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Author Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It  (Read 3546524 times)
niko
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December 08, 2012, 11:50:22 AM
 #981

Nefario finally sends the asset list, and all the hell breaks loose in this thread. Does not sound like a legitimate concern of an investor, or a would-be investor. 

They're there, in their room.
Your mining rig is on fire, yet you're very calm.
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December 09, 2012, 01:06:14 AM
 #982

Nefario finally sends the asset list, and all the hell breaks loose in this thread. Does not sound like a legitimate concern of an investor, or a would-be investor. 

It is, because it gives an insight into the type of people you are doing business with, if they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?
Jesus even BFL is registered, was the pirate fiasco not enough to convince you?

Especially when someone dealing with corporate finance/funding , tells you they don't need to register of have a license.


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niko
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December 09, 2012, 05:45:44 AM
 #983

Nefario finally sends the asset list, and all the hell breaks loose in this thread. Does not sound like a legitimate concern of an investor, or a would-be investor.  

It is, because it gives an insight into the type of people you are doing business with, if they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?
Jesus even BFL is registered, was the pirate fiasco not enough to convince you?

Especially when someone dealing with corporate finance/funding , tells you they don't need to register of have a license.



Alright, makes sense, but - why are you telling me that? I'm not trying to be a smart ass, really wish to know why you bother.

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December 09, 2012, 03:37:13 PM
 #984

they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?

Who said they haven't registered? I suggest you get your facts straight. And does it even matter? We have a contract with friedcat, which is ideally detached from any other entity. We are shareholders of ASICMINER.

And, I thought you were talking about the legitimacy of shareholding through GLBSE, not the actual registration, which doesn't mean much. We were all ex-GLBSE users, so I don't think you can "inform" anyone. Maybe lecture them...

Now, can you state your concerns more briefly?
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December 09, 2012, 04:08:56 PM
 #985

Highly recommended reading for all of you. Especially those, who keep screaming "legal"
http://www.dgcmagazine.com/the-old-radical-how-bitcoin-is-being-destroyed/

"Legally registered" is not a synonym with "honest business" Wink Read the link I posted and think.

Cheers!

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Jutarul
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December 09, 2012, 08:29:03 PM
 #986

"Legally registered" is not a synonym with "honest business" Wink
words of wisdom.

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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December 09, 2012, 08:39:52 PM
 #987

I see the point behind the blog post. But what i dont see is why people think that governments cant hurt bitcoins. Of course you could encrypt the network or tor it but if the governments mark bitcoins illegal and go after websites that exchange or take bitcoins bitcoins will survive maybe but it would be practically dead.

First, the exchange course will go so deep that only nerds will keep it. Then you will be able to use it for nearly nothing anymore. And if governments go after nodes too you will have to fear punishment.

So what will convince you to keep a money you could be punished for and cant do much with it? Money is money because of its use. Take this away and it will die. It doesnt matter if 3 nerds still use it if most of users dont want anymore because of the risks and nearly no use.

Anyway... out of topic.

 

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DutchBrat
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December 09, 2012, 09:57:48 PM
 #988

Back on topic

Friedcat, have you guys decided how to go onward with the shareholding side of ASICMINER now that you have received a list from Nefario. Relisting somewhere perhaps?
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December 09, 2012, 10:24:09 PM
 #989

@DutchBrat... i was nearly asking the same but found that friedcat gave the answer already. He will move them to another platform.

http://blog.glbse.com/

According to Nefario, ASICMINER list has been sent!
We confirm it. They are sent as two different .yml files. We will merge them and compare them with our older claims, then make them online in another platform.

 

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DutchBrat
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December 09, 2012, 10:26:46 PM
 #990

@DutchBrat... i was nearly asking the same but found that friedcat gave the answer already. He will move them to another platform.

http://blog.glbse.com/

According to Nefario, ASICMINER list has been sent!
We confirm it. They are sent as two different .yml files. We will merge them and compare them with our older claims, then make them online in another platform.
Oops yes, I now remember reading that.... Long weekend Wink

Thanks
nebulus
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December 09, 2012, 10:37:27 PM
 #991

What are the plans for MOORE?

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December 10, 2012, 01:45:08 AM
 #992

they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?

Who said they haven't registered? I suggest you get your facts straight. And does it even matter? We have a contract with friedcat, which is ideally detached from any other entity. We are shareholders of ASICMINER.

And, I thought you were talking about the legitimacy of shareholding through GLBSE, not the actual registration, which doesn't mean much. We were all ex-GLBSE users, so I don't think you can "inform" anyone. Maybe lecture them...

Now, can you state your concerns more briefly?

Quote
if they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?

Please NUMB-NUTS do not misquote me for you own ends.


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December 10, 2012, 03:17:06 AM
 #993

What are the plans for MOORE?

I had some MOORE.  I'd like to see it re-listed somewhere.  (personal vote would be btct.co, but cryptostocks or bitfunder would be great too!)


I'm not a Coinbase fan -- I placed a buy order, they took the funds out of my account, then a week later the price went up and they canceled the buy and closed my account.  You've been warned.  Use a different exchange.
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December 10, 2012, 08:52:39 AM
 #994

Quote
if they fail to register a business what does that say about accountability and auditability?

Please NUMB-NUTS do not misquote me for you own ends.

Umm, how did that change the meaning? Were you informing us about your belief that if they hadn't registered a business it would be a bad sign, and it's a good thing they registered? How nice of you.

Ignored. Undecided
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December 10, 2012, 12:10:38 PM
 #995

Were some btct.co related emails to shareholders sent already? I did not receive any.

Look into the "cognitive" former glbse asset thread to see what Garret did there - a script generated account for each old shareholder with instructions how to transfer the shares to a self-created second account once they are in the script-genned one...

Also for people that got not email from the issuer - there is a claims@ email to write to...


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DutchBrat
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December 10, 2012, 12:13:07 PM
 #996

Were some btct.co related emails to shareholders sent already? I did not receive any.

There has been no communication yet on where the shares will be relisted
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December 11, 2012, 02:08:55 PM
 #997

It seems our ASICMINER shares just got worth a little bit more.

BFL announced another much anticipated new delay. Will be about 30 days from now until they get their chips delivered from the foundry. Then they need to turn those into mining rigs of course, which means BFL customers probably won't be mining before the latter part of January 2013.

So if everything with ASICMINER stays on schedule that means we will be mining on a lower difficulty level for 3 to 4 weeks. With about 1/5th of the total network network capacity.

Sounds good to me  Grin

edit: BFL update link: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/519-10-dec-2012-bfl-asic-update.html
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December 11, 2012, 04:02:36 PM
 #998

It seems our ASICMINER shares just got worth a little bit more.

BFL announced another much anticipated new delay. Will be about 30 days from now until they get their chips delivered from the foundry. Then they need to turn those into mining rigs of course, which means BFL customers probably won't be mining before the latter part of January 2013.

So if everything with ASICMINER stays on schedule that means we will be mining on a lower difficulty level for 3 to 4 weeks. With about 1/5th of the total network network capacity.

Sounds good to me  Grin

edit: BFL update link: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/519-10-dec-2012-bfl-asic-update.html
The standard contracts you get from the foundry put customers at the mercy of the foundry. Even if they are past the deadline, they have the right to continue the order without penalty. All they usually require is some good faith estimates. BFL seems to experience that first hand. And if you decide to scrap the order due to the delays, they'll write a bill nevertheless.

If you're a bigger fish in the sea you can play smarter and pressure a foundry for more aggressive contracts, where they loose money on pushing back dates. As we already know, the chip production of ASICMINER is also already past due date. It's a problem of trying to be economical. Let's just hope that friedcats choice for the foundry was a good one (mainly determined by luck).

The ASICMINER Project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
"The way you solve things is by making it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.", Milton Friedman
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December 11, 2012, 04:05:02 PM
 #999

It seems our ASICMINER shares just got worth a little bit more.

BFL announced another much anticipated new delay. Will be about 30 days from now until they get their chips delivered from the foundry. Then they need to turn those into mining rigs of course, which means BFL customers probably won't be mining before the latter part of January 2013.

So if everything with ASICMINER stays on schedule that means we will be mining on a lower difficulty level for 3 to 4 weeks. With about 1/5th of the total network network capacity.

Sounds good to me  Grin

edit: BFL update link: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/519-10-dec-2012-bfl-asic-update.html

So let's do some back-of-the-envelope calculations here: on Dec 5, friedcat said there were 12 layers remaining and the rate is 1.1-1.5 days per layer, which brings us to chip completion date of between Dec 18 and Dec 23. Add another two weeks for packaging and shipping (estimate pulled out of thin air!), then one more week of unwrapping/assembly, which brings us to an estimated hashing starting date of between Jan 8 and Jan 13. Sound reasonable?

And for BFL: chips delivered to their HQ Jan 11, unwrapping/assembly: 1 week, shipping to customers: 4 days, which gives us an estimated hashing starting date of Jan 22.

Pretty close race, but it looks like ASICMINER definitely will win it. I even think it is likely that ASICMINER will move a little faster than estimated above, and BFL will move slower than estimated above. But these back-of-the-envelope calculations give us at least a week as the only ASIC gig in town!

Edit: Anyone familiar with the bASIC and Avalon willing to make a guess at the date they start hashing? Both seem to have been giving mid-January delivery dates, but I don't know if that's the latest available information, or if it is at all accurate.
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December 11, 2012, 04:48:25 PM
 #1000

It seems our ASICMINER shares just got worth a little bit more.

BFL announced another much anticipated new delay. Will be about 30 days from now until they get their chips delivered from the foundry. Then they need to turn those into mining rigs of course, which means BFL customers probably won't be mining before the latter part of January 2013.

So if everything with ASICMINER stays on schedule that means we will be mining on a lower difficulty level for 3 to 4 weeks. With about 1/5th of the total network network capacity.

Sounds good to me  Grin

edit: BFL update link: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/519-10-dec-2012-bfl-asic-update.html

So let's do some back-of-the-envelope calculations here: on Dec 5, friedcat said there were 12 layers remaining and the rate is 1.1-1.5 days per layer, which brings us to chip completion date of between Dec 18 and Dec 23. Add another two weeks for packaging and shipping (estimate pulled out of thin air!), then one more week of unwrapping/assembly, which brings us to an estimated hashing starting date of between Jan 8 and Jan 13. Sound reasonable?

And for BFL: chips delivered to their HQ Jan 11, unwrapping/assembly: 1 week, shipping to customers: 4 days, which gives us an estimated hashing starting date of Jan 22.

Pretty close race, but it looks like ASICMINER definitely will win it. I even think it is likely that ASICMINER will move a little faster than estimated above, and BFL will move slower than estimated above. But these back-of-the-envelope calculations give us at least a week as the only ASIC gig in town!

When those chips are ready, is it guaranteed they actually work or will there be a random testing? Will this happen before or after the shipping to ASICMINER team?
How many chips (%) will be lemons? 10%? 20%? 30%? Lets not forget that this stuff is coming from China, the biggest producer of crap in the world.

BFL nor ASICMINER are big clients. They can scream and threaten, but this will not guarantee quality nor delivery dates. Yes, Chinese manufacturers are well known for "me price so low" but we all know that "Made in China" is a synonym for "shit" Smiley 
Friend of mine, who is in business of building non BTC related hardware, told that expecting those greedy slimy chinese dogs to deliver anything on time and up to the quality requirements is flat out stupid. The fun starts, when your shipment arrives and you realize, that up N% of the stuff is actually junk.
Talked to another friend in optics business. Same story. Price per unit is low but the local quality control is probably done by blind kids.
BTW, if you ever make it to China, go visit some of the factory dump sites. You will see mountains! yes, mountains! of crap that has never made it out the door.
Make sure you do not get caught and ware protective clothing. China is not inly the biggest crap producer but they are also the biggest polluters. Humans cost nothing over there.   
 
I did not want to piss on your parade. I honestly hope you guys get a better results. Be optimist and x 2 everything they tell you (and you still get screwed by half)  Wink


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BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
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