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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2029003 times)
in2tactics
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March 31, 2016, 01:50:51 PM
 #14461

It seems to me that as the difficulty increases the overall p2pool hashrate decreases. Why is that?

Active... 2x AntMiner S7-LN, 4x AntMiner S3, and 5x AntMiner U1
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organofcorti
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March 31, 2016, 09:50:33 PM
 #14462

It seems to me that as the difficulty increases the overall p2pool hashrate decreases. Why is that?

Network difficulty increases as the network hashrate increases, so perhaps miners on p2pool are just keeping up with the rest of the network.

Bitcoin network and pool analysis 12QxPHEuxDrs7mCyGSx1iVSozTwtquDB3r
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Songminer
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March 31, 2016, 10:27:32 PM
 #14463

It seems to me that as the difficulty increases the overall p2pool hashrate decreases. Why is that?

Less miners equals less hash rate.  Down to 136 from over 250 only months ago.  The culprit is the 3 day work drop-out.  That period should be based on average days to block, IMO, although that might not be feasible.
in2tactics
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April 01, 2016, 02:12:06 AM
 #14464

It seems to me that as the difficulty increases the overall p2pool hashrate decreases. Why is that?

Network difficulty increases as the network hashrate increases, so perhaps miners on p2pool are just keeping up with the rest of the network.

@organofcorti  Ummm, I was asking for people's thoughts regarding why p2pool's hashrate is decreasing as the the network difficulty is increasing which is not the same as p2pool keeping up with the rest of the network. It is quite the opposite actually.

It seems to me that as the difficulty increases the overall p2pool hashrate decreases. Why is that?
Less miners equals less hash rate.  Down to 136 from over 250 only months ago.  The culprit is the 3 day work drop-out.  That period should be based on average days to block, IMO, although that might not be feasible.

@Songminer  3 day work drop-out?

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jonnybravo0311
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April 01, 2016, 02:15:53 AM
 #14465

P2Pool has a share life of either three days or three times the average work to find a block, whichever is lower.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
in2tactics
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April 01, 2016, 02:21:11 AM
 #14466

P2Pool has a share life of either three days or three times the average work to find a block, whichever is lower.

Thanks, I was not familiar with the specific algorithm for share life.

Active... 2x AntMiner S7-LN, 4x AntMiner S3, and 5x AntMiner U1
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April 01, 2016, 01:38:24 PM
 #14467

P2Pool has a share life of either three days or three times the average work to find a block, whichever is lower.

Thanks, I was not familiar with the specific algorithm for share life.

Is it time to increase the Three day limit to Seven to be more realistic of current block time; and, if it is, is this something that can be changed slowly as part of a natural rollout or would it require a hard cutover ?
donatebitcointome
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April 01, 2016, 02:05:14 PM
 #14468

After reading ck and jonny explanation about difficulty scaling issue, isn't it the time to move to other pool ?

p2pool is a great concept but unless the dev come up with a solution for difficulty scaling. It can't go any further.
Maybe it couldn't be fix, who knows...

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krisgt30
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April 01, 2016, 02:50:53 PM
 #14469

There are plenty pools that could use your hash power:

Kano's pool
Bitminter
Johnnybravo's pool
BCMonster


www.bcmonster.com Bitcoin Mining Pool - [PPLNS / pays TX]  / Easy Live Dashboard / Help us get up to 1PH. Donate: 1QGZQBhXMo2jVc45wLEsp2bn5agF8SZSuY
windpath
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April 02, 2016, 02:14:57 PM
 #14470

After reading ck and jonny explanation about difficulty scaling issue, isn't it the time to move to other pool ?

p2pool is a great concept but unless the dev come up with a solution for difficulty scaling. It can't go any further.
Maybe it couldn't be fix, who knows...

Interesting there are suddenly a bunch of noob accounts encouraging folks to jump ship...

The scaling issue is only an issue if p2pool has substantially more hash rate then it currently does.

The current problem is our hash rate is simply to low to find regular blocks, 1 decent sized miner can fix that.

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April 07, 2016, 12:12:03 PM
 #14471

Nice to see a bit more hashrate in the pool

smooth
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April 09, 2016, 02:41:58 AM
 #14472

ck, could you kind enough to explain to me about this scaling issue, preferably in noob wording lol...
In a regular pool, the more hashrate the pool has, the less variation there is in each miner's payouts. In p2pool it is biphasic. Initially as the hashrate of the pool increases your variation decreases, and then as the hashrate gets larger again, variation starts increasing again. If all miners were on p2pool, it'd be like they were solo mining at 1/20th of the current network diff which would be horrific variation. It's one of the limitations of the p2pool design that's been talked about, thrashed out and debated about for years on end without a solution.

Isn't an easy solution to too much p2pool participation just to have multiple separate p2pools? I think there are some alts where p2pool got really popular which have done that.

The game theory on this works quite nicely in fact, since being on a p2pool that is too small or too big are both undesirable, so miners will tend to spread out.

Of course, the current problem is too little participation, not too much.
donatebitcointome
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April 09, 2016, 04:21:18 AM
 #14473

Isn't an easy solution to too much p2pool participation just to have multiple separate p2pools? I think there are some alts where p2pool got really popular which have done that.

The game theory on this works quite nicely in fact, since being on a p2pool that is too small or too big are both undesirable, so miners will tend to spread out.

Of course, the current problem is too little participation, not too much.

Yeah separate p2pool is one of the idea I think.

That is true, spread out miner is good I think.

This is the biggest problem of all in p2pool. Lets face it, why do we buy ASIC miner? I believe the one who buy ASIC miner already done some research and reading how many btc we could get with the miner, how much electricity cost, etc. How long will ROI... current p2pool payout is based on 3 days worth of share. but with the pool current hash rate, it will hit the block around 10-12 days (according to what was written on the web front end). I don't think you can cover your electricity cost with this unless you have either super unbelievable cheap or free electricity.

I don't know how high the hash rate in p2pool to make the difficulty undesirable but as of this posting date, if it can reach at least 50 Ph/s and it still desirable (good variation) then it should be all good.

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Meuh6879
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April 09, 2016, 09:04:13 PM
 #14474


French ... but not so much   ---===---   P2P ... it's people at the end   ---===---   P2Pool (10,9 GH/s).
Comment miner des bitcoins ? Un tutoriel est là : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1114415.0
Bitcoin change everything ... an explain of this fact : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joITmEr4SjY
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April 11, 2016, 12:21:34 AM
 #14475

Hey we found a block! Smiley

Of course I'm out of town and my site is reporting it incorrectly as one orphan and one found block, I'll get it sorted on Friday when I return, but hey, we found a block!

donatebitcointome
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April 15, 2016, 03:26:26 AM
 #14476

Block....

Did P2Pool just mine empty block?

https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930

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forrestv
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April 15, 2016, 03:45:20 AM
 #14477


When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.

The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/

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-ck
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Ruu \o/


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April 15, 2016, 03:49:07 AM
 #14478


When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.

The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/

Check the times of the blocks:
Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306  height=407354  log2_work=84.48832
  tx=122495865  date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000  cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930  height=407355  log2_work=84.48836
1  tx=122495866  date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000  cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...

Primary developer/maintainer for cgminer and ckpool/ckproxy.
Pooled mine at kano.is, solo mine at solo.ckpool.org
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in2tactics
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April 15, 2016, 03:49:49 AM
 #14479

Whoops!

Active... 2x AntMiner S7-LN, 4x AntMiner S3, and 5x AntMiner U1
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in2tactics
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April 15, 2016, 03:50:50 AM
 #14480

Check the times of the blocks:
Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306  height=407354  log2_work=84.48832
  tx=122495865  date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000  cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930  height=407355  log2_work=84.48836
1  tx=122495866  date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000  cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...

So, what do you think happened?

Active... 2x AntMiner S7-LN, 4x AntMiner S3, and 5x AntMiner U1
Collecting Dust... 2x ASICMiner Block Erupter Cube, 4x AntMiner S1, GAW Black Widow, and ZeusMiner Thunder X6
Needing RMA (but too lazy)... 2x R9 280x and 2x R7 270x // Coin Interests... BTC, LTC, DOGE
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