Please find a flaw in this: I can send $1B with a fee of 40 cents or less.
That is not a use case for the broad population. For the broad population there is no use case, other than as a get rich speculation. Use cases? 1. Remittances -- very low fees compared to 10-15% of companies like western union 2. Self storage - Your accounts are not able to be "frozen" by 3rd parties 3. Portability -- You can travel to any country and immediately use your bitcoins without needing to transfer funds from one bank to another or pay additional currency exchange fees. If you tried to travel with a suitcase of cash you'd soon be broke/robbed 4. Not able to be used in Bail-ins: Example Cyprus stealing money from large account holders to bail-in their banks. And actually the G20 just agreed that bail-ins should be used before bail-outs by the IMF or the central banks....we are going to see a lot more bank failures and bail-ins in the near future 5. Known inflation/emission rate. : Take notice of argentina, or the QE in USA 6. the list goes on and on but if your too lazy to look them up then I'm going to stop here. 1. Convert to and from fiat is the same or more fees, plus much more hassle in many scenarios. 2. Just wait until the KYC regulations on the miners come once most of the users are accessing Bitcoin through Paypal and Coincase and other centralized choke points. 3. You need to convert to fiat before you can use it. 4. Ditto #2. 5. Bitcoin can be debased just like gold was debased in the 1800s, via fractional reserve loans denominated in BTC. Gresham's Law insures the public will adopt the most debased unit. 6. The longer your list, the more proof you provide that I am correct. 1. Pay with bitcoin you nerd. 2. Maybe they are initially buying bitcoin through a company like coinbase, but then just move it off coinbase. A smart bitcoiner would never leave a large amount of bitcoin on a centralized service, especially after the Mt. Gox problem 3. See #1. Are you mentally delayed? -- And if your argument is "well not everywhere accepts bitcoins and keeps them!" that is why were are in the adoption phase and I'm proud of that fact  4. Nope, you can never take someones bitcoin as a bail-in. If I could I'd own all of satoshi's coins right now  5. Yes there could be a fractional reserve and they would need a very small margin otherwise face quick collapse. But that still prevents endless money printing. 6. The more you argue the point, the more obvious it is that you know very little about bitcoin. |
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@jonoiv
Gold has nothing to do with this, and FYI fiat isn't backed by gold or any tangible assets since 40 years. Some currencies are 'defended' by a certain amount of gold in currencies wars, but that is the extend of it 'backing' anything these days.
It's backed by the ability to prove a debt can be ultimately paid in gold as assumed by the credit agencies. Currency is backed by assets, at least my currency is (GBP). our QE was backed by the purchase of assets. When called to pay debts they are settled in gold. Don't be silly. The small amount of assets that central banks have is nothing compared to the fiat they print. Most assets in central banks are leveraged at 30-40:1 (and usually by shitty assets), and the leverages are going up little by little. Only the IMF has a small leverage of about 3:1 and we dont use SDR's in personal settlements. Fiat has nothing to do with paying a debt back in gold and IF a country were to go bankrupt, gold would be the 1 thing that the country tries to keep. Can a debt be paid in gold? --sure, but there is absolutely nothing that implies that if a country defaults that it will pay its debts in gold or that it even retains enough gold to cover its debts. As far as QE goes, the purpose of it is usually to buy bad assets that are tanking the market and then injecting new currency in exchange for those bad assets. |
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By the way, Facebook was founded in 2004, it didn't even have positive cash flow until 2009 (5 years later!). As of January 2014 they still had ONLY 1.2 billion active users (10 years later!)
Facebook was launched to the public Sept. 2006. Bitcoin also had a period before its Jan 2009 launch wherein it was tested by a smaller group. So thus Facebook is only 8 years old as a public service and has 1.2 billion users. Bitcoin is nearing 6 years old as a public service has about about 1000X less users. Sorry there is no comparison. "launched to public" in 2006? Bitcoin is just known to part of the public during the 2013 run up Launched means launched. Not everyone in the world knew about Facebook in 2006. Before 2006, it was not available to the public, only to closed groups. Continue with your delusion. In 2009 bitcoin was not known to the world, just a small group of cryptoanalysts that were on a specific mailing list, and there was only 1 miner (satoshi). So then we shouldn't be stating that bitcoin was "launched" in 2009 according to your definition. If you don't realize that I'm done feeding you here. |
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Please find a flaw in this: I can send $1B with a fee of 40 cents or less.
That is not a use case for the broad population. For the broad population there is no use case, other than as a get rich speculation. Use cases? 1. Remittances -- very low fees compared to 10-15% of companies like western union 2. Self storage - Your accounts are not able to be "frozen" by 3rd parties 3. Portability -- You can travel to any country and immediately use your bitcoins without needing to transfer funds from one bank to another or pay additional currency exchange fees. If you tried to travel with a suitcase of cash you'd soon be broke/robbed 4. Not able to be used in Bail-ins: Example Cyprus stealing money from large account holders to bail-in their banks. And actually the G20 just agreed that bail-ins should be used before bail-outs by the IMF or the central banks....we are going to see a lot more bank failures and bail-ins in the near future 5. Known inflation/emission rate. : Take notice of argentina, or the QE in USA 6. the list goes on and on but if your too lazy to look them up then I'm going to stop here. |
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By the way, Facebook was founded in 2004, it didn't even have positive cash flow until 2009 (5 years later!). As of January 2014 they still had ONLY 1.2 billion active users (10 years later!)
Facebook was launched to the public Sept. 2006. Bitcoin also had a period before its Jan 2009 launch wherein it was tested by a smaller group. So thus Facebook is only 8 years old as a public service and has 1.2 billion users. Bitcoin is nearing 6 years old as a public service has about about 1000X less users. Sorry there is no comparison. "launched to public" in 2006? Bitcoin is just known to part of the public during the 2013 run up, does that make it a little over 1 year old? Or do we start with inception dates? Even if we use your numbers with facebook taking 8 years to get 1.2 billion users, for such an EASY technology to use....expect bitcoin to take much longer...but that is Okay, I'm patient "Sorry there is no comparison" -- Every part of your (and my) argument is a comparison ....are you just trying to troll? |
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EDIT: to elaborate further, the problem is that exclusive storage of FIAT on a data structure isn't possible
can you please explain why it wouldn't be possible? Because fiat is backed by gold, and gold can't be stored as a series of 0's & 1's as data. maybe? sorry but, wut? You can't store gold backed fiat electronically. Everyone is laughing at you because fiat is not backed by gold. The gold window was closed by Nixon back in 1971ish. It is just printed at will now, not backed by anything at all. This also applies to the other countries such as china, russia, Euro etc. They should educate you instead of jesting  |
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Gyft gives 3% back on all gift card purchases bought with bitcoin. If gas stations ever sell fuel for bitcoin that will avoid the extra $ per gallon that they charge you for using a credit card instead of cash. Same with vending machines. I know that not all states charge the consumer more for using CC (as it is illegal in some states), but in california many places charge you more if you pay with CC (such as gasoline and vending machines). Usually if it's illegal or just against their corporate practice to charge more for CC, they give "cash" discounts or they just flat out raise their prices across the board. Hopefully they will take bitcoin like cash, since they don't get hit with the CC fee. Edit: this also applies to gun stores and dentist offices. Always ask for cash discounts even if they don't advertise it |
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People, you need a reality check. Most of you here are holding to a few BTC expecting to become millionaires some day. You are in a collective mass delusion - about 95% of you here.
Satoshi Nakamoto stated himself that with BTC there will be no middle way - it will absord the whole world's economy which is estimated to be around $100 trillion including the black markets. If this does not happen BTC will be literally worthless - not even half a cent that it started at.
Bitcoin has been around since 2009 , so we are entering the 6th year of its existence. How many years would it take for bitcoin to absorb the total global economy? 50 years ? 100 years ? I doesn't matter because it was just another fad like myspace with a limited lifespan - that opened the social media to the mainstream and gave us twitter and facebook. Bitcoin's historical significance will be that it launched the concept of crypto currency to the mainstream. It will not be worth $10,000 or $100,000 dollars anytime soon (read: never).
So those of you who are still in delusional states holding the BTC you bought at $700 or $900 dollars, cut your loses and get away as fast as you can. November 2013 was the bubble which will never repeat again. All this talk about ETF is rubbish, because it is already calculated into the price.
The time is running out for BTC , and I am 90% certain it will be worthless before 2020. It has accomplished its task - crypto currency is mainstream.
Those smart enough know that the only real purpose of BTC right now is as a vehicle for transaction of fiat money, without being exposed to the scrutiny of the government checks and the global banking system, they understand that bitcoin is not a commodity, not a store of value, and it never was - to them it doesn't matter if the price of one BTC is $1 or $100,000. It doesn't change anything.
Some of you are so emotionally attached to your stack of bitcoins that you will react in a violent emotional outrage at my post. Those of you who are more stable are starting to realize what the score is, and no mate your 10 BTC or your 100 BTC stack will not make you a $ millionaire, might as well go to Vegas and try your hand at becoming a millionaire there. You have better chances.
Sam
Cryptocurrency is mainstream? LOL By the way, Facebook was founded in 2004, it didn't even have positive cash flow until 2009 (5 years later!). As of January 2014 they still had ONLY 1.2 billion active users (10 years later!) with a world population of about 8 billion.... "Easy" tech takes about 6 years for adoption. Bitcoin as of right now is "difficult" tech in many regards. Either way we haven't even reached 6 years yet. bitcoin's future is bright. |
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Holy shit that was well written. Thanks, that was well worth my time |
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We were supposed to be testing the 400's again, and now we are back to 350  Why is reality so stubborn? Because some heavy hitter has perfected a brilliant four punch combination. It has nothing to do with fundamentals at all. It's What four punch combination? and can you finish the sentence "its" heh |
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Edit: By the way smooth, is there no API for the monero wallet yet?
Yes there is. How do you think the exchanges send and receive coins? It is different from the bitcoin API, which makes for a bit of a challenge in integration, but those who want to put in the effort can do it. I was figuring that they were using custom wallet software and then just looking up their received balances and associating it to your account by payment ID (through their modified wallet). I don't see a config file or a way to connect to the wallet. Also no help or readme file in the windows x64 compiled distro, is there a place I can read up on it? |
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Even my cat Riddick makes 1 XMR per day in the game and he does nothing but chase birds around, eat, and sleep.
You are being modest. Riddick has in his 3 days in the game earned: - 3.4 XMR - 33,000 stone worth 6.6 XMR - Land Discount Coupon worth 10 XMR. A certain player has done nothing ever (except bought the initial gold) and last time I checked, his account had gained 185 XMR worth of stuff Is it possible to move the XMR out of the game? IE can you actually sell those stone for IRL XMR? |
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Just bought a bunch dirt cheap. If XMR/BTC drops again tomorrow I'll be buying some more.
By the way, why do bids/ask books keep moving all over the place even when trades aren't actually happening? It looks like people put orders then pull, reprice and put orders back up
Mostly trading bots But the bots just don't actually trade? I literally saw 300 XMR moved up and down on the asks side without anything even being bought. Same for moving bids without actual orders being filled. Edit: By the way smooth, is there no API for the monero wallet yet? |
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Just bought a bunch dirt cheap. If XMR/BTC drops again tomorrow I'll be buying some more.
By the way, why do bids/ask books keep moving all over the place even when trades aren't actually happening? It looks like people put orders then pull, reprice and put orders back up
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I'm looking to buy 700 XMR OTC with bitcoin. Any sellers?
Any reason why you don't buy it at poloniex? Would reduce the ask side a bit Actually I see a nice sell wall I can consume Edit: On my lord the dump competition is on! |
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I'm looking to buy 700 XMR OTC with bitcoin. Any sellers?
Any reason why you don't buy it at poloniex? Would reduce the ask side a bit Price slippage |
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I'm looking to buy 700 XMR OTC with bitcoin. Any sellers?
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That's not what it seems to be. If you purchase taxable goods with bitcoin, the purchaser will still have to pay sales tax (based on the USD value of the coins at that time), BUT the retailer won't have to pay sales tax on the bitcoin that they technically just "bought" with their goods. If you use bitcoin to purchase a non-sales tax item, such as c++ source/code in NY, then there is no tax for either party. But there are very limited number of goods and services that aren't taxed in NY. |
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Update 12/8/14
Hello Everyone,
Unfortunately I have to terminate my discounts on Gaw products due to their new ToS which forbids me from handing them out. It has been a fun ride and I hope everyone finds the HashStakers and HashBase system to be useful in this world of forever increasing altcoin difficulties and low payouts in Proof of Work systems. I'm new to Proof of Stake systems myself and will be personally checking out the HashStaker and Paycoin to see if there is good benefit.
Take Care,
--Lyth
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