Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM.....

[coinlocket$]

Ford is also interested for 2026 to be in F1!

The move that is making teams want to enter is the use of synthetic fuels.
They want to enter formula 1 to develop the technology and then use it in normal cars.

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[SquallLeonhart]

Ford is also interested for 2026 to be in F1!

The move that is making teams want to enter is the use of synthetic fuels.
They want to enter formula 1 to develop the technology and then use it in normal cars.

I come across a simple argument about this. First of all, when liberty took over, they did something amazing with "drive to survive" thing, which allowed people to see formula 1 on netflix and gained them a ton of new viewers, there are millions of people who are new to formula one, literally do not even know the period when Vettel won, they are brand new.

But, this also meant that it is a lot more marketing heavy, and Ford joining means they could do great marketing now, because it is not just a loss, yes you spend some but there is a cap, so you spend not so much and then you get a ton of new customers if you win, even if you lose you still get a lot of customers because now marketing is much better.

[coinlocket$]

I come across a simple argument about this. First of all, when liberty took over, they did something amazing with "drive to survive" thing, which allowed people to see formula 1 on netflix and gained them a ton of new viewers, there are millions of people who are new to formula one, literally do not even know the period when Vettel won, they are brand new.

But, this also meant that it is a lot more marketing heavy, and Ford joining means they could do great marketing now, because it is not just a loss, yes you spend some but there is a cap, so you spend not so much and then you get a ton of new customers if you win, even if you lose you still get a lot of customers because now marketing is much better.

A season costs only 150m $ and for those teams is nothing.

Even if they end the season earning 0 $ as RBR and Ferrari and Mercedes do, they earn through marketing.

Basically, they pay 150m $ for marketing, every year.

[SquallLeonhart]

A season costs only 150m $ and for those teams is nothing.

Even if they end the season earning 0 $ as RBR and Ferrari and Mercedes do, they earn through marketing.

Basically, they pay 150m $ for marketing, every year.

I agree, that's the point of this. I mean sure, there are ones like Haas and Williams, which are losing money, but they are probably making enough from sponsorships to continue, and from the league as well. Which means that they are going to continue for a while longer. I remember clearly back in the day when teams changed names all the time, it still exists to this day, we had renoult and racing point and all that till recently.

All in all, F1 is very expensive for a lot of companies aside from a few, and doesn't make sense to spend it neither. Just to explain further, apple and google and microsoft could have their own teams, spend a billion dollars per year, and they would still be fine, because they are rich, but it wouldn't mean anything. Whereas Mercedes or Ferrari or Red Bull could spend this money, and their marketing in return does mean something because it's related, they can sell more, google won't be used more just because they won F1 but mercedes may sell more cars.

[swogerino]

I come across a simple argument about this. First of all, when liberty took over, they did something amazing with "drive to survive" thing, which allowed people to see formula 1 on netflix and gained them a ton of new viewers, there are millions of people who are new to formula one, literally do not even know the period when Vettel won, they are brand new.

But, this also meant that it is a lot more marketing heavy, and Ford joining means they could do great marketing now, because it is not just a loss, yes you spend some but there is a cap, so you spend not so much and then you get a ton of new customers if you win, even if you lose you still get a lot of customers because now marketing is much better.

A season costs only 150m $ and for those teams is nothing.

Even if they end the season earning 0 $ as RBR and Ferrari and Mercedes do, they earn through marketing.

Basically, they pay 150m $ for marketing, every year.

That marketing in the end and in the long term pays much better than 150m dollars so that is why this sport is considered the richest sport in terms of technology because soccer nowadays with artificial price increases of players sometimes can even be bigger than F1 spendings which is really high.

I like to think also that Ford is not in the best of their days and most likely missing the projected amount of sales and what better than join F1 in order to achieve their goals.

[Davian144]

Sure I think 40% is unreasonable. Almost half of the income. Though I just found out that India is also just going to hold this big event. If I'm not mistaken, WSBK has also cancelled the race there. But it should make more sense for the Indian government to collect taxes. Maybe they need to discuss to make a win-win decision.

Dorna itself is also waiting for the government and authorities in the country to discuss this matter, especially about the large amount of tax that they make in the regulations or what they want from the MotoGP organizers. And actually there is nothing to be sorry about if MotoGP and WSBK don't race there, because Dorna still has 20 races at other circuits and can see other circuits that are more appropriate in the 2024 season if Dorna wants 21 races in each MotoGP season.

[tokeweed]

Ford is also interested for 2026 to be in F1!

The move that is making teams want to enter is the use of synthetic fuels.
They want to enter formula 1 to develop the technology and then use it in normal cars.

Yup and the partnership isn't something new.  Ford and Red Bull were partners before when Red Bull was still Jaguar before it was bought be the Austrian company.  So good to see Ford back with their former partner and see them manufacture new power units.

I also just heard that Ferrari offered Christian Horner a deal to join the Italian team..?  Is this true or is it just a rumor?  It's funny if they really tried to poach Horner away from RBR.  They should've tried years ago and offered big money for Horner, Vettel and Newey as a package.  If they got those three, I think it's possible that Ferrari would've won at least one driver's championship and a constructor's championship.

[coinlocket$]

Another car, another rendering.

I hate this shit they could just don't do these presentations at all.

https://i.imgur.com/TolKJXN.png

Source: https://twitter.com/WilliamsRacing/status/1622596594955702278

[Zackgeno96]

The penalty that Red Bull has imposed can have a considerable influence on the coming season. According to the team boss, this will save a lot of seconds because they are allowed to drive much less time in certain test tunnels. What I do wonder is why the World Championship title is not taken away and given to Hamilton? The regulations have clearly been violated, you have to see it as an athlete who has used doping, then a medal is also withdrawn with retroactive effect. We've seen that happen before with the OS. But Red Bull has only had a fine and also a light test penalty. They got away with that quite easily to be honest.

[swogerino]

The penalty that Red Bull has imposed can have a considerable influence on the coming season. According to the team boss, this will save a lot of seconds because they are allowed to drive much less time in certain test tunnels. What I do wonder is why the World Championship title is not taken away and given to Hamilton? The regulations have clearly been violated, you have to see it as an athlete who has used doping, then a medal is also withdrawn with retroactive effect. We've seen that happen before with the OS. But Red Bull has only had a fine and also a light test penalty. They got away with that quite easily to be honest.

This has been discussed several times and I think the Redbull Championship will not be removed from them.This can serve as an incentive to other teams though for this season to greatly surpass the limit set by FIA as they most likely will get away with a fine too,but by spending more money to develop the car,these other teams will have much better possibilities to fight Redbull much closer than they did last year and I assume that is why they are not making it a big deal for the Redbull team that have broken the rules of the 2022 season.

[tokeweed]

Another car, another rendering.

I hate this shit they could just don't do these presentations at all.

https://i.imgur.com/TolKJXN.png

Source: https://twitter.com/WilliamsRacing/status/1622596594955702278

The thing about F1 car reveals is it's not really about the cars and the technical specs of the cars per se.  That comes later for a myriad of reasons.  They prolly don't want other teams copying their stuff or the real car isn't ready yet..  Who knows.  But yeah, the car reveals is mostly about the livery and showing the sponsors.  It's a marketing and PR thing.

That's why I've mostly stopped getting excited for these before the season reveals as we don't really learn a lot about the cars.  That comes during FP1 of the first racing event.

[Volgastallion]

I really like the new Williams. I hope Williams can finally make some good improvements.

This year i not follow so much this before pre season so i dont know so much about F1 2023.

[coinlocket$]

We have Alfa Romeo too now.




This is the comparison with the previous car, they basically copied half Ferrari and half Redbull. 


I really like the colors.

Pic source: https://www.formulapassion.it/opinioni/carlo-platella/f1-alfa-romeo-c43-analisi-tecnica-progetto-ardito-coraggioso

[FanEagle]

The penalty that Red Bull has imposed can have a considerable influence on the coming season. According to the team boss, this will save a lot of seconds because they are allowed to drive much less time in certain test tunnels. What I do wonder is why the World Championship title is not taken away and given to Hamilton? The regulations have clearly been violated, you have to see it as an athlete who has used doping, then a medal is also withdrawn with retroactive effect. We've seen that happen before with the OS. But Red Bull has only had a fine and also a light test penalty. They got away with that quite easily to be honest.

This has been discussed several times and I think the Redbull Championship will not be removed from them.This can serve as an incentive to other teams though for this season to greatly surpass the limit set by FIA as they most likely will get away with a fine too,but by spending more money to develop the car,these other teams will have much better possibilities to fight Redbull much closer than they did last year and I assume that is why they are not making it a big deal for the Redbull team that have broken the rules of the 2022 season.

I do not think that it would be really a way of telling other teams to go break the rule at all. Right now, there is one thing we are certain, there was a small amount that was passed, was it the thing that gave Max the title? Would he lost if they didn't spend that extra small amount? We do not know, after all even the last lap was more decisive anyway so it shouldn't be really a shock to being with.

However, they will hurt a lot this year because of that, which means unless you are a team that is on the verge of getting a title? Why would you want to risk it? Like lets assume you are Williams, and break the rule, and spend a lot more, what can you gain? Hence, it's not really a valid reason to break the rule unless you are fighting for a title very closely.

[Davian144]

During the three days of the Shakedown test at the Sepang Malaysian circuit, there were many unique things that I saw from several factory motorbikes. Of the 11 riders who participated in the Shakedown test, the Yamaha test riders and the Ducati test riders always paid attention in terms of top speed.

Even though on the third day the Ducati test rider managed to make the fastest time, the top speed of everything was held by the Yamaha test rider. Apart from that, every manufacturer is also trying to change the fairing to find a better balance and also a more increased top speed. This is what made me so happy to see the Shakedown test in Sepang before the official test for pre-season which will start in two days. Here are some photos shared by MotoGP, crashmotogp_, and several others from local media

[Koal-84]

We have Alfa Romeo too now.
~
I really like the colors.
~

The new Sauber car looks really good in terms of colour, but the sponsor Orlen has changed to Alpha Tauri. And Alfa now has a well-known sponsor, stake.com, which is also represented here on the board. The crypto casino has only one big disadvantage, in many countries where Formula 1 races, advertising for an casino is forbidden, not very productive for the casino itself.



I'm curious to see how this will be handled later.

[tokeweed]

We've been looking at the car reveals without talking about what really matters for you guys itt...  The early lines and outright odds before the start of the season.  

I'm not sure what's really new with the cars technically but if there were some new rules, I think they wouldn't that big of a deal unlike the spec changes from 2021 to 2022.  So these lines should be accurate and reflects the correct price for the drivers and the teams.

Drivers top 3 in the outright to win the championship are Verstappen at 1.73, Hamilton at 4 and Leclerc at 6.25

Constructors at top 3 are Red Bull at 1.95, Merc at 2.40 and Ferrari at 5.75.

So what do you guys think?  Any chance Merc or Ferrari snag the top spot from RBR this year?

[Volgastallion]

I really like Alfa Romeo cars, but this year car.... i like the front, but the side i dont know... its ok but at the same time i feel the past car was better with the white.

We've been looking at the car reveals without talking about what really matters for you guys itt...  The early lines and outright odds before the start of the season. 

I'm not sure what's really new with the cars technically but if there were some new rules, I think they wouldn't that big of a deal unlike the spec changes from 2021 to 2022.  So these lines should be accurate and reflects the correct price for the drivers and the teams.

Drivers top 3 in the outright to win the championship are Verstappen at 1.73, Hamilton at 4 and Leclerc at 6.25

Constructors at top 3 are Red Bull at 1.95, Merc at 2.40 and Ferrari at 5.75.

So what do you guys think?  Any chance Merc or Ferrari snag the top spot from RBR this year?

I think its so early to make a prediction lets see how much Mercedes improves, for Ferrari nothing it was 10 years of making illusions.

[ILuckyGuyI]

We've been looking at the car reveals without talking about what really matters for you guys itt...  The early lines and outright odds before the start of the season.  

I'm not sure what's really new with the cars technically but if there were some new rules, I think they wouldn't that big of a deal unlike the spec changes from 2021 to 2022.  So these lines should be accurate and reflects the correct price for the drivers and the teams.

Drivers top 3 in the outright to win the championship are Verstappen at 1.73, Hamilton at 4 and Leclerc at 6.25

Constructors at top 3 are Red Bull at 1.95, Merc at 2.40 and Ferrari at 5.75.

So what do you guys think?  Any chance Merc or Ferrari snag the top spot from RBR this year?

It is interesting to see Hamilton getting ahead of Leclerc according to bookmakers already.

Because Ferrari have been rumoured to have made an improvement of 30 horsepower in their car. It seems like they are coming back much stronger. The reason why they got slower last season was on purpose in fact. I mean that they decided to cut the power by some percentage to prevent the durability problems from continuing to occur. But they are saying now that there is no such problem left from now on. We will see in practice by the new season of course. If they really seem like they have said then I will be putting them ahead of Mercedes.

[swogerino]

We've been looking at the car reveals without talking about what really matters for you guys itt...  The early lines and outright odds before the start of the season.  

I'm not sure what's really new with the cars technically but if there were some new rules, I think they wouldn't that big of a deal unlike the spec changes from 2021 to 2022.  So these lines should be accurate and reflects the correct price for the drivers and the teams.

Drivers top 3 in the outright to win the championship are Verstappen at 1.73, Hamilton at 4 and Leclerc at 6.25

Constructors at top 3 are Red Bull at 1.95, Merc at 2.40 and Ferrari at 5.75.

So what do you guys think?  Any chance Merc or Ferrari snag the top spot from RBR this year?

Did McLaren screw it up again really bad despite them being the first team to stop development of 2022 car just after 5-6 races into the last season that they are not here?I don't think they would be that bad this year and making a bet on them as the constructor winners this year if the odd is big enough like 13-20 I am giving it a try,if they truly have not improved even though they had more time than any other team to develop their car then most probably they need a complete redesign of all of their staff,layoffs are happening in tech companies,it is time to start happening even in F1 as a tech sport that they are.

From the options here I would go with Ferrari just because of the odd and not that I expect them to be winners this year.