GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[elkrisi]

I fear we are building his product for him as we speak, liken it to a Sam's Club or Costco, with membership and card in hand. Bulk buying power at work. If he signs up 1 million users and controls them and can dictate how and where they can shop via the browser plug-in, one might assume any vendor might come rushing to him to have him direct his customer base to their store(s).

The farcical state of the matter is how exceedingly contra to crypto currency it all is.

Exactly. We're looking at a centralized shop loyalty coupon system. Everything we know of in fiat world (know your customer practices, locking of accounts, full regulation) is replicated here.

The only thing crypto is that GAW has used crypto enthusiasm to collect money that nobody would ever give to them under any other pretext.

[seedtrue]

If this payment system is not backed by FDIC or SIPC I wouldn't go near it at all. They can't pull this off without attracting regulator attention so it should get interesting. If they were smart they would try to hoodwink some smaller bank or credit union to back this so they can get some legitimacy into it.

I love the idea, just not the shady company trying to pull it off. Forget about the buying stuff, the payments from BTC to other parties like credit cards and other bills is a good idea.

Good thing Mr.CEO says

one of my best friends runs the largest bond trading company in the world, and the other one of the largest banks in the world. I did not start my career in crypto

[alienesb]

I fear we are building his product for him as we speak, liken it to a Sam's Club or Costco, with membership and card in hand. Bulk buying power at work. If he signs up 1 million users and controls them and can dictate how and where they can shop via the browser plug-in, one might assume any vendor might come rushing to him to have him direct his customer base to their store(s).

The farcical state of the matter is how exceedingly contra to crypto currency it all is.

Exactly. We're looking at a centralized shop loyalty coupon system. Everything we know of in fiat world (know your customer practices, locking of accounts, full regulation) is replicated here.

The only thing crypto is that GAW has used crypto enthusiasm to collect money that nobody would ever give to them under any other pretext.

Yep, it's Shoprunner for crypto but this one will not work most of the time and over promise and under deliver. Shoprunner is a real company doing something that actually give you something (like faster/cheaper shipping) and the company is backed by Kynetic, Alibaba, and American Express. I don't think Mt. Gaw can compete with that.

[bitgeek]

while i dont know if this paycoin thing will be legit or not, chances are it wont be, but some of the people in this thread are insufferable, must be frustrating being filled with hate towards someone you don't know... but, i remember when i was going through puberty like you guys, its a tough time.

Most of us have seen very similar scams before and they all started out like gaw, thats why we're making people aware.

"We" meaning sockpuppet spammers, who want their own cloud minings to look better compared to GAW.

[raskul]

I was talking about crypto as a whole, it will either die a fad or go mainstream

and what part of me being able to buy a coffee in my local cafe - with Bitcoin - is not already mainstream?
BTC is already mainstream, it is merely the greed which people hide behind that insists on them wanting more.

Josh insists that his shitcoin is going to put cryptocurrency into the mainstream.
I say, he trying to sell a clone of something which already has such successes.

from what I gather, the Paycoin protocol is a simple ripoff of the Mastercoin protocol.
there is nothing new here.

However, I did not know that it BFL was under criminal charges, this is news to me, and the same, with MtGox. I had thought they were under civil indictments.
Perhaps sometimes, when you live in a land which confuses criminality with civil complaint, it's easy to make that mistake.
"I can't breathe"

[maildir]

This will not end well






https://i.imgur.com/cE0756s.jpg

[Chris_Sabian]

GAW has decent backing. This is the difference between their coin and any cheap altcoin anybody can make.
Unfortunately backing and advertising aren't the only factors needed for success.

Backing by whom?  Some anonymous partners that are hidden by a NDA?  Some big bank that wants to change the world?  Some people who believe that a product will have a $250 million market cap based on a terrible whitepaper with no technical information/code?

[numanoid]

You havent been mining anything. Youre just being given points.. wake up

FUCK YOU!

[owlcatz]

You havent been mining anything. Youre just being given points.. wake up

FUCK YOU!

It's true - you are mining coupons. The ceo was here a few days ago and admitted as much. Sorry the truth hurts man. 

[Snipe85]

You havent been mining anything. Youre just being given points.. wake up

FUCK YOU!

That's right, show him! Let's use his language against him! Fight a spammer with more spam! 

[EQXhatter]

I just dont get one thing. A lot of people here is saying it is scam because of the hashlets dont exists etc. But I see their business model in a different way, which tells a lot why they are hiding their minning adresses.

You don´t buy miner, which is pointed to the pool you choose (e.g. waffle, multi etc..). You just buy the calculation of payout GAW will pay you. I think they are pointing their mninig power on whatever pool they just find most profitable, they will earn more than your chosen payout is and keep the difference (plus the high fees). That is the way, they are not loosing if they have to pay customers one satoshi for "obsolete" miners (they just point the power to profitable pool, but you wont get anything from that). They just don´t want you to know, where they are mining or where the people they hired the power are mining. Because I can imagine all the angry customers, who say, that they paid for MH´s which are minning coins, but they dont get anything from that minning, just gaw get.

Is it clear what I have on mind?

Any antithesis to this? Can this be right or am I just another scammed customer ? thank you

[bumpershot]

I just dont get one thing. A lot of people here is saying it is scam because of the hashlets dont exists etc. But I see their business model in a different way, which tells a lot why they are hiding their minning adresses.

You don´t buy miner, which is pointed to the pool you choose (e.g. waffle, multi etc..). You just buy the calculation of payout GAW will pay you. I think they are pointing their mninig power on whatever pool they just find most profitable, they will earn more than your chosen payout is and keep the difference (plus the high fees). That is the way, they are not loosing if they have to pay customers one satoshi for "obsolete" miners (they just point the power to profitable pool, but you wont get anything from that). They just don´t want you to know, where they are mining or where the people they hired the power are mining. Because I can imagine all the angry customers, who say, that they paid for MH´s which are minning coins, but they dont get anything from that minning, just gaw get.

Is it clear what I have on mind?

Any antithesis to this? Can this be right or am I just another scammed customer ? thank you

No, you could be right. The problem if you're right is that instead of renting out mining power, they're possibly selling an unregistered security.

[welchy8764]

You cant withdraw currently, "we are unable to process your transaction at this time" support tells me its a general issue will be fixed tomorrow

This issue has been on-going since the beginning. They will delay/hold/review any large withdrawl. so when removing bitcoin use small amount under 2 btc and do several. Keep trying the withdrawl several times. I dont know what they're going to do when several thousand transactions occur at the same time, they can't manage their current system. I also wonder how much time has been invested in the current system since Paycoin has been announced. If the past is any indication the current system will die a slow death and everyone will be forced on paycoin pool.

[Phildo]

I just dont get one thing. A lot of people here is saying it is scam because of the hashlets dont exists etc. But I see their business model in a different way, which tells a lot why they are hiding their minning adresses.

You don´t buy miner, which is pointed to the pool you choose (e.g. waffle, multi etc..). You just buy the calculation of payout GAW will pay you. I think they are pointing their mninig power on whatever pool they just find most profitable, they will earn more than your chosen payout is and keep the difference (plus the high fees). That is the way, they are not loosing if they have to pay customers one satoshi for "obsolete" miners (they just point the power to profitable pool, but you wont get anything from that). They just don´t want you to know, where they are mining or where the people they hired the power are mining. Because I can imagine all the angry customers, who say, that they paid for MH´s which are minning coins, but they dont get anything from that minning, just gaw get.

Is it clear what I have on mind?

Any antithesis to this? Can this be right or am I just another scammed customer ? thank you

If that is true, why aren't they showing us the hashpower? the entire point of bitcoin is that everything is recorded on a public ledger. If they are mining coins, there is a public record of it, and them showing it would end all of the speculation. Show us the freshly mined coins.

There have been lots of scams in bitcoin, all of them could have been avoided if people asked for proof of what was happening. No one should believe someone is mining without seeing the proof on the blockchain. If you don't believe GAW is mining why are you paying them to mine for you?

[raskul]

I was talking about crypto as a whole, it will either die a fad or go mainstream

and what part of me being able to buy a coffee in my local cafe - with Bitcoin - is not already mainstream?
BTC is already mainstream, it is merely the greed which people hide behind that insists on them wanting more.

Josh insists that his shitcoin is going to put cryptocurrency into the mainstream.
I say, he trying to sell a clone of something which already has such successes.

from what I gather, the Paycoin protocol is a simple ripoff of the Mastercoin protocol.
there is nothing new here.

However, I did not know that it BFL was under criminal charges, this is news to me, and the same, with MtGox. I had thought they were under civil indictments.
Perhaps sometimes, when you live in a land which confuses criminality with civil complaint, it's easy to make that mistake.
"I can't breathe"

It isn't mainstream, I wouldn't say in mainstream until at least we get into the paypal area of use. I understand your local coffee shop accepts it but Starbucks, dunkin dnuts , panera, lilly,  tully's, Tim Hortons, Caribou coffee, The coffee bean, and Costa Coffee don't. Do you see where I am going with this? Yes were past the unknown stage but nowhere near main stream use and it isn't for being greedy it so we can have a time in a couple years where i can pay my bills in bitcoin and shop in bitcoin directly. A dual fiat/crypto economy.

Fair enough, and forgive me if you felt i was insinuating that you were greedy in any way, this was not my intent. I do think that there is a long way to go before we see mass acceptance, but I'm not sure it will ever be in my lifetime. I am confident that it will happen, but there is - fortunately for those of us on the greyer side of the barber seat, something slightly encouraging that small retailers are happy to accept Bitcoin. It's enough for me, and it's a starting block to build on. Every day the technology behind Bitcoin in improving and there are easier ways to use it as a spendable currency. Understanding is another obstacle which needs to be overcome, and simply designing a clone, or piggy-backing on an already designed protocol to create a competitor to Bitcoin is in no way going to help cryptocurrencies in any way. Instead of trying to out-Bitcoin Bitcoin, GAW should have concentrated on building what is already available. The Mastercoin protocol is a great idea for things like loyalty coupons and company-specific rewards programs, but to try and start from scratch, something new which they think will outperform the 'old original' is very narrow minded, and will do more harm, than good.
Again, speaking personally, i'm quite content at where BTC is at the moment - the price is good - the availability of it is good - and my undetstanding of it (though not total) is also good enough for me. For that reason, i'm going to stick with what I have 1BTC = 1BTC but 1PAYCOIN = 1GAWPROFIT and not much else.

[bumpershot]

GAW has decent backing. This is the difference between their coin and any cheap altcoin anybody can make.
Unfortunately backing and advertising aren't the only factors needed for success.

Backing by whom?  Some anonymous partners that are hidden by a NDA?  Some big bank that wants to change the world?  Some people who believe that a product will have a $250 million market cap based on a terrible whitepaper with no technical information/code?

They have the money to promote it, that's for sure. Show me another altcoin, that started with a domain worth 1 million USD. They also have the hash to mine this coin, while other altcoins need people to point their own hash to the pool. And there's Cantor Fitzgerald.

I agree there's some solid backing here, but Cantor Fitzgerald isn't part of it. It's a guy who works for Cantor Fitzgerald. The press release from GAW is very clear about this.

[clanbake]

They did not buy physical miners. They bought bulk hashing power at a discount and re-sold it at a profit. Any idiot with a few dollars can do that.

Do you honestly believe this?

You've made some good points and we agree on several fronts, but if you stand by the above claim with no proof to back it up (and "proof" exists to the contrary) then you've gone down a road I can't follow.

Does Bitmain even rent their gear?  The statement was that GAW purchased 5 PH and Bitmain confirmed it.  Occam's Razor time.

I can guarantee you with certainty that they will not and never will take delivery of 5 PH physical miners.

Not sure how you can be so certain, but here is one interesting detail. Those S4s they've been selling on oneminer.com - one of my customers purchased a couple and said they arrived from Hattiesburg MS, seemed to be slightly used, and had GAW's proxy servers in the pool settings. He didn't think of taking a screenshot but apparently there was nothing interesting there anyway (no BTC addresses). Not quite clear why they are selling off those miners but "Bitmain Antminer S4 2 TH/s Shipped (NEW)" it ain't .

Also, you can get these miners (really brand new) from bitmaintech right now, with shipping for 1010.99, shipped in 48 hours via ups.

[bitpop]

Paycoin paypal
Paybase Coinbase

Who else will they try to impersonate?

[Chris_Sabian]

GAW has decent backing. This is the difference between their coin and any cheap altcoin anybody can make.
Unfortunately backing and advertising aren't the only factors needed for success.

Backing by whom?  Some anonymous partners that are hidden by a NDA?  Some big bank that wants to change the world?  Some people who believe that a product will have a $250 million market cap based on a terrible whitepaper with no technical information/code?

They have the money to promote it, that's for sure. Show me another altcoin, that started with a domain worth 1 million USD. They also have the hash to mine this coin, while other altcoins need people to point their own hash to the pool. And there's Cantor Fitzgerald.

You mean the $1 million btc.com domain?  Why pay that much money for a domain of a coin that you will never use?

Also, if you are creating a new coin, you don't need much hash to start with.  For most of 2009, Satoshi solo mined using a 10 mh/s cpu with SHA256.  

If GAW is really creating a new coin, controller all of the miners, in charge of merchant integration, and coin source, then why have massive hashing power competing with itself?  Why not just have each 'prime' be 1 hash/s for whatever logarithm you want (sha265 or scrypt) and call it good?

As far as Cantor Fitzgerald, show us an actual statement from the company that they are working with GAW.  Even a 1 line verification saying "We, Cantor Fitzgerald, are working with GAW on a cryptocurrency project" will be satisfactory.

[Chris_Sabian]

Paycoin paypal
Paybase Coinbase

Who else will they try to impersonate?

PayBay.com
PayChain.info
PayPay.com