PB Mining -- 5 year mining contracts!

[Group Bitcoin]

"Group Bitcoin" I see You do same business in UK as PB in Canada  and sell ghs for 2.8 usd and only with order more than 1 ths.In UK kwh more expensive than in Canada,so Your long term success is less possible because of kwh price and I think Your goal to spread FUD here and get some customers, I'm adding You on my ignore list and if possible remove  "Group Bitcoin" from this thread.

What business is that?

bitcoin cloud mining

cex.io you mean?

Just please take a moment to read what I've said.

[1714964564]

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[tprogex]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

imaging there is such  thing like progress and it tell me what at least in end of this year We will have 0.2 watt per ghs now go ahead and imaging end of 2015 year at least technically possible 0.1 watt and 0.2 usd per ghs  so div Your calcs with 10.

[Group Bitcoin]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

imaging there is such  thing like progress and it tell me what at least in end of this year We will have 0.2 watt per ghs now go ahead and imaging end of 2015 year at least technically possible 0.1 watt per ghs so div Your calcs with 10.

How can you talk about future hardware lol ? What do you buy it with? hardware you had a year ago wouldn't buy anything now.

Anyway I'm done, my comments have been lost in other comments and a busy thread if you actually read them you'll see it's just a bit of simple math 1TH/s cannot be sold now for $2000 to run for 5 years with no running costs ever being deducted.

It's not Fud it's just simple logic.

[jonsi]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

[tprogex]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

100% agree with You, he complacently not understand how business works and also technical side of process understanding in 0 level.

[Group Bitcoin]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

[Muhammed Zakir]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

Now Groupbitcoin offers some pre-orders which seem promising.

Pb mining is asking for no fee but they ask some fee at the time of buying. Some people have doubt that whether they are doing a Ponzi Scheme than giving BTC by mining. I have the same doubt too as they aren't giving a photo, same deposit address for everyone.

It is legit but don't know whether it is a legit mining group.
Kindly,
        Muhammed Zakhir

[jonsi]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

I am not saying PB is legit, they could very well be a ponzi, I really don't know. I just pointed out the flaws in your logic. A business could be run and turn a profit by their model. If they do it or not, that's for everyone to decide for themselvs.

[Group Bitcoin]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

I am not saying PB is legit, they could very well be a ponzi, I really don't know. I just pointed out the flaws in your logic. A business could be run and turn a profit by their model. If they do it or not, that's for everyone to decide for themselvs.

I'm sorry but it simply can't run that method at all. Grab a calculator and take 10 mins to work out electricity consumption alone on 0.5w per GH/s efficiency which isn't even out yet.

Hardware goes DOWN in value, steeply! You cannot use old hardware to buy new hardware as a model that is utterly impossible.

[tprogex]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

I am not saying PB is legit, they could very well be a ponzi, I really don't know. I just pointed out the flaws in your logic. A business could be run and turn a profit by their model. If they do it or not, that's for everyone to decide for themselvs.

I'm sorry but it simply can't run that method at all. Grab a calculator and take 10 mins to work out electricity consumption alone on 0.5w per GH/s efficiency which isn't even out yet.

Hardware goes DOWN in value, steeply! You cannot use old hardware to buy new hardware as a model that is utterly impossible.

sp30 model 0.4-0.5 watts per ghs.

[PilotofBTC]

Does anyone know which of the BTC mining calculators is even close to reality. Yes, I know they all make assumptions..

I am calculating 100 GHS at $200 purchase with $0 electric cost, for 12 months.

For example, http://www.bitcoinx.com/profit/

Shows $425.16 profit ($625.16 revenue). This assume BTC value doesn't change.

But, https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

Shows a $63 loss.

I'm not sure how a difficulty increase percentage relates to profitability decline. But I've left them at the defaults.

[Group Bitcoin]

They're selling it now though, so that's completely pointless comment.

It's not pointless at all actually.  There is nothing on our web site to say that the customer will be mining with the same hardware for 5 years.  

You quoted the first sentence... If someone sold cloud mining on that Avalon machine a year ago they had to buy it in the first place now it's not worth anything in relation to some new hardware like a Terraminer so no money to upgrade that hardware. If there was more efficient hardware in the future that has no relation to selling a GH/s now 27/06/14. Even if they bought the new future hardware it wouldn't be free would it? and the hardware isn't free to buy now is it? A 800TH/s data center isn't free either.

Hardware goes down in value rapidly meaning there's nothing to pay for the new hardware.

At 0.5w/GH/s efficiency it's over $2 for 5 years for 1GH/s this efficiency doesn't exist yet it's much more.  

Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over you cost per GH/s

You are very limited in your point of view. Maybe (and I say maybe because I don't know how this business model work) they buy hardware for x and sell it for y resulting a profit of y-x=z. The z doesn't all go into profit but a part goes in reinestments, a fund for future upgrades and future expansion, because, as a business you have to think of this parts. You just assume that they all take as profit but I'm know for shure it doesn't work like that, because I have a business (not btc related) but the principles apply also.

'your view is very limited' Your understanding of mining is obviously limited the product x uses electricity.......

Electricity alone for the 5 year contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over the cost per GH/s at $2

No, not only your view is very limited, you are as a person (this is for beying a smart ass) )
It uses x electricity now, it will not use x electricity in the future. Anyway, you don't have any understanding how how a business work. If you use just math like you are doying, well let's say if you put 10 dollars somewhere ( like in your wallet) it's imposibble to have in a year $11 or $9, you will have $10 exactly. But if you use economics and if you put $10 somewhere (like in a business, or a fund) in a year is very probable you will have $100 or $0.1. Anyway, it's preaty clear you have no ideea how a business work and you just assume 1+1 always equals 2. If this would be the case it would be impossible for a business to grow if you invested $100, because math forbide it, but it's not like that.

Math is running the computer you just wrote your silly comment on. It's quite well respected and it clearly shows. Electricity alone for your contract in one of the cheapest areas in the world, on efficiency that doesn't exist yet is over your cost per GH/s at $2.

I just had someone from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada say I'm going to get 'shit on' thanks pb... no terms of service, mixed coins, no pictures, less than the cost of electricity for the term. Facts not Fud.

I am not saying PB is legit, they could very well be a ponzi, I really don't know. I just pointed out the flaws in your logic. A business could be run and turn a profit by their model. If they do it or not, that's for everyone to decide for themselvs.

I'm sorry but it simply can't run that method at all. Grab a calculator and take 10 mins to work out electricity consumption alone on 0.5w per GH/s efficiency which isn't even out yet.

Hardware goes DOWN in value, steeply! You cannot use old hardware to buy new hardware as a model that is utterly impossible.

sp30 model 0.4-0.5 watts per ghs.

Is that out yet, have you got one, has anyone. No ?  

''Grab a calculator and take 10 mins to work out electricity consumption alone on 0.5w per GH/s efficiency which isn't even out yet.''

[PilotofBTC]

I'm not sure how a difficulty increase percentage relates to profitability decline. But I've left them at the defaults.

The most important factors in mining profitability are the cost of the equipment, the future difficulty, and the cost of electricity to a lesser extent. Future difficulty is difficult to predict, and different rates of increase can give you wildly different results.

Yes, I realize that.

But, it seems the first calculator I listed calls it profitability decline rather than difficulty increase. But, I expect they are talking about the same thing. However, when I change the number HIGHER the profit went up. So, I'm not sure what that calculator is doing with that number. The page doesn't seem to explain it.

[rodeoclownicp]

Does anyone know which of the BTC mining calculators is even close to reality. Yes, I know they all make assumptions..

I am calculating 100 GHS at $200 purchase with $0 electric cost, for 12 months.

For example, http://www.bitcoinx.com/profit/

Shows $425.16 profit ($625.16 revenue). This assume BTC value doesn't change.

But, https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

Shows a $63 loss.

I'm not sure how a difficulty increase percentage relates to profitability decline. But I've left them at the defaults.

one calculator assumes the dificulty will never increase.. it can only be used for a single instance ...the other allows you to use a more practical approach..setting the dificulty to anything less than 15% is absurd

[rodeoclownicp]

I'm not sure how a difficulty increase percentage relates to profitability decline. But I've left them at the defaults.

The most important factors in mining profitability are the cost of the equipment, the future difficulty, and the cost of electricity to a lesser extent. Future difficulty is difficult to predict, and different rates of increase can give you wildly different results.

Yes, I realize that.

But, it seems the first calculator I listed calls it profitability decline rather than difficulty increase. But, I expect they are talking about the same thing. However, when I change the number HIGHER the profit went up. So, I'm not sure what that calculator is doing with that number. The page doesn't seem to explain it.

i know witch one you are talking about, as a calc it is not useful

[PBmining]

The best option I believe is an excel spreadsheet, using a set difficulty variable to progressively decrease the profit down the rows.  You can input different scenarios this way.  Excel requires very basic computer skills to master, and is highly recommended.

[Biomech]

I'll probably regret this, but I'm gonna jump in to this fray and say a couple of hopefully cogent things.

First, to all of you making your calculations, I have to challenge what appears to be an axiom to all of you: That pbmining is ONLY mining with the hardware they are leasing out. It may be true, but I highly doubt it.

Think about this: They sell ONE HALF of the hashrate they purchase, and they continue to do so. This would indeed cover both expansion and electric costs.

Here's more. As some of you keep saying, the coins come from 'somewhere unknown' rather than a specific mining address. I can tell you from direct personal experience that low grade equipment is still damn profitable if it's mining something other than bitcoin. Now, with the way they are set up, are you sure all of your hash is mining BTC directly? I'm not. It's a hell of a way to recycle obsolete equipment!

And there is yet another thing that gets constantly ignored not only in this theread, but for the most part in the whole bitcoin ecosphere. I find this shocking, actually, but it's true. There is no reason why a company cannot buy land with running water and generate their own power!!!! Among other ways to keep old equipment mining.

I think pbmining has proven themselves quite adequately. I could be wrong of course, but I don't  think I am.

[Group Bitcoin]

I'll probably regret this, but I'm gonna jump in to this fray and say a couple of hopefully cogent things.

First, to all of you making your calculations, I have to challenge what appears to be an axiom to all of you: That pbmining is ONLY mining with the hardware they are leasing out. It may be true, but I highly doubt it.

Think about this: They sell ONE HALF of the hashrate they purchase, and they continue to do so. This would indeed cover both expansion and electric costs.

Here's more. As some of you keep saying, the coins come from 'somewhere unknown' rather than a specific mining address. I can tell you from direct personal experience that low grade equipment is still damn profitable if it's mining something other than bitcoin. Now, with the way they are set up, are you sure all of your hash is mining BTC directly? I'm not. It's a hell of a way to recycle obsolete equipment!

And there is yet another thing that gets constantly ignored not only in this theread, but for the most part in the whole bitcoin ecosphere. I find this shocking, actually, but it's true. There is no reason why a company cannot buy land with running water and generate their own power!!!! Among other ways to keep old equipment mining.

I think pbmining has proven themselves quite adequately. I could be wrong of course, but I don't  think I am.

You'd need to buy Niagara Falls to power 800TH/s. 

[5ick3uffalo]

I'll probably regret this, but I'm gonna jump in to this fray and say a couple of hopefully cogent things.

First, to all of you making your calculations, I have to challenge what appears to be an axiom to all of you: That pbmining is ONLY mining with the hardware they are leasing out. It may be true, but I highly doubt it.

Think about this: They sell ONE HALF of the hashrate they purchase, and they continue to do so. This would indeed cover both expansion and electric costs.

Here's more. As some of you keep saying, the coins come from 'somewhere unknown' rather than a specific mining address. I can tell you from direct personal experience that low grade equipment is still damn profitable if it's mining something other than bitcoin. Now, with the way they are set up, are you sure all of your hash is mining BTC directly? I'm not. It's a hell of a way to recycle obsolete equipment!

And there is yet another thing that gets constantly ignored not only in this theread, but for the most part in the whole bitcoin ecosphere. I find this shocking, actually, but it's true. There is no reason why a company cannot buy land with running water and generate their own power!!!! Among other ways to keep old equipment mining.

I think pbmining has proven themselves quite adequately. I could be wrong of course, but I don't  think I am.

I think they not mine btc directly with all hashing power.

Really don´t know but whatever they do they seem to do it right and until now i can´t complain i always get what i paid for

[Biomech]

I'll probably regret this, but I'm gonna jump in to this fray and say a couple of hopefully cogent things.

First, to all of you making your calculations, I have to challenge what appears to be an axiom to all of you: That pbmining is ONLY mining with the hardware they are leasing out. It may be true, but I highly doubt it.

Think about this: They sell ONE HALF of the hashrate they purchase, and they continue to do so. This would indeed cover both expansion and electric costs.

Here's more. As some of you keep saying, the coins come from 'somewhere unknown' rather than a specific mining address. I can tell you from direct personal experience that low grade equipment is still damn profitable if it's mining something other than bitcoin. Now, with the way they are set up, are you sure all of your hash is mining BTC directly? I'm not. It's a hell of a way to recycle obsolete equipment!

And there is yet another thing that gets constantly ignored not only in this theread, but for the most part in the whole bitcoin ecosphere. I find this shocking, actually, but it's true. There is no reason why a company cannot buy land with running water and generate their own power!!!! Among other ways to keep old equipment mining.

I think pbmining has proven themselves quite adequately. I could be wrong of course, but I don't  think I am.

You'd need to buy Niagara Falls to power 800TH/s. 

No. You might, but I'd need about ten 8 foot waterwheels each powering five delco 10Si alternators feeding a bank of 100 deep cycle batteries. Cost would be about the same as two spondoolies sp 30's, and would be scalable for a lot less than that. If the stream moved at a decent volume, you could double that by simply adding 5 more alternators per shaft to keep the battteries at peak. The above by the way, is extreme overkill.