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Author Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It  (Read 3881294 times)
niko
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February 06, 2013, 05:12:12 PM
 #1401

How did you come up with 12%? There were 154`262 shares in circulation after the ipo (search this thread). Each share is entitled to 1/400`000 of the profits.  That ends up being 39%.

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Transactions must be included in a block to be properly completed. When you send a transaction, it is broadcast to miners. Miners can then optionally include it in their next blocks. Miners will be more inclined to include your transaction if it has a higher transaction fee.
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Deprived
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February 06, 2013, 05:15:03 PM
 #1402

How did you come up with 12%? There were 154`262 shares in circulation after the ipo (search this thread). Each share is entitled to 1/400`000 of the profits.  That ends up being 39%.

The 12% he was referring to is the shares NOT sold: so 50%-39% = ~12% depending on how you round.  Not sure why they're of relevance - other than that because they weren't sold we'll get back our initial 0.1 BTC/share a bit quicker.
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February 06, 2013, 05:47:24 PM
 #1403

Has there ever been a confirmation on what will happen with the excess BTC that was not convertd to $

The exchange rate doubled since, will go a long way towards designing a next-gen chip, or will it b distributed as a special dividnd?
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February 06, 2013, 06:42:34 PM
 #1404

Has there ever been a confirmation on what will happen with the excess BTC that was not convertd to $

The exchange rate doubled since, will go a long way towards designing a next-gen chip, or will it b distributed as a special dividnd?

It's probably the cash that was on GLBSE and never returned by nefario (if I remember right).
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February 06, 2013, 08:09:46 PM
 #1405

Ok, fair enough, and I appreciate you defending yourself and setting the record straight.  Nefario did way worse than you, this is for certain.  

Please dont be so certain. Since its OT in this thread, I wont elaborate, just do your own research:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=77469.560
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February 07, 2013, 02:45:30 AM
 #1406

Were there any ASICMINER stocks not purchases (owned by friedcat/the company)  before GLBSE went down? If so, how will these be priced upon the exchange being brought back up? Will the value be at the same (0.1000BTC/per) or will it be adjusted based on market value//trade price after X days?
The IPO was finished long before GLBSE went down. Not all 200`000 IPO shares were sold before sufficient funds were raised, and the IPO closed. Initially, hundred percent of the profits will be diverted to dividends until 0.1 btc per share is paid out. From there on, each public share's dividend is worth 1/400`000 of the profits, regardless of how many shares were sold originally. It's all buried somewhere in this thread.
The only thing I fail to comprehend is if its 1/400000 of the profit per share, isn't 12% of the profits not gonna be distributed?

I'm not sure how you get to 12%. That would require 24% of the ASICMINER shares to be unsold and withdrawn from sale. I imagine ASICMINER"s parent company owns the unsold amount in addition to the other 50% of the profits.
There is about 150k share from the 200k IPO sold, so its 350k/400k, if you decide the profit by 1/400k per share, there would be 12% of the profit bit distributed. Shouldn't the profit dived by 1/350k per share?

No, because the definition at launch was 1/400k per share.  Had exchange-rate moved the other direction (or costs been higher than predicted) and they needed to sell more than 200k then the extra would have come from Bitfountain's share - so only fair they get the surplus when it moved the way it did.

Our cut was defined before we bought the shares - so no reason why it should be changed.
I do not mean to imply it should be done otherwise. I just didn't really conclude how it worked from available information (either by my incomprehension or maybe it is not possible to conclude without abstraction).

So if I understand correctly, from what you say, bitfountain now effectively owns 250k shares?
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February 07, 2013, 02:48:01 AM
 #1407

Has there ever been a confirmation on what will happen with the excess BTC that was not convertd to $

The exchange rate doubled since, will go a long way towards designing a next-gen chip, or will it b distributed as a special dividnd?
Operational cash is the most likely scenario. Could be used for R&D or for covering utility bills.

Technically, these shares belong to ASICMINER itself - it thus acts like a shareholder who invests all dividends back into the business.

So if I understand correctly, from what you say, bitfountain now effectively owns 250k shares?
No. That wouldn't make sense. The unsold shares of ASICMINER act as potential equity in future financing rounds. The availability of unsold shares has the advantage that dilution can be avoided if the 12% cover financing needs.

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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February 07, 2013, 03:01:14 AM
 #1408

Ok, fair enough, and I appreciate you defending yourself and setting the record straight.  Nefario did way worse than you, this is for certain.  Are you paying back the rest?

Yes, over time. The half of income that originally was going to be spent on growing and maintaining the company is now being spent on buying back shares, the other half of income being paid out as dividends as per contract.

Quote
I just don't like you calling BFL a scam.  They aren't a scam if they deliver in the end, they are a scam if they do not.  All of the ASIC companies (with exception of ASICMiner) took preorders, and all of them called their preorder customers customers.  It doesn't matter if that doesn't fit your definition of a customer - everyone who preordered ASICs are customers.

Actually, it depends on what US law thinks. My interpretation of law is what BFL is doing is illegal. If my interpretation is wrong and they can legally call these pre-orders by customers instead of investments by investors, then they are still violating the law by taking pre-order money before shipment. If its not a scam, then what is it? These conditions do not go away just because they ship and the government can still go after them, including halting shipments of product and destroying them or refusing them entry into the US.
It might be unlawful, illegal, etc, but calling it a scam implies malicious intent.  I have seen no malicious intent (towards its customers) from BFL thus far...

Definitions of scamming usually include words like "defrauding" or "swindling", and are preceded with words like "deliberately" or "intentionally".  BFL has not intentionally defrauded or swindled anyone.  They've had delays they were not expecting.

Except they claim they have a lawyer and a lawyer has advised them through this process. No lawyer would ever advise them to break the law. I think that meets the requirement of considering this as intentional.

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February 07, 2013, 03:12:59 AM
 #1409

Please keep this thread free from BFL stuff. I don't have a high opinion of them, but that doesn't make me want to bitch about them in the wrong thread.

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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February 07, 2013, 04:35:38 AM
 #1410

...
No lawyer would ever advise them to break the law.
...
Um ... sorry - that's either just naive or ignorant.

Yes completely OT, but nothign to do with BFL ...

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February 07, 2013, 05:11:07 AM
 #1411

...
No lawyer would ever advise them to break the law.
...
Um ... sorry - that's either just naive or ignorant.

Yes completely OT, but nothign to do with BFL ...
Well, on that note:
http://www.bettercallsaul.com

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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February 07, 2013, 06:28:16 AM
 #1412

Should be another update tonight. Let's hope for good news!

"The difference between a castle and a prison is only a question of who holds the keys."
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February 07, 2013, 03:54:11 PM
 #1413

Update

Deploying has been consuming the time of all us devoted into this project in last week and this one. During the busy days we made us some spare time taking a few pictures:

Peeping over one of our subracks:


Four of them waiting to populate on racks:


Please stay tuned for the *really* good news since our chips arrived. And sorry if there's delay
in replying forum PMs or e-mails. When the most busy time is over the communication should
resume more active.

I'm not sure how you get to 12%. That would require 24% of the ASICMINER shares to be unsold and withdrawn from sale. I imagine ASICMINER"s parent company owns the unsold amount in addition to the other 50% of the profits.
The rest shares unsold is indeed owned by the partner (not so "parent" since ASICMINER owns the voting right). They will unlikely be sold in near- or mid-term.

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February 07, 2013, 03:58:30 PM
 #1414

Now THIS is how you show off boxes. Looking good.
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February 07, 2013, 03:59:47 PM
 #1415

Those things are freaking beautiful

ASICMINERTUBE
   
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February 07, 2013, 04:20:54 PM
 #1416

Update

Deploying has been consuming the time of all us devoted into this project in last week and this one. During the busy days we made us some spare time taking a few pictures:

Peeping over one of our subracks:


Four of them waiting to populate on racks:


friedcat, you are fucking awesome.

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February 07, 2013, 05:18:34 PM
 #1417

I like the clean and tidy work you show. Waiting for the really good news... Smiley

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February 07, 2013, 05:58:16 PM
 #1418

Pretty pictures, friedcat. Thank you.

I've gone back over your posts and didn't find the answer / info for this question:

What is the hash rate for each board?
Or
What is the hash rate for each 'rackable unit' of ten boards each?

I assume you powered up one of these 'rackable units' as an interim step with one or more boards in it.
How did it do?
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February 07, 2013, 06:09:16 PM
 #1419

I assume you powered up one of these 'rackable units' as an interim step with one or more boards in it.
How did it do?

WOuld assume that's the good news Wink
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February 07, 2013, 06:31:58 PM
 #1420

I assume you powered up one of these 'rackable units' as an interim step with one or more boards in it.
How did it do?
WOuld assume that's the good news Wink
Yes, you're probably right. Smiley

Reckon I just got somewhat confused by the pictures and don't really understand what I'm seeing in them.

Looking at the top image I had the impression they were full length boards and assumed that each one was a 'hashing board'. However, in the bottom row of the bottom image it is clear to see that these take up only about a half of the cage depth at most.

Perhaps what we're seeing here is ten power supply modules (psm) in each cage?
Awaiting the addition of ten hashing boards?
(But they don't, to me, look like the picture of a psm posted in:
 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.msg1493791#msg1493791)

If so, I don't see where the hashing boards will be inserted.

Hmmm, perhaps that front 'black bar' is a two slot 'back plane'? And each hashing board plugs in next to each psm?

Regardless, all idle speculation. We will know all we need to know soon enough.  Cheesy
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