GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[HashieNewb]

If it is all rolled into one CAL GAW can hire a crack legal team to fight it and most likely win

With what money? GAW is broke. Garza pulled his hefty salary for as long as he could, and now there's nothing left. They have to sell all of their XPY just to make payroll and pay for basic internet services.

Suing GAWminers won't do much. You have to sue the people who have profited from the scam. For that, you have to know who has Prime Controllers, or at least the ones that stake at that insane rate.

So you're saying all the claims about how GAW made money off this were just lies?

Correct, GAW PR claims about fancy domain purchases and corporate acquisitions were just lies.

The company has been bleeding cash for a long time, likely since before hashlets even when they tried to undercut everyone with ASIC pricing.

$100 million business this ain't.

There seemed to be a bunch of people in this thread saying that gaw was making a lot of money from dumping, but also a lot of people saying that gaw is broke. There isn't a coherent narrative that ties those two together; if it was a scam (which it clearly is at this point), then it must have made money for someone. To claim that gaw is both smart enough to pull off the scam and then incompetent enough to not make any money from it breaks suspension of disbelief.

Something still doesn't add up.

ikeboy, the explanation was provided but you are either too thick to understand or you're just trolling again.

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[vObh0n]6W]

insults snipped

To honest people, a corporation is an entity created to produce goods or services for profit. To a fraudster, a corporation is a tool to bilk investors of their money and funnel it into their own private pockets. Once the fraud is complete and the now bankrupt corporation is collapsing it is discarded, along with any liability. That is how the big boy criminals rip people off.

Unfortunately, liability for fraud doesn't go away when a corporation goes bankrupt.

See e.g. http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/personally-liable-llc-corporate-debt-bankruptcy.html:

A corporation or LLC’s owners may also be held personally liable if they are found to have committed fraud.  If the owner made fraudulent representations or omissions when applying for a business loan, he or she can be held personally responsible for the resulting harm to the creditor and risk losing personal assets.  Alternatively, if a corporation or LLC was created to further a fraudulent cause or business, a court can pierce the corporate veil to get to the owners as well.

[Paul Revere]

It adds up to people who understand what is going on. The only ones who think it doesn't are unable to answer what 2+2 equals. GAW is struggling along hand to mouth and shedding employees day by day as it consumes itself by selling off it's only hard assets, which are the few miners they have. The only other source of income for GAW is XPY dumping, but there are limits to how much can be absorbed by the market.

P.S: Again, you clearly show your lack of intelligence ikeboy. In theory a corporation is liable for fraud, but if it is bankrupt where does the money come from? You can not get blood from a stone and you can not get money from a bankrupt company. You may want to enlighten yourself about this subject by googling "Enron" ya effing imbecile.  

[vObh0n]6W]

snip

There seemed to be a bunch of people in this thread saying that gaw was making a lot of money from dumping, but also a lot of people saying that gaw is broke. There isn't a coherent narrative that ties those two together; if it was a scam (which it clearly is at this point), then it must have made money for someone. To claim that gaw is both smart enough to pull off the scam and then incompetent enough to not make any money from it breaks suspension of disbelief.

Something still doesn't add up.

ikeboy, the explanation was provided but you are either too thick to understand or you're just trolling again.

There was one claim made that they could be hiding money, which seems inconsistent with some of the claims that they're broke. E.g. "The company has been bleeding cash for a long time" doesn't sound like a profitable company, even if the profits are from scams.

It adds up to people who understand what is going on. The only ones who think it doesn't are unable to answer what 2+2 equals. GAW is struggling along hand to mouth and shedding employees day by day as it consumes itself by selling off it's only hard assets, which are the few miners they have. The only other source of income for GAW is XPY dumping, but there are limits to how much can be absorbed by the market.

Could you estimate for me with your superior elementary arithmetic skills how much money GAW has, versus how much people lost?

How many xpy have been sold, how much did gaw get from them, who did it go to, and so on. Asserting that you've already answered is not an answer.

[vObh0n]6W]

more insults snipped

In theory a corporation is liable for fraud, but if it is bankrupt where does the money come from? You can not get blood from a stone and you can not get money from a bankrupt company.

For anyone watching this, note that I didn't mention a corporation being liable for fraud, but responded to the claim that the owner wasn't responsible for the corporation's bankruptcy. That still hasn't been responded to, instead we get a redirection about bankruptcy.

So if everyone involves goes bankrupt, then the creditors can claim anything they own, and as you claim they have more funds, there will be something to take from.

[suchmoon]

There was one claim made that they could be hiding money, which seems inconsistent with some of the claims that they're broke. E.g. "The company has been bleeding cash for a long time" doesn't sound like a profitable company, even if the profits are from scams.

As far as I can see you're the only one trying to spin this now into "a profitable company". They are in dire straits, even the e-mails show a ton of unpaid bills.

Someone potentially hiding cash doesn't contradict the facts pointing to GAW being broke, not sure what you're getting at here.

[vObh0n]6W]

There was one claim made that they could be hiding money, which seems inconsistent with some of the claims that they're broke. E.g. "The company has been bleeding cash for a long time" doesn't sound like a profitable company, even if the profits are from scams.

As far as I can see you're the only one trying to spin this now into "a profitable company". They are in dire straits, even the e-mails show a ton of unpaid bills.

Someone potentially hiding cash doesn't contradict the facts pointing to GAW being broke, not sure what you're getting at here.

Do you think that nobody at GAW profited from the scam? My understanding of all of Paul's "dumping" posts was a claim that GAW's making money.

Also, Josh has said he didn't make any money (like at https://hashtalk.org/topic/33229/coinfire-article/20), and I didn't think that was true.

Should I go through the posts here and point to which ones gave the impression that GAW has money?

[Paul Revere]

So you admit that are indeed ikeboy, who was banned from this forum for good reason? Isn't coming back to the forum after being banned grounds to be banned again?

[coinits]

more insults snipped

In theory a corporation is liable for fraud, but if it is bankrupt where does the money come from? You can not get blood from a stone and you can not get money from a bankrupt company.

For anyone watching this, note that I didn't mention a corporation being liable for fraud, but responded to the claim that the owner wasn't responsible for the corporation's bankruptcy. That still hasn't been responded to, instead we get a redirection about bankruptcy.

So if everyone involves goes bankrupt, then the creditors can claim anything they own, and as you claim they have more funds, there will be something to take from.

Anyone who fraudulently diverts funds from a company causing its bankruptcy is on the hook. They will have all of their personal assets confiscated and sold and then they go to jail. You are too stupid for the Internet. Get off now and raise the worlds IQ level of Internet users by 10 full points. #Hashtard

[suchmoon]

There was one claim made that they could be hiding money, which seems inconsistent with some of the claims that they're broke. E.g. "The company has been bleeding cash for a long time" doesn't sound like a profitable company, even if the profits are from scams.

As far as I can see you're the only one trying to spin this now into "a profitable company". They are in dire straits, even the e-mails show a ton of unpaid bills.

Someone potentially hiding cash doesn't contradict the facts pointing to GAW being broke, not sure what you're getting at here.

Do you think that nobody at GAW profited from the scam? My understanding of all of Paul's "dumping" posts was a claim that GAW's making money.

Also, Josh has said he didn't make any money (like at https://hashtalk.org/topic/33229/coinfire-article/20), and I didn't think that was true.

Should I go through the posts here and point to which ones gave the impression that GAW has money?

Oh FFS, stop that nonsense. GAW -> unpaid bills -> broke. Someone dumping XPY -> pays some of those bills perhaps -> puts some under the mattress perhaps.

What's so hard to understand?

Yes, please point out what gives the impression that GAW has money.

[Paul Revere]

ikeboy simply can not understand not only the general concepts of both fraud and embezzlement, then, when you add in the newfangled methods of fraud  and embezzlement that are possible using Crypto currency and anonymous wallets he is like a little girl wandering in a field picking daisies.

[rawbot]

ikeboy simply can not understand not only the general concepts of both fraud and embezzlement, then, when you add in the newfangled methods of fraud  and embezzlement that are possible using Crypto currency and anonymous wallets he is like a little girl wandering in a field picking daisies.

Problem is, are the current laws even equipped to prosecute this crypto fraud shit?  I must say i am impressed about how knowledgeable the SEC seems to be after reading their subpoena but can you imagine this shit going through the courts?  How do you explain to a jury the many blockchain transactions where the paycoins are hitting the exchanges?

Considering the average age of judges this kind of shit would fry their brains.

[vizique]

Makes you wonder who they would call as expert witness to describe the Blockchain to the jury...

you could start a sweep...
Roger Ver...
Gavin...
Mr Nakamoto LOL

[suchmoon]

Makes you wonder who they would call as expert witness to describe the Blockchain to the jury...

you could start a sweep...
Roger Ver...
Gavin...
Mr Nakamoto LOL

How about that dude on a horse in a church?

[Paul Revere]

ikeboy simply can not understand not only the general concepts of both fraud and embezzlement, then, when you add in the newfangled methods of fraud  and embezzlement that are possible using Crypto currency and anonymous wallets he is like a little girl wandering in a field picking daisies.

Problem is, are the current laws even equipped to prosecute this crypto fraud shit?  I must say i am impressed about how knowledgeable the SEC seems to be after reading their subpoena but can you imagine this shit going through the courts?  How do you explain to a jury the many blockchain transactions where the paycoins are hitting the exchanges?

Considering the average age of judges this kind of shit would fry their brains.

Right. I have said this before and I will say it again: The only innovation I am aware of with this whole operation is the way that fraud and probably embezzlement is being conducted using new methods and technologies. If and when Josh & Co are prosecuted and what the results will be are unknown. I get a little tired of hearing the absurdist bullshit of ikeboy and the other obvious shills here presenting absurd non-arguments to defend what all available evidence filtered through experience and common sense says is a massive fraudulent enterprise.

P,S: Somewhere Josh mentioned that laws would be written around what they were going to do, and that is something I suspect will come true, just not the way he was presenting it as a good thing....

P.S.P.S> I am just a guy signaling with lanterns that there is a problem. The people having their "houses violated" by the invading troops are the ones who will actually have to fight.

[coinits]

ikeboy simply can not understand not only the general concepts of both fraud and embezzlement, then, when you add in the newfangled methods of fraud  and embezzlement that are possible using Crypto currency and anonymous wallets he is like a little girl wandering in a field picking daisies.

Problem is, are the current laws even equipped to prosecute this crypto fraud shit?  I must say i am impressed about how knowledgeable the SEC seems to be after reading their subpoena but can you imagine this shit going through the courts?  How do you explain to a jury the many blockchain transactions where the paycoins are hitting the exchanges?

Considering the average age of judges this kind of shit would fry their brains.

Right. I have said this before and I will say it again: The only innovation I am aware of with this whole operation is the way that fraud and probably embezzlement is being conducted using new methods and technologies. If and when Josh & Co are prosecuted and what the results will be are unknown. I get a little tired of hearing the absurdist bullshit of ikeboy and the other obvious shills here presenting absurd non-arguments to defend what all available evidence filtered through experience and common sense says is a massive fraudulent enterprise.

One could definitely put linkage to the idea that the Primes were created to embezzle coinage. Especially with your fine detective work.

[strangerdanger101]

Good to see Lord of the Internet is still around stompin hushtalk zombies

[adipurnama]

Yes, I agree that GAW has most likely been bled dry, but I bet Homero would scrounge enough to put up a defense if a major lawsuit were brought against GAW/Garza. No matter what I suspect no one will ever get compensated, because of the "Can't get Blood out of a Stone" axiom.

I watched another of the Hashking contest videos and I busted out laughing at this one as well.

Hey KoolAid! https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=preE2bUYgQ4#t=73 Oh Yeaah!

lol
https://youtu.be/hu98b2zmWC8?list=PLztXZxhHlydhWoYLxmm86M4etvYN4SfYH

[bumpershot]

One could definitely put linkage to the idea that the Primes were created to embezzle coinage. Especially with your fine detective work.

Yeah, that's the short version. People who have prime controllers basically get to extract all of the value without directly embezzling.

Also, these people got high salaries. I'd bet lots of cash that the first bill paid was always Garza's paycheck.

[strangerdanger101]