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Author Topic: [ANN][Pool][Profit-Switch][Optional Auto-Exchange per Coin][Vardiff] ~ Hashcows  (Read 347313 times)
2RoyalSox
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December 08, 2013, 10:06:11 PM
 #1121

I really like the new unexchanged estimate, clears up some of the black magic the cows do behind the scenes when calculating my payouts :p
Aphos
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December 09, 2013, 12:23:01 AM
 #1122

Did the dolphins leave yet?
Yup. But at least they thanked us for all the fish.
alientida
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December 09, 2013, 03:56:51 AM
 #1123

Any update on an API? I really want to start mining here, but dont want to leave my workers without a way for me to check on them
aTriz
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December 09, 2013, 04:00:51 AM
 #1124

Any update on an API? I really want to start mining here, but dont want to leave my workers without a way for me to check on them

I think with so many requests we kinda focused on getting the "Est Unexchanged" up first.

I'll speak with nearmiss tonight and see if I can get a ETA for you.

*UPDATE*

Well that was quick, expect a API within a week Smiley

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December 09, 2013, 05:19:07 AM
 #1125


There are a ton of round that say 0 blocks found right now, according to the tracker.

The dev response sounds like this happens fairly often. It should almost never happen.

Just providing the math as to why its almost always pointless to change mid-block.

Wrong, just plain wrong.

It is most profitable in the long run to always mine the most profitable coin. Variance will always even out in the long run, you just need to understand probability. Start by reading this thread from the beginning and also the multipool.us thread where it has been addresses many times before.



Call me wrong and provide no math. Really? I have a masters degree in statistics. I'm pretty sure I understand probability.

I just proved decisively why it's wrong. Are you daft? If you don't understand the math, don't spout nonsense out of your mouth.

It is more profitable to mine the most profitable coin, but you absolutely have to take into consideration how long each block takes. If you swap around mining and never mine a block because you switch before you have the chance you will make zero dollars because you never mine any coins. Yes, as your pool has a greater overall hashing rate this becomes less important as you will find blocks relatively rapidly, but for some of these coins the time per block is hours even for a pool of this size. If you are swapping between them the moment one is more profitable and not taking into consideration the time invested into a block, you are just wasting your time.

You know what, because you don't understand, let me give you an example that's easy enough for anyone to grasp.

Imagine it takes 10 years to mine a single block for every coin out there. You get no coins until you mine a block - I imagine you understand this. Trading is going to make coins more profitable then others during different times of the day. If you even switch only once per day, you will never, ever, receive any coins. Period. Because the chance of mining a 10 year long block in a single day is essentially zero. So over 10 years, if you switch every day, you will make $0. Alternatively, if you stick with one coin, even the least profitable, your profits will be greater than zero. Understand now? You need to use a formula (like the one I proposed) to take into consideration the time you spent on a block and the average time to mine a block (remember that portion about probability? there's a reason I chose average, and used standard deviations and they happen to be related directly to probability and if you had taken introductory statistics, you would know this) as well as the average time to mine a block of the more profitable coin in order to make a good decision on whether you should change coins. It's only profitable relative to time, and if you already invested a lot of time in a coin and have yielded no blocks, the additional time often has a higher profitability than the time that could be spent on another coin.
breel
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December 09, 2013, 05:56:28 AM
 #1126

What you wrote makes sense, but I am still not fully sure.
I do agree that time to find a block should be part of the equation.
But it seems that some times (I have no idea how often) it would be wise to move to another coin, even if that means trashing all the time currently spent on another coin.
Maybe the current coin needs to have a bonus depending on the time we've been on it?

Apart from that, my vote too for getting paid in LTC!
TheQuin
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December 09, 2013, 06:09:59 AM
 #1127


There are a ton of round that say 0 blocks found right now, according to the tracker.

The dev response sounds like this happens fairly often. It should almost never happen.

Just providing the math as to why its almost always pointless to change mid-block.

Wrong, just plain wrong.

It is most profitable in the long run to always mine the most profitable coin. Variance will always even out in the long run, you just need to understand probability. Start by reading this thread from the beginning and also the multipool.us thread where it has been addresses many times before.



Call me wrong and provide no math. Really? I have a masters degree in statistics. I'm pretty sure I understand probability.

I just proved decisively why it's wrong. Are you daft? If you don't understand the math, don't spout nonsense out of your mouth.

It is more profitable to mine the most profitable coin, but you absolutely have to take into consideration how long each block takes. If you swap around mining and never mine a block because you switch before you have the chance you will make zero dollars because you never mine any coins. Yes, as your pool has a greater overall hashing rate this becomes less important as you will find blocks relatively rapidly, but for some of these coins the time per block is hours even for a pool of this size. If you are swapping between them the moment one is more profitable and not taking into consideration the time invested into a block, you are just wasting your time.

You know what, because you don't understand, let me give you an example that's easy enough for anyone to grasp.

Imagine it takes 10 years to mine a single block for every coin out there. You get no coins until you mine a block - I imagine you understand this. Trading is going to make coins more profitable then others during different times of the day. If you even switch only once per day, you will never, ever, receive any coins. Period. Because the chance of mining a 10 year long block in a single day is essentially zero. So over 10 years, if you switch every day, you will make $0. Alternatively, if you stick with one coin, even the least profitable, your profits will be greater than zero. Understand now? You need to use a formula (like the one I proposed) to take into consideration the time you spent on a block and the average time to mine a block (remember that portion about probability? there's a reason I chose average, and used standard deviations and they happen to be related directly to probability and if you had taken introductory statistics, you would know this) as well as the average time to mine a block of the more profitable coin in order to make a good decision on whether you should change coins. It's only profitable relative to time, and if you already invested a lot of time in a coin and have yielded no blocks, the additional time often has a higher profitability than the time that could be spent on another coin.

Still completely wrong.

If for example it takes 60 minutes to find a block on average it would make no difference if you mine 6 periods of 10 minutes each in a day or a single period of 60 minutes. You will have still submitted the same number of shares with exactly the same chance of finding a block. Staying on a coin until you find a block when it is no longer the most profitable coin makes absolutely no sense at all.


freebitcoin.TO WIN A  LAMBORGHINI!..

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2RoyalSox
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December 09, 2013, 06:28:55 AM
 #1128

I believe the cows pay out for rounds where nothing was found too, as in they just apply the shares towards the next round
TheQuin
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December 09, 2013, 06:35:00 AM
 #1129

What you wrote makes sense, but I am still not fully sure.
I do agree that time to find a block should be part of the equation.
But it seems that some times (I have no idea how often) it would be wise to move to another coin, even if that means trashing all the time currently spent on another coin.
Maybe the current coin needs to have a bonus depending on the time we've been on it?

Apart from that, my vote too for getting paid in LTC!

You don't trash time spent. Each share submitted is like buying a lottery ticket, each one has exactly the same probability of winning. How many losing tickets you already bought in the past has no effect on the chances of the next one winning. Thinking it does is known as gamblers fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy

freebitcoin.TO WIN A  LAMBORGHINI!..

.
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Sovietaced
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December 09, 2013, 08:25:22 AM
Last edit: December 09, 2013, 09:17:21 AM by Sovietaced
 #1130

Guys, absolutely loving the site so far. I have some feature requests.

I think it would be really valuable if there was more transparency in regards to where fees are taken, the whole payment system seems really vague.

Also I think it would be nice to have a REST API or something. Id like to write some scripts that will alert me when my workers go down Smiley

EDIT: Just scrolled up and saw the API comments, yay Smiley

EDIT #2 : Disregard my initial comment as well, just found the user ledger.
breel
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December 09, 2013, 09:57:54 AM
 #1131

What you wrote makes sense, but I am still not fully sure.
I do agree that time to find a block should be part of the equation.
But it seems that some times (I have no idea how often) it would be wise to move to another coin, even if that means trashing all the time currently spent on another coin.
Maybe the current coin needs to have a bonus depending on the time we've been on it?

Apart from that, my vote too for getting paid in LTC!

You don't trash time spent. Each share submitted is like buying a lottery ticket, each one has exactly the same probability of winning. How many losing tickets you already bought in the past has no effect on the chances of the next one winning. Thinking it does is known as gamblers fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy

Is it because all events are independent?
So even if we have a probability of reaching a goal in N tries, being at N-1 does not represent anything statistically, does it?

Thanks
TheQuin
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December 09, 2013, 10:40:23 AM
 #1132

What you wrote makes sense, but I am still not fully sure.
I do agree that time to find a block should be part of the equation.
But it seems that some times (I have no idea how often) it would be wise to move to another coin, even if that means trashing all the time currently spent on another coin.
Maybe the current coin needs to have a bonus depending on the time we've been on it?

Apart from that, my vote too for getting paid in LTC!

You don't trash time spent. Each share submitted is like buying a lottery ticket, each one has exactly the same probability of winning. How many losing tickets you already bought in the past has no effect on the chances of the next one winning. Thinking it does is known as gamblers fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy

Is it because all events are independent?
So even if we have a probability of reaching a goal in N tries, being at N-1 does not represent anything statistically, does it?

Thanks

Yes. What has happened in the past has no effect on the future. If you just spent an hour mining a coin and got nothing in reward it doesn't mean "we are due a block soon, let's keep going". All the work you have done in that time is already "wasted" and nothing you do now can change the past.
If the difficulty of that coin increased and another coin it fell, so that it is now more profitable, we should switch. It is not the case that if you do n amount of work you will get a block, because chance plays a part, you sometimes have good luck and sometimes bad, that will even out over the course of time.


freebitcoin.TO WIN A  LAMBORGHINI!..

.
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breel
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December 09, 2013, 12:23:46 PM
 #1133

Thanks for the explanation!
cooldgamer
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December 09, 2013, 01:11:55 PM
 #1134

Did the pool go down?  No shares for 10 minutes..

aTriz
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December 09, 2013, 01:15:26 PM
 #1135

Stratum is currently down!

Just a quick reminder for everyone to set failovers. The good news in all of this is there's rumor that a second stratum server is in the works Smiley

ETA: 10-15 minutes

induktor
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December 09, 2013, 01:16:41 PM
 #1136

Did the pool go down?  No shares for 10 minutes..
Yep
My miners switched to backup, pool down Sad

I really love this site, I am going to move more miners here soon.

BTC addr: 1vTGnFgaM2WJjswwmbj6N2AQBWcHfimSc
induktor
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December 09, 2013, 01:18:13 PM
 #1137

Stratum is currently down!

Just a quick reminder for everyone to set failovers. The good news in all of this is there's rumor that a second stratum server is in the works Smiley

ETA: 10-15 minutes
Thank you for the quick response!
great news for the second stratum server Smiley.

BTC addr: 1vTGnFgaM2WJjswwmbj6N2AQBWcHfimSc
TheUniporn
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December 09, 2013, 01:27:57 PM
 #1138

I'm getting "waiting for work to be available from pools", from what I understand it's bug. Does anyone knows what are some of the latest versions of cgminer that don't have this bug or a way around it?
aTriz
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December 09, 2013, 01:36:15 PM
 #1139

We are back up


Hash away!

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December 09, 2013, 01:49:34 PM
 #1140

Anyone know if there's a way to change how long cgminer waits after a pool is detected as alive again before switching back? I saw it say something about stable for 5 min before it did

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