Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[Elwar]

You also need government protection if you were to establish any seastead, which ultimately makes a seastead largely unfeasible because you are going to be in nearly constant negotiations for your own sovereignty and protection(s) in order to maintain your anti-government posture, you have to suck their dicks.. probably figuratively. 

The only thing we would need government protection from is the government.

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[Globb0]

JJG is a nosey wanker, pretending he's talking about accumulation strategies, all the while estimating people's coin hodl for his little list.
It's not cricket.

He’s building a quantum computer to end us all! He has parts of our private keys, one day we’ll check our balances & they’ll all be 0BTC

**JJG EVIL LAUGHTER**

Get the fuck out of here with your Quantum BS

ladder ladder yadda yadda

[barota]

The mouths became like that ugly woman sell sell sell !!!!!!
This is a time of hold buy
I'm wrong???
So, damn it, I hope prices fall to 1,000usd per btc And everyone loses
and fuck all Community of bitcoin
Weak Curse

[El duderino_]

Stop that red line.....create a green one instead

[FractalUniverse]

 Bitcoin moon will be as beautiful as
 Z --> Z² + C

Avatar-sized



edit: redo

thanks I like your choice of background spirals. I used to have such fractal in green color on windows desktop.

[El duderino_]

nice one, gonna add it as soon as possible

[DeathAngel]

Wonder what the weekend will bring, I’d be happy to settle for sideways. Please no more blood shed!

[realr0ach]

Don't bother arguing with these fools as 99% of them are too lazy to have done any due diligence themselves and just hope that someone else will work on bitcoin and it will somehow make them rich.  From memory, when I did the estimates way back in the day, I think I came up with bitcoin needing 8 MB blocks in the long run to function as a global settlement system where transactions of around $10k or more are viable.

Is 2 MB blocks + LN equal or better to that?  No.  LN is an even more centralized, more permissioned version of bitcoin where they seek to transfer all consumer payments to.  So you theoretically CAN transfer most bitcoin traffic there, but LN doesn't actually have anything in common with bitcoin in the first place.  It's a totally different system.  It's like replacing bitcoin with bitshares and pretending it's the same thing.  But when it comes down to it, bitcoin transaction validators are designed to centralize, nullifying any reason for it's existence, so there's no point in even discussing building any 2nd tier layers on it.

Discussing LN vs bigger blocks is like discussing what color to paint the Titanic.  It's 100% impossible to create a decentralized digital currency where transaction validators don't centralize.

I'm not certain why you constantly belabor this point of decentralization. Satoshi himself already acknowledged this isn't going evolve into a perfectly decentralized system.

The current system where every user is a network node is not the intended configuration for large scale.  That would be like every Usenet user runs their own NNTP server.  The design supports letting users just be users.  The more burden it is to run a node, the fewer nodes there will be.  Those few nodes will be big server farms.  The rest will be client nodes that only do transactions and don't generate.

It's not me that is wrong, you have only quoted Satoshi posts where he admits he's fully aware he's creating a designed to centralize, permissioned ledger.

[Raja_MBZ]

US, Korea, China Stock Markets Plummet: is Crypto Correlated?

https://www.ccn.com/us-korea-china-stock-markets-plummet-is-crypto-correlated/

Correlated? The whole growth of crypto market should've been inversely proportional to the growth of stock markets. What's going on?

IMO, either the big players aren't totally aware of how crypto works, or someone is trying to make us realize that crypto is correlated to stocks and wants us to sell before the big upcoming financial crisis.

[realr0ach]

US, Korea, China Stock Markets Plummet: is Crypto Correlated?

https://www.ccn.com/us-korea-china-stock-markets-plummet-is-crypto-correlated/

Correlated? The whole growth of crypto market should've been inversely proportional to the growth of stock markets. What's going on?

Bitcoin is not the unit of account of anything, so it becomes a derivative of the US dollar by default (the most widely used current unit of account).  If dollar liquidity shrinks, so does the price of everything that's just a derivative of the dollar. Through the vast majority of human history, fiat paper notes have always been a derivative of gold and silver and not vice versa, which will obviously go back to the norm soon.

It all goes back to the Thomas Jefferson quote:

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies.  If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around(these banks) will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."

Never allow Jews to try and fool people into believing something else is the unit of account.  It's always been gold and silver (the actual Schelling point of money tested over thousands of years), and always will be long after I'm dead.

[d_eddie]

A bit strange but made me think: https://www.epsilontheory.com/whats-your-metagame-an-open-letter-to-the-crypto-community/

Umm...the guy said a whole lot of nothing with a lot of words.

Yes, lots of words is what he uses.

But there is an interesting thought on what he calls the ‘Metagame’. In other posts, he describes the behaviour of a coyote encountering a group of humans. The coyote stares down the humans with an expression like ‘I do not care for you humans; I’m not afraid of you’. And puts his nose in the air, turns around and goes away.

The coyote wins this game.

But the humans get together and discuss what they saw. A threatening predator that shows no fear for humans and willing to confront them instead of running away scared at the first sight of humans. The humans vow to hunt this animal so that it’s numbers are decimated.

The humans win. The humans win the Metagame. The coyote is not able to understand that by winning the individual with his behaviour, it is losing the Metagame.

I guess that is what he tries to ask: how is the cryptocurrency community intending to deal with the humans called ‘king’ when taking away their claim on society’s money? How will it save itself from the wrath of the King?

You’ll have to read it all between the lines but I sense that the author understands the tremendous power of of the idea of cryptocurrency. But somehow considers it a lost cause if it’s community does not come to terms with the King on how to blend in and give the King the King’s due.

Personally, I think the King may have less teeth than envisaged. On the other hand, it does is a force to recon with.

This guy does a lot of deep thinking (with a lot of words to express it   ). It stems me positive to see some signs that he may be moving ahead in his thinking about cryptocurrency. We won’t make it just with this WO community (sorry guys).

I'm not disagreeing with the guy. Just kept waiting for the metagame portion that you mentioned.

I believe the ideal is that Bitcoin itself is a virus to the king. Slowly consuming until the king (banks) is dead.

Strangely enough, this was discussed in some of our seasteading discussions. We don't want to piss off the puppet masters who actually control things (especially early on). So we may have to put a Citibank on one of the first seasteads as an offering to the gods.

Will they accept local sovereignty? I mean, the Seastead Council - or whoever is in charge - can issue a decree on a whim, to the effect that all local Citibank assets be forfeited since the bank <insert arbitrary reason here>. If I were the coyote, oops, the bank, I'd stay clear of dangerous libertarian communities.

[realr0ach]

A bit strange but made me think: https://www.epsilontheory.com/whats-your-metagame-an-open-letter-to-the-crypto-community/

Umm...the guy said a whole lot of nothing with a lot of words.

That's exactly what I thought when I read it.  Elwar is not really the sharpest knife in the crypto drawer (a common hodler only a few steps above a simple micgoossens bacteria), so I don't think this guy is going to fool too many people if he didn't pass the Elwar test.  He spent paragraphs upon paragraphs trying to sound profound without saying anything at all.  

I think he also stole my quote about render unto Caesar from this thread when I mentioned it months ago:

Did you cite to Jamie Dimon why you aren't required to pay any tax/extortion to the Pharisee/Ashkenazi fake Jews at the fed from the profit?

http://www.quora.com/What-did-Jesus-mean-when-he-said-Render-unto-Caesar-the-things-which-are-Caesars-and-unto-God-the-things-that-are-Gods

"The governor was Pilate, who was also procurator, responsible to Rome for the collection of "Caesar's tax" in Judea. The chief priests who sent the spies were confident Jesus would condemn Caesar's tax, for taxation is identical to extortion and a violation of the Commandment of God, "Thou shall not steal?" The Commandment does not exempt the State nor its tax collectors from its unequivocal prohibition."

For the religious nuts who keep posting in this thread (Coincube), Jesus is essentially defining forced taxation by the state as extortion and theft - paying tribute to a false god (Caesar).  So if bitcon is not only a permissioned system (from transactions not being blinded and transaction validators being designed to centralize), but also has a taxation and extortion system built-in (being forced to pay ransom to centralized, monopoly miners if you want to move any of your imaginary tokens unlike God's money - gold and silver), then you should probably not be using it.

[El duderino_]

[QuestionAuthority]

Speaking of trilema, what ever happened to Mircea Popescu?

He soldiers on.
MPOE-PR has a baby duck. And tits.
More insights anon.

I haven’t really heard anything about him for a long time. I really miss MPOE-PR. She, he, it was so hilarious.

[realr0ach]

I'm honestly amazed the stupid Chinese pump and dump shills spamming this thread really believe that right at a turning point where things can continue no longer on their current course in civilization, that instead of shifting downwards in complexity, they actually think it's either going to continue as normal or even shift upwards into more complexity instead.  I've studied everything from economics, to sociology, to religion, to complexity theory, to anything you can think of to know exactly what's going to happen in civilization & the monetary system as a whole:

You are fighting against the laws of gravity if you believe metals will be displaced by craptocurrency.  I'll take the Joseph Tainter position any day on this subject matter.  When complex systems implode, they don't shift over to an even more complex system, they either go backwards in complexity or enter a full dark ages.  Complexity is not inherently good, it's a liability.  Another crux of the Joseph Tainter argument when extrapolated to it's end point is that overspecialization is essentially a Fermi Paradox-style extinction level event.  The invisible hand of nature will force chaos and implosions at random intervals to prevent this.  The world doesn't want "total order" as you always reference the term as being bad/an impossibility.

Metals always survive these random interval re-orgs of nature because they are very basic elements and almost indestructable; craptocurrency does not.  Not to mention craptocurrency being a far inferior settlement system with no reason to even exist due to not removing counter party risk and having built-in rent seeking middlemen (transaction validators - so called "miners").

Humans are not going into some type of permanent "knowledge age" as you seem to think.  Cyclical dark ages are kind of inevitable in the grand scheme of nature's design just like economic cycles.  If you actually did attempt to engineer some type of overspecialized "knowledge age", it would just make the coming cyclical dark age all the more severe and possibly lead to extinction.

[bitserve]

^
Thought the same but never no Maybe VERY Maybe @ the Total begin .... but think not also not gonna argue that cause i’m not 100%sure

Well sometimes any of us posting here could talk about percentages or amount or strategies, and the only thing i recall you disclosing related to strategies... such as hodl and buydl of BTC.. and maybe amounts related to games, but not amounts that you were buying or even how long that you have been buying.. even though that could be easy to miss some posts that might have gone over that.

Regarding myself, I have provided a bit more regarding percentages of BTC bought but usually not amounts, except every once in a while I might describe amounts as examples or maybe amounts of some transactions that I have done, for example in the context of debunking claims about slow transaction times and/or high transaction fees.

I've let Mic know what I remember and I'm happy to stand corrected if I'm wrong. 

I am pretty sure Mic has not ever disclosed how much Bitcoin he does have. Not even a ballpark figure. One could speculate, but that's all.

His opsec is bad in regards of his IRL persona -and he is perfectly aware of that- but not about his stash size.

[Icygreen]

r0ach, I think you just want the price to go lower where you believe the bottom is.  That's the entire reasoning behind your tired arguments of centralized transaction validations and a manipulated price on bitfinex. (I believe you also have some real fears about this)    You once stated that you believed JJG was responsible for initiating the pump to 1200 by posting bullishly on WO. I think you were inspired by that and now trying to manipulate sentiment the best you can.  
That underwater silver position is kinda interesting!    For some reason I was sure your position would be between $6.50-12 but it appears you went full FOMO in 2011 buying the top and then you got salty when BTC kept going up and silver fell sharply. Let me guess, do you blame the Jews for that? Shilling for silver makes more sense now.  
 

[bitserve]

Am I the only one that has fears the price of Bitcoin would never even reach the last ATH? I mean, yes, I think it will, heck, I think it could happen as soon as in less than one year from now or, most probably, around the next halving but.... I know there is a non-negligible possibility of that not happening, ever.

What are you guys stance about that? Let's be honest here....

[Spaceman_Spiff_Original]

Am I the only one that has fears the price of Bitcoin would never even reach the last ATH? I mean, yes, I think it will, heck, I think it could happen as soon as in less than one year from now or, most probably, around the next halving but.... I know there is a non-negligible possibility of that not happening, ever.

What are you guys stance about that? Let's be honest here....

I think it is highly likely that we will.  The only 2 things that I could see preventing that are 1) massive government crackdown or 2)a superior crypto taking over.
Or maybe 3) the world as we know it ending, but then honestly we will have bigger fish to fry.

[El duderino_]

^^


not ever close to ATH

who is that there?


one never knows what could happen, everything is possible if not presented @the present time