Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM.....

[Juggy777]

Whoever still had 1% doubts about the new champion of this season, will now have no more doubts, I think. He was really great today, Max. Started from 12th place and after a quarter of the race he was already in first place. It also helps that they have a super car, we saw the weekend that Red Bull was by far the fastest car, but then you have to wonder why Perez couldn't win this race? After all, he started in 2nd place (but had a terrible start). Then Verstappen is still 7 places behind the start. Is Verstappen so much better or Perez much worse?

What Max Verstappen did today was magnificently, leaving just three dated for the first in 20 laps is too few.
I don't remember seeing something like this happen "that often".
RedBull has a fantastic car, we cannot deny that this helped Max a lot to achieve this result, but this would not have been possible without the talent of Verstappen, a perfect combination.

There is no doubt that Verstappen will be champion in 2022.

@Zackgeno96 this was one of the most epic races I have seen in a while, and it made me realise just why I love F1 so much, and though we won’t see many repeats of this happening I feel that Max is racing on another level and currently no one can catch up to him.

Championship was already over before summer break. Max started from P14 today, but winning today was so easy for him that's not even interesting. With Red Bull pace, P3 for Sainz is best what he was able to achieve. Ferrari didn't failed in strategy today, but things can't go well for them - Leclerc got penalty for speeding in pit lane on last pit stop and lost P5 that he got in last lap after overtaking Alonso. Poor Bottas, his race ended after accident with GOATifi and he had no chance to avoid it.
And Alonso radio message about Hamilton was epic - ''This guy only knows to drive starting first'' .

@LTU_btc this race once again proves the era of Hamilton is all but over, and it’ll be interesting will he try to his salvage pride by racing next season or will he be humble enough to quit F1 as he already has built a nice legacy.

[tokeweed]

Ferrari had no chances today, and RBR with the new regulation imposed by FIA had no chances today.

Let's see if next GP they can fight or if FIA killed this championship.

But remember who wanted the new regulations tho and who was saying that changing regulations at the middle of the season is not good and sets something up that can be done again during the next seasons.

It was Toto Wolff who wanted the new regulations, with him thinking it would prolly be advantageous with Mercedes.  And who was against it?  Christian Horner, the team principal of Red Bull.  But ironically it looks like they might be faster because of it...  Lol.

Anyway, it looks like the season is over.  It's Verstappen's season to lose and it also looks like we're witnessing greatness being born in F1. 

[Pulsar77]

I'm happy to give this news to you. The Belgian GP is going to be a part of 2023 calendar as well.

There were rumours about the possibility of its being removed. This track is a special one for most of F1 lovers. The race yesterday was really nice to watch also even though Verstappen dominated it completely.

After hearing about this news I started to think about another possibility. Maybe they changed their mind to changing some things on this track before the next race here. We already know about a change about a specific place on the track for example. They changed the tarmac run-off area with gravel for example. Drivers were sometimes trying to use the place to their advantage before. Some more changes might be yet to come.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.spa-to-form-part-of-2023-f1-calendar-following-agreement-to-extend.7FeUki5B2tpV6LC1NKvgI1.html

[swogerino]

Ferrari had no chances today, and RBR with the new regulation imposed by FIA had no chances today.

Let's see if next GP they can fight or if FIA killed this championship.

But remember who wanted the new regulations tho and who was saying that changing regulations at the middle of the season is not good and sets something up that can be done again during the next seasons.

It was Toto Wolff who wanted the new regulations, with him thinking it would prolly be advantageous with Mercedes.  And who was against it?  Christian Horner, the team principal of Red Bull.  But ironically it looks like they might be faster because of it...  Lol.

Anyway, it looks like the season is over.  It's Verstappen's season to lose and it also looks like we're witnessing greatness being born in F1. 

Yes,that is pretty mature of Max Verstappen considering his young age still,he is becoming double World Champion at an early age which shows exactly that,greatness being born,however we had Vettel and Alonso near the same age becoming double World Champions and it didn't go that well for Alonso especially after those titles as Vettel won two more because of the car he was driving the Redbull being the absolutely best car at that time.Now we are experiencing the same but it is more relevant this title win for Verstappen as in the first part of the Championship he didn't have the best car and it was because of his bravery only that he managed the wins(of course a bit helped by idiotic Ferrari pit strategies).

[Koal-84]

I'm happy to give this news to you. The Belgian GP is going to be a part of 2023 calendar as well.

There were rumours about the possibility of its being removed. This track is a special one for most of F1 lovers. The race yesterday was really nice to watch also even though Verstappen dominated it completely.

I am very happy about that, a great oldschool track with gravel beds but also good chances to overtake.

For the race itself, RedBull was superior, as already mentioned, and no other team had a real chance to win in a normal race.

The pit stop at the end of the race was again typical  for Ferrari, they wanted to win a point with the fastest lap and typical for this season they lost a place due to a penalty and the lap was about 0.6 seconds too slow for the fastest lap.

[Distraction]

The point gap between Verstappen and Leclerc has gone up to 98 now. Perez has also left Leclerc behind in the driver standings now. Ferrari are just experiencing the nightmare in a season they could have done much better than this. But it is their fault mostly at the same time. Making the right decisions would have kept the championship race between Verstappen and Leclerc alive now. The last race was another disaster and I don't have expectations from them in the remaining races anymore.

The Dutch GP is closing in on us. It is this weekend and it is the home GP for Verstappen also. I expect nothing different than a Verstappen win here like he did last season.

[el kaka22]

It is sure that Hamilton era is over, but the fact is that the dude has been a very gracious loser is a great aspect of him. He disliked him as well when he won all the time and acted like he was the king, because we all knew if that car was given to vettel after 4 years of domination in red bull, then vettel would have won 8 in a row after that, making it an unreal 12 in a row. This isn't some "what if" we KNOW that vettel would have won 8 in a row with mercedes if given the chance. So, it wasn't hamiltons success.

However after last years last race scandal and now after this Alonso deal him accepting fault and saying it doesn't matter what Alonso said because it was heat of the moment and these things happen. Hamilton showed that maybe he was a disliked winner, but he is certainly a very likeable loser.

[swogerino]

It is sure that Hamilton era is over, but the fact is that the dude has been a very gracious loser is a great aspect of him. He disliked him as well when he won all the time and acted like he was the king, because we all knew if that car was given to vettel after 4 years of domination in red bull, then vettel would have won 8 in a row after that, making it an unreal 12 in a row. This isn't some "what if" we KNOW that vettel would have won 8 in a row with mercedes if given the chance. So, it wasn't hamiltons success.

However after last years last race scandal and now after this Alonso deal him accepting fault and saying it doesn't matter what Alonso said because it was heat of the moment and these things happen. Hamilton showed that maybe he was a disliked winner, but he is certainly a very likeable loser.

No one knows what Vettel would have done,I think that Vettel completely lost it at Ferrari and he did quite a lot of mistakes there,against Nico Rosberg with those errors I doubt Vettel would have succeeded.We cannot be so sure of any driver,Hamilton was a rising star as he won races even with non performing teams like McLaren in the years back where they did not had the best car in 2011 and 2012 so Mercedes saw that and immediately got him in 2014 after Schumacher retired.He is the living legend so far and he fully deserves what he has achieved.He also removed the supremacy of the Germans in F1 which were some of the greatest drivers like Schumi and then Vettel and that is a good thing for the sport,now we are having a Champion from Holland showing things change radically fast in F1 and that is good for all of us fans of the sport.

[eightdots]

The point gap between Verstappen and Leclerc has gone up to 98 now. Perez has also left Leclerc behind in the driver standings now. Ferrari are just experiencing the nightmare in a season they could have done much better than this. But it is their fault mostly at the same time. Making the right decisions would have kept the championship race between Verstappen and Leclerc alive now. The last race was another disaster and I don't have expectations from them in the remaining races anymore.

The Dutch GP is closing in on us. It is this weekend and it is the home GP for Verstappen also. I expect nothing different than a Verstappen win here like he did last season.

It's almost as if Ferrari is doing its best to ensure that its drivers do not win. This is a nightmare for drivers. They go to every race with an obscurity. It's sad to see Ferrari in this state. The point gap between Verstappen and Leclerc seems to increase with each race. If the Ferrari team had tried not to make any mistakes, we could have seen a different standings. As you said, my guess is that Verstappen will win the race in the Netherlands. In the last race, he started from the 14th row and became the 1st. That's why nothing else can be thought of for the race in the Netherlands.

[Davian144]

This week there will be another MotoGP race at the San Marino Misano circuit. But before that there is already two good news for the three riders at this time where Joan Mir who has officially joined Repsol Honda starting next year and Miguel Oliveira and Raul Fernandes who have also officially joined the independent team WithU RNF Racing starting next year. So there are only four seats left which are still not official or who has not yet announced who will fill them, and that is for the independent team LCR Honda, Gasgas, and also the Mooney VR46 Racing team.

[swogerino]

The point gap between Verstappen and Leclerc has gone up to 98 now. Perez has also left Leclerc behind in the driver standings now. Ferrari are just experiencing the nightmare in a season they could have done much better than this. But it is their fault mostly at the same time. Making the right decisions would have kept the championship race between Verstappen and Leclerc alive now. The last race was another disaster and I don't have expectations from them in the remaining races anymore.

The Dutch GP is closing in on us. It is this weekend and it is the home GP for Verstappen also. I expect nothing different than a Verstappen win here like he did last season.

It won't be that easy but judging how easily he won the Belgian GP,even if the track is not that really suitable to Redbull but much more to Ferrari still the pace of Redbull can make that win happen.We already know that the Championship is over and that Verstappen is enjoying this remaining part of the season like a walk in a park if a lot of unpredictable things happen,like crashing,power unit failure and weather stubbornness.I personally hope to see a win from Ferrari here just to keep us motivated to continue watching the F1 remaining part with emotions.

[ILuckyGuyI]

It is sure that Hamilton era is over, but the fact is that the dude has been a very gracious loser is a great aspect of him. He disliked him as well when he won all the time and acted like he was the king, because we all knew if that car was given to vettel after 4 years of domination in red bull, then vettel would have won 8 in a row after that, making it an unreal 12 in a row. This isn't some "what if" we KNOW that vettel would have won 8 in a row with mercedes if given the chance. So, it wasn't hamiltons success.

However after last years last race scandal and now after this Alonso deal him accepting fault and saying it doesn't matter what Alonso said because it was heat of the moment and these things happen. Hamilton showed that maybe he was a disliked winner, but he is certainly a very likeable loser.

I don't believe that the Hamilton era is completely over yet. This season is really tough for him because of not having a fast car. I know that he was doing much better with a slower car when he was much younger. But in today's F1 conditions, there is no way you can win a championship with a car like that. For example, Verstappen would have also been in a bad condition now if Red Bull weren't able to give a this much fast car to him.

I think that Hamilton can still fight for his 8th title next season. It is only up to his getting a strong car like in the previous season or not. He isn't intending to give up yet by retiring. He is still ambitious for being the only owner of the title record.

[coinlocket$]

Despite rumors, Riccardo spoke before the GP this weekend and said he wants to stay in F1.

Rumors were pretty intense about him going to Formula Indy next year.

[swogerino]

Despite rumors, Riccardo spoke before the GP this weekend and said he wants to stay in F1.

Rumors were pretty intense about him going to Formula Indy next year.

He can stay at F1 but the only spot available for him would be a place in a Williams car most likely I heard the commentators of Sky UK during Belgium GP talking about him and how everyone were said for his departure from McLaren but when things don't work they simply don't work,there is nothing anyone can do,McLaren will pay his contract in full so financially nothing is broken for him.I am also sad to see him leave or drive a Williams but most of the other seats for next season are already taken so I don't see a whole lot of other opportunities for him to stay in F1 except with that worst performing car of the grid,that Williams.

[ryzaadit]

-snip-

Yes, a few rumor.

Going to "Alpine or Hass" but who knows about The Honey Badger fate. Just to bad, he really have a bad performance for this season. I'm not fans of him, but seeing his interaction of fun he was.

Really sad to see he got this mess.

[tokeweed]

Despite rumors, Riccardo spoke before the GP this weekend and said he wants to stay in F1.

Rumors were pretty intense about him going to Formula Indy next year.

That's really a 'come and get me' plea.  Poor guy...  His F1 days took a down turn the day he rejected the lucrative contract Horner was offering him to stay at Red Bull.  He should have just stayed but the threat of the young Dutchman got to him.  I still think Ricciardo's decision to leave, or one of the causes at least, was when Red Bull started marketing Verstappen more.  The F1 game that year had Verstappen's face if you guys remember.  There prolly a little bit of politics mixed in there too.

[Zackgeno96]

This week we will race again in the Netherlands. Last year, Max Verstappen won the championship here, while Lewis Hamilton was also still in the running for the world championship. Only Leclerc or his own team mate Perze could keep him from winning but I think there is an 80% chance that Verstappen will win this GP again. It must be a wonderful feeling for Verstappen to be able to race in front of his home crowd, knowing that the world championship cap is actually 95% within reach now in this situation.

[CLS63]

Despite rumors, Riccardo spoke before the GP this weekend and said he wants to stay in F1.

Rumors were pretty intense about him going to Formula Indy next year.

I believe Ricciardo should absolutely stay here despite having a bad season now. These things happen to even the most experienced drivers sometimes so he shouldn't be wasted this much easy. He is still one of the very talented drivers. I remember how ambitious he was when he was driving for Red Bull but he was sent from the team because of the problems between him and Verstappen. Otherwise his future would have been brighter than this.


Let's say hello to a new race week.     The Dutch Grand Prix is the home GP for Verstappen and we know how he dominated the last race here. While Red Bull are the fastest on the grid currently it is going to be really difficult for Leclerc to compete with him at the same level. Maybe we would see a fierce rivalry if Ferrari don't screw up. Leclerc must have missed to win races so much after this poor form.

[coinlocket$]

1   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m12.455s
2   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m12.695s
3   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m12.845s
4   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m12.929s
5   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m13.077s
6   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m13.127s
7   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m13.416s
8   Fernando Alonso   ESP   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m13.633s
9   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m13.963s
10   Alexander Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m14.063s
11   Mick Schumacher   GER   Haas F1 Team   1m14.163s
12   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m14.257s
13   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   Haas F1 Team   1m14.405s
14   Pierre Gasly   FRA   Scuderia AlphaTauri   1m14.474s
15   Sebastian Vettel   GER   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m14.500s
16   Guanyu Zhou   CHN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m14.534s
17   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Scuderia AlphaTauri    1m14.630s
18   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m14.695s
19   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m14.714s
20   Nicholas Latifi   CAN   Williams Racing   1m15.122s


This is the final test for Ferrari, if they will be not competitive here, then the FIA change of rules decreased the efficiency of Ferrari.

Source: https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1011194/1/f1-2022-dutch-grand-prix-free-practice-results-1

[ILuckyGuyI]

Verstappen had only 7 laps in FP1 so it is normal to see him that much down below. Mercedes were still impressive in the first session of course. But we all know that not all the teams are showing their real strength in practice sessions. We'd get a clearer idea after watching the qualifying. Mercedes really need an improvement before the season ends. Russell has been the most consistent driver throughout the season so far but I can't say the same for Hamilton.

When it comes to the race, I think that it is going to be a Verstappen win here in his home GP. The driver I want to see as the winner is Leclerc of course but I need to stay realistic. Leclerc really needs a push these days as he was on podium only once for a long time period. Ferrari's having serious problems and making simple mistakes have finished his season earlier than he expected.