starting eleven.  Arsenal witnessed some setback when they had some key players injured and no one suitable enough to fill in the roles of the injured player. Without suitable replacements to fill in these roles when needed, the performance of the team would suffer setback as witnessed by Arsenal.
They would definitely need to make some drastic improvements as they’ve now qualified to be in the race for the title of the UCL. They would meet and play against other top clubs from other leagues.
Now with their condition it looks like Arteta has started to see this as a necessity because really looking at their condition in this season's transfer, there is talk that they will make a breakthrough by selling several players such as Rob Holding, Tierney, Partey and now Xhaka is also certain. go.
Their midfield seems to be completely overhauled at this time because indeed with several players on the current list and some who have confirmed going to new clubs, indirectly they want to make developments in their midfield.
Caicedo is now a good target and of course this will make things better but if several players leave and only Caicedo comes in it will not make them comfortable because there must be other players.

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June 09, 2023, 10:10:58 AM
 #75795

A stronger team is necessary given the competition in the Champions League and Premier League. Arsenal must concentrate on having a strong bench team in addition to strengthening their starting group. Key player injuries are a real possibility and without a reliable backup the team performance as a whole could suffer significantly. Therefore in order to properly handle the demands of both tournaments Arteta and the club management must place a high priority on squad depth.

I would say Arsenal is a strong team as it is and is still capable of fighting for the title of the EPL. I agree with you on the need to concentrate on having an equally strong squad as substitutes for the starting eleven.  Arsenal witnessed some setback when they had some key players injured and no one suitable enough to fill in the roles of the injured player. Without suitable replacements to fill in these roles when needed, the performance of the team would suffer setback as witnessed by Arsenal.
They would definitely need to make some drastic improvements as they’ve now qualified to be in the race for the title of the UCL. They would meet and play against other top clubs from other leagues.
yes, it's true and Arteta will certainly need additional power in the Arsenal squad in the coming season. He must have many options when unwanted situations occur such as injuries to several key players which of course can affect the team's overall performance.

And I think Arsenal's side in the current transfer market have become more aggressive in their hunt for the players they need. Recently Arsenal are also eyeing one of West Ham's talented players and West Ham will release him in the upcoming transfer market. And Arsenal have moved quickly by bidding ahead of other teams that are also after the player. the player was named Declan Rice.

as we know Declan Rice has contributed a lot to West Ham and managed to bring West Ham to win the UEFA Conference League. So many clubs want this player. And Arsenal is also included in the list of clubs eyeing this player.
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June 09, 2023, 10:19:45 AM
 #75796

Pochettino is a good coach and had good experience with Premier League. He built up Tottenham with limited resources and transfer budget, even helped Tottenham to play in a Champions League final. A few seasons later, Pochettino did not break out more so it can be his limit or Chelsea will be a club where he can win titles, Premier League and Champions League.
I wouldn't even blame Lampard for anything aas he came late to the party and then was asked to fix what couldn't be fixed within just a couple of weeks. Fundamental mistakes have been made and there are really better jobs out there then fixing a plethora of problems within a club in a short period of time, but I can understand that Lampard went for it. He saw an opportunity for himself and was hoping to turn it around and perhaps get a chance for a long-term contract. Most people would have done the same and I wouldn't say it was a mistake to hire him temporarily. But the damage was done before. Now they are off to a fresh restart, but their way back up is a long one.
Agree, Frank Lampard is never been blamed as what happen to Chelsea in this last season with he joined when ship was already drowned if we can blame anyone its owner which done few big mistakes just by his own and have result like this which is surely shocking for the fans but here I also agreed instead of hiring him as temporary if they talk about long term contract then surely we can expect better result from him but its another mistake from new management of the Chelsea which create big mess-up, and now they are looking for the new start of next season with new coach and many changes which are surely important before start and having good situation for them to start with positive mindset.

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June 09, 2023, 10:43:38 AM
 #75797

There are team that wont still made the top four next season, Liverpool, Tottenham, and Chelsea, they still have a lot to do in their team to be able to play the champions league again. Manchester united and Newcastle are balanced team and they wont lose the spot four next season, they are also title contenders for next season.

it will take chelsea and pochettino a very long time to play in Europe football again, no body should expect magic from him  next season. the club is messed up already.

Tottenham has a new coach that needs time to cope in the league, then Harry kane will leave the club this summer, with the rumour on the media, if that happens then, Tottenham will not make it to champions league.

Liverpool, is still struggling with the new players they bought after the world cup. they are still struggling to settle in the premier league. if kloop change tactic and buy new players that can settle fast, then they can still fight for top four next season.
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June 09, 2023, 11:31:14 AM
 #75798

The performance of Chelsea by next season is somthing I cannot actually predict. I mean it is easy to say that Chelsea will perform well by next season. But also consider that almost every club wants to perform well also. If you wish to talk about the top 5. What is the possibility that Chelsea can displace;
Manchester city;
Arsenal;
Manchester United;
Liverpool
And not to talk about Newcastle and Co from the top 4. It will be difficult to Chelsea. If Poch can take Chelsea to Europa it should be considered a success.

I think that the first four teams you have mentioned have a big potential to end in top 4 next season. The first three have already done it but Liverpool have had serious problems so far. Liverpool couldn't make it to top four surprisingly and left their place to Newcastle. But hopefully Klopp will figure out a way. Mane's absence was also a serious factor in this but this isn't an issue that can't be solved of course. They already started to get more consistent results while we were getting close to the end of the season.

I think Newcastle's consistency will depend on how good transfers they will make this summer. Thinking all about these Chelsea's job is really difficult but not impossible. Their main target should be top 4 before anything else.

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June 09, 2023, 11:43:06 AM
 #75799

The performance of Chelsea by next season is somthing I cannot actually predict. I mean it is easy to say that Chelsea will perform well by next season. But also consider that almost every club wants to perform well also. If you wish to talk about the top 5. What is the possibility that Chelsea can displace;
Manchester city;
Arsenal;
Manchester United;
Liverpool
And not to talk about Newcastle and Co from the top 4. It will be difficult to Chelsea. If Poch can take Chelsea to Europa it should be considered a success.

I think that the first four teams you have mentioned have a big potential to end in top 4 next season. The first three have already done it but Liverpool have had serious problems so far. Liverpool couldn't make it to top four surprisingly and left their place to Newcastle. But hopefully Klopp will figure out a way. Mane's absence was also a serious factor in this but this isn't an issue that can't be solved of course. They already started to get more consistent results while we were getting close to the end of the season.

I think Newcastle's consistency will depend on how good transfers they will make this summer. Thinking all about these Chelsea's job is really difficult but not impossible. Their main target should be top 4 before anything else.
Yea, the only club that Chelsea can boast to displace from the top 4 is Newcastle United and this can be possible if Newcastle United refuses to reinforce their team. And I think we all know that it is impossible for Newcastle not to reinforce their team. So it will really be tough for Chelsea next season.
The only advantage that Chelsea will have over Newcastle and others in top 4 is that Chelsea will not be playing in European competitions next season, so they will have enough rest time and few game time. This can enable them concentrate on EPL title chase.

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nara1892
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June 09, 2023, 11:48:19 AM
 #75800

A stronger team is necessary given the competition in the Champions League and Premier League. Arsenal must concentrate on having a strong bench team in addition to strengthening their starting group. Key player injuries are a real possibility and without a reliable backup the team performance as a whole could suffer significantly. Therefore in order to properly handle the demands of both tournaments Arteta and the club management must place a high priority on squad depth.

I would say Arsenal is a strong team as it is and is still capable of fighting for the title of the EPL. I agree with you on the need to concentrate on having an equally strong squad as substitutes for the starting eleven.  Arsenal witnessed some setback when they had some key players injured and no one suitable enough to fill in the roles of the injured player. Without suitable replacements to fill in these roles when needed, the performance of the team would suffer setback as witnessed by Arsenal.
They would definitely need to make some drastic improvements as they’ve now qualified to be in the race for the title of the UCL. They would meet and play against other top clubs from other leagues.
That's because they don't have an even squad, so when their main players get injured the substitutes can't fill the gaps left to the fullest. Of course this must be considered by Arsenal if they want to be even more stable in the coming season. all teams will compete to improve as strong as they can, and that must also be done by Arsenal. Arsenal actually have enormous capital, but they will feel that in the future not for the next season, with their current young squad.

There are team that wont still made the top four next season, Liverpool, Tottenham, and Chelsea, they still have a lot to do in their team to be able to play the champions league again. Manchester united and Newcastle are balanced team and they wont lose the spot four next season, they are also title contenders for next season.

it will take chelsea and pochettino a very long time to play in Europe football again, no body should expect magic from him  next season. the club is messed up already.

Tottenham has a new coach that needs time to cope in the league, then Harry kane will leave the club this summer, with the rumour on the media, if that happens then, Tottenham will not make it to champions league.

Liverpool, is still struggling with the new players they bought after the world cup. they are still struggling to settle in the premier league. if kloop change tactic and buy new players that can settle fast, then they can still fight for top four next season.
Talking about Tottenham, they should be able to improve themselves to be more ready for even higher competition, because they are playing well, but they are still there. I mean when other teams improve they don't, so they compete in that sphere only. Actually, if they want, they are very capable of competing, even fighting for the championship, but as we can see they can only compete in that position and never improve.

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