[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[qwizzie]

PODCAST EPISODE 10: EVAN DUFFIELD FROM DASH ON DECENTRALIZED GOVERNANCE & THE BITCOIN BLOCK SIZE DEBATE

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/podcast-episode-10-evan-duffield-dash-decentralized-governance-bitcoin-block-size-debate/

 

nice to see more interviews / articles popping up about Dash's decentralised governance budgetting system, well-deserved attention...

[WastedLTC]

8.5 days and counting from last payment.    The other 2 that were above 7 days between payments finally hit.

https://dashninja.pl/mndetails.html?mnpubkey=Xn8o721S6aomdXErP9k6ECwqSBhQYWcKf8

This just bad luck?   I feel like I'm solo mining.  

Since the reference node was rebooted Monday 22th of june and masternode payments take approx 4.44 days you should receive
a payment for that last masternode between today and tomorrow (assuming there are no problems with the proof of service score).
Its unfortunetely this happened but c'est la vie ... (happened to me before too)  

Edit 1 : if you do not receive a masternode payment at the end of the weekend i would advice you to shoot Evan an email.
Edit 2 : nice MN payment that your other MN got .. 3.5 Dash ? niceee

I heard the reference node was rebooted but it didn't sink in that all payments got reset from that point and not from where it left off.    Gotcha and that node did just get paid.   All is well, but thanks for explaining that extra bit.  Now it makes sense.   

[Minotaur26]

PODCAST EPISODE 10: EVAN DUFFIELD FROM DASH ON DECENTRALIZED GOVERNANCE & THE BITCOIN BLOCK SIZE DEBATE

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/podcast-episode-10-evan-duffield-dash-decentralized-governance-bitcoin-block-size-debate/

Really good interview, I am of the idea that the governance and funding project will be the key differentiation for Dash in the near term.  Mainly because it is a clearly defined way to sustain the project financially, resolve conflict and ensure continuity. I would say knowing that you are getting on board with a project that has a plausible sustainability model allows to invest long term rather than speculate short term.

It works in many different levels:

First the holders have incentive to participate and contribute in the network, alongside miners, as they generate income from running full nodes.

Second, they get to participate in direction and contribute initiatives to grow the ecosystem and they know there is a clearly defined mechanism by which they can get their ideas funded. So my bet is you will have more people getting involved as they know there is a real possibility to implement things.

The design is very elegant, the part I love the most is how it helps people that don't know each other in real life, come together and pull in the same direction. I think one of Dash biggest achievements is having incentives in the right places, not only for mining, and having a clear way to collaborate and make decisions that is defined at the protocol level.

Many things will come from that, instead of just creating a particular feature, Dash is creating a machine capable of adapting to a changing environment and producing the features the user needs.   That took Dash away from being another mono-feature altcoin, which is basically what you still find on the market place, and becoming a platform with an original architecture and model that comes as a new interpretation of what a digital currency should be.




 

[noobtrader]

PODCAST EPISODE 10: EVAN DUFFIELD FROM DASH ON DECENTRALIZED GOVERNANCE & THE BITCOIN BLOCK SIZE DEBATE

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/podcast-episode-10-evan-duffield-dash-decentralized-governance-bitcoin-block-size-debate/

Really good interview, I am of the idea that the governance and funding project will be the key differentiation for Dash in the near term.  Mainly because it is a clearly defined way to sustain the project financially, resolve conflict and ensure continuity. I would say knowing that you are getting on board with a project that has a plausible sustainability model allows to invest long term rather than speculate short term.

It works in many different levels:

First the holders have incentive to participate and contribute in the network, alongside miners, as they generate income from running full nodes.

Second, they get to participate in direction and contribute initiatives to grow the ecosystem and they know there is a clearly defined mechanism by which they can get their ideas funded. So my bet is you will have more people getting involved as they know there is a real possibility to implement things.

The design is very elegant, the part I love the most is how it helps people that don't know each other in real life, come together and pull in the same direction. I think one of Dash biggest achievements is having incentives in the right places, not only for mining, and having a clear way to collaborate and make decisions that is defined at the protocol level.

Many things will come from that, instead of just creating a particular feature, Dash is creating a machine capable of adapting to a changing environment and producing the features the user needs.   That took Dash away from being another mono-feature altcoin, which is basically what you still find on the market place, and becoming a platform with an original architecture and model that comes as a new interpretation of what a digital currency should be.

i think the most awesome part is that we may able to implement cool feature like marketplace from nxt, naming from namecoin, smart contract from ethereum etc this is awesome

[Kienbui]

PODCAST EPISODE 10: EVAN DUFFIELD FROM DASH ON DECENTRALIZED GOVERNANCE & THE BITCOIN BLOCK SIZE DEBATE

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/podcast-episode-10-evan-duffield-dash-decentralized-governance-bitcoin-block-size-debate/

Really good interview, I am of the idea that the governance and funding project will be the key differentiation for Dash in the near term.  Mainly because it is a clearly defined way to sustain the project financially, resolve conflict and ensure continuity. I would say knowing that you are getting on board with a project that has a plausible sustainability model allows to invest long term rather than speculate short term.

It works in many different levels:

First the holders have incentive to participate and contribute in the network, alongside miners, as they generate income from running full nodes.

Second, they get to participate in direction and contribute initiatives to grow the ecosystem and they know there is a clearly defined mechanism by which they can get their ideas funded. So my bet is you will have more people getting involved as they know there is a real possibility to implement things.

The design is very elegant, the part I love the most is how it helps people that don't know each other in real life, come together and pull in the same direction. I think one of Dash biggest achievements is having incentives in the right places, not only for mining, and having a clear way to collaborate and make decisions that is defined at the protocol level.

Many things will come from that, instead of just creating a particular feature, Dash is creating a machine capable of adapting to a changing environment and producing the features the user needs.   That took Dash away from being another mono-feature altcoin, which is basically what you still find on the market place, and becoming a platform with an original architecture and model that comes as a new interpretation of what a digital currency should be.
 

GREAT!! After this I believe a lot of crypto developers will come to Dash-land and we will have a lot more innovations.

[Macrochip]

GREAT!! After this I believe a lot of crypto developers will come to Dash-land and we will have a lot more innovations.

and a HUGE potenail for scammers to take the DASH and run.... mark my words

Isn't it obvious that they won't get paid until they deliver working, useful and especially peer-reviewed code? The risk isn't at their end, since the payment mechanisms can't be cheated on. *Imagining us taking their code and run*  

[toknormal]

Isn't it obvious that they won't get paid until they deliver working, useful and especially peer-reviewed code? The risk isn't at their end, since the payment mechanisms can't be cheated on. *Imagining us taking their code and run*  

I'm quite fascinated to see how this is going to work.

Decentralised code procurement and project management. This is kind of breaking new frontiers.

I've got deja-vu from the 1990's when I swore that no-one would ever buy clothes, shoes or bikes over the internet. I just couldn't see it happening.

I've got the same feeling now about decentralised code procurement and project management. How do you ?....where do I start ?...... requirements analysis, contracting, supervisor, management milestones, quality control. Sh*t, I'd really like to see how this is gonna work all out in the open. If this gets pulled off it will be a mini revolution IMO.

[TanteStefana2]

and a HUGE potenail for scammers to take the DASH and run.... mark my words

Why do you think that, MB?  This will not be so easy to do, and at least not long term.  First, you need to get a MN owner to "apply" for funding, then you have to convince a majority to vote your project high enough to actually achieve funding.  Then, if you don't show progress, MN owners can remove their vote and hence your funding.  There is potential for a service provider to fail at coming through with the goods, and running away with some of the funds, but I don't think a hemorrhaging of the funds will occur.

[TanteStefana2]

Isn't it obvious that they won't get paid until they deliver working, useful and especially peer-reviewed code? The risk isn't at their end, since the payment mechanisms can't be cheated on. *Imagining us taking their code and run*  

I'm quite fascinated to see how this is going to work.

Decentralised code procurement and project management. This is kind of breaking new frontiers.

I've got deja-vu from the 1990's when I swore that no-one would ever buy clothes, shoes or bikes over the internet. I just couldn't see it happening.

I've got the same feeling now about decentralised code procurement and project management. How do you ?....where do I start ?...... requirements analysis, contracting, supervisor, management milestones, quality control. Sh*t, I'd really like to see how this is gonna work all out in the open. If this gets pulled off it will be a mini revolution IMO.

We are breaking new ground, and I do believe we may end up with a hybrid system with an oversight committee of some sort with the "nix it" button.  Possibly the foundation?  I'm certain there will be growing pains, but hell, we're exploring new frontiers!

[toknormal]

We are breaking new ground, and I do believe we may end up with a hybrid system with an oversight committee of some sort with the "nix it" button.  Possibly the foundation?  I'm certain there will be growing pains, but hell, we're exploring new frontiers!

+1 !  (Oops - not allowed to say +1 anymore on BCT).

I thought that also. That's what I thought would be fascinating about it - it's a completely new way to structure things. Nobody knows what will turn out. There will no doubt have to be some spectacular failures to pave the way for the spectacular successes but the ultimate prize is definitely worth pursuing.

[TanteStefana2]

Just listened and it was a great interview!  Liked the song at the end too  Grunge!

[toknormal]

Tsipras calling a referendum.

That will kind of put the ball up on the slates. One of his predecessors tried that and was promptly take off the pitch and substituted for a parachuted-in Goldman hand-me-down.

Tsipras generation seem different class to me. He seems to have an inate ability to tell people to "go to h**" in the most polite, friendliest possible way. They've played an absolute ace game so far. Maybe he's more worried about losing his wife than the Euro, but to me the Greeks seem to be out-manoevring both the Europeans and their domestic critics on every turn.

They deserve at least a few "away goals" IMO  

[TanteStefana2]

I'm always perplexed at our price in the scheme of things.  And I've come to the conclusion that people really are afraid of cutting edge.  They truly follow the horde.  Humans often equal cattle.  Really, a look at the top currencies right now shows the lamest currencies pumping up again.  People don't understand DASH.  I guess it's hard if you haven't been here actively informing yourself of this project.  People are mostly lazy I guess.  To invest money in Litecoin and Doge (actually, I understand Doge better (IF the community is as fun and active as it used to be?) and most of the coins on the top 10 that regularly ride the roller coaster is unfathomable to me.

Still, DASH is very much understandable to the lay person.  Cryptographics, ring signatures, etc... those things confuse me, but I can understand mixing, and I can understand the benefits of mixing with denominated funds and ahead of time and change addresses, and how that solves the weaknesses of plain coinjoin implementation.  I can also see clearly all the benifits of a 2 tier network and 3 tier reward system.

A little effort on the crypto enthusiast's side can do nothing but reveal the brilliance of this project.  But that's ok.  I'll be here in 3, 5, 10 + years and enjoy the ride.  And when people say I was lucky, I'll know that it wasn't luck.  It was my gut feeling about Evan from the start, and of the team he built of developers, businessmen, lawyers and people of all walks of life here that made DASH such a success.  No luck involved, just a ton of hard work from dedicated individuals!

[TanteStefana2]

Tsipras calling a referendum.

That will kind of put the ball up on the slates. One of his predecessors tried that and was promptly take off the pitch and substituted for a parachuted-in Goldman hand-me-down.

Tsipras generation seem different class to me. He seems to have an inate ability to tell people to "go to h**" in the most polite, friendliest possible way. They've played an absolute ace game so far. Maybe he's more worried about losing his wife than the Euro, but to me the Greeks seem to be out-manoevring both the Europeans and their domestic critics on every turn.

They deserve at least a few "away goals" IMO  

\

Wish I understood half of what you're saying!  LOL.  I know it's about the Greek debt crisis......... ?  Maybe a link?  LOL

[kointrend]

I'm always perplexed at our price in the scheme of things.  And I've come to the conclusion that people really are afraid of cutting edge.  They truly follow the horde.  Humans often equal cattle.  Really, a look at the top currencies right now shows the lamest currencies pumping up again.  People don't understand DASH.  I guess it's hard if you haven't been here actively informing yourself of this project.  People are mostly lazy I guess.  To invest money in Litecoin and Doge (actually, I understand Doge better (IF the community is as fun and active as it used to be?) and most of the coins on the top 10 that regularly ride the roller coaster is unfathomable to me.

Still, DASH is very much understandable to the lay person.  Cryptographics, ring signatures, etc... those things confuse me, but I can understand mixing, and I can understand the benefits of mixing with denominated funds and ahead of time and change addresses, and how that solves the weaknesses of plain coinjoin implementation.  I can also see clearly all the benifits of a 2 tier network and 3 tier reward system.

A little effort on the crypto enthusiast's side can do nothing but reveal the brilliance of this project.  But that's ok.  I'll be here in 3, 5, 10 + years and enjoy the ride.  And when people say I was lucky, I'll know that it wasn't luck.  It was my gut feeling about Evan from the start, and of the team he built of developers, businessmen, lawyers and people of all walks of life here that made DASH such a success.  No luck involved, just a ton of hard work from dedicated individuals!

You are totaly right! And not worrying about price...others are pumping up from the hells,...but we have the pattern of the winners...we had not knowledge of the hells...we are the champions...just patient.

[toknormal]

I'm always perplexed at our price in the scheme of things

Tante - I think you might be mis-interpreting the markets here and denying yourself a few favours.

A huge amount of the speculative trading has left the Dash market which is why it's settled into a very stable state - just like bitcoin. That is a significant achievement because it means that Dash succeeded in acquiring itself one of the very few places available as "one of the survivors" of the 2014 altcoin explosion.

It's a double edged sword however, because it means that more of the value will be driven by fundamentals. The asset is much less "pumpable". Re-valuations from now on will be based more on adoption than speculation IMO which will be a long hard road but all top 10 coins are now well established and have plenty fuel in the tanks to give them long term endurance....ah !! A light bulb just lit up above my head.

Endurance
That is now the name of the game for top 10 coins. We need to shift priority from tantalising bells and whistles to fuel. The decentralised blockchain governance and long term funding fits squarely into that agenda.

The marketcap game is drawing to a close - it lasted a good 18 months to 2 years but the players are all now more or less in position. (There will be the odd latecomer like Etherium). Early adopters have now adopted their permanent and semi-permanent positions and in my opinion the top 10 coins are all there by merit (apart from Stellar and Ripple which are not really cryptocurrencies anyway).

How Did We Do ?
If you're feeling frustrated about price, have a look at our bedfellows in the context that Dash settled at 50% off its all time high:

Bitcoin: 20% of its ATH
Litecoin: 30% of its ATH
Doge: 36% of its ATH
Bitshares: 33% of its ATH
NxT: 40% of its ATH
PPC: 28% of its ATH

IMO, all the top-10 marketcap listings have great merit of one sort or another. If I look across the first 300 on coinmarketcap.com, those are probably the ones I'd have picked for the top ten. It's a very rare occurrence to find a project which has all these things: innovative, has a highly dedicated team, is commercial, has sustained funding of some kind, has favorable media presence and actually does something useful.

Compare that to the concept of side chains which is a kind of miserable boilerplating, pale shadow of the vibrancy of these projects. I re-iterate: how G Maxwell can possibly posit that altcoins have "distracted" from fortunes of bitcoin is beyond me. Bitcoin would be nowhere without the wholesale embracing of the cryptocurrency frontier. It would be like 1 solitary buffalo crossing the rapids instead of a whole heard of them. (He would say that all the other buffalos should have helped the first one, but neither biological nor technical nor monetary ecosystems work that way - "network effect" is earned, not engineered).

The New Priorities
Anyway, getting back to my original point, we need to revise our priorities and milestones now. Marketcap is 'in the bag'. Dash does not need to worry about price anymore. It DOES need to worry about 2 things IMO:

[1] - adoption
[2] - sustaining itself

Forget the old expectations of a market pump as a reward for some new development. All that's now priced in. We're in the same league as bitcoin - its fundamentals have been ballooning for a year without any reflection in the markets. Bitcoin got so over speculated on in 2013 that it's taken a year for the 'real' price to converge with the speculative one.

What to Expect
There will be revaluations but from now on they will increasingly originate in the commercial world, not the 4-hour bitcoinwisdom MACD turning green to coincide with a development post from Evan in the Dash [ANN] thread.

We need to grow up and start thinking industrial.

That's a whole new way of thinking which involves a lot of quite boring concepts and "watching paint dry" experiences. At the same time, I think you'll still find you wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

...and Why !
Solving the bitcoin fungibility problem directly - without recourse to obfuscation - and levering the huge opportunities that a functionaly diversified network brings is a very exciting prospect because they are unique to Dash, and bitcoin has that window closed now due to its early uptake.

What I like about it is that all our "top 10 bedfellows" are working totally different sectors. Dash has this sector to itself which is a great vindication of its technical priorities of the last year.

We must not waste it.

[TanteStefana2]

I'm always perplexed at our price in the scheme of things

Tante - I think you might be mis-interpreting the markets here and denying yourself a few favours.

A huge amount of the speculative trading has left the Dash market which is why it's settled into a very stable state - just like bitcoin. That is a significant achievement because it means that Dash succeeded in acquiring itself one of the very few places available as "one of the survivors" of the 2014 altcoin explosion.

It's a double edged sword however, because it means that more of the value will be driven by fundamentals. The asset is much less "pumpable". Re-valuations from now on will be based more on adoption than speculation IMO which will be a long hard road but all top 10 coins are now well established and have plenty fuel in the tanks to give them long term endurance....ah !! A light bulb just lit up above my head.

Endurance
That is now the name of the game for top 10 coins. We need to shift priority from tantalising bells and whistles to fuel. The decentralised blockchain governance and long term funding fits squarely into that agenda.

The marketcap game is drawing to a close - it lasted a good 18 months to 2 years but the players are all now more or less in position. (There will be the odd latecomer like Etherium). Early adopters have now adopted their permanent and semi-permanent positions and in my opinion the top 10 coins are all there by merit (apart from Stellar and Ripple which are not really cryptocurrencies anyway).

How Did We Do ?
If you're feeling frustrated about price, have a look at our bedfellows in the context that Dash settled at 50% off its all time high:

Bitcoin: 20% of its ATH
Litecoin: 30% of its ATH
Doge: 36% of its ATH
Bitshares: 33% of its ATH
NxT: 40% of its ATH
PPC: 28% of its ATH

IMO, all these projects have great merit of one sort or another. If I look across the first 300 listings of coinmarketcap.com, those are probably the ones I'd have picked for the top ten. It's a very rare occurrence to find a project which has all these things: innovative, has a highly dedicated team, is commercial, has sustained funding of some kind, has favorable media presence and actually does something useful.

Compare that to the concept of side chains which is a kind of miserable boilerplating, pale shadow of the vibrancy of these projects. I re-iterate: how G Maxwell can possibly posit that altcoins have "distracted" from fortunes of bitcoin is beyond me. Bitcoin would be nowhere without the wholescale embracing of the cryptocurrency frontier. It would be like 1 solitary buffalo crossing the rapids instead of a whole heard of them. (He would say that all the other buffalos should have helped the first one, but neither biological nor technical ecosystems work that way - "network effect" is earned, not engineered).

The New Priorities
Anyway, getting back to my original point, we need to revise our priorities and milestones now. Marketcap is 'in the bag'. Dash does not need to worry about price anymore. It DOES need to worry about 2 things IMO:

[1] - adoption
[2] - sustaining itself

Forget the old expectations of a market pump as a reward for some new development. All that's now priced in. We're in the same league as bitcoin - its fundamentals have been ballooning for a year without any reflection in the markets. Bitcoin got so over speculated on in 2013 that it's taken a year for the 'real' price to converge with the speculative one.

What to Expect
There will be revaluations but from now on they will increasingly originate in the commercial world, not the 4-hour bitcoinwisdom MACD turning green to co-incide with a development post from Evan in the thread.

We need to grow up and start thinking industrial.

That's a whole new way of thinking which involves a lot of quite boring concepts and "watching paint dry" experiences. At the same time, I think you'll still find you wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

...and Why !
Solving the bitcoin fungibility problem directly - without recourse to obfuscation - and levering the huge opportunities that a functionaly diversified network brings is a very exciting prospect because they are unique to Dash, and bitcoin has that window closed now due to its early uptake.

What I like about it is that all our "top 10 bedfellows" are working totally different sectors. Dash has this sector to itself which is a great vindication of its technical priorities of the last year.

We must not waste it.

That's a very good perspective and point, thank you.  I've stopped worrying about it really, but was still perplexed at the value given some coins, such as litecoin.  But in a way, a long term stable price will actually cause people to hold their DASH instead of converting right away - due to convenience and lower risk.  And they'll start using DASH because of adoption and low cost.  We are lucky to have had Bitcoin pave the way.  And now I see how excellent it is that banks will be adopting Bitcoin for account settlements.  Real life adoption won't be a big revolution, but a transition, and I'm starting to understand and appreciate that.

When I was younger, and the space program slowed down and it looked like all we were going to do was go into orbit with the space shuttle and do experiments, and that was it, I thought all the excitement in the world had already happened in the 20th century.  Now, looking back, I see it was simply a calm before the storm.  So much is happening all of a sudden, with the EMdrive and the internet, crypto currencies, etc... we are slowly becoming a population that leaves the nanny state and will have the ability to take control of our individual lives again.  Crypto currency gives us financial control over our government - which will have to SERVICE their people to be paid, and other technologies, such as the EM drive will make it extremely cheap to travel.  In space, and probably on earth as well.  These are exciting times!

[toknormal]

When I was younger, and the space program slowed down and it looked like all we were going to do was go into orbit with the space shuttle and do experiments, and that was it, I thought all the excitement in the world had already happened in the 20th century.

Tante -

You sound like a dyed-in-the-wool technical fanatic since childhood. Is that the case ? Did you own a TRS-80 at some point by any chance ?

[davidrindu]

mining, i just learn here...

[TanteStefana2]

When I was younger, and the space program slowed down and it looked like all we were going to do was go into orbit with the space shuttle and do experiments, and that was it, I thought all the excitement in the world had already happened in the 20th century.

Tante -

You sound like a dyed-in-the-wool technical fanatic since childhood. Is that the case ? Did you own a TRS-80 at some point by any chance ?

Nah, I'm a machinist's daughter.  I like making things.  Mom and sister were in computers.  Though Mom learned some programming languages for work, my sister was the real programmer.  She built her first computer back around 1982, and I built my first around 1997 or so (which was a lot easier by then).  Before that, hubby had a mac and since I worked out in the field, I used his mac Powerbook 100 which was a pretty nifty little bugger.  I even had a cool portable printer that I could print my documents on.  I had to prove to my bosses I could recreate their forms and print them out at the end of the day on it to get permission.  And with typical bureaucracy, some of the higher ups didn't want to let me do that because it was unconventional, though you couldn't tell the difference between my forms and theirs.

My degree was in architecture, and I gotta say, until the computer graphics (CAD) came along, I hated drawing, LOL.  Still, in the end, I became a construction inspector so I can be with the makers.