[ANN] [PMC] Premine Coin | Rare | Mining Transaction Fee Proof of Concept

[maardein]

Why free giveaway and not distributed for bounties like NHZ. People getting coins for doing something like blogpromotion, translating, facebook,twitter etc.

not everyone can do something.
How many people does it really take to translate into other languages? 10?
then developers making services, maybe another 10, and then some people making blog posts. maybe 50-100.
This is a tiring way of getting support. It's fake, and doesn't reach as wide an audience.
And again, this would mean making set amounts of PMC for certain actions. This places a limit on the number of people who can participate.

if we say posting on your blog is worth 500 PMC and tweeting about it is worth 100 PMC We are then saying, only a max of 1000 people can post about it or tweet about it.

This also means arbitrarily setting a value for the coin. If we give it away to everyone we can make sure to reach the widest audience and not any one person gets too much PMC.

Also, don't forget there are quite a few people who already supported PMC in the past. By donating to the multipool, making scritps etc. to distribute transaction fees, getting it on Poloniex in the first place, getting shops to accept it, even a charity is accepting it.

Without these people PMC would have been forgotten a long time ago, and reviving would have been pointless anyway.

[1714661176]

1714661176

[TheMightyX]

Hi All,

Here are my thoughts on the matter. Would welcome an opportunity to discuss further in an IRC meet.

This is what I had to say earlier.

PMC was the first alt that was unique to Polo   My, how it has grown since then. Shame about PMC, I feel it inspired a lot of PoS coins but got lost along the way. I guess that by the time BTC mining is exhausted something else will have taken over, probably something secured with PoS, or the transactions fees alone would be worth mining (indicating high real life usage, i.e. BTC) - Nice experiment and idea, it was fun to watch.

There are a few things that I think should be considered.

Activity in and around PMC stopped. This is why it was delisted. No-one posted in the thread, no-one was trading it, the community fizzled away. This is an important and irrefutable fact.

Any 'revival' of PMC should be 'as new' - What I mean by this is that it should stay true to the original intentions of the coin. Those original intentions were an experiment to try to expose what would happen to BTC once it had all been mined.

It is important to note now that PMC was traded, people did make profit and people did make a lose. It can be strongly suggested that people who currently hold PMC either did not actively encourage it's use or take part in the community or bought it very cheap over the past several months (since the crash) in the hopes that they would make a profit at some point, a gamble.

Therefor, I very strongly suggest that very careful consideration should be given to any PMC revival that is slanted to the benefit of existing holders. There is no good reason to reward current holders of PMC in any greater way than new investors which may enter into the revival.

It is very easy to see and the suggest that a revival is to benefit existing holders that invested and/or are hurt that their PMC is worthless.

I believe the best way to proceed is to attempt a revival of the 'experiment'.

This could either be done with a hardfork of the current chain or, my preference, a new experiment should be started but with absolutely no exchange of existing PMC to the revival. It should be a completely new and fresh, clean experiment.

Absolutely no IPO, ever.

All that being said, I do have PMC - But that is my fault and I understand that.

Please PM me a date/time if there is to be an IRC meetup (as I will receive an email alert and will then know to jump in)

I hate that I agree with much of what you say.

I will say that yes, a revival can and will be seen as an attempt to benefit existing holders that have invested or held.
But if we really get right down to it, this is partly what it is.
The idea of PMC was not so special that it "MUST BE REVIVED AT ALL COSTS".
Our motivation to revive PMC may be selfish in part. But is that really a bad thing?
If that selfish motivation wasn't there, at least in part, would we even bother?
Or would we say "well, we tried, lets see what else is out there". I think the latter is more likely.

Your argument reminds me of arguments against capitalism (which I tend to agree with). Capitalism seems greedy and selfish, but it ultimately forces us to try to make people happy and provide things and services that make their lives better. Which company makes the most money? The one that makes the best product.
There is also an altruistic side of our motivations I think, that wants to take part in something successful and inherently fair.

The idea was not to grant any existing PMC holders any NEW PMC, just exchanging their current PMC1 for PMC2 so they could continue on. This was to make it fair for new members joining the community. Most people here have less than 500 PMC. As well, we can also see that the value of PMC will be diluted initially. The max coins of PMC1 is 500,000. Where as PMC2's max coins will have to be as high as 1.5 to 2 million.
This is a 300-400% increase in the number of coins.
You may ask, why would we do that to ourselves?
Well because we think the benefits outweigh the negatives.
For this initial dilution we give ourselves the chance to grow and our investments to become more valuable in the near future.

Very thoughtful post though. I will have to think about this.
You are very welcome to sit in on our chat.
I think I will like debating you  

[TheMightyX]

Why free giveaway and not distributed for bounties like NHZ. People getting coins for doing something like blogpromotion, translating, facebook,twitter etc.

not everyone can do something.
How many people does it really take to translate into other languages? 10?
then developers making services, maybe another 10, and then some people making blog posts. maybe 50-100.
This is a tiring way of getting support. It's fake, and doesn't reach as wide an audience.
And again, this would mean making set amounts of PMC for certain actions. This places a limit on the number of people who can participate.

if we say posting on your blog is worth 500 PMC and tweeting about it is worth 100 PMC We are then saying, only a max of 1000 people can post about it or tweet about it.

This also means arbitrarily setting a value for the coin. If we give it away to everyone we can make sure to reach the widest audience and not any one person gets too much PMC.

Also, don't forget there are quite a few people who already supported PMC in the past. By donating to the multipool, making scritps etc. to distribute transaction fees, getting it on Poloniex in the first place, getting shops to accept it, even a charity is accepting it.

Without these people PMC would have been forgotten a long time ago, and reviving would have been pointless anyway.

Very valid point.

[Nullu]

It's not so much the issue of leaving PMC behind I question, but how you value the conversion rate from PMC to PMC+, or whatever it'll be called.

Also the method of giveaway has to be different than it was originally. The original giveaway model was flawed, as many just grabbed and sat on their coins. Anyone still with PMC is clearly someone who is more valuable to the new currency than someone who had no faith in the currency and has none, or sold all of their PMC.

My point is, the distribution method has to be fairer, and the rewards to those who worked hard for PMC and still hold PMC should reflect their contributions.  All things being equal, if person A has 500 PMC+ because he converted his PMC, and person B has 500 PMC because he was simply given it, then person A is at a huge disadvantage, so you either give more to person A, or less to person B. Meaning, either the conversion rate is higher, or the giveaway amount of PMC+ is considerably lower per person than in the original giveaway.

I'm also all for a reward-based giveaway system where coins are given to active community members, rather than someone who has no interest in actually investing in the future of the currency whatsoever.

I'm less concerned with shifting to the new currency than I am of the system of exchange and distribution being fair and well thought out.

I'm sorry I didn't reply to this.
I fully agree with you. The "everyone gets X amount of coins" is a flawed model, for many reasons.
Primarily it sets a max cap on how many people can participate.

I've come up with a better solution that I've shared with KBroadfoot but I'd like to go over with you as well.
Maybe we could have a group chat on IRC or something.
It's not something we want to be telling the public about until it is hammered out.
I will say that I think it will not only award an appreciated amount of PMC2 to PMC1 holders/supporters but it will also increase demand and growth in the future.
KBroadfoot is available in the evenings EST time I believe. I'm free whenever.

I'm GMT timezone here. I can pop on later this evening or any late evening this week.

[kbroadfoot]

Lets IRC around 7 PM Eastern Time?

I think current PMC holders can convert some PMC to PMC2 and can keep some in PMC... the original experiment does not have to end...
However I would like it if 'some' of the original PMC people get a jump onto the new coin...

The history of PMC is part of the story though.... when creditcoin_CRD decided to premine 100 percent of the coin and give it away it invited the famous 'SCAMMER' accusation. ANY premine back in the day was cause for accusations.. ( or insta-mine, etc etc ) Besides being a 'what will BTC be without blockrewards' question, it was also a social experiment. Now premine/distribution is a feature of almost all new coins. Many are hybrids.

BCT coin is a premine/charity POW coin that is rather interesting... it makes 'everyone' happy ( sorta ) enough to have someone spend 7.9 BTC to help get it Mintpal listed.. This coin and Aurora and many many others do not exist without PMC leading...

PMC2 is sort of another experiment.... Can we transition a coin and a community to something very different? And can we leave in place part of the old as well? XBC has 54,000 coins. PMC will have something less than 499,000 coins if we do the swap/destroy method ( still my favorite ).

PMC holders that do not want to participate can only sit back and watch their coins get more scarce ( and more valuable? )

I would probably swap in most of my PMC, but keep a few on the side...

The 'experiment' continues...

[maardein]

Lets IRC around 7 PM Eastern Time?

I think current PMC holders can convert some PMC to PMC2 and can keep some in PMC... the original experiment does not have to end...
However I would like it if 'some' of the original PMC people get a jump onto the new coin...

The history of PMC is part of the story though.... when creditcoin_CRD decided to premine 100 percent of the coin and give it away it invited the famous 'SCAMMER' accusation. ANY premine back in the day was cause for accusations.. ( or insta-mine, etc etc ) Besides being a 'what will BTC be without blockrewards' question, it was also a social experiment. Now premine/distribution is a feature of almost all new coins. Many are hybrids.

BCT coin is a premine/charity POW coin that is rather interesting... it makes 'everyone' happy ( sorta ) enough to have someone spend 7.9 BTC to help get it Mintpal listed.. This coin and Aurora and many many others do not exist without PMC leading...

PMC2 is sort of another experiment.... Can we transition a coin and a community to something very different? And can we leave in place part of the old as well? XBC has 54,000 coins. PMC will have something less than 499,000 coins if we do the swap/destroy method ( still my favorite ).

PMC holders that do not want to participate can only sit back and watch their coins get more scarce ( and more valuable? )

I would probably swap in most of my PMC, but keep a few on the side...

The 'experiment' continues...

Everyone can decide for themselves whether they want to trade everything in or not. That's the beauty of cryptocurrencies, no one can decide to pull the plug. As long as someone is mining, they coin will keep working.

[getmining.info]

I hate that I agree with much of what you say.

Your argument reminds me of arguments against capitalism (which I tend to agree with).

The idea was not to grant any existing PMC holders any NEW PMC, just exchanging their current PMC1 for PMC2 so they could continue on.

I think I will like debating you  

I think we may be on a similar wave-length  

[kbroadfoot]

I AM a bass player, as my little avatar shows on this site and I have been called to duty ( as it were ).

I probably will NOT be able to IRC on this day....

However, for those of you that do, ask TheMightyX about the tiered giveaway idea he came up with... Lets agree on some specs and a name for the coin and get this thing created.... with the 500,000 coin set aside for PMC to <New Coin> conversions and the giveaway amounts in different addresses... and once this new coin is made, we need to start a new OP for it on this site...

Also, a new OP can be set up as 'vaporware' as well with our intentions...

I will need something to send Poloniex to show progress...

Also, as far as Hashcows is concerned, we could ask him to buy PMC from Europex.eu or C-Cex or Cryptofunds.... any input on this?

[TheMightyX]

I AM a bass player, as my little avatar shows on this site and I have been called to duty ( as it were ).

I probably will NOT be able to IRC on this day....

However, for those of you that do, ask TheMightyX about the tiered giveaway idea he came up with... Lets agree on some specs and a name for the coin and get this thing created.... with the 500,000 coin set aside for PMC to <New Coin> conversions and the giveaway amounts in different addresses... and once this new coin is made, we need to start a new OP for it on this site...

Also, a new OP can be set up as 'vaporware' as well with our intentions...

I will need something to send Poloniex to show progress...

Also, as far as Hashcows is concerned, we could ask him to buy PMC from Europex.eu or C-Cex or Cryptofunds.... any input on this?

Oh damnit!
I just messaged people saying it looks like we are all available 
As you mentioned I already spoke with you (very briefly) about the tiered giveaway.
If any of the other people I PM'd want to speak I'll still be on the IRC.
I'll leave it open most of the evening.

I would like to get started on this while I have the energy/motivation/time, before I get swamped with other work.
Developer is ready to go as soon as we come up with his payment.

[kingscrown]

so whats up with this coin?

[poncho32]

so whats up with this coin?

Poloniex was going to delist it.

[bungholio]

Wow, gone for a while and things go crazy again.  I like it!!  I chucked in 0.05BTC to the donation.  Any action is good IMO so I'll keep an eye on this thread and help where I can.  Thanks everyone for the revival!!

[Nullu]

My block rewarder is still fully functional. It'll work with any cryptocurrency based on the BitcoinQT.

If there's anything that can be done with that to help with distribution of the new currency, I'd be happy to help. It's essentially a TX Fee injection script, but you can set the parameters to send rewards based on whatever conditions you see fit. It would be a shame not to use it. I've not used it for any other coin than PMC, so it's still fairly unique as scripts go.

[kbroadfoot]

I am available for IRC..  

Edit: sleepy time...

[leejjae]

so whats up with this coin?

More and more people are interested in it, so this coin will soon die!

[yogibaer]

My Wallet stopp synchronizing at block 170886. Wallet is back since 27h ....
looks like there are no block generated at all any more?

[leejjae]

I hope we have reached the bottom...Pherpas we see 0.001 BTC/PMC again.

Yes, it is almost the bottom of it, can be appropriate to buy some of it!
 

[maardein]

My Wallet stopp synchronizing at block 170886. Wallet is back since 27h ....
looks like there are no block generated at all any more?

I had a power outage at my home, and somehow had some trouble getting my miners up and running again after that.

Seems like I am the only one still mining PMC?

[yogibaer]

My Wallet stopp synchronizing at block 170886. Wallet is back since 27h ....
looks like there are no block generated at all any more?

I had a power outage at my home, and somehow had some trouble getting my miners up and running again after that.

Seems like I am the only one still mining PMC?

Yeah looks like that you are the only one mining PMC. My wallets are synced now.

I don't have any asic miner to join mining

[maardein]

My Wallet stopp synchronizing at block 170886. Wallet is back since 27h ....
looks like there are no block generated at all any more?

I had a power outage at my home, and somehow had some trouble getting my miners up and running again after that.

Seems like I am the only one still mining PMC?

Yeah looks like that you are the only one mining PMC. My wallets are synced now.

I don't have any asic miner to join mining

Yeah, bit disappointing. Let's hope my miners do not break down then...

Also, it's still not paying anything. I just check, and I mined 42318 blocks last month (yes, over 42 thousand blocks). It paid 1.4PMC in transaction fees, of which 1PMC is from a single transaction. So 0.4PMC in 42317 blocks. So, currently, I am spending around $20 montly to keep the network up, with no return whatsoever...

[edit]
I just started the PMC wallet on the server I have running for thenodeslist.com (yes, that website needs an overhaul/update). You can use it as a node: addnode=thenodeslist.com:9335

If anyone feels like mining, I can give the details to connect to that server so you can mine without having to keep a pc running. There is no pool or anything, it is just like solomining, but to a remote location. As stated before, there is practically no payout, so I am not going to set up a pool. It would be just to make sure the network keeps running.
[/edit]