Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[Branko]

Land to Russia, minerals to America, and glory to Ukraine!

[BADecker]

~

Here is what you and almost everybody else is missing BIG TIME. THERE ISN'T ANY UKRAINE, LEGALLY.

When Zelensky cancelled elections, what he really did was conquered Ukraine, by cancelling the Ukraine Constitution. He talks Ukraine. But since he doesn't formally have any flow of legalization into what was Ukraine, it all is big talk... and that's all.

Show me law in their constitution which allows elections under martial law

Permanent suspension of the constitution is the same as conquering the country.

When Z maintains certain aspects of the Ukraine constitution to blind his people to the fact that he took over, this doesn't mean he did not take over.

Ukraine is Z-land... our second Z-land, spelled differently than the first one over by Australia. Or it's no-man's land, depending on who will take it away from Z, and then who can hold it after they take it away from him.

With Macron maintaining Z's security, France shows that they are interested in the land.

Regarding the talks between Trump and Putin, we will know they are meaningful when the sanctions are lifted.

[paxmao]

Putin is trying very hard to downplay the EU. The size of EU's economy is massive compared to Ruzzia - something between x9 and x10m so not even in the same range. Ignoring that reality is a life-changing mistake.

Land to Russia, minerals to America, and glory to Ukraine!

Let me see... so land to Ruzzia and then, Ruzzia out of the kidness of their hart will pass the minerals to the US? Interesting, looks as solid as the Bucharest agreement. You know... the one providing guarantees for Ukraine?

The fact is that if the US want to recover the investment, Ukraine needs to be free. All the rest is.. well, something like Branko's comment here.

But look, if the US does not want to have a good and balanced deal with Ukraine, Europe is ok to invest - it would be a great opportunity to generate the growth that Europe needs and, since the US wants to drop NATO and not being a trusted ally, well, I see no reason for Europe to share.

[...]

Here is what you and almost everybody else is missing BIG TIME. THERE ISN'T ANY UKRAINE, LEGALLY.

When Zelensky cancelled elections, what he really did was conquered Ukraine, by cancelling the Ukraine Constitution. He talks Ukraine. But since he doesn't formally have any flow of legalization into what was Ukraine, it all is big talk... and that's all.

The former Ukraine is Z-land, or noman's land. The governments of the West and Russia, and anybody else, know this. They have one big problem... conquering Z. And that's all. And they recognize this, even though us 'peasants' don't. They are doing the conquering in different ways. France is doing it by providing security for Z.

The point is, without a legal flow from Z-land into a land called Ukraine, THERE ISN'T ANY UKRAINE.

This is FALSE INFORMATION: Ukraine is an independent country since 24th August 1991, just a many of the ex-Soviet republics. Ukraine was recognised by Ruzzia in December 1991 and 182 countries of the 192 in the United Nations around the same dates.

Ukraine is a country. The Constitution of Ukraine has NOT been cancelled. Zelensky won power by elections - he does not "talk" about Ukraine, he is the president elect of Ukraine.

There isn't anything factually correct - nor correct under any interpretation in all you have said here.

You contradict yourself. Ukraine was cancelled by Zelensky when he broke the Ukrainian Constitution by cancelling elections. Elections are in the U-constitution. They haven'd been done. The Constitution has been cancelled. The new land is either a no-man's land or it is Zelensky land.

Did Z have an appropriately legal method for cancelling elections? Where is it? And did he follow through with it? Where is it?

The things you say are simply things that have been published by other countries. Even if they were published by Z, where is legal follow-through that makes them legal?

Simply stated, Z doesn't have any of that legal paperwork. Zelensky is the dictator of his own country that he conquered through destroying the Ukrainian Constitution when he disallowed elections. That's what is legal... not any hogwash that the West and Russia might be spouting. And certainly not any of your hogwash.

This is FALSE INFORMATION

- Zelensky was elected. He is less of a dictator than Trump as he requires the Congress for many important decissions.

- The Ukrainian constitution is being followed to the letter.The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during martial law (so yes, there is "paperwork" dumBAss). It is not only legal, it is exactly what the Ukrainian constitution says.

Altough you do not know, because you are a Chinese red-neck, not ever bothered to learn about politics and history, ,any long standing democratic countries suspend elections while at war. You do not read the thread that is obvious, because all this has beed discussed a few posts ago.

This narrative about Zelensky is being used by Trump to find an easy way out of his promise of peace. He though he would just bully Zelensky into signing a shitty deal. Well, as usual, trying easy yet wrong ideas to complex problems. Trump's branded shit.

BTW there are talks in Europe of dedicating enough to keep the war going for another year...

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-war-in-ukraine-military-aid-package-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelenskyy/

EU leaders plan €20B Ukraine aid package as Trump turns against Zelenskyy
As the U.S. turns its back, Europe is scrambling to step up.

[...]

The amount of European aid, which would include military hardware like artillery shells and missiles as well as cash, could yet rise farther as diplomats continue intensive consultations ahead of a gathering of foreign ministers in Brussels on Monday. POLITICO reported earlier this week that the package's projected value was €6 billion to €10 billion, but that amount has changed during the talks and could still evolve.

[BADecker]

~

You contradict yourself. Ukraine was cancelled by Zelensky when he broke the Ukrainian Constitution by cancelling elections. Elections are in the U-constitution. They haven'd been done. The Constitution has been cancelled. The new land is either a no-man's land or it is Zelensky land.

Did Z have an appropriately legal method for cancelling elections? Where is it? And did he follow through with it? Where is it?

The things you say are simply things that have been published by other countries. Even if they were published by Z, where is legal follow-through that makes them legal?

Simply stated, Z doesn't have any of that legal paperwork. Zelensky is the dictator of his own country that he conquered through destroying the Ukrainian Constitution when he disallowed elections. That's what is legal... not any hogwash that the West and Russia might be spouting. And certainly not any of your hogwash.

This is FALSE INFORMATION

- Zelensky was elected. He is less of a dictator than Trump as he requires the Congress for many important decissions.

- The Ukrainian constitution is being followed to the letter.The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during martial law (so yes, there is "paperwork" dumBAss). It is not only legal, it is exactly what the Ukrainian constitution says.

Altough you do not know, because you are a Chinese red-neck, not ever bothered to learn about politics and history, ,any long standing democratic countries suspend elections while at war. You do not read the thread that is obvious, because all this has beed discussed a few posts ago.

This narrative about Zelensky is being used by Trump to find an easy way out of his promise of peace. He though he would just bully Zelensky into signing a shitty deal. Well, as usual, trying easy yet wrong ideas to complex problems. Trump's branded shit.

BTW there are talks in Europe of dedicating enough to keep the war going for another year...

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-war-in-ukraine-military-aid-package-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelenskyy/

EU leaders plan €20B Ukraine aid package as Trump turns against Zelenskyy
As the U.S. turns its back, Europe is scrambling to step up.

[...]

The amount of European aid, which would include military hardware like artillery shells and missiles as well as cash, could yet rise farther as diplomats continue intensive consultations ahead of a gathering of foreign ministers in Brussels on Monday. POLITICO reported earlier this week that the package's projected value was €6 billion to €10 billion, but that amount has changed during the talks and could still evolve.

You are so naive. Either that, or you are an agent of the UK or the US or Ukraine.

For those of you who are watching this thread, look at the following video to see a little bit of what is really going on, from a guy who does this kind of stuff for a living:
A Scott Ritter Investigation: Agent Zelensky - Part 1

[hellflame]

The USSR now back as Russia again was always supposed to be a part of a European kingdom (one of the 10 kingdoms under the antichrist even if you believe this "crazy" theory or not it they care not) and Hitler failed to bring this about before his limited time had to be ended as the allied victory had to happen either way once his usefulness was over. For a second time including the time Napoleon ventured north it was the Russian winter that defeated the one to bring Russia into the future kingdom. Back then it would have not have looked so good if the allies turned on the soviets after the soviets had provided the top flank however it did not end the issue of Russia becoming part of the European kingdom by contract or by conquest. The fall of the wall with the help of old 666 did not even bring this about in totality apart form getting back some eastern european countries into the fold.

Ukraine is like a fuse on a cannon ball and that fuse has not even got to the core yet and the minions of Satan will not allow it to extinguish even if that leads to a catastrophic cataclysm foolishly thinking that such a game can be contained on a quarantined playing field. Any reprieve is temporary as the 3rd world war is highly likely to involve limited nuclear exchanges decided by the powers that be among themselves. Your opinions or lives do not matter to them.

Your "democratic" leaders do not represent you anymore than Putin represents the Russian citizenry. They represent those who ensured they hold office at whatever given point in time.

[paxmao]

[...]

Your "democratic" leaders do not represent you anymore than Putin represents the Russian citizenry. They represent those who ensured they hold office at whatever given point in time.

This FALSE INFORMATION, the leaders in the proper democratic countries are elected, with different methods depending on the country and type of election. All the process is transparent, observable and has in-built guarantees that ensure that the outcome corresponds to what people choose. This includes free press and the posiblity for nearly anyone to become a candidate.

Democracies balance a number of influences from different parties, people and economic interests, but they have to respond to people. The obvious difference with countries like Iran, Ruzzia, Korea, ... is that there is free press and the leaders can be removed without violence.

~

You contradict yourself. Ukraine was cancelled by Zelensky when he broke the Ukrainian Constitution by cancelling elections. Elections are in the U-constitution. They haven'd been done. The Constitution has been cancelled. The new land is either a no-man's land or it is Zelensky land.

Did Z have an appropriately legal method for cancelling elections? Where is it? And did he follow through with it? Where is it?

The things you say are simply things that have been published by other countries. Even if they were published by Z, where is legal follow-through that makes them legal?

Simply stated, Z doesn't have any of that legal paperwork. Zelensky is the dictator of his own country that he conquered through destroying the Ukrainian Constitution when he disallowed elections. That's what is legal... not any hogwash that the West and Russia might be spouting. And certainly not any of your hogwash.

This is FALSE INFORMATION

- Zelensky was elected. He is less of a dictator than Trump as he requires the Congress for many important decissions.

- The Ukrainian constitution is being followed to the letter.The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during martial law (so yes, there is "paperwork" dumBAss). It is not only legal, it is exactly what the Ukrainian constitution says.

Altough you do not know, because you are a Chinese red-neck, not ever bothered to learn about politics and history, ,any long standing democratic countries suspend elections while at war. You do not read the thread that is obvious, because all this has beed discussed a few posts ago.

This narrative about Zelensky is being used by Trump to find an easy way out of his promise of peace. He though he would just bully Zelensky into signing a shitty deal. Well, as usual, trying easy yet wrong ideas to complex problems. Trump's branded shit.

BTW there are talks in Europe of dedicating enough to keep the war going for another year...

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-war-in-ukraine-military-aid-package-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelenskyy/

EU leaders plan €20B Ukraine aid package as Trump turns against Zelenskyy
As the U.S. turns its back, Europe is scrambling to step up.

[...]

The amount of European aid, which would include military hardware like artillery shells and missiles as well as cash, could yet rise farther as diplomats continue intensive consultations ahead of a gathering of foreign ministers in Brussels on Monday. POLITICO reported earlier this week that the package's projected value was €6 billion to €10 billion, but that amount has changed during the talks and could still evolve.

You are so naive. Either that, or you are an agent of the UK or the US or Ukraine.

[...]

There, I have marked for you who worte it. If you think THEY are naive, you have not been around for too long in this planet.

On regards to YOUR FALSE INFORMATION, I refer to a credible source:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_presidential_election

Presidential elections were held in Ukraine on 31 March 2019.[...] The Central Election Commission (CEC) announced that Zelenskyy won the second round with 73.22% of the total vote[1] (or 74.96% of the valid vote). The elections were recognized as free and fair by the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe.[2

You can check the original sources as cited by Wiki.

If you wish to challenge this, calling "naive", "delusional", "uninformed" is not enough dumBAss, you need to give evidence of:

= Those elections not happening (tought cookie to crack).
= Zelensky not winning them.
= Elections not following due democratic process.

Else, you are providing false information. I may start listing the posts in which you provide factually incorrect data (not biaed "opinion"m simply fake facts).

[hellflame]

[...]

Your "democratic" leaders do not represent you anymore than Putin represents the Russian citizenry. They represent those who ensured they hold office at whatever given point in time.

This FALSE INFORMATION, the leaders in the proper democratic countries are elected, with different methods depending on the country and type of election. All the process is transparent, observable and has in-built guarantees that ensure that the outcome corresponds to what people choose. This includes free press and the posiblity for nearly anyone to become a candidate.

Democracies balance a number of influences from different parties, people and economic interests, but they have to respond to people. The obvious difference with countries like Iran, Ruzzia, Korea, ... is that there is free press and the leaders can be removed without violence.

Members of political parties follow the party line once elected and it is not the people who elect them that determine what the party line is. You get to decide who the supervisor or management is every so often but you will never change the stakeholders namely those who hold your debt or have indoctrinated your next batch of potential leaders and main opposition.

For example you are in the UK right? Ok lets see ...you had a prime minister alongside a minister for finance alongside a mayor of the city of London who also then became prime minister afterwards all in such positions at the same time who just happened to all go to school together namely Eton which shows a distinct hierarchial process or you have George Bush senior as president and then his son as president while his brother is governor of the key state in Florida at a critical point in time but of course we could be just coming to conclusions like the whole Iraq war debacle where the majority of citizens did not want their elected leaders to drag them into a war in the middle east https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_February_2003_anti-war_protests ....after all ....there were no WMDs found so what the haps?

You could have what is known as Helsinki syndrome although you seem to have a relatively high level of acumen however we all can fall into the trap of letting our opinions dictate our beliefs and some say opinions only belong to the ignorant and I do not think you are ignorant so am perplexed by the simplicity of your retort to what I said but feel free to have an "opinion".

I am sure some these people would love to still have such a luxury also.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiriyah_shelter_bombing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Kelly_(weapons_expert)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-13709515


A politican who serves the people who elect them instead of the people who ensure they get into office will either not remain long in office or get there in the first place. "State capture" comes in many forms and the most subtle ones point the finger at the most blatant ones. One day once the stage is fully set the masses will have a saviour though but he won't be their saviour.

[BADecker]

Just saying...

It looks like Europe is uniting behind Ukraine. At the same time, it looks like the US is moving towards uniting with Russia and breaking up their agreements with NATO. We won't know that there is anything between Russia and the US until the US sanctions are lifted.

It's too early to tell that this is happening, but there are a bunch of signals that show that this could happen with a few more moves by all these countries.

Note that all the while 'talks' are taking place between these countries, Russia is constantly moving further into Ukraine. If the talk remains talk, Russia will ultimately take over Ukraine militarily... except if Z decides to capitulate. Then nobody knows what Russia will do, because Russia does not really want Ukraine.

[DaRude]

...

[...]

Here is what you and almost everybody else is missing BIG TIME. THERE ISN'T ANY UKRAINE, LEGALLY.

When Zelensky cancelled elections, what he really did was conquered Ukraine, by cancelling the Ukraine Constitution. He talks Ukraine. But since he doesn't formally have any flow of legalization into what was Ukraine, it all is big talk... and that's all.

The former Ukraine is Z-land, or noman's land. The governments of the West and Russia, and anybody else, know this. They have one big problem... conquering Z. And that's all. And they recognize this, even though us 'peasants' don't. They are doing the conquering in different ways. France is doing it by providing security for Z.

The point is, without a legal flow from Z-land into a land called Ukraine, THERE ISN'T ANY UKRAINE.

This is FALSE INFORMATION: Ukraine is an independent country since 24th August 1991, just a many of the ex-Soviet republics. Ukraine was recognised by Ruzzia in December 1991 and 182 countries of the 192 in the United Nations around the same dates.

Ukraine is a country. The Constitution of Ukraine has NOT been cancelled. Zelensky won power by elections - he does not "talk" about Ukraine, he is the president elect of Ukraine.

There isn't anything factually correct - nor correct under any interpretation in all you have said here.

You contradict yourself. Ukraine was cancelled by Zelensky when he broke the Ukrainian Constitution by cancelling elections. Elections are in the U-constitution. They haven'd been done. The Constitution has been cancelled. The new land is either a no-man's land or it is Zelensky land.

Did Z have an appropriately legal method for cancelling elections? Where is it? And did he follow through with it? Where is it?

The things you say are simply things that have been published by other countries. Even if they were published by Z, where is legal follow-through that makes them legal?

Simply stated, Z doesn't have any of that legal paperwork. Zelensky is the dictator of his own country that he conquered through destroying the Ukrainian Constitution when he disallowed elections. That's what is legal... not any hogwash that the West and Russia might be spouting. And certainly not any of your hogwash.

This is FALSE INFORMATION

- Zelensky was elected. He is less of a dictator than Trump as he requires the Congress for many important decissions.

- The Ukrainian constitution is being followed to the letter.The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during martial law (so yes, there is "paperwork" dumBAss). It is not only legal, it is exactly what the Ukrainian constitution says.

Altough you do not know, because you are a Chinese red-neck, not ever bothered to learn about politics and history, ,any long standing democratic countries suspend elections while at war. You do not read the thread that is obvious, because all this has beed discussed a few posts ago.

This narrative about Zelensky is being used by Trump to find an easy way out of his promise of peace. He though he would just bully Zelensky into signing a shitty deal. Well, as usual, trying easy yet wrong ideas to complex problems. Trump's branded shit.

BTW there are talks in Europe of dedicating enough to keep the war going for another year...

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-war-in-ukraine-military-aid-package-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelenskyy/

EU leaders plan €20B Ukraine aid package as Trump turns against Zelenskyy
As the U.S. turns its back, Europe is scrambling to step up.

[...]

The amount of European aid, which would include military hardware like artillery shells and missiles as well as cash, could yet rise farther as diplomats continue intensive consultations ahead of a gathering of foreign ministers in Brussels on Monday. POLITICO reported earlier this week that the package's projected value was €6 billion to €10 billion, but that amount has changed during the talks and could still evolve.

Can you point exactly where in the UA constitution it does not allow presidential elections during martial law? Or explain why do you keep repeating what you know to be a lie

Article 103
The President of Ukraine is elected by the citizens of Ukraine, on the basis of
universal, equal and direct suffrage, by secret ballot for a five-year term.
...

I'm pretty sure it's been over five years since the last UA presidential election. Now, you can claim all you want that EU doesn't want UA to have a presidential elections, or even argue impracticality of it, that's fine but unless you can cite it, stop lying that UA constitution is being followed   once again, UA constitution suspends Verkhovna Rada elections during martial law, it DOES NOT suspend presidential elections!

Edit:
In fact Verkhovna Rada was considering confirming Z's legitimacy but just failed.

Deputies of the Verkhovna Rada, in the presence of the leaders of the European Union, failed a bill in support of Vladimir Zelensky's continuation of his powers.

According to the Strana newspaper, the resolution gained 218 votes out of the required 226. It stated that Zelensky "must fulfill his powers until the newly elected president of Ukraine takes office in accordance with part one of Article 108 of the Constitution of Ukraine."
...

Also https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2025/02/24/7499829/ if you don't like the previous citation

[BADecker]

^^^ Here's the problem with not answering paxmao. He won't simply go away after a while. He is the start of a new section of propaganda.

For example. Recently popular news announcer, Rachel Madow, said that Trump authorized the production of $400-million in armored Tesla's for government. That looks like a big conflict of interest for Musk.

The truth is that Biden authorized it. But how many people will go check it out? So, the Madow propaganda will stick and probably give people at least a little bit of an upset feeling with Musk.

Truth has to be expressed just to combat the lies. So, we have to answer paxmao, at least some of the time.

[paxmao]

@daRude

This is getting boring... There are more than enough reasons not to hold elections. For example that large parts of Ukraine are under foreign occupation.

But since you want the long version ...

Article 64

Constitutional human and citizens' rights and freedoms shall not be restricted, except in cases envisaged by the Constitution of Ukraine.
Under conditions of martial law or a state of emergency, specific restrictions on rights and freedoms may be established with the indication of the period of effectiveness of these restrictions. The rights and freedoms envisaged in Articles 24, 25, 2 7, 28, 29, 40, 47, 51, 52, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62 and 63 of this Constitution shall not be restricted.

There is an impossibility to cancel Human Rights, among these and widely recognised as such: "the right to hold free elections at reasonable intervals by secret ballot under conditions which will ensure the free expression of the opinion of the people."

Those conditions are not met, so..

But as said, I am not going to interpret the legal code of Ukraine, that is for people who understand it. Just google it.

Now,Can you point me to the Ruzzian elections international observers?

But it is largely irrelevant, Zelensky is not and has never been an obstacle.

https://www.nbcnews.com/video/zelenskyy-says-he-s-willing-to-step-down-in-exchange-for-peace-in-ukraine-232709189562

Volodymyr Zelenskyy offers to step down in exchange for peace and Ukraine’s Nato membership
President’s comment comes a day before third anniversary of Russia’s full-blown invasion of Ukraine

That is the problem, not Zelensky. I am sure he has no desire to keep being the President for ever - needs some time out.

You want to push elections to further de-estabilise Ukraine, create a narrative of power usurpation,... there is nothing of the like. There is a Ruzzia that wants to set the conditions to invade Ukraine again in a couple of years. As anyone may understand, it is much better for Ukraine to keep fighting now than letting Ruzzia re-arm and Ukraine dis-arm.

They whole thing now comes to arm-twisting as there is no possible peaceful agreement. Ruzzia is not ready to move, Europe is not ready to conceede. US politics is to sell suppor to the highest bidder.

So ... daRude, it is time for home made Ruzzian cookies, send to

Donald J. Trump
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington

^^^ Here's the problem with not answering paxmao. He won't simply go away after a while. He is the start of a new section of propaganda.

For example. Recently popular news announcer, Rachel Madow, said that Trump authorized the production of $400-million in armored Tesla's for government. That looks like a big conflict of interest for Musk.

The truth is that Biden authorized it. But how many people will go check it out? So, the Madow propaganda will stick and probably give people at least a little bit of an upset feeling with Musk.

Truth has to be expressed just to combat the lies. So, we have to answer paxmao, at least some of the time.

I have not spoken about it. but... as usual... THIS IS FALSE INFORMATION

Nothing has been authorised since it has not been tendered and the tender has not been won there was simply a government intent and forecast. My guess is that is simply another hidden subsidy for Elon and now that it came to light, has been stopped.

But worry not... he will get much much more

[o48o]

-cut-
If you wish to challenge this, calling "naive", "delusional", "uninformed" is not enough dumBAss, you need to give evidence of:

= Those elections not happening (tought cookie to crack).
= Zelensky not winning them.
= Elections not following due democratic process.

Else, you are providing false information. I may start listing the posts in which you provide factually incorrect data (not biaed "opinion"m simply fake facts).

Psychological projection has been weaponized to be as part of standard troll-factory techniques. BADecker is using words, that other people have been using to describe his bs. Difference being that he doesn't care how those adjectives should be used. They just made him emotional so he is suspecting it would work for others as well. Basically he is just deflecting like a child, trying to take the discussion to the level of a child.

Sometimes it helps me to remember that every accusation is confession with these guys, and the stuff he is accusing his "opponents" doing horrifies me to the core. They are basically admitting crimes out in the open. Funny how some of that rhetoric has been dropped as soon as their own guys have been caught doing exactly those things.

[paxmao]

[...]

Your "democratic" leaders do not represent you anymore than Putin represents the Russian citizenry. They represent those who ensured they hold office at whatever given point in time.

This FALSE INFORMATION, the leaders in the proper democratic countries are elected, with different methods depending on the country and type of election. All the process is transparent, observable and has in-built guarantees that ensure that the outcome corresponds to what people choose. This includes free press and the posiblity for nearly anyone to become a candidate.

Democracies balance a number of influences from different parties, people and economic interests, but they have to respond to people. The obvious difference with countries like Iran, Ruzzia, Korea, ... is that there is free press and the leaders can be removed without violence.

Members of political parties follow the party line once elected and it is not the people who elect them that determine what the party line is. You get to decide who the supervisor or management is every so often but you will never change the stakeholders namely those who hold your debt or have indoctrinated your next batch of potential leaders and main opposition.

For example you are in the UK right? Ok lets see ...you had a prime minister alongside a minister for finance alongside a mayor of the city of London who also then became prime minister afterwards all in such positions at the same time who just happened to all go to school together namely Eton which shows a distinct hierarchial process or you have George Bush senior as president and then his son as president while his brother is governor of the key state in Florida at a critical point in time but of course we could be just coming to conclusions like the whole Iraq war debacle where the majority of citizens did not want their elected leaders to drag them into a war in the middle east https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_February_2003_anti-war_protests ....after all ....there were no WMDs found so what the haps?

You could have what is known as Helsinki syndrome although you seem to have a relatively high level of acumen however we all can fall into the trap of letting our opinions dictate our beliefs and some say opinions only belong to the ignorant and I do not think you are ignorant so am perplexed by the simplicity of your retort to what I said but feel free to have an "opinion".

I am sure some these people would love to still have such a luxury also.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiriyah_shelter_bombing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Kelly_(weapons_expert)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-13709515


A politican who serves the people who elect them instead of the people who ensure they get into office will either not remain long in office or get there in the first place. "State capture" comes in many forms and the most subtle ones point the finger at the most blatant ones. One day once the stage is fully set the masses will have a saviour though but he won't be their saviour.

I live in Paxmania, in a luxury road underpass with seven dogs or maybe I am an evolved AI living in a cloud server in an unnamed island in the Pacific.

When the "party line" does not serve the public, the "party" is launched into obvlion, pacefully (unless is Trump) and quickly. There are many examples of parties and individuals that go from government to even non-existance. And you do not have to wait for the dictator to die, have a violent revolution nor anything else.

Your argument is "since it is not perfect, it is not good". To that, I can answer with



If people do not like those who choose people they went to school with, they can vote for other. For a moment I was not sure you were talking about Boris (UK), Trump, Berlusconi (Italy), Aznar (Spain)... they all gave ranks to family.

If they do not like Putin... well, they can always try to go to another country I guess.

Bottomline, Zelensky has been elected, so if you do not like it ... vote for another. I mean if you were Ukrainian, else too bad.

[tvbcof]

From America's standpoint, it would make a lot more sense to get Ukrainian (or former Ukrainian) rare earth's and other goodies from Russia than to try to do so via a bunch of impressively corrupt Zionazi freaks.  Cheaper and more reliable, and Russia has always been pretty good to their word when they make a deal.

The U.S. would do quite well to bury the hatched with Russia in a deal where the U.S. provides a nominal contingent of 'peacekeepers' in a line just beyond the areas that Russia might want.  That would keep the Europeans at bay (should general laziness and dysfunction not be enough.)  In conjunction with demilitarization of medium-range ballistic missiles Russia should be fine with this.

Again, a huge advantage of this for the U.S. is that it would reduce the propensity for Russian/Chinese relations to flourish.  Prices of certain of the minerals should also be subject to competitive market forces since currently global demand is met mostly by China.

The cat is out of the bag now and the world knows that if you want to win wars, you want Russian technology.  The longer things drag on, the more damage it does to the American arms industry.  Time to sew things up.  Maybe we'll even see the U.S. again supplying arms to Ukraine...the Russian occupied parts of Ukraine, that is, because it will take a little time to get the new borders properly labeled.

[paxmao]

From America's standpoint, it would make a lot more sense to get Ukrainian (or former Ukrainian) rare earth's and other goodies from Russia than to try to do so via a bunch of impressively corrupt Zionazi freaks. Â Cheaper and more reliable, and Russia has always been pretty good to their word when they make a deal.

The U.S. would do quite well to bury the hatched with Russia in a deal where the U.S. provides a nominal contingent of 'peacekeepers' in a line just beyond the areas that Russia might want. Â That would keep the Europeans at bay (should general laziness and dysfunction not be enough.) Â In conjunction with demilitarization of medium-range ballistic missiles Russia should be fine with this.

Again, a huge advantage of this for the U.S. is that it would reduce the propensity for Russian/Chinese relations to flourish. Â Prices of certain of the minerals should also be subject to competitive market forces since currently global demand is met mostly by China.

The cat is out of the bag now and the world knows that if you want to win wars, you want Russian technology. Â The longer things drag on, the more damage it does to the American arms industry. Â Time to sew things up. Â Maybe we'll even see the U.S. again supplying arms to Ukraine...the Russian occupied parts of Ukraine, that is, because it will take a little time to get the new borders properly labeled.

So... your peace plan is for the US to give Ukraine to Ruzzia and then pay Ruzzia for the minerals and depend on Russias good will to get them? And the "advantage" would be that they can choose betwee Ruzzia and China?? Have you smoked something other than tobacco?

 I can already tell you are going to have a difficutl time selling that to the US.

But it does not matter because the decission is not the US to make. They can cut support, but as Trump say... Europe is there, there is a whole ocean in the middle for US. If Europe decides to make this one year longer, it will be one year longer, and maybe another after.


BTW seems Trump is ok to talk to others as long as they have a nuclear arsenal.
https://youtu.be/OmL0g7PNsmc

[Branko]

I'm sure tsar Putin, emperor Trump and the great leader Kim Jong Un will soon meet in Yalta in order to consolidate this successful cooperation
 and determine the fate of the world for the coming decades.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-russia-us-north-korea-un-resolution-b2704015.html

[EdinboroSc]

I think Trump will take away part of the occupied territories from Putin.

[DaRude]

@daRude

This is getting boring... There are more than enough reasons not to hold elections. For example that large parts of Ukraine are under foreign occupation.

But since you want the long version ...

Article 64

Constitutional human and citizens' rights and freedoms shall not be restricted, except in cases envisaged by the Constitution of Ukraine.
Under conditions of martial law or a state of emergency, specific restrictions on rights and freedoms may be established with the indication of the period of effectiveness of these restrictions. The rights and freedoms envisaged in Articles 24, 25, 2 7, 28, 29, 40, 47, 51, 52, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62 and 63 of this Constitution shall not be restricted.

There is an impossibility to cancel Human Rights, among these and widely recognised as such: "the right to hold free elections at reasonable intervals by secret ballot under conditions which will ensure the free expression of the opinion of the people."

Those conditions are not met, so..

But as said, I am not going to interpret the legal code of Ukraine, that is for people who understand it. Just google it.
...

"Under conditions of martial law or a state of emergency, specific restrictions on rights and freedoms may be established with the indication of the period of effectiveness of these restrictions." != "The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during martial law"

So in what language "specific restrictions on rights and freedoms may be established" means "constitution does not allow"   (outside of the propaganda language)

But even then, can you point me to who and when, established a restriction on the specific right of presidential elections in Ukraine, as the constitution requires? And where is the "period of effectiveness of these restrictions" indicated? I'd love to read about it. Because as far as i can tell Ukrainian parliament tried but failed to pass any resolution resembling that Surely you'll have no issues providing that info, seeing as how you're so confident that "The Ukrainian constitution is being followed to the letter."  

[GoMaD]

Come on..

This is what i found:

Article 83... long quote

The constitution is pretty clear on this isn't it? Unless there's another article that specifically addresses expiration of presidential powers during martial law that i missed, claiming that Ukranian constitution does not allow presidential elections in time of war is a straight up propaganda and a blatant lie made to mislead the masses.

You found the constitution and even quoted something about 'martial law' and did not research it? I mean the martial law thing. It is written down like in every halfway sane country.

Here you go for the Ukrainian one: https://zakon.rada.gov.ua/laws/show/389-19

Have a look at article 19

And here the same thing from your beloved country:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law_in_Russia#Permitted_limitations
in your beloved language:
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%92%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B5_%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D0%B2_%D0%A0%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B8#%D0%94%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%83%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BC%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%BE%D0%B3%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%87%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F (don’t know how to quote that properly)
B пepиoд вoeннoгo пoлoжeния нe пpoвoдятcя[12]:
•   выбopы пpeзидeнтa Poccийcкoй Фeдepaции;
•   выбopы в Гocyдapcтвeннyю Дyмy Фeдepaльнoгo Coбpaния Poccийcкoй Фeдepaции;
•   выбopы в мecтныx opгaнax caмoyпpaвлeния;
•   peфepeндyмы.
Same thing different languages.

[BADecker]

^^^ The point seems to be this. Once martial law has been enacted, here is no way to assure that it will ever be repealed. What that means is that the country has lost its constitution, its name, and its identity... at least until the martial law leader removes martial law.

This makes the martial law leader into a quasi-dictator. Even though there are all kinds of protections written into the constitution to keep this from happening, martial law is essentially a suspension of the constitution until the leader voluntarily steps down and reinstates the constitution.

Zelensky-land... until or if he decides to change things back to the constitutional republic that Ukraine was.