Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[realr0ach]

We will relatively soon get to a point where people will be able to create their vision at will (at first digitally only), and value will be derived based on how capable a person is to create an experience of interest to others.

I've already seen other people bring up this shitcoiner topic before, that EVERYONE will have their own coin that derives value from what they produce or whatever.  Assuming you could even make it work with all the interchangeability problems, most people simply produce nothing, so it's like....lol?  You are aware of the term bread and circus right?  

Welfare is money you bribe poor people with so they don't murder you in your sleep and take your stuff.  In that regard, any change back to a non-fantasy land, fraudulent monetary system is probably going to involve enormous taxes on 'the haves' to distribute bread to the people who produce nothing to stop them from burning down the planet.  Well, actually, just the cost of handing out food would be low and not requiring enormous taxes, but that assumes you completely abolish the entire military money laundering scam, medicare money laundering scam, and all other fraudulent govt programs.

By digitally only I mean that people will create virtual worlds and experiences that others will choose to consume. Similar to Youtube, Twitch and Patreon today but on a much larger scale.

Costs are on an exponential downward slope for any physically produced good that the government or other such players don't have their hands in. As such, there will be no need for labour in the traditional sense. And value and money will literally just be brownie points exchanged between different parties. For this even shitcoins would fit the bill. But I think that something like Bitcoin will be the common denominator, as central bank fiat currencies are inflating too much.

It's going to most likely be the exact opposite.  Instead of only intellectual property having value, things like manual labor will probably make a LARGE comeback with the collapse of EROI in the oil industry.  The books are ALL cooked on this stuff, but a lot of sources claim the EROI is already lower than what is required to maintain an industrial civilization in the first place and there is no real substitute for oil.  

I personally think the govt is subsidizing the price of oil/oil industry right now as a stealth form of helicopter money.  You already know they want to enact helicopter money and simply giving people free or reduced price oil is the same thing since everyone buys it.  So in the end, the question of:  hey, what do we do with all these people who don't know how to program or whatever the fuck?  Will probably fix itself.  They might end up chopping logs or working in a field or something.

[nutildah]

Has there been a massive MSM outrage yet? Against the letter?

Far right, hardcore anti-immigration senator from Australia? Unlikely there will be.

But the idea that somehow immigrants are responsible for their own unprovoked, cold-blooded murder is fucking sickening.

And accurate.

You don't have to like it, but it is a fact that Islam is fundamentally incompatible with western culture. They have no business here. And no place at all to play victims.

So let me get this straight: you're saying they deserved to be massacred? And being a victim of a massacre isn't an appropriate time to "play victim"?

[mindrust]

I finally accomplished my first target. Finally.



This includes my altcoins too which are %6. Still need another 0.3 to make it pure 5.  

I'mma going ballistic   Gotta slow down for a while.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

We will relatively soon get to a point where people will be able to create their vision at will (at first digitally only), and value will be derived based on how capable a person is to create an experience of interest to others.

I've already seen other people bring up this shitcoiner topic before, that EVERYONE will have their own coin that derives value from what they produce or whatever.  Assuming you could even make it work with all the interchangeability problems, most people simply produce nothing, so it's like....lol?  You are aware of the term bread and circus right?  

Welfare is money you bribe poor people with so they don't murder you in your sleep and take your stuff.  In that regard, any change back to a non-fantasy land, fraudulent monetary system is probably going to involve enormous taxes on 'the haves' to distribute bread to the people who produce nothing to stop them from burning down the planet.  Well, actually, just the cost of handing out food would be low and not requiring enormous taxes, but that assumes you completely abolish the entire military money laundering scam, medicare money laundering scam, and all other fraudulent govt programs.

By digitally only I mean that people will create virtual worlds and experiences that others will choose to consume. Similar to Youtube, Twitch and Patreon today but on a much larger scale.

Costs are on an exponential downward slope for any physically produced good that the government or other such players don't have their hands in. As such, there will be no need for labour in the traditional sense. And value and money will literally just be brownie points exchanged between different parties. For this even shitcoins would fit the bill. But I think that something like Bitcoin will be the common denominator, as central bank fiat currencies are inflating too much.

It's going to most likely be the exact opposite.  Instead of only intellectual property having value, things like manual labor will probably make a LARGE comeback with the collapse of EROI in the oil industry.  The books are ALL cooked on this stuff, but a lot of sources claim the EROI is already lower than what is required to maintain an industrial civilization in the first place and there is no real substitute for oil.  

I personally think the govt is subsidizing the price of oil/oil industry right now as a stealth form of helicopter money.  So the question of:  hey, what do we do with all these people who don't know how to program or whatever the fuck?  Will probably fix itself.  They might end up chopping logs or working in a field or something.

What kind of labour exactly do you see so valuable when oil collapses?

[Arriemoller]

Yeah, the questions also aren't sufficiently well-defined for my taste.

Some years back I went to the doctor to get my insomnia checked out. Ended up at some ADHD specialist.

The questionnaire was so ambiguous that I could've crossed anything without distorting the truth depending on how I'd choose to interpret the questions. Needless to say, I could choose the outcome so I went ahead and got a Ritalin prescription just to be sure.

Surprisingly, it knocked me out. First time in my life I went to bed and just fell asleep.

Not taking it anymore because I don't like having to watch my diet to negate the side-effects, and while it makes me more productive and focused it makes me think more linearly and thus tampers with creativity.

Tl;dr questionnaires are shitty ways to collect data. But unfortunately the best we have for now. Probably going to change in a decade or so though.

That is my experience with Ritalin as well, I never had any sleeping problems tho, rather the opposite, I sleep too much and is usually on a 25 hour cycle.
But I tried microdosing it instead (1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg pill in the morning) and that gave me a good balance between focus and creativity without messing with sleep and hunger.
I'm not taking it right now because of interactions with other drugs, but I will try another round when I'm of that drug.

I sleep too much as well. My problem is with falling asleep. Even if I worked myself out and have been awake for 30+ hours it would generally take me 2-3 hours of toss and turn before I'd finally doze off. At that point I sleep through though.

That sucks, have you tried melatonin pills, they seem to work well with some individuals.
I always read for an hour or two when I go to bed, and sleep just comes to me during that time. When I close the book, I fall a sleep.

[realr0ach]

We will relatively soon get to a point where people will be able to create their vision at will (at first digitally only), and value will be derived based on how capable a person is to create an experience of interest to others.

I've already seen other people bring up this shitcoiner topic before, that EVERYONE will have their own coin that derives value from what they produce or whatever.  Assuming you could even make it work with all the interchangeability problems, most people simply produce nothing, so it's like....lol?  You are aware of the term bread and circus right?  

Welfare is money you bribe poor people with so they don't murder you in your sleep and take your stuff.  In that regard, any change back to a non-fantasy land, fraudulent monetary system is probably going to involve enormous taxes on 'the haves' to distribute bread to the people who produce nothing to stop them from burning down the planet.  Well, actually, just the cost of handing out food would be low and not requiring enormous taxes, but that assumes you completely abolish the entire military money laundering scam, medicare money laundering scam, and all other fraudulent govt programs.

By digitally only I mean that people will create virtual worlds and experiences that others will choose to consume. Similar to Youtube, Twitch and Patreon today but on a much larger scale.

Costs are on an exponential downward slope for any physically produced good that the government or other such players don't have their hands in. As such, there will be no need for labour in the traditional sense. And value and money will literally just be brownie points exchanged between different parties. For this even shitcoins would fit the bill. But I think that something like Bitcoin will be the common denominator, as central bank fiat currencies are inflating too much.

It's going to most likely be the exact opposite.  Instead of only intellectual property having value, things like manual labor will probably make a LARGE comeback with the collapse of EROI in the oil industry.  The books are ALL cooked on this stuff, but a lot of sources claim the EROI is already lower than what is required to maintain an industrial civilization in the first place and there is no real substitute for oil.  

I personally think the govt is subsidizing the price of oil/oil industry right now as a stealth form of helicopter money.  So the question of:  hey, what do we do with all these people who don't know how to program or whatever the fuck?  Will probably fix itself.  They might end up chopping logs or working in a field or something.

What kind of labour exactly do you see so valuable when oil collapses?

Do you not understand that most labor in modern civilization is done by machines and much of that is oil powered?  It requires a human doing physical labor for 12 years to equal one barrel of oil.  This is where all the huge increase in qualify of life came from for humans.  The oil barrels are your black servants so to speak.  You remove oil from the equation and humans themselves are going to be doing a lot more of the work.  Here's some math/engineering on it:

https://fatcatwatch.wordpress.com/2011/04/30/abarrel-of-crude-is-worth-164000/

Warning:  blog is written by a lunatic Marxist, but I think his math on oil checks out.  He claimed a world run by women that disenfranchises men would have less wars.  I think female rulers actually started more wars per capita but not sure.  Females do not really care about if men live or die so wouldn't be surprised if they were more careless in sending them off to their deaths.

[d_eddie]

Japan is faking its friendliness.

Also, it's not true that I couldn't get a Japanese passport. It's not as easy as it is in most Western places, but it's certainly possible. I could pretty much get one within two more years if I recall correctly.

You have to give up your previous citizenship though: Japan doesn't allow double passport.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

We will relatively soon get to a point where people will be able to create their vision at will (at first digitally only), and value will be derived based on how capable a person is to create an experience of interest to others.

I've already seen other people bring up this shitcoiner topic before, that EVERYONE will have their own coin that derives value from what they produce or whatever.  Assuming you could even make it work with all the interchangeability problems, most people simply produce nothing, so it's like....lol?  You are aware of the term bread and circus right?  

Welfare is money you bribe poor people with so they don't murder you in your sleep and take your stuff.  In that regard, any change back to a non-fantasy land, fraudulent monetary system is probably going to involve enormous taxes on 'the haves' to distribute bread to the people who produce nothing to stop them from burning down the planet.  Well, actually, just the cost of handing out food would be low and not requiring enormous taxes, but that assumes you completely abolish the entire military money laundering scam, medicare money laundering scam, and all other fraudulent govt programs.

By digitally only I mean that people will create virtual worlds and experiences that others will choose to consume. Similar to Youtube, Twitch and Patreon today but on a much larger scale.

Costs are on an exponential downward slope for any physically produced good that the government or other such players don't have their hands in. As such, there will be no need for labour in the traditional sense. And value and money will literally just be brownie points exchanged between different parties. For this even shitcoins would fit the bill. But I think that something like Bitcoin will be the common denominator, as central bank fiat currencies are inflating too much.

It's going to most likely be the exact opposite.  Instead of only intellectual property having value, things like manual labor will probably make a LARGE comeback with the collapse of EROI in the oil industry.  The books are ALL cooked on this stuff, but a lot of sources claim the EROI is already lower than what is required to maintain an industrial civilization in the first place and there is no real substitute for oil.  

I personally think the govt is subsidizing the price of oil/oil industry right now as a stealth form of helicopter money.  So the question of:  hey, what do we do with all these people who don't know how to program or whatever the fuck?  Will probably fix itself.  They might end up chopping logs or working in a field or something.

What kind of labour exactly do you see so valuable when oil collapses?

Do you not understand that most labor in modern civilization is done by machines and much of that is oil powered?  It requires a human doing physical labor for 12 years to equal one barrel of oil.  This is where all the huge increase in qualify of life came from for humans.  The oil barrels are your black servants so to speak.  You remove oil from the equation and humans themselves are going to be doing a lot more of the work.  Here's some math/engineering on it:

https://fatcatwatch.wordpress.com/2011/04/30/abarrel-of-crude-is-worth-164000/

Warning:  blog is written by a lunatic Marxist, but I think his math on oil checks out.  He claimed a world run by women that disenfranchises men would have less wars.  I think female rulers actually started more wars per capita but not sure.  Females do not really care about if men live or die so wouldn't be surprised if they were more careless in sending them off to their deaths.

Again, just because we use oil right now doesn't mean we have to. We have a myriad of options with different trade offs. Nuclear power is the easiest solution. But there are others.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

Japan is faking its friendliness.

Also, it's not true that I couldn't get a Japanese passport. It's not as easy as it is in most Western places, but it's certainly possible. I could pretty much get one within two more years if I recall correctly.

You have to give up your previous citizenship though: Japan doesn't allow double passport.

Aware, but in a scenario where I'd have to leave my country I wouldn't care about its passport anymore.

[Ibian]

Has there been a massive MSM outrage yet? Against the letter?

Far right, hardcore anti-immigration senator from Australia? Unlikely there will be.

But the idea that somehow immigrants are responsible for their own unprovoked, cold-blooded murder is fucking sickening.

And accurate.

You don't have to like it, but it is a fact that Islam is fundamentally incompatible with western culture. They have no business here. And no place at all to play victims.

So let me get this straight: you're saying they deserved to be massacred? And being a victim of a massacre isn't an appropriate time to "play victim"?

Yes. And their little children too, they are all part of the same group.

But not their dogs.

And no, I am not joking. The dogs did nothing wrong.

[Ibian]

We will relatively soon get to a point where people will be able to create their vision at will (at first digitally only), and value will be derived based on how capable a person is to create an experience of interest to others.

I've already seen other people bring up this shitcoiner topic before, that EVERYONE will have their own coin that derives value from what they produce or whatever.  Assuming you could even make it work with all the interchangeability problems, most people simply produce nothing, so it's like....lol?  You are aware of the term bread and circus right?  

Welfare is money you bribe poor people with so they don't murder you in your sleep and take your stuff.  In that regard, any change back to a non-fantasy land, fraudulent monetary system is probably going to involve enormous taxes on 'the haves' to distribute bread to the people who produce nothing to stop them from burning down the planet.  Well, actually, just the cost of handing out food would be low and not requiring enormous taxes, but that assumes you completely abolish the entire military money laundering scam, medicare money laundering scam, and all other fraudulent govt programs.

By digitally only I mean that people will create virtual worlds and experiences that others will choose to consume. Similar to Youtube, Twitch and Patreon today but on a much larger scale.

Costs are on an exponential downward slope for any physically produced good that the government or other such players don't have their hands in. As such, there will be no need for labour in the traditional sense. And value and money will literally just be brownie points exchanged between different parties. For this even shitcoins would fit the bill. But I think that something like Bitcoin will be the common denominator, as central bank fiat currencies are inflating too much.

It's going to most likely be the exact opposite.  Instead of only intellectual property having value, things like manual labor will probably make a LARGE comeback with the collapse of EROI in the oil industry.  The books are ALL cooked on this stuff, but a lot of sources claim the EROI is already lower than what is required to maintain an industrial civilization in the first place and there is no real substitute for oil.  

I personally think the govt is subsidizing the price of oil/oil industry right now as a stealth form of helicopter money.  So the question of:  hey, what do we do with all these people who don't know how to program or whatever the fuck?  Will probably fix itself.  They might end up chopping logs or working in a field or something.

What kind of labour exactly do you see so valuable when oil collapses?

Been thinking about this actually. What are machines? Substitutes for slaves. Machines are the reason we no longer have slavery. Oil runs out, electricity runs out, what do? Slavery might just make a comeback, in some form or other (other than the wage slavery we already have).

[Arriemoller]

Why would we run out of electricity?
We have been producing electricity for over 100 years now, during countless wars and crisis, and with many different methods. Sure there might be temporary blackouts locally, but a total, for ever, worldwide blackout? Not gonna happen.

[vapourminer]

re: infofronts "fuckyoucoiner" poll

my answer is based on todays value of ~$4k USD.

voted 200-499

reason is less than 200 btc is currently worth less than 1 mil USD (800k) max. now, combined with my other assets that possibly could meet minimum "set for life" money (although i would have to be careful) baring catastrophic collapse of fiat or other large scale unforeseen collapse of local civilization. although it could survive some fairly major "shit hits the fan things." largely because i already have a lot of what i need and all is paid off, in good repair, common failure mode spare parts, plus a decent amount of common maintenance stuff like tools, fuel, oil, filters are already purchased. stuff is well taken care of, and i have gone through a LOT of more or less worst case scenarios in my head, test my infrastructure and backup systems regularly, and modify things as real world testing indicates. a couple real world tests have validated my setups (tornado, week long power outage).

but to me thats not really "fuckyoucoiner" level. as you really have to e careful who you say "fuck you" to (aside from JJG on "fuckyou thursday" of course ).

so, at todays ~4k price i voted 200 - 499. so 800k-2 mil. split the difference, say 1.5 mil. combined with what i have that translates into being pretty comfortable. should allow a good sized cushion against much unforeseen stuff, still allow a pretty good lifestyle with the option of discretionary buying of toys and such. provides a decent amount of "fuck you" to things.

keep in mind that im older. younger people would need more as it needs to last longer. and if btc moons, well infofront will need a new poll.

[xhomerx10]

Actually you might have persuaded me that 2 + 2 doesn’t necessarily equal 4.  You might have gotten me there.

I haven’t responded because I am still thinking about it.  To your point, it’s not a topic I know a lot about.

 Just to add to the shades of grey; the numeral 4 doesn't even exist in base 2 and 3 number systems and while it exists in the base 4 number system as a descriptor,  2+2=10

edit: Help!  I've fallen behind in the thread and I can't catch up.

[Wilhelm]

Why would we run out of electricity?
We have been producing electricity for over 100 years now, during countless wars and crisis, and with many different methods. Sure there might be temporary blackouts locally, but a total, for ever, worldwide blackout? Not gonna happen.

EMPs, magnetic pole shift, solar flare....
It could happen... Remote chance but it could happen....

[realr0ach]

Do you not understand that most labor in modern civilization is done by machines and much of that is oil powered?  It requires a human doing physical labor for 12 years to equal one barrel of oil.  This is where all the huge increase in qualify of life came from for humans.  The oil barrels are your black servants so to speak.  You remove oil from the equation and humans themselves are going to be doing a lot more of the work.  Here's some math/engineering on it:

https://fatcatwatch.wordpress.com/2011/04/30/abarrel-of-crude-is-worth-164000/

Warning:  blog is written by a lunatic Marxist, but I think his math on oil checks out.  He claimed a world run by women that disenfranchises men would have less wars.  I think female rulers actually started more wars per capita but not sure.  Females do not really care about if men live or die so wouldn't be surprised if they were more careless in sending them off to their deaths.

Again, just because we use oil right now doesn't mean we have to. We have a myriad of options with different trade offs. Nuclear power is the easiest solution. But there are others.

That takes years...decades...to transition to.  Our civilizations are run by demonic Jews that do not give a flying shit about the welfare of any of the inhabitants, only how much they can steal from or enslave you.  Actually planning for the future would decrease how much they can steal from you in the present, so it's not done.  Or as Max Keiser calls them, suicide bankers.  The plan is always to scam everyone possible and then outsource the cost of the catastrophe to someone else like the 'taxpayer'.  

If the cost of not spending money to build things like these highly effective, mirror array solar collectors everywhere is the complete collapse of civilization because they would rather steal the money instead, well, that's Talmudic Jewry for you:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivanpah_Solar_Power_Facility

[Ibian]

Why would we run out of electricity?
We have been producing electricity for over 100 years now, during countless wars and crisis, and with many different methods. Sure there might be temporary blackouts locally, but a total, for ever, worldwide blackout? Not gonna happen.

We have been producing electricity for ONLY about 100 years. Oil and coal are the driving force behind it. We have plenty of coal allegedly, but you forget what I have been talking about recently. People today have fucking small amygdalas. We WANT to die as a group. People are gonna obstruct the use of profitable power with ethics and other bullshit while people are dying. Solar and wind is simply not enough for our current lifestyle.

[Ibian]

Has there been a massive MSM outrage yet? Against the letter?

Far right, hardcore anti-immigration senator from Australia? Unlikely there will be.

But the idea that somehow immigrants are responsible for their own unprovoked, cold-blooded murder is fucking sickening.

And accurate.

You don't have to like it, but it is a fact that Islam is fundamentally incompatible with western culture. They have no business here. And no place at all to play victims.

So let me get this straight: you're saying they deserved to be massacred? And being a victim of a massacre isn't an appropriate time to "play victim"?

Yes. And their little children too, they are all part of the same group.

But not their dogs.

And no, I am not joking. The dogs did nothing wrong.

I wonder how someone could be intelligent enough to open an account on this forum but then retarded enough to condone a massacre of innocent people.

Thank you for your emotional ourburst. It was exactly what I expected. As a wise person once said, NPCs are gonna NPC.

Can you explain, with facts and numbers and cause and effect, why I am wrong? Your personal emotions in this moment are not evidence of anything.

[realr0ach]

We have plenty of coal allegedly

Supposedly 100 years of coal in the US, but I don't know many people with coal powered cars.  So yea, shouldn't be a problem powering buildings in the US with a combination of coal and nuclear, but there's no substitute for oil to power the cars.  The future I imagine for the west is an oil shock and a large societal shift to where western countries are going to be riding around on little motorcycles that consume small amounts of gas like they do in Asian countries.  Then some electric cars here and there, with the big gas guzzlers only being used to transport food or other materials.

As for this ArrieMoller and Trollgoossens guy, Europe has just about no fossil fuels, so you guys are cucked unless you beg Putin to not let you die.

[Arriemoller]

Has there been a massive MSM outrage yet? Against the letter?

Far right, hardcore anti-immigration senator from Australia? Unlikely there will be.

But the idea that somehow immigrants are responsible for their own unprovoked, cold-blooded murder is fucking sickening.

And accurate.

You don't have to like it, but it is a fact that Islam is fundamentally incompatible with western culture. They have no business here. And no place at all to play victims.

So let me get this straight: you're saying they deserved to be massacred? And being a victim of a massacre isn't an appropriate time to "play victim"?

Yes. And their little children too, they are all part of the same group.

But not their dogs.

And no, I am not joking. The dogs did nothing wrong.

I wonder how someone could be intelligent enough to open an account on this forum but then retarded enough to condone a massacre of innocent people.

If you adhere to a religion that condones and even encourages terrorism and slaughter of anyone that holds another opinion then your own, you are not innocent.