Off-Topic

[kkooks]

Some nice shitstorm happens here.
We are where we are.
If TH made that they said, they done all perfect.

Avalon clones from china, which i seen link here before in thread is scam,
there are also mistical customers from Spain who got chips apart from Zefir B1, but maybe it's just urban legends.
gen2 will not arrive in september, then another 8-10 weeks lead time.

Question is in chips only

Correct me if i'm wrong

Thanks

We seem to be making progress with project management issues--

Terrahash-- please work to close out the open issues that your company is responsible for before 8/15.
Should you fail to complete those obligations by then, my project management skills wont help your case beyond that date.
1. PSUs (open ETA TBD)
2. Cases (open ETA TBD)
3. Head Sinks (open ETA TBD)
4. PCBs (open ETA TBD)
5. Board BOM (closed)
6. Avalon (closed)

If you cannot meet the 8/15 date, be sure to issue a Force Majeure letter to your customers immediately as well.
This will help your case in court when you fail to deliver.

Also, in your Force Majeure letter, include the option for your customers to opt for a partial shipment (if case + psu was ordered). Include basic visual installation instructions for when the completed, fully populated boards are delivered so that your customers can DIY. Cost of shipment should be footed by your company at 100% obviously but you will recover much more in labor, time, and public relations.

[atomicchaos]

Taking money and not offering any refunds up until 2-3 month after estimated delivery is "Slimy"

Taking money and offering a refund until shipping starts is not "slimy"

+1 - Glad we agree. Although, I would add changing the refund policy right before taking orders and then stating that they would consider refunds in the forums as slightly slimy.

[Vigil]

Bottom line is they have a responsibility to require that Avalon compensate them for damages but they are silent and have no intention of doing so.

[kkooks]

Taking money and not offering any refunds up until 2-3 month after estimated delivery is "Slimy"

Taking money and offering a refund until shipping starts is not "slimy"

+1 - Glad we agree. Although, I would add changing the refund policy right before taking orders and then stating that they would consider refunds in the forums as slightly slimy.

exactly...

IMHO

in the event that he refuses a full refund to customers that decide to forego the wait after the committed 8/15 date, the loss of profit to us + paid monies + interest should be fully recoverable (if we can prove that the intent of terrahash was never to deliver on time)

In many ways, we are helping terrahash ensure his exposure for trying to do the "right thing" is fair.
As long as he follows through with all obligations other than Avalon issues at this point he should be in good shape...

(I've not even gone through his other exposures yet-- does he have the labor in place to assemble. Has he proven out on the production rate whereby the delivery timing can be met. Has he conducted sufficient training with his staff etc etc etc)

...BTW avalon should hire some legal counsel.

[MinermanNC]

For me, I want the Klondikes.  Not refunds preferably. And after that I want to reorder more from TH. I'm giving it another 1-2 weeks on the chips and for more accurate info on time frame. yifu said they will begin shipping late this week. So lets see. I'm sure TH wants them as badly as we do.

[MinermanNC]

Taking money and not offering any refunds up until 2-3 month after estimated delivery is "Slimy"

Taking money and offering a refund until shipping starts is not "slimy"

+1 - Glad we agree. Although, I would add changing the refund policy right before taking orders and then stating that they would consider refunds in the forums as slightly slimy.

exactly...

IMHO

in the event that he refuses a full refund to customers that decide to forego the wait after the committed 8/15 date, the loss of profit to us + paid monies + interest should be fully recoverable (if we can prove that the intent of terrahash was never to deliver on time)

In many ways, we are helping terrahash ensure his exposure for trying to do the "right thing" is fair.
As long as he follows through with all obligations other than Avalon issues at this point he should be in good shape...

(I've not even gone through his other exposures yet-- does he have the labor in place to assemble. Has he proven out on the production rate whereby the delivery timing can be met. Has he conducted sufficient training with his staff etc etc etc)

...BTW avalon should hire some legal counsel.

What was your order # with TH and how many chips total are you committed to? if you don't mind sharing that with us

[Vigil]

For me, I want the Klondikes.  Not refunds preferably. And after that I want to reorder more from TH. I'm giving it another 1-2 weeks on the chips and for more accurate info on time frame. yifu said they will begin shipping late this week. So lets see. I'm sure TH wants them as badly as we do.

Then why aren't they putting pressure on Avalon to compensate for not meeting their deadline?

[kendog77]

Bottom line is they have a responsibility to require that Avalon compensate them for damages but they are silent and have no intention of doing so.

How do you know what Terrahash is or isn't doing? You do realize that things do happen that aren't posted on the bitcointalk internet forum, right?

[Vigil]

Bottom line is they have a responsibility to require that Avalon compensate them for damages but they are silent and have no intention of doing so.

How do you know what Terrahash is or isn't doing? You do realize that things do happen that aren't posted on the bitcointalk internet forum, right?

Where are these things posted? And don't they have an obligation to tell customers what sorts of deals they may or may not be arranging? We are the ones that need to be compensated. Its not a damn secret, they can send out an email to let us know they are in talks with Avalon over the situation. Or they could say "we are in talks but we can't discuss this info until everything is agreed to."

[Vigil]

What don't you understand about there is nothing to talk to Avalon about.

If you try to threaten them, they delay your chips and you are royally screwed.

If you try to contact them they don't pick up or reply.

Maybe you don't understand the concept of being held by the nuts.

 

Do you think Terrahash wants this delay? You have to be NUTS, they stand to make a ton of money from mounting peoples chips.

Go read a nice long book I recommend this for you, by the time you are done Avalon will have delivered the chips and you can decide what to do from there.

Of course there is. They missed their contractual deadline. If Avalon doesn't want to answer the phone then TerraHash and the group buys need to get a lawyer to force talks with them.  How hard is that for you to understand. Avalon isn't going to want a lawsuit so they will compromise and make-up for lost time. they don't have to actually go through the whole process of litigation, they can negotiate.

[Vigil]

What don't you understand about there is nothing to talk to Avalon about.

If you try to threaten them, they delay your chips and you are royally screwed.

If you try to contact them they don't pick up or reply.

Maybe you don't understand the concept of being held by the nuts.

 

Do you think Terrahash wants this delay? You have to be NUTS, they stand to make a ton of money from mounting peoples chips.

Go read a nice long book I recommend this for you, by the time you are done Avalon will have delivered the chips and you can decide what to do from there.

Of course there is. They missed their contractual deadline. If Avalon doesn't want to answer the phone then TerraHash and the group buys need to get a lawyer to force talks with them.  How hard is that for you to understand. Avalon isn't going to want a lawsuit so they will compromise and make-up for lost time. they don't have to actually go through the whole process of litigation, they can negotiate.

First, if they were even a US Based Company (I believe they are a Chinese Company) even if you "lawyered" up, it would take years to come to any sort of conclusion or remedy.

Secondly, if they are a Chinese based company they will literally laugh at you if you mention the word lawyer.

Sorry but this is how is it.

Also someone already suggested this, do you really think you can "Out lawyer" them when they are sitting on 70,000 bitcoins?

Avalon is a US based company. It would not take years it would take like a week or two once everyone was together and decided what they were going for. Stop spreading FUD. The only point is to put some pressure on Avalon to compensate for their wrong-doing. It would be the cheapest route for them. Right now he is just laughing cause no one has the balls to make it happen. So he hangs up and doesn't answer messages. If I had the money I would just sue the total fuck out of him and completely bankrupt any chances he has of ever getting anywhere for fun.

[kkooks]

What don't you understand about there is nothing to talk to Avalon about.

If you try to threaten them, they delay your chips and you are royally screwed.

If you try to contact them they don't pick up or reply.

Maybe you don't understand the concept of being held by the nuts.

 

Do you think Terrahash wants this delay? You have to be NUTS, they stand to make a ton of money from mounting peoples chips.

Go read a nice long book I recommend this for you, by the time you are done Avalon will have delivered the chips and you can decide what to do from there.

Of course there is. They missed their contractual deadline. If Avalon doesn't want to answer the phone then TerraHash and the group buys need to get a lawyer to force talks with them.  How hard is that for you to understand. Avalon isn't going to want a lawsuit so they will compromise and make-up for lost time. they don't have to actually go through the whole process of litigation, they can negotiate.

First, if they were even a US Based Company (I believe they are a Chinese Company) even if you "lawyered" up, it would take years to come to any sort of conclusion or remedy.

Secondly, if they are a Chinese based company they will literally laugh at you if you mention the word lawyer.

Sorry but this is how is it.

Also someone already suggested this, do you really think you can "Out lawyer" them when they are sitting on 70,000 bitcoins?

yeah... I understand what you are saying... I dont know how accurate your statements are... but always remember
"All that it takes for evil to prevail, is for good men to do nothing"

So this is really a business decision that Amir will have to make--

Terrahash has an obligation to us
Avalon to Terrahash

[MinermanNC]

What don't you understand about there is nothing to talk to Avalon about.

If you try to threaten them, they delay your chips and you are royally screwed.

If you try to contact them they don't pick up or reply.

Maybe you don't understand the concept of being held by the nuts.

 

Do you think Terrahash wants this delay? You have to be NUTS, they stand to make a ton of money from mounting peoples chips.

Go read a nice long book I recommend this for you, by the time you are done Avalon will have delivered the chips and you can decide what to do from there.

Of course there is. They missed their contractual deadline. If Avalon doesn't want to answer the phone then TerraHash and the group buys need to get a lawyer to force talks with them.  How hard is that for you to understand. Avalon isn't going to want a lawsuit so they will compromise and make-up for lost time. they don't have to actually go through the whole process of litigation, they can negotiate.

First, if they were even a US Based Company (I believe they are a Chinese Company) even if you "lawyered" up, it would take years to come to any sort of conclusion or remedy.

Secondly, if they are a Chinese based company they will literally laugh at you if you mention the word lawyer.

Sorry but this is how is it.

Also someone already suggested this, do you really think you can "Out lawyer" them when they are sitting on 70,000 bitcoins?

Avalon is a US based company. It would not take years it would take like a week or two once everyone was together and decided what they were going for. Stop spreading FUD. The only point is to put some pressure on Avalon to compensate for their wrong-doing. It would be the cheapest route for them. Right now he is just laughing cause no one has the balls to make it happen. So he hangs up and doesn't answer messages. If I had the money I would just sue the total fuck out of him and completely bankrupt any chances he has of ever getting anywhere for fun.

I sure as hell hope you didn't order anything from BFL! lol, what we are going through is childs play compared to that mess...I dont recall reading about anyone suing applying pressure, threatening them etc etc etc them???  excuse me, dillweed

[Vigil]

All the group buys have to do is force Yifu and Avalon into face to face talks and place some legitimate damage compensation remedies on the table then move forward with what that will be. Yifu is going to play ball because it is too stupid not to. He made mad profit off this he can return a few percent of it back to counter the losses.  Its not that big of a deal if people will just make it happen. Who wouldn't do that? Its baffling.

I sure as hell hope you didn't order anything from BFL! lol, what we are going through is childs play compared to that mess...I dont recall reading about anyone suing them???  

I never said dick about a lawsuit, stop dropping strawmen argument in here. You are such an ignorant shillbag.

Bicknellski is the only one I have heard actually try to get anything going, everyone is quiet as a dead baby.

[ak49er]

I'm simply amazed at the naivety and unrealistic expectations in this thread.  On the one hand people willingly gave money for a product that didn't exist in an industry with a track record fostered by the likes of BFL.  They want Terrahash to be totally professional and above board, which is understandable, but on the other hand they want them to divulge all kinds of information that no professional company would ever dream of doing.  I'm not in the least bit surprised that Terrahash remains mostly silent on much of what's being asked of them.

From what I can tell the main question is when will you ship.  And the answer hasn't changed since day one - two weeks after we get the chips from Avalon.

But I gotta tell you this.  It makes for some excellent reading!

[Vigil]

I'm simply amazed at the naivety and unrealistic expectations in this thread.  On the one hand people willingly gave money for a product that didn't exist in an industry with a track record fostered by the likes of BFL.  They want Terrahash to be totally professional and above board, which is understandable, but on the other hand they want them to divulge all kinds of information that no professional company would ever dream of doing.  I'm not in the least bit surprised that Terrahash remains mostly silent on much of what's being asked of them.

From what I can tell the main question is when will you ship.  And the answer hasn't changed since day one - two weeks after we get the chips from Avalon.

But I gotta tell you this.  It makes for some excellent reading!

"Divulging information that no professional company....?"

WTF is this?

[MinermanNC]

All the group buys have to do is force Yifu and Avalon into face to face talks and place some legitimate damage compensation remedies on the table then move forward with what that will be. Yifu is going to play ball because it is too stupid not to. He made mad profit off this he can return a few percent of it back to counter the losses.  Its not that big of a deal if people will just make it happen. Who wouldn't do that? Its baffling.

I sure as hell hope you didn't order anything from BFL! lol, what we are going through is childs play compared to that mess...I dont recall reading about anyone suing them???  

I never said dick about a lawsuit, stop dropping strawmen argument in here. You are such an ignorant shillbag.

Bicknellski is the only one I have heard actually try to get anything going, everyone is quiet as a dead baby.

I know im just so dumb I am clueless, and I know that you and you alone only knows everything about what ought to be done, forgive me for ever doubting your wonderfull depth and wisdom on such complex matters,,,what are you 19 or something? lol lil wussy please leave here now vagil before i call the cops on ya
EDIT: your nothing other than a loud mouth trouble maker lately! we know your kind

[kkooks]

Oh dear-- lets redirect our energy toward piecing Terrahash together from their project management fiasco
#1 Goal
Keep terrahash accountable for their obligations to us so that they dont turn into BFL or have a severe PR crisis like Avalon
#2 WE need to create a success story outta Terrahash because the world is watching BTC and losing faith (scams, drugs, tax evasion etc etc)

We are all vested in the success of BTC are we not?

[Vigil]

All the group buys have to do is force Yifu and Avalon into face to face talks and place some legitimate damage compensation remedies on the table then move forward with what that will be. Yifu is going to play ball because it is too stupid not to. He made mad profit off this he can return a few percent of it back to counter the losses.  Its not that big of a deal if people will just make it happen. Who wouldn't do that? Its baffling.

I sure as hell hope you didn't order anything from BFL! lol, what we are going through is childs play compared to that mess...I dont recall reading about anyone suing them???  

I never said dick about a lawsuit, stop dropping strawmen argument in here. You are such an ignorant shillbag.

Bicknellski is the only one I have heard actually try to get anything going, everyone is quiet as a dead baby.

I know im just so dumb I am clueless, and I know that you and you alone only knows everything about what ought to be done, forgive me for ever doubting your wonderfull depth and wisdom on such complex matters,,,what are you 19 or something? lol lil wussy please leave here now vagil before i call the cops on ya
EDIT: your nothing other than a loud mouth trouble maker lately! we know your kind

You are forgiven.

[ak49er]

"Divulging information that no professional company....?"

WTF is this?

Do you seriously think that Terrahash is under any obligation to post pictures of POs?  Or even parts come to that?  Or to discuss any negotiations they may be in with any supplier for any parts large or small?  Whether said supplier is on time or late?

Either way it makes no odds to me, as I chose not to pre-order.  They still look like the best bet if they ever manage to get some in stock, and that's when I'll buy.