Pretty fair to say that hate has been spewed on the two of them from different sources and are coming from people from the opposite side of the aisle. Literally the same people who are probably now yelling" SHE'S THE FIRST LADY SHOW SOME RESPECT" are the first people to make the comments like "MICHELLE OBAMA IS A MAN"

The reverse is true as well.

Continuing to flip like a pancake on policy and have the attention span of a goldfish -- America is great.

Well that's the thing for some people, even in 'legitimate hospitals' they'll still find ways to pull as much money as they can from them as possible and they can't afford that. Administrative fees could be something in the realm of $30-50, which is what the CDC is saying as of right now (can't find where I saw this, though I did)

I hope there are programs established for low income people to have these all waived, and I do expect for this to be the case.

We want everyone who really needs this vaccine to get it, so I hope they establish the right systems to ensure it gets to everyone who needs it.

Are you telling me that if I keep insisting that evidence is needed in court then evidence will be needed in court? Crazy. That's how our country works and that's a GOOD thing.

I'm not exactly sure what you're complaining about here now, doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. Is there something in particular you want to point to or something like that?

Ah, nice compilation of this entire thing.

Faithless electors were something that I've seen a ton of people talking about on Facebook and such. I guess the new thing is talking about how Trump can convince tons of faithless electors to vote for him or convince the SC to side with him. BOTH of these are totally undemocratic processes but I guess no one really cares about overturning the results of their election when the god emperor wants it for himself.

Conservatives complained about the courts for the longest time as well and now want them to involve themselves in deciding an election just to give it to their guy with no evidence? You'd understand if there was real evidence here, but there is NOT.

This shit is just fucking sad now.

Heh. Well, I'm pretty sure that the coronavirus vaccine is actually going to be free though. Though administrative charges *rolls eyes* are allowed See the CDC quote and link below:


Administrative fees...... Guess we'll get to see what that looks like in the coming weeks / months.

This is actually something that is tried in developing nations to incentivize people to take normal vaccines - such as malaria, polio, and so on and so forth. It's really more of a way to get people to stop working for the day/week and to travel to the hospital and get these treatments done.

Not something that is needed in Western worlds where hospitals are abundant and a vaccine is within reach for people. Makes me think for a moment, is the Coronavirus vaccine free for people who live in the US?

I don't think I would say that we have to fix Healthcare first, though I do think that before we are to 'cancel student debt' we have to fix the issues that got us here in the first place.

Not every school is crazy expensive like NYU or something like that. Though I wouldn't compare schools to the ones that are the most expensive. There's still no reason for college costs to have increased 3x or so the pace of inflation over time for no real reason.

It's just the creation of more and more bureaucracy and administrators in these schools rather then improving schooling. Most of the money has just went straight down the drain.

I love seeing new people in P&S, so I just want to thank you for coming over to our section and contributing. We love new contributions and it's great to have you here. Onto the subject of this thread:

My personal opinion is that cancelling student loan debt is a horrible idea without actually fixing the problem behind student loans and government backing of these loans. If you didn't know this, and many do not, the government guarantees / backs student loan debt to the people that you're accepting private loans from when you're going to college. This is one of the key reasons that student loans CAN NOT be discharged in bankruptcy. Another reason these can not be discharged in bankruptcy is that there is nothing that can be reposed from you / nothing has been put up as collateral.

In regards to your mortgage, if you stop paying for it the bank can take your house. If you stop paying your Auto loan / Lease then the bank can take your car. You can't really take away the knowledge that people learn while in school.

Further, the government backing of these loans is BECAUSE no one would ever loan up to 70k a year (for tuition and room/board) to an 18 year old fresh out of High School with no assets, income, etc. Government backing of these loans is the reason that everyone can get these crazy loans to go to school.

The government SHOULD step in and try to set some limits on school costs as ONLY reason that school costs have continued to rise in price at a much higher rate then inflation is because these schools know the government money is just a faucet of cash. Real reform has to happen to ensure that government money isn't wasted maintaining things that don't contribute to academics and are excess. As an example, some state schools (I think this is Univ of Florida or Univ of Miami) have multiple pools on their campus.

I love this post by the way and can't wait to see the other contributions here.

Not exactly sure where the evidence is that I am 'ignoring reality'.

At this point there is ZERO credible evidence to back the fact the voter fraud claims. Trump continues to repost things on his twitter that aren't true, and aren't holding up in a court of law. It doesn't really matter if you spread tons of BS on your twitter or random conspiracy theory blog sites, these claims do have to be proved in court where real evidence is needed.

True, though there was a bit of an issue surrounding WHEN he changed the predetermined parts of his plan. Seems like thesee were updated August 19th of 2020, see here:


Nothing to really look at in regards to him setting a price and hope it goes up to that. It'd be a bit of a different conversation if he had changed these predetermined parts of his plan right when he was told about the news. But regulators will most likely look into it and determine if there was any violation here.

Yeah that's going to invite some scrutiny from lawmakers, bureaucrats, and so on and so forth. I would say there is probably some sort of investigation ongoing regarding that sale.

I do understand it though -- the guy knows that the market is most likely overpricing what is actually happening and that it is a good time for him to get out. Subsequent investigations and testimony in front of Congress, will determine if the sale was predetermined to happen in advance at a set price or if this decision was made only after they knew good news was going to come out.

JetCash what exactly is your claim here? I assume something along the lines of "the vaccine does not work which is the reason for him getting out"

Little late on my response here, though I TOTALLY have to agree. Once he was starting to play kingmaker with his votes he begined to depart from any real conservative judicial philospohy. Not a fan of it, and I think Republicans can now look back on the John Roberts nomination and know that he wasn't what everyone thought he was going to be.

That's obviously the reason for people like ACB, Kavanuagh, and Gorseuch to be nominated. They haven't really departed from the conservative judicial philosophy that much. No one really wants to take that chance again and end up losing.

That's what you GET from a VACCINE. You get from the virus from taking a vaccine, or more technically you have a very high rate of developing immunity once you're injected with a vaccine.

Do people actually think that they're going to get injected with something that is going to kill them? That would literally make the solution worse then the problem, for most people, and then it wouldn't have been approved for emergency authorization.

I understand not wanting to be one of the first few batches of people to get this vaccine. It's not like any of us normal people could do that anyway, as they're prioritizing healthcare workers and such. But I do understand wanting to see if others develop any side effects, that's totally normal. But just disregarding the whole thing for no reason is really not going to help us get out of this.

Pretty sure this is the article that they are referencing, though the CoinDesk website is giving me some issues right now. They're also not the most reputrable outfit in news, but I guess it works for the claim itself.

https://www.coindesk.com/coinbase-ceo-trump-administration-may-rush-out-burdensome-crypto-wallet-rules

I mean yeah it's POSSIBLE that the Trump admin could push out some burdensome crypto rules on the way out of the administration. I don't personally see much of a point unless some people in the administration want to see some volatility in crypto. There's no real threat at the moment from crypto to the real world in terms of doing anything to the traditional financial markets.

But I think we can all agree that messing with Bitcoin is NOT a priority of the admin on the way out. There's a lot more influential regulations to finish up that could actually take time for the Biden admin to roll back and be useful for GOP politics.

Pretty sure it's not the part about opinion or about technology that is the issue here.

It's the part that Theymos thinks that the advertisement that Phore itself is using isn't advertising an investment but they are advertising the the technology behind what they're building and the usage of it. It's easily arguable that there is a DIRECT LINK between talking about the technology behind a coin and a product trying to drum up some hype for people to buy the coin.

Not sure if I'm a fan of advertising products like this, kinda sounds like a wormhole of people coming in and talking about the wild claims of their coin even if there is little to no chance of any of that coming to fruition. Not knocking the idea of Phore or whatever as I really know nothing about it, but still.

As an aside question, what would your thoughts be about advertising the more legitimate companies in DeFi such as Compound, Aave, and so on?

Yup, that commission found nothing. As there was nothing to actually find.

Even as of now, with explosive claims from Trump and his lawyers, there is nothing to back any of these claims. Not even small amounts of evidence that could maybe be building up to get to something that is real. Nothing, NADA, ZERO evidence at all to support these crazy claims that dead people are voting and all of this.

Where's the evidence? No where to be found right now.

In my opinion though, I don't think it should take THAT LONG to find out that voter fraud happened. Like, Donald Trump has the full force of his legal team, his DOJ, and the rest of Republican state governors

Plus like, if it was uncovered by prosecutors within the DOJ then wouldn't it take a lot to hide all of this from the American people? There are career members of the DOJ who are Republicans, not all of them are Dems who are beholden to Biden or anything along those lines.

Yeah the early admin of the Trump administration is something that we REALLY should start a thread about. Way too much disfunction which stopped anything from really happening.

While I'm not really a fan of gravedigging this thread, it does work in terms of continuing the conversation about this.


People that would lobby for Bitcoin would probably include the exchanges, mining organizations, investors who want to have like kind exchanges and some leniency when it comes to going from BTC --> Stablecoin --> Altcoin --> Bitcoin, maybe some companies like BlockFi / Holdnaut to allow for better tax issues relating to interest gained on BTC.

Just some thoughts.

Lobbying groups are around for everything. Probably would be best to try to start on the state level to fix up some of the worst regulatory issue (See: BitLicense in NY)

This is more of what I was going with.

Not being covered by anyone else is fine, I mean there's been a lot of stories broken by news companies that weren't being covered by others at first. Think about stories like the Boston Globe and the Catholic Church, or the NY Times (?) and the Pentagon Papers. These weren't covered by others initially.

But yes, in the case of the stories you're talking about there is NO credibility and literally just conspiracy theories that people are trying to sell as fact.

I mean.... it is the radio. Far right wing radio is still VERY VERY VERY popular. So that's the reason that they're giving people radio time for all of this shit that obviously isn't true and isn't being covered by anyone else. But yes, Spendulus is right, we are in very different universes.

No evidence being shown and nothing happening. States continue to certify results and states are shooting down Trump Campaign / RNC lawsuits have they have no merits. This is over.