[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[Bitsky]

How are you going to sign a message if you're not willing to use a website or some software?

Well, okay, I give it to a software, namely one on the airgapped system.

Maybe this is the part you're not understanding. What do you mean about "giving up my sig address"? Do you think that when you sign a message with an address you aren't making the address known? Because you are. Every time you publish a signature you are publishing the public key along with it.

I was referring to the vanity address in my signature. If I'd use some website which claims clams by using my private key, that address would essentially be dead. And I want to actually keep it because it's well published.

Signed proof is how every transaction works in every crypto. If you're looking for a way of signing a message without revealing the address used to do the signing I don't think you're going to find it.

With Electrum, you can have two wallets, one with the private keys on an airgapped machine, and one with watch-only addresses on a connected one that does not contain any private key.
You can create a raw transaction which you can transfer to your secure machine, sign it there, copy the signed transaction back and broadcast it. That way, the private key was never exposed to the potentially insecure machine.
You can even copy that signed tx to a pushtx website, like at blockchain.info.

[dooglus]

With Electrum, you can have two wallets, one with the private keys on an airgapped machine, and one with watch-only addresses on a connected one that does not contain any private key.
You can create a raw transaction which you can transfer to your secure machine, sign it there, copy the signed transaction back and broadcast it. That way, the private key was never exposed to the potentially insecure machine.

You can do the same with the CLAM client. Create the raw transaction on an online machine and sign it on an airgapped offline machine:

$ clamd help createrawtransaction | head -1
createrawtransaction [{"txid":txid,"vout":n},...] {address:amount,...} [tx-comment]

$ clamd help signrawtransaction | head -1
signrawtransaction <hex string> [{"txid":txid,"vout":n,"scriptPubKey":hex,"redeemScript":hex},...] [<privatekey1>,...] [sighashtype="ALL"]

[MasterP4]

With Electrum, you can have two wallets, one with the private keys on an airgapped machine, and one with watch-only addresses on a connected one that does not contain any private key.
You can create a raw transaction which you can transfer to your secure machine, sign it there, copy the signed transaction back and broadcast it. That way, the private key was never exposed to the potentially insecure machine.

You can do the same with the CLAM client. Create the raw transaction on an online machine and sign it on an airgapped offline machine:

$ clamd help createrawtransaction | head -1
createrawtransaction [{"txid":txid,"vout":n},...] {address:amount,...} [tx-comment]

$ clamd help signrawtransaction | head -1
signrawtransaction <hex string> [{"txid":txid,"vout":n,"scriptPubKey":hex,"redeemScript":hex},...] [<privatekey1>,...] [sighashtype="ALL"]

 I suggested that to him, but he said that he doesn't want "clamd" to access his Private Keys

Thanks for the thought you put into it, but it would still mean that I give eg clamd access to my keys (in a truly paranoid way I could argue that they might be added into the transaction as eg comments). Ideally, Clam would allow me to export an unsigned transaction which I can sign for example with Electrum or signrawtransaction, save and re-import in Clam to broadcast. I'm looking for a method where I don't need to give Clam any access to any private key.

 At least the way that I see it, he wants to sign a the clam transaction that will allow him to dig his Clams, but he doesn't want to do it with Clamclient because he is worry about the possibility that the software will add to the signature some "theorical" trace of his Private Key encoded in the way of comments or a 'hidden message' so he told that even an airgapped offline Clamclient is not trusted for him.

 As far I can see he trust Electrum to do signing for unsigned transaction or raw transactions on an offline airgapped environment but even if he creates a raw transaction with a Clamclient, he's won't be able to sign that transaction with his Bitcoin client that he use to sign Bitcoin transactions and he feel will not add anything "extra" to the transaction, because like was pointed before many altcoins including Clam use a different 'version byte' than Bitcoin. Some type of modification to the source code should be needed to allow for example his Electrum wallet to sign the Clam raw transaction and that open the question 'would you trust your bitcoin client after been modified?' because if you don't make the changes to the code by yourself knowing what the new added feature does, you end up in the same situation as trusting the Clamclient just that is even worse because if the new feature is not public available as open source other peers won't be able to review and warn you about something suspicious in the code.

 I think the best way to solve a case like this will be (if it's possible) to explain in a easy way the differences between how does the Bitcoin Client and Clam Client creates the signature for a transaction, that way maybe, someone could see well that the process is almost equal to how Bitcoin do it and the parts were is not equal is because of for example 'version byte' and how that doesn't compromised or add anything extra. Of course that will require the ability to read the code and understand how it works, because it probably won't be something too easy to be explain.

[Richard Branson]

Can I use the "setstaketo" command to let my Raspberry Pi do the staking while keeping my precious Clams secure?

[dooglus]

Can I use the "setstaketo" command to let my Raspberry Pi do the staking while keeping my precious Clams secure?

No, that only affects where the newly created coins are sent.

[dooglus]

I suggested that to him, but he said that he doesn't want "clamd" to access his Private Keys

Yes, I saw. I just thought I'd tell him too.

The CLAM client signs its transactions in the same way as Bitcoin clients do, with minor changes - the version byte is different, there's an optional 'clam speech' field, etc.

It's not too big a job to review the code and see how the signing is done if you have the required knowledge. But if someone doesn't want to put in the effort and isn't willing to trust the signing code without reviewing it then they don't have to claim their coins.

[MasterP4]

 The way you explain things is very well and you speak with the authority of being able to understand the code, I try to explain but is more harder because I'm not 100% sure about what I'm talking about because i do guessing in some cases about how something is supposed to work, your opinion is very appreciated doog.

 He have a case very similar to me, I have a couple of addresses that i don't want to empty, my options were clear, check the code by myself (required knowledge is still on 101), try to follow the best security practices to minimize risk and trust the clam client with my private keys or never claim those clams. I opted for the third one, sometimes an address like your first btc address or a vanity one that you like can be very important in some way, if you don't gonna feel comfortable with a certain action is better to try find another way to get those Clams.

[gjhiggins]

sometimes an address like your first btc address or a vanity one that you like can be very important in some way

One of the ways in which such btc addresses are important is as a signal to others that these addresses are considered “special” by the owner and worth close attention, such as generating a “look-alikey” vanity address that is designed, in the right circumstances, to sneak under the user's perceptual filters.

Re-use of btc addresses (either “vanity” or “favoured”) leaks information and opens up the attack surface so is not consonant with a “total opacity” approach.

Just sayin'.

Cheers

Graham

[MasterP4]

sometimes an address like your first btc address or a vanity one that you like can be very important in some way

One of the ways in which such btc addresses are important is as a signal to others that these addresses are considered “special” by the owner and worth close attention, such as generating a “look-alikey” vanity address that is designed, in the right circumstances, to sneak under the user's perceptual filters.

Re-use of btc addresses (either “vanity” or “favoured”) leaks information and opens up the attack surface so is not consonant with a “total opacity” approach.

 Absolutly right, I don't recommend the use Re-use of btc addresses or use the same address as a change address, but I did it went I was new to bitcoin and more focused on getting the satoshis than reading about how it works, for example my first address can't be empty, because it contains dust that "now" will cost me more in fee that the value that they have, but i don't know if in the future will be anything that allows that dust to be used, also to proof ownership of address that was active since year X month Y, and is not consider a leaked or cracked address. In relation with the "look-alike" like address another good point because for vanity and non-vanity is relative easy, doesn't even need gpu power just proper knowledge to create something that will fool a fast visual inspection, so be aware from where you retrieve your public addresses and full visual inspection letter by letter must be recommended if from where you copied your public key is not trusted.

 I must clarify that I don't have any reasons to doubt about Clamclient's source code, It have been reviewed by dooglus and many others in the community and has enough time around for someone to point anything that doesn't looks right, anyone that has the ability can review it. The decision that I have take may not have sense and not necessary is what the others should do and in the future I can change opinion and decide to dug it.

[almightyruler]

How about this to see if it's worth spending any further time on CLAMs:

1. Sync the CLAM client on an internet connected computer which doesn't contain your private keys. This can be done within a VM, or a fresh OS install, or even a remote VPS.

2. Copy, via sneakernet, the client executable and blockchain data to a NON internet connected computer. Start client. Import wallet.dat, or individual private keys.

3. If balance is zero, stop here.

[Mrfrismint]

Hi CLAMs community. I am new to CLAMs and trying to understand this coin and it's (future) value. Could someone explain me (and other CLAMs newbies reading this) why people should own this coin? What make CLAMs for example unique to DeCred or BTC itself. What does the near development future look like? Hope to read some interesting views. Thanks!

[BayAreaCoins]

Hi CLAMs community. I am new to CLAMs and trying to understand this coin and it's (future) value. Could someone explain me (and other CLAMs newbies reading this) why people should own this coin? What make CLAMs for example unique to DeCred or BTC itself. What does the near development future look like? Hope to read some interesting views. Thanks!

It's the Clamunity that makes us special, the distribution and the fact that coins mine coins.

[scarar]

Does anyone have a working blockchain its not updating at all.?

I have the Mac for Claims but the blockchain isn't working.

[MasterP4]

Does anyone have a working blockchain its not updating at all.?

I have the Mac for Claims but the blockchain isn't working.

Did you tried using dooglus' bootstrap? and btw it's Clam not Claims 

Problems Getting Sync'd with the Network?

The following file may be placed in the data direcrory.  Then, simply restart the client:

dooglus' Bootstrap:
Bootstrap Post

 I don't use Mac so I don't have any idea or found references if it works for Mac ClamClient. good luck

[scarar]

I tried the bootstrap.dat file and on Mac OS/X version it doesn't detect it at all. I think the Mac version is broken, due to the blockchain just stays and not download. Has anyone build a new version yet?

Does anyone have a working blockchain its not updating at all.?

I have the Mac for Claims but the blockchain isn't working.

Did you tried using dooglus' bootstrap? and btw it's Clam not Claims 

Problems Getting Sync'd with the Network?

The following file may be placed in the data direcrory.  Then, simply restart the client:

dooglus' Bootstrap:
Bootstrap Post

 I don't use Mac so I don't have any idea or found references if it works for Mac ClamClient. good luck

[Mrfrismint]

Hi CLAMs community. I am new to CLAMs and trying to understand this coin and it's (future) value. Could someone explain me (and other CLAMs newbies reading this) why people should own this coin? What make CLAMs for example unique to DeCred or BTC itself. What does the near development future look like? Hope to read some interesting views. Thanks!

It's the Clamunity that makes us special, the distribution and the fact that coins mine coins.

Yes, but there are more coins with these features. What it's the pipeline in terms of development? Like if you don't stake, what makes Clam worth holding compared to other coins? I am seriously interested in hearing people's opinions. I can't find a lot on the site.

[dooglus]

I must clarify that I don't have any reasons to doubt about Clamclient's source code, It have been reviewed by dooglus and many others in the community and has enough time around for someone to point anything that doesn't looks right, anyone that has the ability can review it.

I would also point out that I have claimed CLAMs from some old very well funded Bitcoin addresses without moving the bitcoins out of them first, and the coins were never stolen from those addresses.

I couldn't be more confident that CLAM isn't a scam intended to steal Bitcoin private keys.

[MasterP4]

Yes, but there are more coins with these features. What it's the pipeline in terms of development? Like if you don't stake, what makes Clam worth holding compared to other coins? I am seriously interested in hearing people's opinions. I can't find a lot on the site.

 There are some key features that I can point out, First like BayAreaCoins said the method of distribution of Clam, it implemented a method to give out the coins in a way that it can reach most crypto currencies users in a set of very popular (at the time that was take the snapshot) crypto currencies, some can say things like "litecoin sucks" or "doge is joke" but those crypto currencies were chosen because they have some good amount of user that at least tested their waters.

 The method is so unique in his kind, that can literally only be done once if it works or at least will need to use the same point as the Clamcoin's blockchain snapshot or prior to avoid gaming in the distribution. Some people can argue that it benefit one more than others, but in general it try to give equal chances to everyone in the distribution, I mean each fund address give equal to everybody, no matter if you have less than 1 btc or have a lot more, you'll get 4.60 per funded address, well people more involved in crypto can usually have more addresses like BTC, LTC or Doge that's how thing goes, some people with "bad practices" like not implemented cold storage can had a disruptive advantage, Clam tries to find the most fair distribution method, no a perfect one.

 Contrary to BTC the Proof-of-stake imply that Clam users doesn't need to invest in mining equipment in order to get a share of the staking process, that is a good concern because don't imply equipment that will become obsolete and not able to find another purpose for they and are expensive and waste much electricity, also are hard to setup for the average user.

 The coin is deflationary but only by the amount of blocks produced per day at a reason of 1 Clam per staked block contrary to BTC, this promote that users protect the network by staking and receive in exchange a share that in the least case (of staking constantly) is enough to absorb the inflation dilution or in the case of less people staking, gives profit by interest gain. Also depending the point of view, the stake can protect early adopters against the inclusion of new undug Clams in the money supply, I mean there is gonna be dilution but those Clams that have been staking will have an advantage against those recently dug.

 In the development part you can find features like the ClamSpeech (that I don't understand well), I think it has a notarization feature, but a feature that was somehow hard to implement because they were trying to find consensus about how to do it was the the Clamour a kind of consensus tool to make development more decentralized. I'm sure that if you explore what the Clamour is and how it work you can see what others proposals are in the way to be add to the coin and what type of acceptance it has. Also if you have the knowledge you can check the clam github and see how the code goes and i think it also has a place for people check "issues".

 There must be some other things that i must be forgotten, like proposals for dynamic fees, no related to the coin directly like loaning Clams for margin trade in site poloniex but this should give you some ideas.

[vitocorp]

Some lightweight purses for clam like electrum?

[westhafen]

How many coins will I receive from 10,000 coins  POS