[ActiveMining] Official Shareholder Discussion Thread [Moderated]

[toastee]

Takes millions of dollard in pre-orders and selling shares and can't set up a plugin or can't hire a webmaster. So fail!

No plugin exists, as I pointed out already.

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[auto2nr1]

Adding 100 more cards for sale from our mining farm due to the delay in getting our step down transformers installed.  We will be adding back these 100 cards from our next production run in 2 weeks.  The new cards will be our revision 3 cards which will be faster.

Good news Ken. Can you take pictures of the in-stock products to show us that it is really available? Some updated pictures of the shipping facility as well as product pictures would be great. Please get that posted up today. Thanks.

[toastee]

i was actually considering purchasing one (for testing then resale) since they are "in-stock" so i went through the process, but the only form of payment available now is bank wire (no bitcoin?!?!).  and it said DHL shipping would take 4 days, which from Missouri to Louisiana would be 2 at the most.  so sadly to say i will not be ordering one of these.

Yes, we only have Wire Transfers on our site at the moment as our bitcoin processor before was MtGox.  We can still take bitcoins, but we will process them manual.  Send us a message if you want to order with bitcoins.

I think it's important that this gets highlighted on the site somewhere.

[jrodder]

I think it's important that this gets highlighted on the site somewhere.

+1 on that, I mean this *is* a BTC oriented group you're targeting here.

[MilkyWayMasta]

https://coinbase.com/docs/merchant_tools/payment_buttons

[kslaughter]

Yes, I am going to use Coinbase.  I need a prestashop plugin, do they have one?

There doesn't seem to be a plugin available for Prestashop yet, and I can't find any evidence of anyone working on one.

BitPay has one though: https://github.com/bitpay/prestashop-plugin

Yes, I know, but BitPay is a little to close to BFL for me.  I now have a lot of experience with Prestashop plugins so I may write my own.

[babybonobo]

Just stopping by to say hi!  A lot of trash talking still, but hey that's just the way the cookie crumbles...

When customers start to receive their miners, the truth will be known.  Long and strong my friends, there is no turning back.  Nothing much for me to say except for that I am excited for ACTM and its investors.  Good luck everyone (who is not an asshole :p)!  Remember not to live in micro-internet-time! 

[klondike_bar]

@klondike, let's explore this as a possibility.  

What does this mean for us, the investor?

hard to say. a custom design, even with another chip, is a profitable route to go, but likely less than half as much as a custom chip.

lack of proof or photos is my concern though.

[knybe]

...
lack of proof or photos is my concern though.

[zumzero]

hard to say. a custom design, even with another chip, is a profitable route to go, but likely less than half as much as a custom chip.

lack of proof or photos is my concern though.

Indeed.  We can crunch the numbers all day long when it comes to profitability.  

One thing that interested me today was the shouting voices exclaiming that miners shouldn't be purchased at X$ per GH because that is insane!  Welcome to the real world.

On paper perhaps a valid argument, but in reality people will value something based on more than mere statistics.  The human element (will I buy now? there are at least 89 left. Omfg now there's only 4 left!  Fuck it, I've bought!). We've all been there.

It's worth noting that there are likely, many bitcoiners out there who have factored in the long term valuation of the Bitcoin price and simply desire to accumulate btc and are prepared to buy miners at a premium if they can deliver TODAY.  That said, I think Ken priced well.  For me, those customers are the clever ones but we all have our own opinions.

See: Asic Miner and the USB 'pen drive' miners that were selling for X btc a piece last year.  I can't recall if they cost 1, 2, or 5 btc per unit @ 200 MH/s?, but everyone knew how overpriced they were and people kept on spending and justifying, knowing they wouldn't ROI.  And guess what? The Bitcoin price shot through the roof and people even started firing up their GPUs again and suddenly those pen drives were the best buy ever.

All said and done, I don't think the units sold today were overpriced in any shape or form.  There were cries of,  "Up the price by 25% if they sell that fast", and those lucky enough to have got in will see products hit their doorstep in the next few days.  That is what truly matters to the miners.  Ken has recognised that almost every company out there is selling a wish, but in being able to sell IN STOCK products is very much a USP in this space and ActM is holding the reigns.  I think Ken needs to be rewarded for this.  Not for the vision, as that is easy, but the execution.  The fall out there has been the fact that the investors have been kept in the dark.  Hopefully over the next few days and weeks it will make more sense to the unconvinced.

I am also aware of the pre-order sale customers and sincerely hope that Ken has rewarded their patience with extra GH/s.  But then a good business man would have that covered, right?

[tempestb]

ZZ if you buy a miner for $3000 at 600gh it will not earn back the Bitcoins you spent on it by the time it is too expensive to operate.  And that's being generous at a 40% difficulty increase per month.  (Not per week... Per month)  Which won't happen. 

So the smart miner would not buy it at all and just keep their Bitcoins because they'd be worth more if the value of Bitcoin went up.

There is no way to earn with these unless you don't pay for power, and even then you're waiting a really long time.

But I completely agree with you that there are insane people who just buy any flashy thing without thinking about it.  I hope whoever those people are actually get their miner.  Did anyone here buy one?

[zumzero]

Not "insane", just normal, like me and you.  If we all knew today that the Bitcoin price would NEVER exceed $600 again, the entire thing would implode in an instant, I reckon.  Time to widen our horizons and see, not linear growth, but exponential growth.  The issue here is that we are not hardwired to recognise exponential growth, but must force ourselves to do so.

Sry, I've had a few beers.  I missed my champagne breakfast with Ken but will jump aboard the next United Kingdom built and designed Concorde, courtesy of divs.  

EDIT:  Ken I'm heading over the first chance I get and I'll bloody post a YT vid if need be to silence these critics!

[tempestb]

That would work in your favor if Bitcoin was worth more now because you'd spend less of them on the miner.  The miner will never earn more Bitcoin then you paid for it.  You would earn more profit by holding your Bitcoin than you would buying the miner.

It makes no sense to buy the miner instead of holding coins.  None.  It would only make sense if you bought it for less Bitcoins then it earns.  Currently it does not do that.

If I earn 5 Bitcoin or kept 6.  Regardless of whether the price of Bitcoin is $10,000 or $600.  Keeping the 6 is always worth more than the 5.

[finlof]

103 Items in stock - the number seems to be increasing...

[zumzero]

Yep, that's three more than one hundred which should be good for the investors, right?

Once we stop bickering and in fighting then the potential customers may become customers more readily.

Not saying that anyone should calm their bridges and it's very important that AMC/VMC/ActM do things correctly, but we should all be aware of the fact that this thread is likely to see an enormous volume of new traffic and may be already.

Here are a couple of my thoughts moving onto the next stage which we've sadly not had the opportunity to discuss until now;

Are we looking after our pre-ordered customers?  If so, how so?  This is AS important as looking after shareholders.

Is there an infrastructure already in place to cater for complaints and a procedure set in place?  If not, it should be created immediately.  (This, for me personally, is extremely important - I would get a working visa in an instant and fly over if I could be of any use)

Are there, or when will there be, technical support contacts available?  (It's totally useless if the same person is trying to cover multiple departments and is too busy dealing with other issues as a one person switchboard).   If that ever happened then the whole enterprise is sunk.

My expertise is worlds apart from this industry, but common sense prevails.  Being able to anticipate the inevitable issues and dealing with them in a fair way is what defines a good company from a bad one.  So far Ken is untested in this area, at scale, and I for one would give up my day job if I knew that I could help make things work to keep customers happy.

As vbs said a long time ago, 'the potential for products sales is unimaginable'.  That fact has never changed.  The most crucial challenge facing this company is how well it can scale.

Ken, think hard about this and PLEASE start taking on staff.  


EDIT:  I am sick of the Bitcoin community getting shafted and will not allow that to happen with ActM as long as I can share my voice as a shareholder.  I've never told him, but am sure Ken gets it.

[drasted]

http://virtualminingcorp.com/shop1/index.php?id_product=38&controller=product
in the specs it has:

    ·Ultimate Bitcoin Mining Performance: up to 512 GH/s
    ·Typical Bitcoin Mining Performance:  512 GH/s +/- 20%

Why does it list "typical" performance as up to 614 GH/s, but "ultimate" performance is only up to 512GH/s

[jimmothy]

Processor Highlights
·Fast-Hash One 28nm ASIC
·Underclocked for greater efficiency or overclocked for greater performance.
·Built in thermal controls that allow the chip optimization without damage to processor.
Warranty:  Quality Controlled Pre-shipping tested against DOA. Experimental No Warranty

Thanks for clearing that up, Ken.

Only thing that is clear is that he copy/pasted hashfast evo description.

http://virtualminingcorp.com/shop1/index.php?id_product=38&controller=product

http://hashfast.com/shop/yolievo/

[wasubii]

Look, every single other investment that it is legit has put up photos of their completed products.  Why do I have to care about Ken's personality in this situation?  I shouldn't.  He's selling a product that was paid for by my and other people's money.  Can I see the product that he's selling?  I don't want to see that mock-up photoshop thing, I want to see the actual in stock item.  I wouldn't mind seeing the "facility" that we paid for as well.  That's part of what being a shareholder is about.  You own a piece of the company.  You have some rights to see financial books, to walk around, to talk to people, to see what is going on.  If Ken would not like me to be a shareholder anymore, he could give me access to my shares and I'd quickly sell them and remove myself form this forum thread and he can have the pleasure of working with those of you that are in this for the long haul.  Unfortunately my shares are held hostage and I can't exit other than just accepting a total loss, which I refuse to do.  I put my money into this and so far I've seen no evidence of anything happening.  I'm not wrong in wanting proof.  If his personality somehow forbids that, then he's the one at fault.

As everyone here has said, including ZZ, it takes the guy 5 seconds to photograph what is there and post it.  If I see proof of the hardware, I'll be quiet and wait around for access to my shares like everyone else, minus some discussion on when we'll actually ever get access to them.  I think this is completely fair.

+1

[PurpleTentacle]

There is absolutely no reason at all for Ken to not post a picture of his in stock mining hardware, especially when it's supposed to be delivered to customers over the next few days.

That is if Ken has told us the truth.

[emkay47]

Those last added 3 are mine ....I canceled my order of 3 x Boards.