Martin Armstrong Discussion

[CoinCube]

I dont understand why we have to go back to Christianity to survive.

Look at the east asians. They do fine without Christianity  (japan/korea) or religion (china).

I see no decline in productivity or creativity when i take a look at my atheist friends.

Criptix your idea that the east asians are without Christianity with the exception of the Japanese could not be further from reality. See the links below for more information.

China on course to become 'world's most Christian nation' within 15 years
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1373864.msg18308732#msg18308732

How Korea embraced Christianity
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1373864.msg18404033#msg18404033

Christian missionaries find Japan a tough nut to crack
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1373864.msg18680060#msg18680060

Regarding atheism it is true that a few individuals, in the short term, can survive atheism mentally intact; but it is questionable if this is a possibility for human societies over more than a few decades.

Is it true that Man is a primarily religious being?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1373864.msg19427375#msg19427375

CoinCube

That was a most interesting piece, but perhaps a tad pessimistic.  Maybe not though, ITALIANS over here do not seem happy nor joyous.  We will be seeing more Europeans before long, I'll check them out and report in, smile.
...

Yes well Charlton is from the UK which may increase his pessimism. I remain hopeful that the USA can branch away from declining Europe and perhaps even pull the UK with us but time will tell.

I am also optimistic regarding the long term prospects of east Asia except for Japan.

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[1714812489]

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[joebrook]

I dont understand why we have to go back to Christianity to survive.

Look at the east asians. They do fine without Christianity  (japan/korea) or religion (china).

I see no decline in productivity or creativity when i take a look at my atheist friends.


/edit

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

Until then most scientist believed it has solely to do with wealth and education of the parents.
After several studies that showed poor vietnamese children are actually much more successful in education then their peers (migrants and native germans) scientist believe that there must be more.

One explanation is Pierre Bourdieu's theory of mutual transformation of social, cultural and economical forms of capital as resources which parents can invest in their children.


Religion plays no relevant part in it.

Christianity doesnt offer the survival of the human body, it offers the survival of the human spirit which is eternal and lives forever just as its creator GOD.

[r0ach]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

[sidhujag]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

A bigger factor is that children from third world placed in first world generally excells when given similar opportunities because natives feel sense of entitlement while immigrants relish the chance to participate freely.

[OROBTC]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

A bigger factor is that children from third world placed in first world generally excells when given similar opportunities because natives feel sense of entitlement while immigrants relish the chance to participate freely.

I believe that the outperformance (by kids from poor countries like India, China, and perhaps Pakistan & Bangladesh) seen at US universities can be explained differently.

It is VERY hard to get into US universities on scholarship for poor kids from poor countries.  The ones who actually DO make it in are typically ONLY the very smartest and hard-working ones.

An example: I was studying statistics, had just started the second semester class at the Masters level.  The professor was from Bangladesh.  I had a health problem come up at the end (herniated disc at 48 years old), it was BAD, and I was unable to study for the Final Exam (50% of the grade).  I asked for a day or two longer to better study as I was on painkillers, it hurt (later I had to be operated on, ugh).  He said NO.

So, improperly prepared I took the Final, failed it, and got a "C" for the class (equivalent to an "F" in grad school).

At other earlier times I had heard stories about lots of whiny undergrads bugging their professors about papers or exams.  So, I have to believe that my professor was likely TIRED of hearing about student "problems" and just decided that I was a whiner too.  Naturally I was pissed-off...

Later on it occurred to me that this professor from BANGLADESH had probably busted his ass for many years to get trained up, learn English, then win a US scholarship to get a PhD, then land a hard-to-get position as a prestigious professor.  Perhaps clawed his way out of some shit-hole ghetto (perhaps not).

Almost surely that professor had to pay higher dues than I did.  He succeeded whereas I did not.  Of course, he would almost surely be a definite minority, "off the charts" guy from a dump like Bangladesh.

[Risk Mgmt]

I dont understand why we have to go back to Christianity to survive.

Look at the east asians. They do fine without Christianity  (japan/korea) or religion (china).

I see no decline in productivity or creativity when i take a look at my atheist friends.


/edit

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

Until then most scientist believed it has solely to do with wealth and education of the parents.
After several studies that showed poor vietnamese children are actually much more successful in education then their peers (migrants and native germans) scientist believe that there must be more.

One explanation is Pierre Bourdieu's theory of mutual transformation of social, cultural and economical forms of capital as resources which parents can invest in their children.


Religion plays no relevant part in it.

Christianity doesnt offer the survival of the human body, it offers the survival of the human spirit which is eternal and lives forever just as its creator GOD.

The problem is the Christian Text has been corrupted...big time.   Does anyone confirm to have original or even a have a "copy of a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy" of anything from the original writings of any of the writers of the Old or the New Testament.

Lot of revisions, edited , mistranslations.    Lot of errors - but this not mean that there isn't good in it....just not much credibility.

[Risk Mgmt]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

A bigger factor is that children from third world placed in first world generally excells when given similar opportunities because natives feel sense of entitlement while immigrants relish the chance to participate freely.

I believe that the outperformance (by kids from poor countries like India, China, and perhaps Pakistan & Bangladesh) seen at US universities can be explained differently.

It is VERY hard to get into US universities on scholarship for poor kids from poor countries.  The ones who actually DO make it in are typically ONLY the very smartest and hard-working ones.

An example: I was studying statistics, had just started the second semester class at the Masters level.  The professor was from Bangladesh.  I had a health problem come up at the end (herniated disc at 48 years old), it was BAD, and I was unable to study for the Final Exam (50% of the grade).  I asked for a day or two longer to better study as I was on painkillers, it hurt (later I had to be operated on, ugh).  He said NO.

So, improperly prepared I took the Final, failed it, and got a "C" for the class (equivalent to an "F" in grad school).

At other earlier times I had heard stories about lots of whiny undergrads bugging their professors about papers or exams.  So, I have to believe that my professor was likely TIRED of hearing about student "problems" and just decided that I was a whiner too.  Naturally I was pissed-off...

Later on it occurred to me that this professor from BANGLADESH had probably busted his ass for many years to get trained up, learn English, then win a US scholarship to get a PhD, then land a hard-to-get position as a prestigious professor.  Perhaps clawed his way out of some shit-hole ghetto (perhaps not).

Almost surely that professor had to pay higher dues than I did.  He succeeded whereas I did not.  Of course, he would almost surely be a definite minority, "off the charts" guy from a dump like Bangladesh.

FAMILY STRUCUTRE --  the newbies until modernized...depend on family ...once modernized depend on GOVT/ BANKS RETIRMENTS.
Before Modernization indoctrination - they live in large 3 generational families in one home.  As the newbie kids get accustomed to localization they adapt and shun their own families becoming modern...but enslaved by banking system.

The only time this modernization stays in check -- is when family instills good values maybe or are practicing their faith well.
Example...the Muslim Community in North America...those that can afford send kids to Private State Approved Relgious school - which focus on MORAL/ ETHICS and ofcourse MATH/ ENGLISH/ SCIENCE etc etc.

They take pride in how their food / even banking (USUARY Laws).   

[Risk Mgmt]

Anyone here - can share latest Market Projections by MA.

Are we expecting some serious corrections in the Market from DOW / NASDAQ / CRYPTs/ GOLD/ OIL etc. over next few months.
Or is everything is to continue as in current trend

[Risk Mgmt]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

A bigger factor is that children from third world placed in first world generally excells when given similar opportunities because natives feel sense of entitlement while immigrants relish the chance to participate freely.

I believe that the outperformance (by kids from poor countries like India, China, and perhaps Pakistan & Bangladesh) seen at US universities can be explained differently.

It is VERY hard to get into US universities on scholarship for poor kids from poor countries.  The ones who actually DO make it in are typically ONLY the very smartest and hard-working ones.

An example: I was studying statistics, had just started the second semester class at the Masters level.  The professor was from Bangladesh.  I had a health problem come up at the end (herniated disc at 48 years old), it was BAD, and I was unable to study for the Final Exam (50% of the grade).  I asked for a day or two longer to better study as I was on painkillers, it hurt (later I had to be operated on, ugh).  He said NO.

So, improperly prepared I took the Final, failed it, and got a "C" for the class (equivalent to an "F" in grad school).

At other earlier times I had heard stories about lots of whiny undergrads bugging their professors about papers or exams.  So, I have to believe that my professor was likely TIRED of hearing about student "problems" and just decided that I was a whiner too.  Naturally I was pissed-off...

Later on it occurred to me that this professor from BANGLADESH had probably busted his ass for many years to get trained up, learn English, then win a US scholarship to get a PhD, then land a hard-to-get position as a prestigious professor.  Perhaps clawed his way out of some shit-hole ghetto (perhaps not).

Almost surely that professor had to pay higher dues than I did.  He succeeded whereas I did not.  Of course, he would almost surely be a definite minority, "off the charts" guy from a dump like Bangladesh.

FAMILY STRUCUTRE --  the newbies until modernized...depend on family ...once modernized depend on GOVT/ BANKS RETIRMENTS.
Before Modernization indoctrination - they live in large 3 generational families in one home.  As the newbie kids get accustomed to localization they adapt and shun their own families becoming modern...but enslaved by banking system.

The only time this modernization stays in check -- is when family instills good values maybe or are practicing their faith well.
Example...the Muslim Community in North America...those that can afford send kids to Private State Approved Relgious school - which focus on MORAL/ ETHICS and ofcourse MATH/ ENGLISH/ SCIENCE etc etc.

They take pride in how their food / even banking (USUARY Laws).   

I would add the good practicing Judaist and Christian families do the same.  "THE GOOD PRACTICING" applicable to all three Abrahamic faiths

[CoinCube]

The problem is the Christian Text has been corrupted...big time.   Does anyone confirm to have original or even a have a "copy of a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy" of anything from the original writings of any of the writers of the Old or the New Testament.

Lot of revisions, edited , mistranslations.    Lot of errors - but this not mean that there isn't good in it....just not much credibility.

You argument does not match the known facts Risk Mgmt. There is plenty of evidence that these religious texts were copied accurately and faithfully over thousands of years.

The Greatest Archaeological Find of the 20th Century
https://lifehopeandtruth.com/bible/is-the-bible-true/proof-2-dead-sea-scrolls/

The doctrine of inerrancy, as commonly understood, states: “Inerrancy is the view that when all the facts become known, they will demonstrate that the Bible in its original autographs and correctly interpreted is entirely true and never false in all it affirms, whether that relates to doctrines or ethics or to the social, physical, or life sciences.” This statement was articulated in the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy 1974.

The Dead Sea Scrolls are universally proclaimed as the greatest archaeological find of the 20th century. The first scrolls were discovered quite by accident by a young Bedouin shepherd in the Qumran area near the Dead Sea in 1947. When tossing a rock into an open cave in the cliffs just above the Dead Sea, he heard the sound of a breaking pot.

Upon investigation, he and his fellow Bedouins discovered several clay jars that contained rolled-up scrolls. They took four of these scrolls to Bethlehem for testing. An antiquities dealer by the name of Kando confirmed their authenticity and purchased the original four scrolls for $150. He then sold them to Archbishop Samuel, head of the Syrian Orthodox Monastery of St. Mark in Jerusalem.

The Bedouins did not fully realize the value of their discovery and subsequently sold three additional scrolls to another antiquities dealer for an equivalent amount. This all took place in 1947.

Such a historic find could not be kept quiet for very long. When in 1948 Hebrew University Professor Eliezer Lipa Sukenik heard through an Armenian antiquities dealer of the scrolls’ discovery, he promptly looked into it.

He met secretly with the antiquities dealer in the British military zone near the Jerusalem border. The dealer provided a fragment for the professor to examine. Professor Sukenik realized that he was viewing an authentic ancient writing.

He wrote in his diary: “My hands shook as I started to unwrap one of them. I read a few sentences. It was written in beautiful biblical Hebrew. The language was like that of the Psalms, but the text was unknown to me. I looked and looked, and I suddenly had the feeling that I was privileged by destiny to gaze upon a Hebrew Scroll which had not been read for more than 2,000 years.”
...
The treasure trove, now known as the Dead Sea Scrolls, includes a small number of near-complete scrolls and tens of thousands of fragments, representing more than 900 texts in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek.

The scrolls consist of two general types: the biblical text (including partial or complete copies of all the books of the Hebrew Scriptures with the exception of the book of Esther) and nonbiblical texts (including letters, hymns, prayers, calendrical texts and legal documents).
...
What is so special about these scrolls, and how do they help us prove the Bible is true? Until the discovery of the scrolls, the oldest manuscripts of the Hebrew Scriptures dated from the 10th century, about 2,500 years after the time of Moses. How can we be assured of the integrity of a document after so much time?

Considering the carefulness of the copyists is one way to be assured of the accuracy of the preservation
...
The Dead Sea Scrolls are generally dated from around 200 B.C. to A.D. 68. This is more than 1,000 years older than any manuscripts of the Hebrew Old Testament that we had before their discovery. Because of their age and close similarity with the Masoretic Text, we now have an objective basis for determining that the biblical text used in our modern copies of the Old Testament is accurate.

Norman Geisler is the author of several books on the subject of inerrancy: Inerrancy, 1978; General Introduction to the Bible, 1986; and From God to Us, 2012. Dr. Geisler says the Dead Sea Scrolls provide the best external evidence showing the validity of the Masoretic Text, proving that this text type was in fact accurately preserved over a period of about 1,000 years from the first century to the 900s A.D.

He concludes that we can be confident that the texts used to copy the Dead Sea Scrolls were of the same tradition or family as used in the Masoretic Text. He provides evidence from comparative studies of the Isaiah scroll revealing that a word-for-word identity exists in 95 percent of the text. That is a very high rate of similarity for documents that were copied 1,000 years apart.

Other scholars have commented on the similarities between the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Masoretic Text. Hebrew scholar Millar Burrows writes, “It is a matter of wonder that through something like one thousand years the text underwent so little alteration. As I said in my first article on the scroll, ‘Herein lies its chief importance, supporting the fidelity of the Masoretic tradition’” (The Dead Sea Scrolls, 1955).

The Dead Sea Scrolls provide an objective confirmation of the authenticity of the Masoretic Text, which is the basis for our modern copies of the Old Testament. Although we live in 2015, we can go back in time 2,000 years and read from the scroll of Isaiah discovered by a shepherd boy in a cave above the Dead Sea.

[OROBTC]

Anyone here - can share latest Market Projections by MA.

Are we expecting some serious corrections in the Market from DOW / NASDAQ / CRYPTs/ GOLD/ OIL etc. over next few months.
Or is everything is to continue as in current trend

Risk Mgmt

Armstrong is not very precise (IMO) when it comes to short-term predictions.  His specialty is looking at the cyclical nature of economies through long periods of time.

He does not like EUROPE or Socialism.

He thinks gold will go down (perhaps to $800) before jumping much, much higher later (2020 or so?).

He is pessimistic on The West as it lurches towards Socialism.

I read Armstrong for his IDEAS, not his predictions.  He has a fantastic record of looking at economic history, and has made many predictions into the future (loner-term, say to 2030 even).


Our resident expert "iamnotback" has not been around for a long time, he greatly respects Armstrong and his ideas on the cyclical nature of things and how "any single thing" affects everything.

Here is a link to Armstrong's daily blog, he typically puts up about two pieces per day:

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/blog/


*   *   *


FANTASTIC piece you quoted, CC, re the Dead Sea Scrolls, thanks for posting it.

[Risk Mgmt]

Anyone here - can share latest Market Projections by MA.

Are we expecting some serious corrections in the Market from DOW / NASDAQ / CRYPTs/ GOLD/ OIL etc. over next few months.
Or is everything is to continue as in current trend

Risk Mgmt

Armstrong is not very precise (IMO) when it comes to short-term predictions.  His specialty is looking at the cyclical nature of economies through long periods of time.

He does not like EUROPE or Socialism.

He thinks gold will go down (perhaps to $800) before jumping much, much higher later (2020 or so?).

He is pessimistic on The West as it lurches towards Socialism.

I read Armstrong for his IDEAS, not his predictions.  He has a fantastic record of looking at economic history, and has made many predictions into the future (loner-term, say to 2030 even).


Our resident expert "iamnotback" has not been around for a long time, he greatly respects Armstrong and his ideas on the cyclical nature of things and how "any single thing" affects everything.

Here is a link to Armstrong's daily blog, he typically puts up about two pieces per day:

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/blog/


*   *   *


FANTASTIC piece you quoted, CC, re the Dead Sea Scrolls, thanks for posting it.

Thank you OROBTC.

I do agree - he is great on his big picture ideas.   He continues to say this is most "Hated Bull Market"  so I figured he must be publishing items on his private blog to which I don't have access to.    $15/mth not too bad but I don't like being tied up like that...would prefer to pay upfront full yearly cost -- which they cannot handle so I'm told.

Are there others like Armstrong that you follow?

[Risk Mgmt]

The problem is the Christian Text has been corrupted...big time.   Does anyone confirm to have original or even a have a "copy of a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy" of anything from the original writings of any of the writers of the Old or the New Testament.

Lot of revisions, edited , mistranslations.    Lot of errors - but this not mean that there isn't good in it....just not much credibility.

You argument does not match the known facts Risk Mgmt. There is plenty of evidence that these religious texts were copied accurately and faithfully over thousands of years.

The Greatest Archaeological Find of the 20th Century
https://lifehopeandtruth.com/bible/is-the-bible-true/proof-2-dead-sea-scrolls/

The doctrine of inerrancy, as commonly understood, states: “Inerrancy is the view that when all the facts become known, they will demonstrate that the Bible in its original autographs and correctly interpreted is entirely true and never false in all it affirms, whether that relates to doctrines or ethics or to the social, physical, or life sciences.” This statement was articulated in the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy 1974.

The Dead Sea Scrolls are universally proclaimed as the greatest archaeological find of the 20th century. The first scrolls were discovered quite by accident by a young Bedouin shepherd in the Qumran area near the Dead Sea in 1947. When tossing a rock into an open cave in the cliffs just above the Dead Sea, he heard the sound of a breaking pot.

Upon investigation, he and his fellow Bedouins discovered several clay jars that contained rolled-up scrolls. They took four of these scrolls to Bethlehem for testing. An antiquities dealer by the name of Kando confirmed their authenticity and purchased the original four scrolls for $150. He then sold them to Archbishop Samuel, head of the Syrian Orthodox Monastery of St. Mark in Jerusalem.

The Bedouins did not fully realize the value of their discovery and subsequently sold three additional scrolls to another antiquities dealer for an equivalent amount. This all took place in 1947.

Such a historic find could not be kept quiet for very long. When in 1948 Hebrew University Professor Eliezer Lipa Sukenik heard through an Armenian antiquities dealer of the scrolls’ discovery, he promptly looked into it.

He met secretly with the antiquities dealer in the British military zone near the Jerusalem border. The dealer provided a fragment for the professor to examine. Professor Sukenik realized that he was viewing an authentic ancient writing.

He wrote in his diary: “My hands shook as I started to unwrap one of them. I read a few sentences. It was written in beautiful biblical Hebrew. The language was like that of the Psalms, but the text was unknown to me. I looked and looked, and I suddenly had the feeling that I was privileged by destiny to gaze upon a Hebrew Scroll which had not been read for more than 2,000 years.”
...
The treasure trove, now known as the Dead Sea Scrolls, includes a small number of near-complete scrolls and tens of thousands of fragments, representing more than 900 texts in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek.

The scrolls consist of two general types: the biblical text (including partial or complete copies of all the books of the Hebrew Scriptures with the exception of the book of Esther) and nonbiblical texts (including letters, hymns, prayers, calendrical texts and legal documents).
...
What is so special about these scrolls, and how do they help us prove the Bible is true? Until the discovery of the scrolls, the oldest manuscripts of the Hebrew Scriptures dated from the 10th century, about 2,500 years after the time of Moses. How can we be assured of the integrity of a document after so much time?

Considering the carefulness of the copyists is one way to be assured of the accuracy of the preservation
...
The Dead Sea Scrolls are generally dated from around 200 B.C. to A.D. 68. This is more than 1,000 years older than any manuscripts of the Hebrew Old Testament that we had before their discovery. Because of their age and close similarity with the Masoretic Text, we now have an objective basis for determining that the biblical text used in our modern copies of the Old Testament is accurate.

Norman Geisler is the author of several books on the subject of inerrancy: Inerrancy, 1978; General Introduction to the Bible, 1986; and From God to Us, 2012. Dr. Geisler says the Dead Sea Scrolls provide the best external evidence showing the validity of the Masoretic Text, proving that this text type was in fact accurately preserved over a period of about 1,000 years from the first century to the 900s A.D.

He concludes that we can be confident that the texts used to copy the Dead Sea Scrolls were of the same tradition or family as used in the Masoretic Text. He provides evidence from comparative studies of the Isaiah scroll revealing that a word-for-word identity exists in 95 percent of the text. That is a very high rate of similarity for documents that were copied 1,000 years apart.

Other scholars have commented on the similarities between the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Masoretic Text. Hebrew scholar Millar Burrows writes, “It is a matter of wonder that through something like one thousand years the text underwent so little alteration. As I said in my first article on the scroll, ‘Herein lies its chief importance, supporting the fidelity of the Masoretic tradition’” (The Dead Sea Scrolls, 1955).

The Dead Sea Scrolls provide an objective confirmation of the authenticity of the Masoretic Text, which is the basis for our modern copies of the Old Testament. Although we live in 2015, we can go back in time 2,000 years and read from the scroll of Isaiah discovered by a shepherd boy in a cave above the Dead Sea.

Thank you CoinCube -

Appreciate the feedback.   Here are few facts / Questions to ponder

1) How many different versions of the Bible are circulating?
2) What does the word Version suggest
3) The Bible is not just a Book. It is a selection and compilation of many books
4) Its been re-written edited by MAN / WOMAN
5) copies of People's translations / editions -- meanings concepts edited

If you still feel my opinion doesn't meet the facts....I suggest you advise me which Bible you prefer out of the 100 different versions.
I will locate that specific bible - and present you more facts.

Having said all this...by no means do I suggest that Christianity is a false relgion.  What I do suggest is that its core teachings / original founding principals from the original bible - are no more...and the original founding principals have been broken. 

[CoinCube]

Thank you CoinCube -

Appreciate the feedback.   Here are few facts / Questions to ponder

1) How many different versions of the Bible are circulating?
2) What does the word Version suggest
3) The Bible is not just a Book. It is a selection and compilation of many books
4) Its been re-written edited by MAN / WOMAN
5) copies of People's translations / editions -- meanings concepts edited

If you still feel my opinion doesn't meet the facts....I suggest you advise me which Bible you prefer out of the 100 different versions.
I will locate that specific bible - and present you more facts.

Having said all this...by no means do I suggest that Christianity is a false relgion.  What I do suggest is that its core teachings / original founding principals from the original bible - are no more...and the original founding principals have been broken. 

You suggest that these holy texts are fluid changing dramatically from generation to generation on the whims of various commentators. The evidence points to the exact opposite conclusion an amazing and shocking fidelity over thousands of years.

You ask which biblical text I prefer. I have not settled this question definitively yet but if forced to make a choice today it would be the following:

https://www.amazon.com/Hebrew-English-Tanakh-Jewish-Publication-Society/dp/0827606974

As I showed above there is solid evidence that this text has been transcribed faithfully with 95% accuracy for the last 2000 years. 95% is not 100% so I acknowledge that minor errors may have been introduced over untold generations of manual transcription. However given a proven 95% fidelity over 2000 years I am confident that the core message remains intact.

[sidhujag]

Btw. In the last few years german scientist researched the topic of why different ethnicities integrate better or worst in the german society.

It's called...The Bell Curve...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

And:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainstream_Science_on_Intelligence

There's a saying/principle that two people with more than a 20 IQ difference are unable to communicate on any meaningful level.  It applies to things like marriage, but in building a civilization as well.  If two different groups lived apart and mud huts were the only thing one group could build while the other could build space stations, they aren't going to integrate.  In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

A bigger factor is that children from third world placed in first world generally excells when given similar opportunities because natives feel sense of entitlement while immigrants relish the chance to participate freely.

I believe that the outperformance (by kids from poor countries like India, China, and perhaps Pakistan & Bangladesh) seen at US universities can be explained differently.

It is VERY hard to get into US universities on scholarship for poor kids from poor countries.  The ones who actually DO make it in are typically ONLY the very smartest and hard-working ones.

An example: I was studying statistics, had just started the second semester class at the Masters level.  The professor was from Bangladesh.  I had a health problem come up at the end (herniated disc at 48 years old), it was BAD, and I was unable to study for the Final Exam (50% of the grade).  I asked for a day or two longer to better study as I was on painkillers, it hurt (later I had to be operated on, ugh).  He said NO.

So, improperly prepared I took the Final, failed it, and got a "C" for the class (equivalent to an "F" in grad school).

At other earlier times I had heard stories about lots of whiny undergrads bugging their professors about papers or exams.  So, I have to believe that my professor was likely TIRED of hearing about student "problems" and just decided that I was a whiner too.  Naturally I was pissed-off...

Later on it occurred to me that this professor from BANGLADESH had probably busted his ass for many years to get trained up, learn English, then win a US scholarship to get a PhD, then land a hard-to-get position as a prestigious professor.  Perhaps clawed his way out of some shit-hole ghetto (perhaps not).

Almost surely that professor had to pay higher dues than I did.  He succeeded whereas I did not.  Of course, he would almost surely be a definite minority, "off the charts" guy from a dump like Bangladesh.

Exactly what i was saying.. in general the power of the thought of leaving the third world itself is enough to motivate people to do well especially versus peers who are not motivated the same. Yes even brighter third world students will be even better.. theres a reason nasa ibm and microsoft do most of their software in India for example.

[Risk Mgmt]

Thank you CoinCube -

Appreciate the feedback.   Here are few facts / Questions to ponder

1) How many different versions of the Bible are circulating?
2) What does the word Version suggest
3) The Bible is not just a Book. It is a selection and compilation of many books
4) Its been re-written edited by MAN / WOMAN
5) copies of People's translations / editions -- meanings concepts edited

If you still feel my opinion doesn't meet the facts....I suggest you advise me which Bible you prefer out of the 100 different versions.
I will locate that specific bible - and present you more facts.

Having said all this...by no means do I suggest that Christianity is a false relgion.  What I do suggest is that its core teachings / original founding principals from the original bible - are no more...and the original founding principals have been broken. 

You suggest that these holy texts are fluid changing dramatically from generation to generation on the whims of various commentators. The evidence points to the exact opposite conclusion an amazing and shocking fidelity over thousands of years.

You ask which biblical text I prefer. I have not settled this question definitively yet but if forced to make a choice today it would be the following:

https://www.amazon.com/Hebrew-English-Tanakh-Jewish-Publication-Society/dp/0827606974

As I showed above there is solid evidence that this text has been transcribed faithfully with 95% accuracy for the last 2000 years. 95% is not 100% so I acknowledge that minor errors may have been introduced over untold generations of manual transcription. However given a proven 95% fidelity over 2000 years I am confident that the core message remains intact.

Hi CoinCube

Thank you for the information - I'd like to make clear, that I think highly of all three Abraham
faiths - so please do not think I'm trying to be disrespectful.

Having said that - I'm of the mindset that one still needs to keep critical thought process in place to decipher any corruption.   The Tanak JPS version - I take it to exclude the NT - meaning you don't follow the NT?

Anyways - see below

"The New Jewish Publication Society of America Tanakh, first published in complete form in 1985, is a modern Jewish translation of the Masoretic Text of the Hebrew Bible into English. It is based on revised editions of earlier publications of subdivisions of the Tanakh such as the Torah and Five Megillot which were originally published from 1969–1982. It is unrelated to the original JPS Tanakh translation, which was based on the Revised Version and American Standard Version but emended to more strictly follow the Masoretic text, beyond both translations being published by the Jewish Publication Society of America.

This translation emerged from the collaborative efforts of an interdenominational team of Jewish scholars and rabbis working together over a thirty-year period. These translators based their translation on the Masoretic Hebrew text, and consistently strove for a faithful, idiomatic rendering of the original scriptural languages."

So if I understand correctly - scholars based the JPS off other REVISEd or re revised material.
Have you ever played the Chinese whispers aka TELEPHONE game?  Should you open your text JPS tanakh - within the first few pages before the start - (which most skip) is publishers/ editors disclaimers clearly stating the work being to the best ABILITY of the team.   Even with Tanakh there are many editions/ versions .


Read the preface - it confirms my position that original content has been corrupted.
Just another new TEXT With NEW Translation With aid OF PREVIOUS RE REVISED Texts backed by Constant CONSULTATION / REINTERPRETATIONs of OF Jewish authorities.    We're not even talking about KJVersion.

if the Original was present - we wouldn't need 1000 diffferent versions / re-revised materials / editions etc etc

[CoinCube]

if the Original was present - we wouldn't need 1000 diffferent versions / re-revised materials / editions etc etc

Risk Mgmt most of these "versions" you cite are simply translations into different languages. Slightly different wordings are the result of differences in opinion between various scholars that occur when making such a translation.

There are currently almost 7000 living languages currently spoken on the planet. Thus simply communicating with everyone in their native tongue necessitates nearly 7000 "versions" of whatever you are trying to convey.

If you want the original free of translator bias you simply learn and then work from the original material the translator used. In the case of the Old-Testament this means working in Hebrew from the Masoretic text.

The Masoretic Text is widely used as the basis for translations of the Old Testament in Protestant Bibles, and in recent years (since 1943), for some versions of Catholic Bibles. In modern times the Dead Sea Scrolls have shown the Masoretic Text to be nearly identical to some texts of the Tanakh dating from 200 BCE.[4] In a recent finding, the Masoretic Text is discovered to be completely identical with text recovered from an ancient scroll. The approximately 1,700-year-old En-Gedi Scroll was found in 1970 but had not had its content reconstructed until 2016. Researchers were able to recover 35 complete and partial lines of text from the Book of Leviticus and the text deciphered is completely identical with the consonantal framework of the Masoretic Text.[5] The En-Gedi scroll is the first time a biblical scroll has been discovered in an ancient synagogue's holy ark, where it would have been stored for prayers, and not in desert caves like the Dead Sea Scrolls.[6] The Masoretic Text was primarily copied, edited and distributed by a group of Jews known as the Masoretes between the 7th and 10th centuries CE.

The copy of the Old-Testament I linked above has a copy of the Masoretic Text in Hebrew side by side with a translation in English that was vetted by multiple biblical scholars who were experts in both Hebrew and English. Don't trust the translators then read the Hebrew which is side by side with the English. Don't trust the Hebrew Masoretic text to have been accurately transcribed? Simply manually compare your copy with the fragments of the Dead Sea Scrolls which are available online and predate the Masoretic text by up to a thousand years.

One can debate the truth of the information conveyed by the Old-Testament but the fact that it has been accurately transcribed at least for the last 2000 years is fully supported by the historical and archeological record.

[sloanf]

Anyone here - can share latest Market Projections by MA.

Are we expecting some serious corrections in the Market from DOW / NASDAQ / CRYPTs/ GOLD/ OIL etc. over next few months.
Or is everything is to continue as in current trend

with cons and charlatans like Martin Armstrong you always get something like "asset X will go up or down or stay flat". Yet somehow even with such predictions he always ends up being wrong. The dollar is at the same level it was 2.5 years ago and keeps falling. Gold never went below 1000 whereas he has been preaching it at 600-800 since 2013. Bonds are still high despite his bs "big bang" call. Real estate keeps rising, etc, etc...

As for the Dow, just before he couldn't sell his bs conference, he come out and said the dow will decline till the end of 2017. A week later, after he failed miserably with that call, he flip-flopped and returned to his phase transition crap while covering his ass with a possibility of having a sling-shot move. Before that he called for a correction in February and May - failed as usual.

Again, you will never stay solvent much less make any money buying anything from this bs and crappy charlatan. Still in doubt - ask a broke idiot @iamnotback.

[tabnloz]

In Australia they have Aboriginals which are literally modern day cavemen.  Their govt has bent over backwards to try and integrate them into society, but they have the lowest IQ on the planet (something like 60-70), so it always fails miserably.

This is more complete shit. Please stick to an area where you have some idea.

1. Aboriginals are not modern day cavemen. I live in an area with a large Aboriginal population and can confirm your ignorance.

2. Please provide evidence of the government 'bending over backwards' and I counter with almost 200 years where Aboriginals were considered as 'flora and fauna', kept as slaves, murdered, jailed. No education, not allowed to vote, children taken from parents, culture destroyed.

3. I don't know the data on IQ, but I can vouch that none of my Aboriginal mates are 'slow'.

As an aside, Aboriginal culture is very interesting, for example the Dreamtime and other mythology; historically important and surprisingly accurate in many instances.

[Risk Mgmt]

if the Original was present - we wouldn't need 1000 diffferent versions / re-revised materials / editions etc etc

Risk Mgmt most of these "versions" you cite are simply translations into different languages. Slightly different wordings are the result of differences in opinion between various scholars that occur when making such a translation.

There are currently almost 7000 living languages currently spoken on the planet. Thus simply communicating with everyone in their native tongue necessitates nearly 7000 "versions" of whatever you are trying to convey.

If you want the original free of translator bias you simply learn and then work from the original material the translator used. In the case of the Old-Testament this means working in Hebrew from the Masoretic text.

The Masoretic Text is widely used as the basis for translations of the Old Testament in Protestant Bibles, and in recent years (since 1943), for some versions of Catholic Bibles. In modern times the Dead Sea Scrolls have shown the Masoretic Text to be nearly identical to some texts of the Tanakh dating from 200 BCE.[4] In a recent finding, the Masoretic Text is discovered to be completely identical with text recovered from an ancient scroll. The approximately 1,700-year-old En-Gedi Scroll was found in 1970 but had not had its content reconstructed until 2016. Researchers were able to recover 35 complete and partial lines of text from the Book of Leviticus and the text deciphered is completely identical with the consonantal framework of the Masoretic Text.[5] The En-Gedi scroll is the first time a biblical scroll has been discovered in an ancient synagogue's holy ark, where it would have been stored for prayers, and not in desert caves like the Dead Sea Scrolls.[6] The Masoretic Text was primarily copied, edited and distributed by a group of Jews known as the Masoretes between the 7th and 10th centuries CE.

The copy of the Old-Testament I linked above has a copy of the Masoretic Text in Hebrew side by side with a translation in English that was vetted by multiple biblical scholars who were experts in both Hebrew and English. Don't trust the translators then read the Hebrew which is side by side with the English. Don't trust the Hebrew Masoretic text to have been accurately transcribed? Simply manually compare your copy with the fragments of the Dead Sea Scrolls which are available online and predate the Masoretic text by up to a thousand years.

One can debate the truth of the information conveyed by the Old-Testament but the fact that it has been accurately transcribed at least for the last 2000 years is fully supported by the historical and archeological record.

Good Morning Coin Cube,

Trust your day is off to great start.  Not only are there different versions, revised editions in other languages but many multiple versions within English Language also - thus when I ask someone which version is best in English Language - it takes a while....because no two are like obviously.   Most easy way to establish that the TORAH has been edited is via conflicting accounts of many
matters.   But I don't plan to go in detail -- too much work.

Thus far your position is firm on TORAH - thus I take you're of Judaist faith - I maybe wrong.  Do you also hold the view that King James Bible or other "CHRISTIAN BIBLE's" remain the same?