[ANN] Blacknet BLN | Staking | Future of zApp & ZeFi

[morituri13]

There is not democratic process to do so.

Come see democracy in action: http://www.reddit.com/r/blackcoin/comments/24p7i5/pr_firm_transparency_and_please_list_your_ideas/

[vizique]

I've said this many times before on there, your multipool is an accomplishment and done something, you guys get credit for this, but again and again does it matter if it's not marketed? This game of cryptos is about 95% marketing right now, and 5% projects. Those projects will only pay off when the marketing is done on them or over time. You guys don't get this, and I don't expect you to.

5% of your hard working efforts will only be noticed. You need to grasp that when your working on projects. Only once BC becomes LTC status of BTC status will your hard work have paid off and be noticed. It will be in time, but as of now it's about development that will take BC to next level, it's about marketing. We need both, and I commend you guys on this part, but your not businessmen and please stop this foundation, you'll kill this coin.

A note about Marketing for a moment


People are just crying MARKET MARKET MARKET, because they have no long term vision. 95% of people in crypto only care about the short term.

Everyone goes on about market this and that, but if the infrastructure isn't in place to promote, then it's pointless to market anything. If the foundation did a drive to promote the multipool before v2 has been completed, then new miners would just see a WIP and get turned off.

You can't just blindly market and expect it to work, it needs the right timing. Does no-one realize this? If the technology behind the coin is not in place, then all the marketing in the world will not matter, because attention will just be brought towards things that are NOT FINISHED.

To complete a good marketing campaign you need to make sure that your systems are strong enough to support the attention you are going to receive. Right now our core markets are A) Crypto enthusiasts b) Miners and c) Forward thinking investors who see a future in Crypto.

v2 is very close to being released, it will provide a very strong foundation for Black-coin. It opens up a sleek and attractive and more importantly, unique option to provide to the mining market. It is the most profitable pool out there, which in itself will bring people to it, but when it is finalized it will also be sleek, professional and will offer something NO OTHER POOL OFFERS. People have worked incredibly hard to create something in this multi-pool that will stand it above and beyond anything else that already exists on the market.

If you for one minute doubt how important that is to the current Crypto environment, then why has every single copycat coin (and already existing coins) in the last month suddenly panicked themselves into finding a way to integrate Multipool architecture into their coins?

I don't see every coin out there create USB cards, but I do see them building Multipools. I'm not trying to attack anyone here, I think any effort to help benefit this coin should be applauded, but I'm fed up with seeing people just clashing heads and down-talking other peoples work. If there is a criticism to be made of EVERYONE, it is that noone right now seems to be considering a long term plan and many questions are simply not being addressed in a unified way.

Take a step back

In the last week the team has dealt with a severe DDOS (and put in considerable defenses against these and successfully negated follow up attempts), done the Blackcast to open themselves up to their current core following, prepared the v2 multipool front end, completed the v2 backend and put together a marketing strategy for WHEN EVERYTHING IS COMPLETED and ready to cope with external pressure.

Blindly screaming MARKET MARKET MARKET will do more harm than good. Going to Wall Street and having the worlds attention turned to Blackcoin whilst many of the underlying areas are still being heavily worked on will simply apply too much pressure to areas that are already under stress. Give people a fucking break, let them finish the considerable work they are doing and be patient.

Has anyone out there actually considered the harm that one big Wall Street Whale could do to Blackcoin? After the dump from 90k people were ready to kill themselves out of depression all over IRC and these forums. That is but a tiny fraction of what could happen if we open the market up to people that could abuse and manipulate our coin for their own benefit in a short period of time. Our market cap is CHUMP CHANGE, for some people out there in the financial world, think about that for a moment, before your eyes fill with dollar signs. Not only that, they know how to play people like us much better than we know how to play them.

Part of marketing is thinking about the potential ramifications for the strategies you are putting in place, so let me ask a few questions for a moment.

1. Why are we targeting Wall Street?
2. Who is our target audience? Is it the world, is it the press, is it market traders?
3. What is our mission in attracting these people? Are we looking for patronage? etc etc

Everyone wants this coin to be a 'Luxury coin' but answer these:

1. What luxury goods can you actually buy with it?
2. Are these markets unique to Blackcoin? I.E If you can buy them with Bitcoin, what seperate Blackcoin aside from words?

I see a lot of blind yes men in this thread simply agree with things for the sake of believing that a) All marketing will be beneficial for the coin and b) that there is simply no need for timing. We can believe and make videos about Blackcoin being 'Luxury' all we want, but if you can't buy shit with it, then it's all just bullshit and people will see through it in seconds. You cannot market Blackcoin as a Luxury coin right now if there is zero infrastructure to back up that claim.

It's simple. When we have deals with Lambourghini and Rolex allowing people to purchase their goods with Blackcoin, THEN, we can talk about marketing the coin to the wider public as a luxury, but until then, stop talking about it. What we have is different to a product, we are not selling a consumable, we are selling a means to purchase consumables. In that respect you cannot just drum up a campaign to convince people they want Blackcoin, especially if that campaign is based around using it for something that physically doesn't exist.

Focus attention in the right areas and focus on the brand of the coin first and foremost.  

Timing is -everything-

Look at our rise to 90k, why did that happen? Because multiple factors all came together at exactly the right time. We had the convention, where the Blackcoin Foundation were present, we had the Black Friday, we had the Wall Street investment and we had the timing to be the first PoS coin to really grab the crypto worlds attention. All of those together turned that weekend into a frenzy of BC buying power. Why didn't the rise continue? Because it reached a point where the fundamental development and infrastructure of the coin could not support the hype.

Fast forward a month and we have people going crazy over marketing simply because they want some cash. Has anything really changed? Do we have the infrastructure to support such a rise? I would argue we definitely do not right now and that until Coinkite hits, we are still in exactly the same situation. Who knows what Coinkite will do? It might be incredible, it might not be, but until Blackcoin has a place in everyday society the mass public are not going to adopt it. Most people still don't even know about Bitcoin yet and it has only been in the last few weeks that I have been seeing "Bitcoin for dummies" videos over the local news channels (BBC etc).

Right now our target audience should be miners and the crypto enthusiasts. Build upon that solid foundation, first convince the crypto world that Blackcoin is the coin that sets itself apart from the other alt coins and then once they have been won over we can worry about the wider world. Stop trying to rush things, stop trying to convince everyone that screaming to the roof tops will do more good than harm when the social infrastructure for this coin is simply not ready to be accepted into everyday life. Not even Bitcoin has achieved that, so how can we expect to? We can build towards it, we can begin to work out how it might happen, but if we just scream to anyone that will listen, their first impressions of this coin is going to simply be "Well what is the point? How do I use it?"

From that standpoint, we need a PR team to help us with out ambitions, because I don't see logistics being answered, or even considered anywhere. Everyone is two steps ahead of where they should be. You can't force people to adopt blackcoin by ramming it down their throats, you need to be clever and have a clear plan that matches the social and technological progress of the product.

My two cents.

-Arigard.

Without question, this is one of the best posts in this thread.
Balanced, thoughful and reasoned case put forward that is pretty much incontravertible.
As one of those who will be taking Coinkite out there, I'm clear that the target customers for me will be people will barely know Bitcoin let alone Blackcoin. Your point of Blackcoin requiring development in so many areas is well made and highlights just how much work there is to do in ALL areas, front and back of house.
Thank you for a good read and a reminder of just what it is we all should be thinking and working on.

[z3r0]

BlackcoinDirectory has been updated. Check it out: http://blackcoindirectory.com

Still in development, but getting closer.

Working on a better adjusting resizing to fit more screen sizes, better menu system, dynamic suggestions, and getting every useful Blackcoin link there is! If you have any suggestions or see something missing, posts are appreciated.

Loving it, btw Blackcoincharts has added charts, not just price index anymore. =D

BET ON BLACK!

[barabbas]

Some bullet points of significance:

-- The Doge: In the Blackcast, effectively, you said you rolled your joint but someone not paying attention to the preliminaries would have easily missed that and take that your were smoking grass as a statement... as, in fact, by your own recognition, you were making that statement only about tobacco. Sir, you came off, by far, the most eloquent of the group. By far. But your tobacco/grass statement was made and perceived by the audience and, sir, when you are representing BlackCoin, those "statements" are simply damaging for the image of Blackcoin. Besides, the three of you smoking seemed like a clumsy and blatant "product placement" of the tobacco/grass industry. You are obviously free to smoke whatever you want but you should think a few times what you do when you publicly represent BlackCoin. And someone should have advised you three that simultaneously smoking constantly during the blackcast was simply not acceptable. Naturally this critique would have more than probably be banned in your other forums: Contrary to pretensions otherwise, those other forums ONLY look for compliance, censorship and avoiding deserved -and beneficial- criticisms. You guys are NOT doing BlackCoin any good hiding in plain sight. You will have your followers, of course, but don't be fooled, the people investing in BlackCoin will go there where the TRUTH, in all it's sides and implications, is freely spoken, not to the "domesticated" sites you control.

-- morituri13 Who are you, sir? How much (in specific numbers and the wallet number for corroboration) have you invested currently in BC and what are your credentials to not only be a member of the "Foundation" but one outspoken one at it? "Small business owner" (thank you for at least giving that bit out), as in having an eBay seller account, hardly qualifies. But why don't you dissipate all doubts and tell us all who you are and how invested in BC you are.

-- Transparency. We all want it. Doge, we learned in the blackcast that when called you had "the team" ready. Who are them? What entitles them to be part of the proposed -or formed- "Foundation. As fellow investors, we NEED to know who this people are, what their level of investment is and why they volunteer to guide BC's destiny going forward, otherwise the entire group will be perceived as your sock puppets and we don't want to have that perception, do we?

-- Multipool. DOGE, I am still extremely confused about who is behind the multipool and running things there: Soepkip stated that the multipool "is not connected with the dev team" and that "it is important but not vital to BC". If you are "the man" behind that business (and that is exactly what it is, a profitable business, aside and benefiting from BC), can you please clarify? Who runs things at the Multipool, on the controlling side and on the tech side? and is it or isn't it a part of the BC project or a separate business profiting from it, meaning YOU, profiting from it? Look, you have invested time, money and a lot of effort in bringing this coin out and are responsible for it's success so far. If you are really invested in it, you have profited already enormously, to the tune of many thousand % of whatever was your initial investment. And that big stash of BC will make you even richer, very much richer indeed, if BC reaches a substantially higher valuation. THAT, sir, should be your motivation. If the multipool is a business on the side, then it should compete in offers with other pools ready to take on the BC business and RESPONSIBLE for whatever shortcomings -and DDOS attacks- they may have. If one multipool fails, for whatever reason, there have to be immediate back ups in numbers to insure practically flawless, continuous operation. If the multipool is in fact a "side business" or yours. If it is a business of BlackCoin, meaning all proceeds from it go to BlackCoin development, we need to have that aspect clear as clear water.

On the multipool point: Who makes the decisions as to what coins are mined? and why, which are his qualifications for that, what the strategy? Are the mining proceeds converted to BlackCoin immediately, regardless of the trading rate or, as I have read, those proceeds are first converted to BTC, held, and then converted to BC on "dips". Finally, officials at Cryptsy have stated that the delays reported and blamed on them yesterday, regarding payouts to miners, were in fact Multipool's fault for not having established 2FA, which is required from everyone. What was it?

-- Iconic's attacks. Although there's some poetic justice in the developments of the last 48 hours on that field (he's the one prone to promote bannings of dissenting people... dissenting with some or all or his opinions/methods), the juvenile peculiarity of the attacks, the viciousness in some cases and the totally inappropriate way of going about it by a seemingly coordinated gang, totally discredits those -including the devs- who have willingly and repeatedly participated, instead of the chosen target. Once again, I find the guy generally regrettable, an out of control dangerous egomaniac without capability of accepting criticism and in on this to make a buck by any means he find necessary, both on the coin valuation and on side business such as his card. But the attacks on him personally are, clearly, politically motivated. I don't personally know how much has he invested in BC but I am fairly sure he won't have any problem showing his wallet for everyone to see. If for no other reason that to keep him in check and benefit from some of his ideas, the proposed "Foundation" should have offered him a seat in their board. But it seems that the Foundation, with or without quotes, is more or less a fan club (of the DOGE) grabbing territory before "that crazy guy" gets the bulk of the community on his side and actually running things". Hastily doing so, can easily prove to be counter intuitive and obviously shows weakness. Repercussions, potentially serious ones, are sure to follow.

[morituri13]

Some bullet points of significance:

-- morituri13 Who are you, sir? How much (in specific numbers and the wallet number for corroboration) have you invested currently in BC and what are your credentials to not only be a member of the "Foundation" but one outspoken one at it? "Small business owner" (thank you for at least giving that bit out), as in having an eBay seller account, hardly qualifies. But why don't you dissipate all doubts and tell us all who you are and how invested in BC you are.

Hi barabbas. My short bio: I own over 400k BC. I once owned over 500k BC but I have given 80k BC to various projects, some to coinkite adoption, some to support the multipools black friday event etc. I own a small brick and mortar business (I don't know what the ebay comment is in regards to? Also I should note this business is not my primary source of income). At my real job, I am a project manager, and I have worked with the PR firm we eventually hired previously getting products into Hammacher Schlemmer but I am not by trade in PR or Marketing. Is this sufficient?

[morituri13]

My wallet.

http://explorer.blackcoin.co/address/B83HKi1wqsZHqJSH6u24CYUxyqD51VKRrE

[IconicExpert]

We all know I have an ego, but do we really need 100 pages to point out I have an ego? I rather people post 100 pages on another forum how awesome BlackCoin is. People are so focused on me but once again we wasted a week where we could have really made some buzz.

You should have stopped your ego from tearing up the dev's project. All of this recent mess, stemmed from your original post about how the PR campaign is the worst choice any start up business can make (as if BC or any crypto is your typical startup). Not only that, but you also made others believe it was such a bad decision and that we are some kind of amateurs running BC. From there, it spiraled into chaos. And this chaos was also the result tension that was building up from some of the investors who put a lot of time and money into BC, and really didn't enjoy you taking all the credit for everything that BC has accomplished - while downplaying everyone's accomplishments outside of your own.

This needs to be settled now. Trying to move this under the carpet again is a no go. We settle this now, and not later on when we are at $1+ and there will be a lot more money at stake. Because as you know, this isn't the first time... and this time was a lot worse than the previous one. I don't even want to know what a third time a month or two from now may look like if we don't address this now.

So, I ask, where do we start the compromise?

You just can't leave well enough alone. You guys do know there is post history... right? Your constant attempts at changing history it is very annoying. All my recent posts are here for all to see and I never delete my posts.

1. Gritt made his Asinine comment on an article that was getting a lot of attention. Whether his comment was malicious or not, his comment started the rift between the dev team and me.

2. When the dev team announced the PR firm I asked two simple questions, and it wasn't FUD. I was given a response along with pages of attacks.

3. Please stop with the talking points about me taking credit for everything, it is old. I have made factual claims that the "media" attention we have received has been from the efforts of me and the community, and that is FACT. Please show me one major article about BlackCoin in the past month that didn't involve something I was involved with. However, I do not try and take credit for stuff I didn't do. I didn't try to take credit for the multi-pool, I didn't try to take credit for Moolah, I didn't try to take credit for CoinKite, and I don't take credit for anything I wasn't a part of. And I have also given thanks and support to many members who have taken initiative with their own projects, so WTF are you talking about? No really WTF are you talking about? I get very annoyed with double talk and BS. I am a straight shooter and I dislike BS. Besides the PR firm idea when the f..k did I ever downplay someone else idea? Please show me just one instance where I downplayed someone else idea just to make mine look better. And the only reason why I questioned the PR firm idea was because of the blatant lack of transparency. I fundamentally believe in transparency and I have stated this millions of times.

So if you want an open dialog where we can get back to business, stop posting bs. This attempt to try and paint me as an egomaniac that wants all the attention and will destroy everyone's projects doesn't hold water when all one has to do is look through my previous posts. If you are tired of me "getting to much attention" then stop chatting 14+ hours a day on IRC and get something done. Because if all you and the dev team can focus on is the multi-pool and IRC, then we will keep having this issue every few weeks because I will always be doing something new to generate buzz.

So take my advice here... The few times I came to IRC to chat with you guys, 99% of my predictions ended up being correct. I am telling you right now, you are only hurting yourself with this bickering. I am NOT the official face of BC, and I do not have anything to lose from this bickering, but you guys most certainly do. I do not know how long you think you can keep up this  bickering before people start turning AGAINST YOU. So stop, I am not going anywhere, it is too late for that. So call it a learning experience and lets move the f..k on and make money.

[buy-black]

I hate when irrational poeple are selling. yesh sell at cheap price when it's not time....

MACD telling up
RSI up
fibonacci UP
EVERYTHING IS TELLING UP but they are selling.

Humanity gonna kill us for some shit.


there is a rational and logic tip i give you for free. BUY BLACKCOIN ==> MAKE IT A PARADIGME ==> SELL IT ! the unholly name of ass.

why poeple are acting with emotion and not logic for god sake.

Traders are waiting for all of these emotional confrontations to finish.  Timing is very important so when they stop fighting the price will go up...  but some big players will still want cheap coins so they will add more conflict in the forum until everybody has their bag full to sell at the run up!

Market conditions are good but the market sentiment is down so we sit here and churn some more until all signs turn +ve.  Then we have a short run to the upside and then AB or XY or ZZ says something totally fucked to keep the market down.  Sell off.

This is total market manipulation!  Self serving greedy fuckers that just want to take the most profit.  Most of the big whales here are doing this every day and making money.  They hold the train untill they are ready for the next run..

And most of them dont give a fuck BC!  THAT IS FUCKING CLEAR!

[IconicExpert]

Some bullet points of significance:

-- Iconic's attacks. Although there's some poetic justice in the developments of the last 48 hours on that field (he's the one prone to promote bannings of dissenting people... dissenting with some or all or his opinions/methods), the juvenile peculiarity of the attacks, the viciousness in some cases and the totally inappropriate way of going about it by a seemingly coordinated gang, totally discredits those -including the devs- who have willingly and repeatedly participated, instead of the chosen target. Once again, I find the guy generally regrettable, an out of control dangerous egomaniac without capability of accepting criticism and in on this to make a buck by any means he find necessary, both on the coin valuation and on side business such as his card. But the attacks on him personally are, clearly, politically motivated. I don't personally know how much has he invested in BC but I am fairly sure he won't have any problem showing his wallet for everyone to see. If for no other reason that to keep him in check and benefit from some of his ideas, the proposed "Foundation" should have offered him a seat in their board. But it seems that the Foundation, with or without quotes, is more or less a fan club (of the DOGE) grabbing territory before "that crazy guy" gets the bulk of the community on his side and actually running things". Hastily doing so, can easily prove to be counter intuitive and obviously shows weakness. Repercussions, potentially serious ones, are sure to follow.

I still think you should be banned. However, I do not think there is anyone who dislikes me more than you, and when you can clearly see and admit these attacks are "political" should make them take pause.

[Arigard]

I've said this many times before on there, your multipool is an accomplishment and done something, you guys get credit for this, but again and again does it matter if it's not marketed? This game of cryptos is about 95% marketing right now, and 5% projects. Those projects will only pay off when the marketing is done on them or over time. You guys don't get this, and I don't expect you to.

5% of your hard working efforts will only be noticed. You need to grasp that when your working on projects. Only once BC becomes LTC status of BTC status will your hard work have paid off and be noticed. It will be in time, but as of now it's about development that will take BC to next level, it's about marketing. We need both, and I commend you guys on this part, but your not businessmen and please stop this foundation, you'll kill this coin.

A note about Marketing for a moment


People are just crying MARKET MARKET MARKET, because they have no long term vision. 95% of people in crypto only care about the short term.

Everyone goes on about market this and that, but if the infrastructure isn't in place to promote, then it's pointless to market anything. If the foundation did a drive to promote the multipool before v2 has been completed, then new miners would just see a WIP and get turned off.

You can't just blindly market and expect it to work, it needs the right timing. Does no-one realize this? If the technology behind the coin is not in place, then all the marketing in the world will not matter, because attention will just be brought towards things that are NOT FINISHED.

To complete a good marketing campaign you need to make sure that your systems are strong enough to support the attention you are going to receive. Right now our core markets are A) Crypto enthusiasts b) Miners and c) Forward thinking investors who see a future in Crypto.

v2 is very close to being released, it will provide a very strong foundation for Black-coin. It opens up a sleek and attractive and more importantly, unique option to provide to the mining market. It is the most profitable pool out there, which in itself will bring people to it, but when it is finalized it will also be sleek, professional and will offer something NO OTHER POOL OFFERS. People have worked incredibly hard to create something in this multi-pool that will stand it above and beyond anything else that already exists on the market.

If you for one minute doubt how important that is to the current Crypto environment, then why has every single copycat coin (and already existing coins) in the last month suddenly panicked themselves into finding a way to integrate Multipool architecture into their coins?

I don't see every coin out there create USB cards, but I do see them building Multipools. I'm not trying to attack anyone here, I think any effort to help benefit this coin should be applauded, but I'm fed up with seeing people just clashing heads and down-talking other peoples work. If there is a criticism to be made of EVERYONE, it is that noone right now seems to be considering a long term plan and many questions are simply not being addressed in a unified way.

Take a step back

In the last week the team has dealt with a severe DDOS (and put in considerable defenses against these and successfully negated follow up attempts), done the Blackcast to open themselves up to their current core following, prepared the v2 multipool front end, completed the v2 backend and put together a marketing strategy for WHEN EVERYTHING IS COMPLETED and ready to cope with external pressure.

Blindly screaming MARKET MARKET MARKET will do more harm than good. Going to Wall Street and having the worlds attention turned to Blackcoin whilst many of the underlying areas are still being heavily worked on will simply apply too much pressure to areas that are already under stress. Give people a fucking break, let them finish the considerable work they are doing and be patient.

Has anyone out there actually considered the harm that one big Wall Street Whale could do to Blackcoin? After the dump from 90k people were ready to kill themselves out of depression all over IRC and these forums. That is but a tiny fraction of what could happen if we open the market up to people that could abuse and manipulate our coin for their own benefit in a short period of time. Our market cap is CHUMP CHANGE, for some people out there in the financial world, think about that for a moment, before your eyes fill with dollar signs. Not only that, they know how to play people like us much better than we know how to play them.

Part of marketing is thinking about the potential ramifications for the strategies you are putting in place, so let me ask a few questions for a moment.

1. Why are we targeting Wall Street?
2. Who is our target audience? Is it the world, is it the press, is it market traders?
3. What is our mission in attracting these people? Are we looking for patronage? etc etc

Everyone wants this coin to be a 'Luxury coin' but answer these:

1. What luxury goods can you actually buy with it?
2. Are these markets unique to Blackcoin? I.E If you can buy them with Bitcoin, what seperate Blackcoin aside from words?

I see a lot of blind yes men in this thread simply agree with things for the sake of believing that a) All marketing will be beneficial for the coin and b) that there is simply no need for timing. We can believe and make videos about Blackcoin being 'Luxury' all we want, but if you can't buy shit with it, then it's all just bullshit and people will see through it in seconds. You cannot market Blackcoin as a Luxury coin right now if there is zero infrastructure to back up that claim.

It's simple. When we have deals with Lambourghini and Rolex allowing people to purchase their goods with Blackcoin, THEN, we can talk about marketing the coin to the wider public as a luxury, but until then, stop talking about it. What we have is different to a product, we are not selling a consumable, we are selling a means to purchase consumables. In that respect you cannot just drum up a campaign to convince people they want Blackcoin, especially if that campaign is based around using it for something that physically doesn't exist.

Focus attention in the right areas and focus on the brand of the coin first and foremost.  

Timing is -everything-

Look at our rise to 90k, why did that happen? Because multiple factors all came together at exactly the right time. We had the convention, where the Blackcoin Foundation were present, we had the Black Friday, we had the Wall Street investment and we had the timing to be the first PoS coin to really grab the crypto worlds attention. All of those together turned that weekend into a frenzy of BC buying power. Why didn't the rise continue? Because it reached a point where the fundamental development and infrastructure of the coin could not support the hype.

Fast forward a month and we have people going crazy over marketing simply because they want some cash. Has anything really changed? Do we have the infrastructure to support such a rise? I would argue we definitely do not right now and that until Coinkite hits, we are still in exactly the same situation. Who knows what Coinkite will do? It might be incredible, it might not be, but until Blackcoin has a place in everyday society the mass public are not going to adopt it. Most people still don't even know about Bitcoin yet and it has only been in the last few weeks that I have been seeing "Bitcoin for dummies" videos over the local news channels (BBC etc).

Right now our target audience should be miners and the crypto enthusiasts. Build upon that solid foundation, first convince the crypto world that Blackcoin is the coin that sets itself apart from the other alt coins and then once they have been won over we can worry about the wider world. Stop trying to rush things, stop trying to convince everyone that screaming to the roof tops will do more good than harm when the social infrastructure for this coin is simply not ready to be accepted into everyday life. Not even Bitcoin has achieved that, so how can we expect to? We can build towards it, we can begin to work out how it might happen, but if we just scream to anyone that will listen, their first impressions of this coin is going to simply be "Well what is the point? How do I use it?"

From that standpoint, we need a PR team to help us with out ambitions, because I don't see logistics being answered, or even considered anywhere. Everyone is two steps ahead of where they should be. You can't force people to adopt blackcoin by ramming it down their throats, you need to be clever and have a clear plan that matches the social and technological progress of the product.

My two cents.

-Arigard.

First, Arigard, who are you, since this is your second post ever.

I would strongly disagree with you, marketing is everything above and beyond developement. Development is important, but takes is only part of this. Look at kittiecoin if you need a reference. They were huge on development and lacked on marketing. They didn't capitialize on memes, and wasted efforts on developing coin, which they at time had one of the strongest teams in crypto alts. They failed. DOGE on otherhand did most of what they did on hype and marketing. There is nothing special about DOGE, it's an alt LTC clone, but made itself one of the best coins out there.

BTC, sure it was first, and got noticed cause of that, but it's being actively marketed on purpose or cause it was first. Either way it's being marketed. It has by far biggest market cap. Now tell me, anyone that understands cryptos would in a heartbeat point out how inferior BTC is to any alt, yet it demands prices of 400 + per coin. Its slow, lacking, outdated, energy intense. Yet BC is greener, fast, innovative, pure POS, not minable. If we can market these things we would be #1.

Look outside community, not just inside the box. We have millions of people to reach. Hype and marketing will only do this, and will also bring more people on board as success follows success.

Your putting the cart before the horse here. Now both are important, we just can't have a board of unelected programmers running the business operations with the blackcoin foundation behind the name of there effort.

I just can't understand why more people here are not upset about this foundation forming, cause once you let it happen, good luck removing those in power positions. It will be near impossible. There is not democratic process to do so.

I'm the ghost of christmas past, present and future all rolled into one..

I'm beggining to even doubt my own existence now.

But seriously... I am a mod on IRC (Think of that what you want), a small business owner, with a MSc (With distinction) in a digital/social subject from a top University in England. I deal with clients regularly, I deal with outreach to the wider public regularly. I work with attracting and developing messages and engaging people on a daily basis. I'm never going to mention this again, but as people on this forum seem to only listen to a voice when it is wrapped in some kind of title, letters, or qualification, there you go.

Here are my thoughts.

1. Doge has totally different ambitions and market to us. It received marketing because it's brand was already in place and was strengthened by it's purpose. Doge was already a meme before it became a coin. It didn't need to build a 'meme', it was a product of a social phenomena. It made itself the best coin out there for it's purpose by designing a plan by WHICH IT ALREADY HAD THE FOUNDATION TO SUCCEED. Doge's aim was to be a currency of goodwill and it is set up perfectly for that. Dogecoin was not solely made to be associated with money, or purchasing of goods, it was made to be traded by people for social acts. The fact it is valuable (Not massively though by any means), is secondary to it's primary purpose.

2. Bitcoin has got 4 YEARS of social and economic development ahead of Blackcoin. It had endorsements in television shows (The Good Wife), it has articles and sponsorships in popular magazines, it is the face of crypto. Does Blackcoin have more potential? Yes, does it have as good an infrastructure as Bitcoin? NO. Will marketing Blackcoin alone move it ahead of Bitcoin? NO.

3. Millions of people to reach to say what? Buy Blackcoin. Why? What can they do with it? If someone buys Doge, they can use it right now in an addictive way through Reddit. It's supply and demand and it works. What use do normal, everyday people have for Blackcoin right now? -none-. There is zero supply and demand for Blackcoin right now outside of people that need to mine it to return their investments and people that are already connected to the Crypto world. The innovators of the future need to be reached, but the wider public at this point in time are just deaf ears.

If you asked 20 people on the street and told them to buy Bitcoin, they would ask "What the fuck would I do with Bitcoin". I'd be willing to bet 19/20 people wouldn't even know what Bitcoin was, or what the point was.

Think before you act is all I am asking this community. If you want Blackcoin to grow, let it grow. You can't force people to love it or accept it. It's not ready yet.

[barabbas]

I've said this many times before on there, your multipool is an accomplishment and done something, you guys get credit for this, but again and again does it matter if it's not marketed? This game of cryptos is about 95% marketing right now, and 5% projects. Those projects will only pay off when the marketing is done on them or over time. You guys don't get this, and I don't expect you to.

5% of your hard working efforts will only be noticed. You need to grasp that when your working on projects. Only once BC becomes LTC status of BTC status will your hard work have paid off and be noticed. It will be in time, but as of now it's about development that will take BC to next level, it's about marketing. We need both, and I commend you guys on this part, but your not businessmen and please stop this foundation, you'll kill this coin.

A note about Marketing for a moment


People are just crying MARKET MARKET MARKET, because they have no long term vision. 95% of people in crypto only care about the short term.

Everyone goes on about market this and that, but if the infrastructure isn't in place to promote, then it's pointless to market anything. If the foundation did a drive to promote the multipool before v2 has been completed, then new miners would just see a WIP and get turned off.

You can't just blindly market and expect it to work, it needs the right timing. Does no-one realize this? If the technology behind the coin is not in place, then all the marketing in the world will not matter, because attention will just be brought towards things that are NOT FINISHED.

To complete a good marketing campaign you need to make sure that your systems are strong enough to support the attention you are going to receive. Right now our core markets are A) Crypto enthusiasts b) Miners and c) Forward thinking investors who see a future in Crypto.

v2 is very close to being released, it will provide a very strong foundation for Black-coin. It opens up a sleek and attractive and more importantly, unique option to provide to the mining market. It is the most profitable pool out there, which in itself will bring people to it, but when it is finalized it will also be sleek, professional and will offer something NO OTHER POOL OFFERS. People have worked incredibly hard to create something in this multi-pool that will stand it above and beyond anything else that already exists on the market.

If you for one minute doubt how important that is to the current Crypto environment, then why has every single copycat coin (and already existing coins) in the last month suddenly panicked themselves into finding a way to integrate Multipool architecture into their coins?

I don't see every coin out there create USB cards, but I do see them building Multipools. I'm not trying to attack anyone here, I think any effort to help benefit this coin should be applauded, but I'm fed up with seeing people just clashing heads and down-talking other peoples work. If there is a criticism to be made of EVERYONE, it is that noone right now seems to be considering a long term plan and many questions are simply not being addressed in a unified way.

Take a step back

In the last week the team has dealt with a severe DDOS (and put in considerable defenses against these and successfully negated follow up attempts), done the Blackcast to open themselves up to their current core following, prepared the v2 multipool front end, completed the v2 backend and put together a marketing strategy for WHEN EVERYTHING IS COMPLETED and ready to cope with external pressure.

Blindly screaming MARKET MARKET MARKET will do more harm than good. Going to Wall Street and having the worlds attention turned to Blackcoin whilst many of the underlying areas are still being heavily worked on will simply apply too much pressure to areas that are already under stress. Give people a fucking break, let them finish the considerable work they are doing and be patient.

Has anyone out there actually considered the harm that one big Wall Street Whale could do to Blackcoin? After the dump from 90k people were ready to kill themselves out of depression all over IRC and these forums. That is but a tiny fraction of what could happen if we open the market up to people that could abuse and manipulate our coin for their own benefit in a short period of time. Our market cap is CHUMP CHANGE, for some people out there in the financial world, think about that for a moment, before your eyes fill with dollar signs. Not only that, they know how to play people like us much better than we know how to play them.

Part of marketing is thinking about the potential ramifications for the strategies you are putting in place, so let me ask a few questions for a moment.

1. Why are we targeting Wall Street?
2. Who is our target audience? Is it the world, is it the press, is it market traders?
3. What is our mission in attracting these people? Are we looking for patronage? etc etc

Everyone wants this coin to be a 'Luxury coin' but answer these:

1. What luxury goods can you actually buy with it?
2. Are these markets unique to Blackcoin? I.E If you can buy them with Bitcoin, what seperate Blackcoin aside from words?

I see a lot of blind yes men in this thread simply agree with things for the sake of believing that a) All marketing will be beneficial for the coin and b) that there is simply no need for timing. We can believe and make videos about Blackcoin being 'Luxury' all we want, but if you can't buy shit with it, then it's all just bullshit and people will see through it in seconds. You cannot market Blackcoin as a Luxury coin right now if there is zero infrastructure to back up that claim.

It's simple. When we have deals with Lambourghini and Rolex allowing people to purchase their goods with Blackcoin, THEN, we can talk about marketing the coin to the wider public as a luxury, but until then, stop talking about it. What we have is different to a product, we are not selling a consumable, we are selling a means to purchase consumables. In that respect you cannot just drum up a campaign to convince people they want Blackcoin, especially if that campaign is based around using it for something that physically doesn't exist.

Focus attention in the right areas and focus on the brand of the coin first and foremost.  

Timing is -everything-

Look at our rise to 90k, why did that happen? Because multiple factors all came together at exactly the right time. We had the convention, where the Blackcoin Foundation were present, we had the Black Friday, we had the Wall Street investment and we had the timing to be the first PoS coin to really grab the crypto worlds attention. All of those together turned that weekend into a frenzy of BC buying power. Why didn't the rise continue? Because it reached a point where the fundamental development and infrastructure of the coin could not support the hype.

Fast forward a month and we have people going crazy over marketing simply because they want some cash. Has anything really changed? Do we have the infrastructure to support such a rise? I would argue we definitely do not right now and that until Coinkite hits, we are still in exactly the same situation. Who knows what Coinkite will do? It might be incredible, it might not be, but until Blackcoin has a place in everyday society the mass public are not going to adopt it. Most people still don't even know about Bitcoin yet and it has only been in the last few weeks that I have been seeing "Bitcoin for dummies" videos over the local news channels (BBC etc).

Right now our target audience should be miners and the crypto enthusiasts. Build upon that solid foundation, first convince the crypto world that Blackcoin is the coin that sets itself apart from the other alt coins and then once they have been won over we can worry about the wider world. Stop trying to rush things, stop trying to convince everyone that screaming to the roof tops will do more good than harm when the social infrastructure for this coin is simply not ready to be accepted into everyday life. Not even Bitcoin has achieved that, so how can we expect to? We can build towards it, we can begin to work out how it might happen, but if we just scream to anyone that will listen, their first impressions of this coin is going to simply be "Well what is the point? How do I use it?"

From that standpoint, we need a PR team to help us with out ambitions, because I don't see logistics being answered, or even considered anywhere. Everyone is two steps ahead of where they should be. You can't force people to adopt blackcoin by ramming it down their throats, you need to be clever and have a clear plan that matches the social and technological progress of the product.

My two cents.

-Arigard.

First, Arigard, who are you, since this is your second post ever.

I would strongly disagree with you, marketing is everything above and beyond developement. Development is important, but takes is only part of this. Look at kittiecoin if you need a reference. They were huge on development and lacked on marketing. They didn't capitialize on memes, and wasted efforts on developing coin, which they at time had one of the strongest teams in crypto alts. They failed. DOGE on otherhand did most of what they did on hype and marketing. There is nothing special about DOGE, it's an alt LTC clone, but made itself one of the best coins out there.

BTC, sure it was first, and got noticed cause of that, but it's being actively marketed on purpose or cause it was first. Either way it's being marketed. It has by far biggest market cap. Now tell me, anyone that understands cryptos would in a heartbeat point out how inferior BTC is to any alt, yet it demands prices of 400 + per coin. Its slow, lacking, outdated, energy intense. Yet BC is greener, fast, innovative, pure POS, not minable. If we can market these things we would be #1.

Look outside community, not just inside the box. We have millions of people to reach. Hype and marketing will only do this, and will also bring more people on board as success follows success.

Your putting the cart before the horse here. Now both are important, we just can't have a board of unelected programmers running the business operations with the blackcoin foundation behind the name of there effort.

I just can't understand why more people here are not upset about this foundation forming, cause once you let it happen, good luck removing those in power positions. It will be near impossible. There is not democratic process to do so.

First, I agree with 90% of what Arigard post there... all the way to the point where he turns around and endorses the PR initiative. So he has been telling us about the convenience of built the infrastructure first and then he goes on the totally OPPOSITE direction and tells us that the PR initiative is now the way to go. I totally disagree on that. Totally. There's -as you very well explain in the long post -no benefit in PR, none. First clarify what is it the makes BlackCoin an option that will survive; then  get a lot of people to mine it by offering the best for the money multipool out there; simultaneously, get more merchants on board for withgout them, as you clearly point out, there's no benefit whatsoever to any PR, be it through gitzmos or stunts or coordinated by a PR firm. Once again, BC has done fabulously without any of them so far, why ANY have to be done at all? To pretend that BC will bring new money to cryptoworld is simply and insane pretension and, within cryptoworld, more money is SURE to keep on coming if the pool delivers and the trading keeps on bringing opportunities for traders/investors. Let it fucking develop, ok? Don't go out cheapening with overexposure to people that could care less about crysto and ridiculous hype. We DO NOT NEED marketing. At all. We need to do things right instead. On the technical side, on the actions and strategies of the multipool, on the transparency of the initiatives to keep it goin in the right direction.

The same obviously happens with your post, Brammien, while I agree 110% with the last paragraphs, I strongly disagree with the previous ones (except the question about who Arigard is, I agree with that too), Irreconcilable differences? perhaps. Open debate. Let others express and reason themselves. And please, do not get carried away with hasty decisions, be it the PR initiative, the Wall Street bimbo march or the land grab of the "Foundation". Think, everyone, but above all, the 5 developers, of the future. It WILL come. No point in rushing potentially damaging actions. "With PR on our side, the sky is the limit" writes an obviously deluded Soepkip... what is "the sky", one BC=one lambo? The "sky" is the continuing interest of the crypto world, and that has already been achieved. The rest, is progression, with logical initiatives targeted to the crypto community and then, when there are freaking places where you can spend BC in a way that benefits the spender AND the merchant, then it would be time to market it... not to the entire world necessarily, but to the customers of those merchants and services providers. Keep the powder dry for it surely will be needed in the future, when there is a reason to use it.

And to all brewing in ideas, keep them coming by all means but, above all, let's try and get some merchants or services providers to accept BC. Otherwise, we are just pulling our own legs and running hard on a treadmill: Going nowhere.

[blade87]

If you are tired of me "getting to much attention" then stop chatting 14+ hours a day on IRC and get something done. Because if all you and the dev team can focus on is the multi-pool and IRC, then we will keep having this issue every few weeks because I will always be doing something new to generate buzz.

See? There you again. Passive aggressive. So we are chatting on IRC for 14+ hours a day and being useless? Was this even necessary to post after I openly asked to begin some sort of compromise?

FYI I am an engineer. I work 40-50 hours M-F. My pool takes up the rest of my free time. I don't have time to chat 14+ hours a day on IRC. Any way, I tried with you plenty of times. I am done trying. It's a waste of effort and energy. I got nothing done with weekend for a very important presentation I have next week because of this whole mess.

[morituri13]

Barabbas, I appreciate your comments and concerns. The PR firm will be used to help garner retail adoption though.. That's the point of it? We can't be the everything you want us to be first and then market it without getting more and more people on board..

[TheBlackDogeOfWallStreet]

Some bullet points of significance:

-- The Doge: In the Blackcast, effectively, you said you rolled your joint but someone not paying attention to the preliminaries would have easily missed that and take that your were smoking grass as a statement... as, in fact, by your own recognition, you were making that statement only about tobacco. Sir, you came off, by far, the most eloquent of the group. By far. But your tobacco/grass statement was made and perceived by the audience and, sir, when you are representing BlackCoin, those "statements" are simply damaging for the image of Blackcoin. Besides, the three of you smoking seemed like a clumsy and blatant "product placement" of the tobacco/grass industry. You are obviously free to smoke whatever you want but you should think a few times what you do when you publicly represent BlackCoin. And someone should have advised you three that simultaneously smoking constantly during the blackcast was simply not acceptable. Naturally this critique would have more than probably be banned in your other forums: Contrary to pretensions otherwise, those other forums ONLY look for compliance, censorship and avoiding deserved -and beneficial- criticisms. You guys are NOT doing BlackCoin any good hiding in plain sight. You will have your followers, of course, but don't be fooled, the people investing in BlackCoin will go there where the TRUTH, in all it's sides and implications, is freely spoken, not to the "domesticated" sites you control.

-- morituri13 Who are you, sir? How much (in specific numbers and the wallet number for corroboration) have you invested currently in BC and what are your credentials to not only be a member of the "Foundation" but one outspoken one at it? "Small business owner" (thank you for at least giving that bit out), as in having an eBay seller account, hardly qualifies. But why don't you dissipate all doubts and tell us all who you are and how invested in BC you are.

-- Transparency. We all want it. Doge, we learned in the blackcast that when called you had "the team" ready. Who are them? What entitles them to be part of the proposed -or formed- "Foundation. As fellow investors, we NEED to know who this people are, what their level of investment is and why they volunteer to guide BC's destiny going forward, otherwise the entire group will be perceived as your sock puppets and we don't want to have that perception, do we?

-- Multipool. DOGE, I am still extremely confused about who is behind the multipool and running things there: Soepkip stated that the multipool "is not connected with the dev team" and that "it is important but not vital to BC". If you are "the man" behind that business (and that is exactly what it is, a profitable business, aside and benefiting from BC), can you please clarify? Who runs things at the Multipool, on the controlling side and on the tech side? and is it or isn't it a part of the BC project or a separate business profiting from it, meaning YOU, profiting from it? Look, you have invested time, money and a lot of effort in bringing this coin out and are responsible for it's success so far. If you are really invested in it, you have profited already enormously, to the tune of many thousand % of whatever was your initial investment. And that big stash of BC will make you even richer, very much richer indeed, if BC reaches a substantially higher valuation. THAT, sir, should be your motivation. If the multipool is a business on the side, then it should compete in offers with other pools ready to take on the BC business and RESPONSIBLE for whatever shortcomings -and DDOS attacks- they may have. If one multipool fails, for whatever reason, there have to be immediate back ups in numbers to insure practically flawless, continuous operation. If the multipool is in fact a "side business" or yours. If it is a business of BlackCoin, meaning all proceeds from it go to BlackCoin development, we need to have that aspect clear as clear water.

On the multipool point: Who makes the decisions as to what coins are mined? and why, which are his qualifications for that, what the strategy? Are the mining proceeds converted to BlackCoin immediately, regardless of the trading rate or, as I have read, those proceeds are first converted to BTC, held, and then converted to BC on "dips". Finally, officials at Cryptsy have stated that the delays reported and blamed on them yesterday, regarding payouts to miners, were in fact Multipool's fault for not having established 2FA, which is required from everyone. What was it?

-- Iconic's attacks. Although there's some poetic justice in the developments of the last 48 hours on that field (he's the one prone to promote bannings of dissenting people... dissenting with some or all or his opinions/methods), the juvenile peculiarity of the attacks, the viciousness in some cases and the totally inappropriate way of going about it by a seemingly coordinated gang, totally discredits those -including the devs- who have willingly and repeatedly participated, instead of the chosen target. Once again, I find the guy generally regrettable, an out of control dangerous egomaniac without capability of accepting criticism and in on this to make a buck by any means he find necessary, both on the coin valuation and on side business such as his card. But the attacks on him personally are, clearly, politically motivated. I don't personally know how much has he invested in BC but I am fairly sure he won't have any problem showing his wallet for everyone to see. If for no other reason that to keep him in check and benefit from some of his ideas, the proposed "Foundation" should have offered him a seat in their board. But it seems that the Foundation, with or without quotes, is more or less a fan club (of the DOGE) grabbing territory before "that crazy guy" gets the bulk of the community on his side and actually running things". Hastily doing so, can easily prove to be counter intuitive and obviously shows weakness. Repercussions, potentially serious ones, are sure to follow.

The "team" is me and St.Gnu + 3 developers that I pay out of pocket to work full time for us. They are not in the foundation, they are employees of LDG, they are my employees that get paid from my pocket, and I don't feel I have to justify to you are anyone why I hired them.

I run the pool along with St.Gnu, we are 100% equal partners, and an algorithm decides which coins to mine, the reason the acct didn't have 2fa is cause it was a brand new account, and required more than one person to access it for a day or two while we set up our automated liquidation system. Since 2FA makes it impossible to share an account, we had to forego it (although it's active now.) Another problem we ran in to, was cryptsy locks new accounts that have influx of a large volume of coins (we did not know this, and our account is fully vetted to the maximum degree now.)

I don't know how you are calculating profit, but everyone can see our hash rate, what coins we mine as well as how many blocks of that coin we get, and then do a calculation on how much we earn. Trust me when I say it's not a lot (go on do your own math and figure out what 2% from our daily haul.) It's not nearly enough to sustain the development that I am currently managing. Yes the pool fees are great for covering things like the server costs, cloud flare (200 dollars a month alone) as well as any little ol' problems that pop up and require some money (and they always do.) How ever these fees do not come even close to covering 3 peoples salaries week to week.

Me and gnu have given up and foregone profit, I am working the pool full time and so is he. We pass all of our profit along to the other programmers, including whatever's left of the fees after the server and cloudlfare are paid out. We have never once asked for a penny from the community, and have declined numerous donations.

The foundation consists of community members outside of the dev team, me and rat4 are the only people from the dev community that are on the foundation so far (as far as I know.)

We are currently working on a website that will be up with in a day or two, that will introduce everyone to the current foundation members. There's about 15-20 foundation members, all well known from the community since day 1. The website will not only provide full transparency of who is on the foundation, but will allow people to see current active foundation projects, and even possibly vote on where to focus the foundation's efforts next.

Transparency, I understand everyone wants it, but it takes time to build the tools to make sure that transparency is readily available. It's coming with the website, and will be greater expanded as we create the tools necessary to open up information to everyone.

I have even put my designer (that I am paying from my own pocket) to design the website, so it looks nice clean and professional, and all the information will be delivered in a nice coherent manner.

The multi pool is just one tiny facet of what we are developing, and our multi pool will be the most advanced multi pool available on the internet. Even the features we are pushing and testing today such as bucketed dynamic hash rate assignment per coin to maximize the amount of blocks being mined with out running in to the diminishing return problem of over saturating a coin have never been seen in a multi pool before.

If you have any further questions, or feel that I have answered anything in an unsatisfactory manner, feel free to contact me in IRC, if I am awake I answer 99% of all PM's, or send your questions to the BlackCast, and I will gladly answer them on air.

Thanks.

Edit: Also as far as Iconic is concerned and a board seat for him, although membership is available to mostly any one who is interested in joining, and has some resources to commit, I highly doubt after all of the attacks on the foundation, the development team and the community that the foundation would consider his membership. Had he approached this civilly, there would be absolutely no reason why he would not be able to have a seat on the board.

[L3pje]

If they lock the tread another one will just open up. Lets just all stop this BS and get back to implementing great ideas.

Why don't you just open up another BC thread for your 'thing'?

[morituri13]

Barabbas: "the rest, is progression, with logical initiatives targeted to the crypto community and then, when there are freaking places where you can spend BC in a way that benefits the spender AND the merchant, then it would be time to market it... not to the entire world necessarily, but to the customers of those merchants and services providers."

What I am saying is we can't get a store to accept us and then market to that store's clients? It's impractical to go door to door and attempt to get retail adoption by asking retailers... We have to create a demand on those retailers...

That is what you see everyday in BTC forums, people asking for customers themselves to ask for adoption. Only when large retailers see lost profit will BC gain acceptance.

[Ziploc]

Should IE sell all his blackcoin? Vote now!!

http://strawpoll.me/1627733

hey trolls...you pool is about to bite you in the ass....lol

http://strawpoll.me/1627733/r

[IconicExpert]

If you are tired of me "getting to much attention" then stop chatting 14+ hours a day on IRC and get something done. Because if all you and the dev team can focus on is the multi-pool and IRC, then we will keep having this issue every few weeks because I will always be doing something new to generate buzz.

See? There you again. Passive aggressive. So we are chatting on IRC for 14+ hours a day and being useless? Was this even necessary to post after I openly asked to begin some sort of compromise?

No that wasn't passive aggressive..that was aggressive aggressive.  Passive aggressive would be..."Maybe you should consider spending far less time on IRC and shift more of your focus to other things..."

Now can we go back to making money?

This could be a good week for BC if the BS can stop....

[hashmoon]

If you are tired of me "getting to much attention" then stop chatting 14+ hours a day on IRC and get something done. Because if all you and the dev team can focus on is the multi-pool and IRC, then we will keep having this issue every few weeks because I will always be doing something new to generate buzz.

See? There you again. Passive aggressive. So we are chatting on IRC for 14+ hours a day and being useless? Was this even necessary to post after I openly asked to begin some sort of compromise?

FYI I am an engineer. I work 40-50 hours M-F. My pool takes up the rest of my free time. I don't have time to chat 14+ hours a day on IRC. Any way, I tried with you plenty of times. I am done trying. It's a waste of effort and energy. I got nothing done with weekend for a very important presentation I have next week because of this whole mess.

all those truth, fact, wise words already told to those flamer, so 

-Never try to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and it annoys the pig

[Arigard]

First, I agree with 90% of what Arigard post there... all the way to the point where he turns around and endorses the PR initiative. So he has been telling us about the convenience of built the infrastructure first and then he goes on the totally OPPOSITE direction and tells us that the PR initiative is now the way to go. I totally disagree on that. Totally. There's -as you very well explain in the long post -no benefit in PR, none. First clarify what is it the makes BlackCoin an option that will survive; then  get a lot of people to mine it by offering the best for the money multipool out there; simultaneously, get more merchants on board for withgout them, as you clearly point out, there's no benefit whatsoever to any PR, be it through gitzmos or stunts or coordinated by a PR firm. Once again, BC has done fabulously without any of them so far, why ANY have to be done at all? To pretend that BC will bring new money to cryptoworld is simply and insane pretension and, within cryptoworld, more money is SURE to keep on coming if the pool delivers and the trading keeps on bringing opportunities for traders/investors. Let it fucking develop, ok? Don't go out cheapening with overexposure to people that could care less about crysto and ridiculous hype. We DO NOT NEED marketing. At all. We need to do things right instead. On the technical side, on the actions and strategies of the multipool, on the transparency of the initiatives to keep it goin in the right direction.

The same obviously happens with your post, Brammien, while I agree 110% with the last paragraphs, I strongly disagree with the previous ones (except the question about who Arigard is, I agree with that too), Irreconcilable differences? perhaps. Open debate. Let others express and reason themselves. And please, do not get carried away with hasty decisions, be it the PR initiative, the Wall Street bimbo march or the land grab of the "Foundation". Think, everyone, but above all, the 5 developers, of the future. It WILL come. No point in rushing potentially damaging actions. "With PR on our side, the sky is the limit" writes an obviously deluded Soepkip... what is "the sky", one BC=one lambo? The "sky" is the continuing interest of the crypto world, and that has already been achieved. The rest, is progression, with logical initiatives targeted to the crypto community and then, when there are freaking places where you can spend BC in a way that benefits the spender AND the merchant, then it would be time to market it... not to the entire world necessarily, but to the customers of those merchants and services providers. Keep the powder dry for it surely will be needed in the future, when there is a reason to use it.

And to all brewing in ideas, keep them coming by all means but, above all, let's try and get some merchants or services providers to accept BC. Otherwise, we are just pulling our own legs and running hard on a treadmill: Going nowhere.

Everyone is assuming that the PR company is going to incessantly spew out bastardized advertising. If it does this, then I will not agree with the initiative. I am under the impression however, that the role of the PR team is to build a tactile and developed strategy for implementing Blackcoin and helping to build it's infrastructure.

I.E If the PR team's job is to aid in getting Blackcoin adopted by traders (helping with pitches etc), identifying weaknesses with it's message and potential implementation then I am fully 100% behind it. These are the fundamentals we need to be working on right now and a plan for this is badly needed to unify the message. We need to be working out how we can actually develop a supply and demand for Blackcoin and if that is the PR teams job, which is what I imagine it to be, then great. That is a logical step right now. That is why I am not currently against it.