Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM.....

[Pulsar77]

Another race under rain, I see.  

I think that we can see many accidents on this track also as Suzuka track is really difficult for the drivers normally already. I wonder what Verstappen will be able to do this time. In the previous race, he had significant individual mistakes which blocked the way for him to fight for the win. This is an important race for Red Bull also in terms of their bond with Honda as you've added. Verstappen must race more focused this time to get the win otherwise this is another race that is likely for him to finish at an unwanted position. I don't think Perez can win two times in a row. Leclerc must have learned his lesson after mistakes while he was just behind Perez in Singapore also.

In addition to these, maybe Hamilton might be able to fight harder for getting a surprising result. He had a terrible race in Singapore and it was his fault also as he lacked concentration in some part of the race and had an accident.

[FanEagle]

I don't think Honda really has a choice but to leave after their partnership with Red Bull ends.  Even if they really wanted to stay, Honda doesn't really have the resources to work on the new specs for the new engine change on 2026.  They were set to leave F1 this season but the engine change was moved to 2026 encouraging them to stay til end of 2025 season.

And it looks like there's gonna be some rain...  Drivers who are fast on wet tracks are Hamilton, Alonso and Verstappen but with the track having lots of turns and corners I think Sainz could be a surprise here.

Very hard to see what Honda will do in the future, the new engine specification should be easier and RedBull is now building the powertrains themselves at RedBull Powertrain, maybe Honda will just do the combustion engine as they are doing now (I think I read) and they might have the resources for that. But we will see in 2026.

The coming race is very difficult for me to predict but I expect Verstappen to be world champion this weekend, but we'll see how qualifying goes and what the weather is like on race day.

The problem is none of these, the problem was the fact that it didn't worth the money they were getting, and even though it was also marketing (we give engines to formula cars is a good sale point) it still wasn't enough.

If it would drop the cost, and increase the price, then they could have done it, but seeing how formula wants to drop the cap, and make the teams closer, so that they could all be close to each other and not have dominant cars like we have right now, that means Honda can't be getting a huge raise in the price. What we should do instead is let Red Bull create their engines, and maybe Honda could supply some engineering help at best to them for a price, instead of directly build them.

[coinlocket$]

Riccardo is rumored now to become the 3rd driver of... Mercedes!

He will probably not be an official driver the following season but only a back up driver.

source: https://www.formulapassion.it/motorsport/formula-1/f1-piloti/nuova-indiscrezione-ricciardo-terzo-pilota-mercedes-636068.html

[LTU_btc]

So, return to Suzuka for the first time since 2019, and potentially wet race. I missed this track. IIRC, last time when we had race here, there was typhoon or something and both qualifying and race were held on Sunday after qualifying got postponed. I hope this time such things wont happen.
Only thing I hate about Japanese GP that I will have to get up early on weekend to watch it

Riccardo is rumored now to become the 3rd driver of... Mercedes!

He will probably not be an official driver the following season but only a back up driver.

source: https://www.formulapassion.it/motorsport/formula-1/f1-piloti/nuova-indiscrezione-ricciardo-terzo-pilota-mercedes-636068.html

So, even Haas or Williams don't want to sign him or he don't want to go there? 3rd driver maybe is better than nothing, but I doubt that's good step.

[coinlocket$]

1st hour of test has been concluded, there the results

1   Fernando Alonso   ESP   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m42.248s
2   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m42.563s
3   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m42.634s
4   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.022s
5   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   Haas F1 Team   1m43.258s
6   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m43.362s
7   Mick Schumacher    GER   Haas F1 Team   1m43.761s
8   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m43.889s
9   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m43.969s
10   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m44.234s
11   Zhou Guanyu   CHN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m44.429s
12   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m44.486s
13   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m44.558s
14   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m44.570s
15   Alex Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m44.791s
16   Pierre Gasly   FRA   Scuderia AlphaTauri   1m44.878s
17   Nicholas Latifi   CAN   Williams Racing   1m45.424s
18   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m46.103s
19   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Scuderia AlphaTauri    1m46.192s
20   Sebastian Vettel   GER   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m48.090s

Source: https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1013927/1/f1-2022-japanese-grand-prix-free-practice-results-1

As predicted, rainy day.

[swogerino]

1st hour of test has been concluded, there the results

1   Fernando Alonso   ESP   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m42.248s
2   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m42.563s
3   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m42.634s
4   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.022s
5   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   Haas F1 Team   1m43.258s
6   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m43.362s
7   Mick Schumacher    GER   Haas F1 Team   1m43.761s
8   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m43.889s
9   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m43.969s
10   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m44.234s
11   Zhou Guanyu   CHN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m44.429s
12   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m44.486s
13   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m44.558s
14   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m44.570s
15   Alex Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m44.791s
16   Pierre Gasly   FRA   Scuderia AlphaTauri   1m44.878s
17   Nicholas Latifi   CAN   Williams Racing   1m45.424s
18   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m46.103s
19   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Scuderia AlphaTauri    1m46.192s
20   Sebastian Vettel   GER   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m48.090s

Source: https://www.crash.net/f1/results/1013927/1/f1-2022-japanese-grand-prix-free-practice-results-1

As predicted, rainy day.

It is nice seeing Alonso there in the top spot with a not that good car like Alpine.What is making me wonder is also not seeing in the top 5 any Redbull but most probably Redbull does not care much about such sessions so I need to see the other practice in order to have a clear view.

It is encouraging seeing two Ferraris near the top as most probably this track favors them with low speed corners and technical ones but as I said in order to make a conclusion I need to see the final practice session.

[Davian144]

The MotoGP race schedule for next season has been issued a few days ago by Dorna and I see that there are two new circuits in it so that the number of MotoGP races next season will be 21 races on different circuits. For the time being, this schedule has been considered fixed although there can still be changes again before next season starts, because Dorna can change everything if there is a better option for racing. But for the time being, I see that this schedule has been very fixed and there is no news for a change.

[tokeweed]

I don't think Honda really has a choice but to leave after their partnership with Red Bull ends.  Even if they really wanted to stay, Honda doesn't really have the resources to work on the new specs for the new engine change on 2026.  They were set to leave F1 this season but the engine change was moved to 2026 encouraging them to stay til end of 2025 season.

And it looks like there's gonna be some rain...  Drivers who are fast on wet tracks are Hamilton, Alonso and Verstappen but with the track having lots of turns and corners I think Sainz could be a surprise here.

Very hard to see what Honda will do in the future, the new engine specification should be easier and RedBull is now building the powertrains themselves at RedBull Powertrain, maybe Honda will just do the combustion engine as they are doing now (I think I read) and they might have the resources for that. But we will see in 2026.

The coming race is very difficult for me to predict but I expect Verstappen to be world champion this weekend, but we'll see how qualifying goes and what the weather is like on race day.

Red Bull will need a partner as I don't think the engineers they acquired when Honda was originally set to move out isn't  doesn't really have the resources either.  Imagine going against Mercedes and Ferrari who's been in the business of making engines for more than 50 years.  Lol.

Anyway, here are the results for FP2.  The wet track is making things really unpredictable

2022 F1 Japanese GP FP 2 Results

1   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m41.935s
2   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m42.170s
3   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m42.786s
4   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m42.834s
5   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   Haas F1 Team   1m43.187s
6   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m43.204s
7   Fernando Alonso   ESP   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.533s
8   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m43.733s
9   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m43.884s
10   Zhou Guanyu   CHN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m44.525s
11   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m44.709s
12   Nicholas Latifi   CAN   Williams Racing   1m44.962s
13   Alex Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m45.039s
14   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Scuderia AlphaTauri    1m45.257s
15   Sebastian Vettel   GER   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m45.261s
16   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m45.885s
17   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m46.030s
18   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m46.776s
19   Pierre Gasly   FRA   Scuderia AlphaTauri   1m47.109s
20   Mick Schumacher    GER   Haas F1 Team   No Time Set


Hamilton 15.00 to be finish on top at FP3 could make for an interesting bet...  What do you guys think?

[coinlocket$]

Hamilton 15.00 to be finish on top at FP3 could make for an interesting bet...  What do you guys think?

Without the raid should be an easy pole-position for Max Verstappen.

This track is similar to SPA so at the high-speed RBR has a big advantage

[emrecemsan]

Riccardo is rumored now to become the 3rd driver of... Mercedes!

He will probably not be an official driver the following season but only a back up driver.

source: https://www.formulapassion.it/motorsport/formula-1/f1-piloti/nuova-indiscrezione-ricciardo-terzo-pilota-mercedes-636068.html

This is really interesting news indeed. I was expecting him to find a team for himself but it looks like things aren't going well in that way. Alpine has been speculated with him quite much but then this isn't happening. Ricciardo has been a talented driver and he's been shown as one of the best drivers on the grid. But after his performance in this season he dropped to this level. Being the third driver for any team is a big decline in his career. He won't take any seat at Mercedes for a long time obviously.


The performances of Mercedes drivers in FP2 were really impressive. But we'd see the real deal in qualifying.    Bookmakers are favouring Verstappen very highly by 1.54. But if we take the rain probability into account too, Verstappen might not take the win that easy. I might even try my luck with Hamilton @10.00 just for fun. 

[coinlocket$]

This is really interesting news indeed. I was expecting him to find a team for himself but it looks like things aren't going well in that way. Alpine has been speculated with him quite much but then this isn't happening. Ricciardo has been a talented driver and he's been shown as one of the best drivers on the grid. But after his performance in this season he dropped to this level. Being the third driver for any team is a big decline in his career. He won't take any seat at Mercedes for a long time obviously.

I think his plan could be to be 3rd driver for 2023 but in 2024 when the contract with Hamilton will expire he could aim to be the second driver after Russell (who will be probably the 1st driver of the team).

[tokeweed]

^  So third driver, meaning he gets a seat when Hamilton retires?  It could be a hint that Hamilton's current contract will be his last.  Happy for Ricciardo if he gets a drive at Mercedes.  He's been in a rut since leaving Red Bull.  The guy deserves a big break for once as he is a talented driver.

Anyway here's the results for quali.  Verstappen let out the big guns and came out first from Q1 to Q3.  

2022 F1 Japanese GP Qualification Results

1   Max Verstappen   NED   Oracle Red Bull Racing   1m30.224s   1m30.346s   1m29.304s
2   Charles Leclerc   MON   Scuderia Ferrari   1m30.402s   1m30.486s   1m29.314s
3   Carlos Sainz   ESP   Scuderia Ferrari   1m30.336s   1m30.444s   1m29.361s
4   Sergio Perez   MEX   Oracle Bull Racing   1m30.622s   1m29.925s   1m29.709s
5   Esteban Ocon   FRA   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m30.696s   1m30.357s   1m30.165s
6   Lewis Hamilton   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m30.906s   1m30.443s   1m30.261s
7   Fernando Alonso   ESP   BWT Alpine F1 Team   1m30.603s   1m30.343s   1m30.322s
8   George Russell   GBR   Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team   1m30.865s   1m30.465s   1m30.389s
9   Sebastian Vettel   GER   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m31.256s   1m30.656s   1m30.554s
10   Lando Norris   GBR   McLaren F1 Team   1m30.881s   1m30.473s   1m31.003s
11   Daniel Ricciardo   AUS   McLaren F1 Team   1m30.880s   1m30.659s   
12   Valtteri Bottas   FIN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m31.226s   1m30.709s   
13   Yuki Tsunoda   JPN   Scuderia AlphaTauri    1m31.130s   1m30.808s   
14   Zhou Guanyu   CHN   Alfa Romeo F1 Team Orlen   1m30.894s   1m30.953s   
15   Mick Schumacher   GER   Haas F1 Team   1m31.152s   1m31.439s   
16   Alex Albon   THA   Williams Racing   1m31.311s       
17   Pierre Gasly   FRA   Scuderia AlphaTauri   1m31.322s       
18   Kevin Magnussen   DEN   Haas F1 Team   1m31.352s       
19   Lance Stroll   CAN   Aston Martin Aramco Cognizant Formula One Team   1m31.419s       
20   Nicholas Latifi   CAN   Williams Racing

[coinlocket$]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

[swogerino]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

I don't think he will get a penalty as the maximum it can happen is they put a fine to Redbull for such dangerous maneuver he made there.It would be a surprise if he got a penalty considering that we are at Suzuka,Japan home of Honda and they would be penalizing their engine manufacturer if they did this so that is why I think the maximum they will give a fine so they can shut up the critics that we did our job but I highly doubt a penalty.

Having said that he made a spectacular first and third sector and despite Ferrari being much faster in the second sector they lost more than 0.207 in the short third sector in their fastest laps.It will be interesting tomorrow which is supposed to be again under rain.

[boltz]

I've missed qualifiers because of the early hour here in Europe but I didn't expect any other poler besides Max and tomorrow won't be anything new regarding the winner. Max will secure his 2nd world championship (1st for so many fans tho ) and yea ...another boring F1 season when nothing special happened and a new team came and dominating everything. What a show , right ? I miss F1 in early 2000 so bad man....

[swogerino]

I've missed qualifiers because of the early hour here in Europe but I didn't expect any other poler besides Max and tomorrow won't be anything new regarding the winner. Max will secure his 2nd world championship (1st for so many fans tho ) and yea ...another boring F1 season when nothing special happened and a new team came and dominating everything. What a show , right ? I miss F1 in early 2000 so bad man....

That would be the scenario if no rain is coming but it is expected about 40-60% chances of good rain and we saw in the last year that Max could not keep his head cool and completely miscalculated his overtaking move against Norris and screwed his race there.I think the rain which is widely expected on Sunday can change this race for the better and I think we will have to wait a bit more for him to be crown as Champion from tomorrow although anything is possible.

I don't like at all the early 2000 when only Ferrari dominated at that time and it was one of the most boring times of all F1 history.

[tokeweed]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

I don't think it was that big of a deal to get a penalty.  It was a misstep, sure..  And a dumb one.  But really would Leclerc or Hamilton be given a penalty if they did it?  I don't think so.  They'll be reprimanded like Verstappen was reprimanded but it doesn't deserve a penalty imho.

This an interesting market...  

Group 4:

Gasly, Pierre 3.00
Tsunoda, Yuki 3.00
Zhou, Guanyu 3.00
Schumacher, Mick 5.00

What do you guys think and who would you pick?  Gasly could be the best driver here but he's behind those other drivers.  :/

[savetheFORUM]

That time zone thing is horrible, I mean sure they need to make it a decent time in Japan to make sure that there are a lot of people who come to watch, and that is a huge amount of money, not only tickets but merchandise gets sold, and sponsorships are made there, millions of dollars depending on the proper time in Japan, or wherever the race is at that day.

But, it is literally wake up with the rooster hours here, I cannot really bother to wake up that early, maybe I will catch the ending of it tomorrow, I can't imagine waking up earlier than that, it's 7 AM and I am not really fan of it, wish I was back at home, it would be at least 10 AM there, would make more sense.

[swogerino]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

I don't think it was that big of a deal to get a penalty.  It was a misstep, sure..  And a dumb one.  But really would Leclerc or Hamilton be given a penalty if they did it?  I don't think so.  They'll be reprimanded like Verstappen was reprimanded but it doesn't deserve a penalty imho.

This an interesting market...  

Group 4:

Gasly, Pierre 3.00
Tsunoda, Yuki 3.00
Zhou, Guanyu 3.00
Schumacher, Mick 5.00

What do you guys think and who would you pick?  Gasly could be the best driver here but he's behind those other drivers.  :/

From those 4 you have chosen in theory yes an odd of 3 should be really generous on Gasly but keep in mind that tomorrow we are racing under race conditions and that is why we see such high odds for all the drivers because of the unknown the rain brings.

If we were in normal conditions between those 4 drivers I think the real odd of Gasly should be something like 1.7 to 1.8 as a maximum.Still from the bets I prefer head 2 head bets in F1,they are much easier to find if the cars do not have failures of any kind.

[ILuckyGuyI]

Verstappen was only reprimanded after that dangerous moment with Norris. I don't know what the rules say about this and I hope FIA abided by the rules. Other than that, I believe he deserved the pole by a solid lap. Leclerc and Sainz both were pretty close to Verstappen by 0.01s and 0.05s gaps respectively. There was a really fierce fight between this trio in qualifying maybe but this shouldn't be misleading of course.

Ferrari still don't have a car that is as fast and durable as Red Bull's so Verstappen can get another win here easily and announce his second title officially also. This is an important race for Honda so Red Bull will hope one of their drivers to win here. But if we see some rain tomorrow then it'd be really difficult to predict the final result.