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yohan (OP)
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May 21, 2012, 11:09:55 AM |
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We won't release details of our sources as that can be capitalised on by our competitors and finding these heatsinks took us a lot of research time. We will be offering them in our shop before long. The Enzotech parts are similar but in copper and we will be offering the equivalent of those as well. The copper parts are very heavy and don't offer a massive advantage over the aluminium we are using when air air is blown over them but some people will want them. The copper parts are also prone to mechanical damage as the copper is very soft. The samples we have here arrived with the vanes out of shape and the aluminium is much better in that respect.
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"There should not be any signed int. If you've found a signed int
somewhere, please tell me (within the next 25 years please) and I'll
change it to unsigned int." -- Satoshi
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rjk
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Merit: 250
1ngldh
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May 21, 2012, 12:10:32 PM |
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Hello yohan, I hope I don't come across as too pushy, but I'd like to point out to you a few points as I have done with other merchants in the past in regards to accepting bitcoins as payment. The main point I'd like to make is that if you use a merchant service provider such as http://bit-pay.com/ , they actually protect you against volatility and insulate you from that risk a few different ways. They allow you to set a price in GBP or USD or whatever currency, and then dynamically update the bitcoin price themselves. Then, when someone decides to order, they lock in the price for 15 minutes to give the person time to pay, and guarantee you the exchange rate during that time so you won't lose out to fluctuations. And once the customer has paid, they instantly convert to fiat money and deposit it into your bank account. With bit-pay (not sure about others), they also offer you the option of splitting the payout so you get some fiat and some bitcoins. I hope this bit of information enables you to look into using a merchant service provider like bit-pay or paysius.com, and end rant thanks for listening. |
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bulanula
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May 21, 2012, 12:22:40 PM |
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Hello yohan, I hope I don't come across as too pushy, but I'd like to point out to you a few points as I have done with other merchants in the past in regards to accepting bitcoins as payment. The main point I'd like to make is that if you use a merchant service provider such as http://bit-pay.com/ , they actually protect you against volatility and insulate you from that risk a few different ways. They allow you to set a price in GBP or USD or whatever currency, and then dynamically update the bitcoin price themselves. Then, when someone decides to order, they lock in the price for 15 minutes to give the person time to pay, and guarantee you the exchange rate during that time so you won't lose out to fluctuations. And once the customer has paid, they instantly convert to fiat money and deposit it into your bank account. With bit-pay (not sure about others), they also offer you the option of splitting the payout so you get some fiat and some bitcoins. I hope this bit of information enables you to look into using a merchant service provider like bit-pay or paysius.com, and end rant thanks for listening. How much are you getting paid to advocate bitpay, rjk ? Nice PR action. TLDR : they act as a proxy - BTC comes in from buyer they ( bitinstant ) get a cut and pass the fiat as GBP to you. Still risky and depending on their fees you might come ahead with normal fiat and CC and Paypal etc. Surprised to see some heavy pushing of bitpay here ... |
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rjk
Sr. Member
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1ngldh
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May 21, 2012, 12:50:50 PM |
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How much are you getting paid to advocate bitpay, rjk ? Nice PR action.
TLDR : they act as a proxy - BTC comes in from buyer they ( bitinstant ) get a cut and pass the fiat as GBP to you.
Still risky and depending on their fees you might come ahead with normal fiat and CC and Paypal etc.
Surprised to see some heavy pushing of bitpay here ...
I'm not paid anything by them. The fee isn't a "risk", just something to factor into price. I don't like mtgox's half-baked "solution", and I need to do some more research into Paysius. I don't like pushing a single provider either, but there aren't many options available, and they have been around the longest. And they deserve a cut, doing all the work for you and absorbing the fluctuation risk. |
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TheHarbinger
Sr. Member
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Why is it so damn hot in here?
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May 21, 2012, 12:53:24 PM
Last edit: May 25, 2012, 06:30:58 PM by Maged |
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Hello yohan, I hope I don't come across as too pushy, but I'd like to point out to you a few points as I have done with other merchants in the past in regards to accepting bitcoins as payment. The main point I'd like to make is that if you use a merchant service provider such as http://bit-pay.com/ , they actually protect you against volatility and insulate you from that risk a few different ways. They allow you to set a price in GBP or USD or whatever currency, and then dynamically update the bitcoin price themselves. Then, when someone decides to order, they lock in the price for 15 minutes to give the person time to pay, and guarantee you the exchange rate during that time so you won't lose out to fluctuations. And once the customer has paid, they instantly convert to fiat money and deposit it into your bank account. With bit-pay (not sure about others), they also offer you the option of splitting the payout so you get some fiat and some bitcoins. I hope this bit of information enables you to look into using a merchant service provider like bit-pay or paysius.com, and end rant thanks for listening. How much are you getting paid to advocate bitpay, rjk ? Nice PR action. TLDR : they act as a proxy - BTC comes in from buyer they ( bitinstant ) get a cut and pass the fiat as GBP to you. Still risky and depending on their fees you might come ahead with normal fiat and CC and Paypal etc. Surprised to see some heavy pushing of bitpay here ... How is it risky? They convert BTC to fiat at the current market price, with the fluctuation on the BTC side. $500 my be 100 BTC one day, and 110 BTC the next, but it is still $500. The fiat price stays the same regardless of the change in BTC value. The merchant is totally isolated from the "volatility" of the BTC market. In fact the merchant never even has to deal with BTC at all. Fees? Credit Cards and PayPal, and every payment processor charges a fee. If the fee that is charged is unreasonably large, it gets added to the purchase price and paid by the customer, isolating the merchant from losses due to the fee. BitPay (or another similar service) is getting pushed because it allows the merchant to receive fiat and allows the customer to pay in BTC. Merchants like getting paid in fiat. BitCoin users like paying in BTC. |
12Um6jfDE7q6crm1s6tSksMvda8s1hZ3Vj
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occulta
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May 21, 2012, 01:04:44 PM |
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How much are you getting paid to advocate bitpay, rjk ? Nice PR action.
TLDR : they act as a proxy - BTC comes in from buyer they ( bitinstant ) get a cut and pass the fiat as GBP to you.
Still risky and depending on their fees you might come ahead with normal fiat and CC and Paypal etc.
Surprised to see some heavy pushing of bitpay here ...
What a fucking troll. I advocate the use of Bit-Pay, maybe they pay me for PR too ? TheHarbinger is spot on with all his points, the merchant never has to deal with BTC, they set the price and get the price. |
GPG KeyID: F5A703CC74E46E5D
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yohan (OP)
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May 21, 2012, 01:42:54 PM |
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We have started to look at this and the services like Bit-pay do look like the way we would go for Bitcoin acceptance but we still need to walk though this properly and slowly. We don't want to run any volume on any new processing system in case there are problems and we would certainly get that if we said that this was available today. It's something we need to take time on and get right. Running the timeline on our build is enough to handle at the moment.
Something that is a little different to people outside of the UK is that we don't usually charge fees for Visa, Mastercard or PayPal processing but do generally limit the size of transacton to about £1500 maximum. It's always been an easy way for our customers to make small purchases like 1 or 2 boards. We run enough business through Paypal that the fee isn't too high to us and it looks nearly comparible to the Bitcoin conversion merchant handlers.
Yohan
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steamboat
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May 21, 2012, 03:27:01 PM |
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At the moment we are not taking Bitcoins or margin is too slim to consider anything that we don't fully understand all aspects of and right at the moment we are too busy to do that work. The volatility of exchange rates is also an issue for things being delivered up to 1-2 months. All of our costs are GBP or USD and we have no other option to reduce exchange risk and to use those currencies. Even the euro is becoming a problem although we already margined that. Our margin there is gone in the last week or so and we are watching what happens there. All of these traditional currencies have a big momentum and rarely change quickly which cannot be said about Bicoin.
MtGOX haas been suggested but elsewhere in the forum there are reports of problems and possibly insolvency so that is a big problem for us to go that way until it is clear what is the real situation.
Yohan
k, i'll be your guinea pig. I will personally guarantee my payment through bit-pay. i.e. if you receive less than the agreed upon price (minus transaction fees of course) due to exchange rate volatility, I will pay the difference prior to the product being shipped. |
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gyverlb
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May 21, 2012, 03:34:31 PM |
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The problems with integrating bit-pay aren't limited to a risk of not being paid the full amount. There is some effort to be put integrating it (someone must work on the shopping site), there may be local legislation/regulation making things more difficult. If I were a business I'll submit this kind of project to an accountant and if he/she raises some issues maybe a lawyer too.
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Garr255
Legendary
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Activity: 938
Merit: 1000
What's a GPU?
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May 21, 2012, 03:35:11 PM |
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k, i'll be your guinea pig.
I will personally guarantee my payment through bit-pay.
i.e. if you receive less than the agreed upon price (minus transaction fees of course) due to exchange rate volatility, I will pay the difference prior to the product being shipped.
I would also do this. |
“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.” -- Mahatma Gandhi
Average time between signing on to bitcointalk: Two weeks. Please don't expect responses any faster than that!
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rjk
Sr. Member
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Activity: 448
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1ngldh
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May 21, 2012, 03:36:08 PM |
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The problems with integrating bit-pay aren't limited to a risk of not being paid the full amount. There is some effort to be put integrating it (someone must work on the shopping site), there may be local legislation/regulation making things more difficult. If I were a business I'll submit this kind of project to my an accountant and if he/she raises some issues maybe a lawyer too.
Quite so. I understand they are under a bit of pressure to start getting the devices out the door, and I don't want to interrupt that. I was only posting to clear common misconceptions, and would be glad to wait. |
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gyverlb
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May 21, 2012, 03:37:51 PM |
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The problems with integrating bit-pay aren't limited to a risk of not being paid the full amount.
In fact I don't think there is a risk there (given that there's no chargeback provision in Bitcoin, once you get your GBP and start processing the purchase the risk is entirely assumed by the shopper). |
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yohan (OP)
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May 21, 2012, 03:49:52 PM |
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 Some more to salivate over. |
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Isokivi
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May 21, 2012, 03:57:33 PM |
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Some more to salivate over.
Is that the Arcfic cooling F12 or F14 ? ..Either way a good choice of fan supplier. |
Bitcoin trinkets now on my online store: btc trinkets.com <- Bitcoin Tiepins, cufflinks, lapel pins, keychains, card holders and challenge coins. |
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rjk
Sr. Member
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Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
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May 21, 2012, 03:58:27 PM |
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Looks like the airflow is down, is that correct? |
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Isokivi
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May 21, 2012, 04:01:39 PM |
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Looks like the airflow is down, is that correct? Yeah, it's down .. took a look at one of my installed F12's to confirm. |
Bitcoin trinkets now on my online store: btc trinkets.com <- Bitcoin Tiepins, cufflinks, lapel pins, keychains, card holders and challenge coins. |
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Bitinvestor
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May 21, 2012, 04:02:29 PM |
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The fan can also be removed and used for side blowing if you really want to pack them in and if you really want to keep them cooler use a push pull fan arrangement. In this way you might get down to a 40-50mm stack spacing. With the right r/a bracket, and suitable stack spacing, the fan holes on the PCB can be used to hold on 120mm side fans in a stack.
That's what I would like to do. Can you supply a suitable r/a bracket? |
Those who cause problems for others also cause problems for themselves.
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Syke
Legendary
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Activity: 3878
Merit: 1193
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May 21, 2012, 04:36:42 PM |
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4 individual heat sinks so each one is perfectly mated to the chip, and one large fan. Very very nice. |
Buy & Hold
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Gomeler
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May 21, 2012, 04:42:59 PM |
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Some more to salivate over.
Looks very good. Will be interesting to see how the heatsinks perform with a push-pull configuration blowing across the boards. |
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yohan (OP)
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May 21, 2012, 05:58:53 PM
Last edit: May 21, 2012, 08:04:23 PM by yohan |
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It is a F12 fan and blowing down. When it is stacked that way it will draw air over back of board above. Equally setting a stack heigh of say 40mm would allow reasonable side to side air flow especially if the ends are boxed as well. We are looking for a r/a bracket that will allow the side mount fans for the push pull fan arrangement but that is not high priority at the moment.
The F12 is a very quite fan with good airflow and long life. The way we did the mounts will also allow a heatsink and fan arrangement for the back if you want but that is maybe overkill. (cat fixed)
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