[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[jaysabi]

So now it comes full circle again to simply limiting the mining (digging) to an amount that would be equivalent to a PoW coin that has been out for as many months as CLAMs has. Several hundred clams dug per day was a rough approximation I had come up with in the past.

There is no need to stop the digging but it must be limited so that millions of coins cannot get dug in a short period of time. Any low impact solution that does not limit the daily digging in some way will probably not save the coin. I can see it limiting the speed at which diggers can make money and increasing the value of the coin significantly. So diggers might be against it having to wait longer to dig all their coins.
But better CLAMS market cap be $1 million+ again and have to wait to dig your CLAMs than for them to be near worthless as the market cap drops under $100k.

So how long till this vote? And then how long after that for implementation.

I don't share your optimism that slowing the digging will result in a recovered price. Higher than it is currently? Possibly, but I'm skeptical it holds for any meaningful period of time. The problem is that even with slowed digging, there's already a great many more CLAMs out there chasing the same small base of buyers, and the buyers are mainly gamblers at JD. So unless you increase demand for the coin, the base of buyers doesn't increase, and the price doesn't recover, it just keeps slowly dropping.

Now the price might recover initially as confidence is restored in the system and people buy back in to earn their staking income under the delusion that they're "making money" by holding CLAM, but eventually to realize the "profit" they have to cash out to BTC, and when this happens in any meaningful way, the price plummets. This is the long term reality of CLAM. The falling price isn't an anomaly caused by the whale digger, it's the long term trend being accelerated by him.

[smooth]

So now it comes full circle again to simply limiting the mining (digging) to an amount that would be equivalent to a PoW coin that has been out for as many months as CLAMs has. Several hundred clams dug per day was a rough approximation I had come up with in the past.

There is no need to stop the digging but it must be limited so that millions of coins cannot get dug in a short period of time. Any low impact solution that does not limit the daily digging in some way will probably not save the coin. I can see it limiting the speed at which diggers can make money and increasing the value of the coin significantly. So diggers might be against it having to wait longer to dig all their coins.
But better CLAMS market cap be $1 million+ again and have to wait to dig your CLAMs than for them to be near worthless as the market cap drops under $100k.

So how long till this vote? And then how long after that for implementation.

I don't share your optimism that slowing the digging will result in a recovered price. Higher than it is currently? Possibly, but I'm skeptical it holds for any meaningful period of time. The problem is that even with slowed digging, there's already a great many more CLAMs out there chasing the same small base of buyers, and the buyers are mainly gamblers at JD. So unless you increase demand for the coin, the base of buyers doesn't increase, and the price doesn't recover, it just keeps slowly dropping.

Now the price might recover initially as confidence is restored in the system and people buy back in to earn their staking income under the delusion that they're "making money" by holding CLAM, but eventually to realize the "profit" they have to cash out to BTC, and when this happens in any meaningful way, the price plummets. This is the long term reality of CLAM. The falling price isn't an anomaly caused by the whale digger, it's the long term trend being accelerated by him.

I agree and that's a large part of the reason, aside from it being unethical, that I'm firmly against any undug CLAM grab. The do well in the future this coin has to grow and that means: a) long term confidence that comes from NOT tinkering with the parameters when it is convenient, and b) bringing new people and services into the ecosystem, which is helped not harmed by having a stronger distribution mechanism.

What if the next big digger is a huge site with a big BTC/LTC/DOGE wallet that instead of digging and dumping (as this digger appears to be doing) instead sees it in their interest to support CLAM on their site and promote it? That will never happen if the short-sighted decision is made to hurt future diggers in response to THIS digger.

[picolo]

Should have sold at 0.001+ :-D

It will go back to that price as big players loose and buy back some clams.

[chilly2k]

Should have sold at 0.001+ :-D

It will go back to that price as big players loose and buy back some clams.

  You've got plenty of time to sell at .001.  The price just needs to drop another .0005 and you're there.    I'm assuming you meant .01. 

[Chuck_Bartowski]

I agree and that's a large part of the reason, aside from it being unethical, that I'm firmly against any undug CLAM grab. The do well in the future this coin has to grow and that means: a) long term confidence that comes from NOT tinkering with the parameters when it is convenient, and b) bringing new people and services into the ecosystem, which is helped not harmed by having a stronger distribution mechanism.

I certainly agree that a coin needs long time confidence and i would like to see more services for clam (not only gambling sites, cause that wont help the coin on the long run either), what i find unbelievable though is that people in general think, rules on a coin made from starters are set in stone and can never be changed again..yet we are even not sure WHEN the digger will end, maybe beginning next year, maybe in middle of 2016 or after..

What if the next big digger is a huge site with a big BTC/LTC/DOGE wallet that instead of digging and dumping (as this digger appears to be doing) instead sees it in their interest to support CLAM on their site and promote it?

This Site would have all wallets like the digger on the exact date to do the digging, otherwise to promote the coin they just go to an exchange and buy these clam.

That will never happen if the short-sighted decision is made to hurt future diggers in response to THIS digger.

as far as i know, no one wants to remove the digging feature, just slow the digger down..

Greetings, Chuck

[smooth]

This Site would have all wallets like the digger on the exact date to do the digging, otherwise to promote the coin they just go to an exchange and buy these clam.

If you find wallets with balances just on that exact date it would be evidence of cheating.

More likely that the balances are there before during and after the cutoff date. That wouldn't be all that unusual for any site that keeps balances on many addresses (for example, gives each user a different deposit/payment address and doesn't automatically sweep everything right away).

As for going to an exchange, that has a liquidity cost. Right now to just buy 20k CLAMs you would double the price and many of those CLAMs would be bought well above the market. You then risk being unable to liquidate except at substantially lower prices. That might very well discourage new participants in a way that being able to claim a bunch of CLAMs would not.

as far as i know, no one wants to remove the digging feature, just slow the digger down..

Some have certainly suggested eliminating digging altogether, or imposing a tax that would make it worth a lot less going forward. I don't really see a good method to just slow it down, and especially not slowing down larger diggers without making it prohibitive for smaller ones.

[Noolz39]

price will be drop. more lo . see it again

[jaysabi]

So now it comes full circle again to simply limiting the mining (digging) to an amount that would be equivalent to a PoW coin that has been out for as many months as CLAMs has. Several hundred clams dug per day was a rough approximation I had come up with in the past.

There is no need to stop the digging but it must be limited so that millions of coins cannot get dug in a short period of time. Any low impact solution that does not limit the daily digging in some way will probably not save the coin. I can see it limiting the speed at which diggers can make money and increasing the value of the coin significantly. So diggers might be against it having to wait longer to dig all their coins.
But better CLAMS market cap be $1 million+ again and have to wait to dig your CLAMs than for them to be near worthless as the market cap drops under $100k.

So how long till this vote? And then how long after that for implementation.

I don't share your optimism that slowing the digging will result in a recovered price. Higher than it is currently? Possibly, but I'm skeptical it holds for any meaningful period of time. The problem is that even with slowed digging, there's already a great many more CLAMs out there chasing the same small base of buyers, and the buyers are mainly gamblers at JD. So unless you increase demand for the coin, the base of buyers doesn't increase, and the price doesn't recover, it just keeps slowly dropping.

Now the price might recover initially as confidence is restored in the system and people buy back in to earn their staking income under the delusion that they're "making money" by holding CLAM, but eventually to realize the "profit" they have to cash out to BTC, and when this happens in any meaningful way, the price plummets. This is the long term reality of CLAM. The falling price isn't an anomaly caused by the whale digger, it's the long term trend being accelerated by him.

I agree and that's a large part of the reason, aside from it being unethical, that I'm firmly against any undug CLAM grab. The do well in the future this coin has to grow and that means: a) long term confidence that comes from NOT tinkering with the parameters when it is convenient, and b) bringing new people and services into the ecosystem, which is helped not harmed by having a stronger distribution mechanism.

What if the next big digger is a huge site with a big BTC/LTC/DOGE wallet that instead of digging and dumping (as this digger appears to be doing) instead sees it in their interest to support CLAM on their site and promote it? That will never happen if the short-sighted decision is made to hurt future diggers in response to THIS digger.

Pretty well said. The ethics at this point are the most important thing to me as well, including the concept of the majority (however that is defined: by count or voting weight) having the power to affect the rights of the minority. I don't know that even the "right" decision made here can give CLAM long-term viability, but the wrong decision can certainly destroy it.

[gamblingbad]

Ok, guys. I'm the whale digger. I can prove it if necessary.

Yes, it is true that I am digging and selling my CLAMs for BTC. Though I am not dumping hard. I usually just put asks above the market price. I rarely ever do a market sell order. So although I am adding sell pressure to the price by adding asks to the orderbook, I am not "dumping" technically. The main reason why the price crashed hard is because the fear of me dumping. This lead everyone else to dump. Unfortunately, I made a error in my digging code when I did not randomize my dig addresses. Dooglus noticed this and was smart to figure out the total coins that I have yet to dig. He posted a comment on this thread and THAT was the reason why the price dumped hard. That's how markets work. Oh, and the chat about forking the coin made the price dump even harder.

I decided Yesterday to accelerate the dig but not change my selling strategy. So I should finish digging up all my coins in a few days. Maybe that will alleviate some of the fear. Sure, I will still sell CLAM for BTC when I feel it's a good price. I am not stupid. I will not dump the price to nothing and kill the coin. The market was doing that and not me.

Ask me anything, though I may or may not answer some questions.

Are you interested in selling in bulk?

[jpcfan]

Mr. Digger,


would you be interested in selling them all at a fair price. one buy from a pool of us clam holders?






p.s. i hope your getting a lot of hookers n blow now. congrats on the digs

[Noolz39]

Ok, guys. I'm the whale digger. I can prove it if necessary.

Yes, it is true that I am digging and selling my CLAMs for BTC. Though I am not dumping hard. I usually just put asks above the market price. I rarely ever do a market sell order. So although I am adding sell pressure to the price by adding asks to the orderbook, I am not "dumping" technically. The main reason why the price crashed hard is because the fear of me dumping. This lead everyone else to dump. Unfortunately, I made a error in my digging code when I did not randomize my dig addresses. Dooglus noticed this and was smart to figure out the total coins that I have yet to dig. He posted a comment on this thread and THAT was the reason why the price dumped hard. That's how markets work. Oh, and the chat about forking the coin made the price dump even harder.

I decided Yesterday to accelerate the dig but not change my selling strategy. So I should finish digging up all my coins in a few days. Maybe that will alleviate some of the fear. Sure, I will still sell CLAM for BTC when I feel it's a good price. I am not stupid. I will not dump the price to nothing and kill the coin. The market was doing that and not me.

Ask me anything, though I may or may not answer some questions.

have u proof bro?
do u like clam?

[xploited]

Ok, guys. I'm the whale digger. I can prove it if necessary.

Yes, it is true that I am digging and selling my CLAMs for BTC. Though I am not dumping hard. I usually just put asks above the market price. I rarely ever do a market sell order. So although I am adding sell pressure to the price by adding asks to the orderbook, I am not "dumping" technically. The main reason why the price crashed hard is because the fear of me dumping. This lead everyone else to dump. Unfortunately, I made a error in my digging code when I did not randomize my dig addresses. Dooglus noticed this and was smart to figure out the total coins that I have yet to dig. He posted a comment on this thread and THAT was the reason why the price dumped hard. That's how markets work. Oh, and the chat about forking the coin made the price dump even harder.

I decided Yesterday to accelerate the dig but not change my selling strategy. So I should finish digging up all my coins in a few days. Maybe that will alleviate some of the fear. Sure, I will still sell CLAM for BTC when I feel it's a good price. I am not stupid. I will not dump the price to nothing and kill the coin. The market was doing that and not me.

Ask me anything, though I may or may not answer some questions.

Can you sign a message from an address that you dug from?

[Noolz39]

would you be interested in selling them all at a fair price. one buy from a pool of us clam holders?

Sure, like I've said I'm not dumping. If you want to buy a lot at the current price, just tell me how much and I will put an ask order for that many clams on polonix. And you can take my order.

can you sell me 0.00110 on this price   ?

[DrkLvr_]

Ask me anything, though I may or may not answer some questions.

Hi, do you have any more big wallets or just this one?

[rindo]

I think if you donate a little  
bdw,,whether it would not be endless ??

[xploited]

Can you sign a message from an address that you dug from?

Do you have a particular address you have in mind. Otherwise, I can just pick one.

If you could pick maybe 2 address's you dug from the same block (any block) as sign messages for them that would be perfect.

Just want to say, if its really true thank you for coming forward!!

[tspacepilot]

Any low impact solution that does not limit the daily digging in some way will probably not save the coin.

Save the coin?!  How is the coin in need of saving?  I can see that the market price is lower than it used to be, but it's still many times higher than the world of shitcoins out there.  The idea that the world is coming to an end if we don't act fast is what makes us look desperate and scammy, imo.  Just be normal, rational, calm people and you've got no problems.  CLAM is still listed on the major exchanges, it's secure, it works, etc.  What's with the doomsday talk?

[micky123]

The digger appears quite genuine, anyone who checks his previous posts will know that. I have no doubt that you are indeed the digger. You seem to be level headed and this was probably a good decision to reveal yourself if only to re-assure people that you are not a dumper!

[Noolz39]

would you be interested in selling them all at a fair price. one buy from a pool of us clam holders?

Sure, like I've said I'm not dumping. If you want to buy a lot at the current price, just tell me how much and I will put an ask order for that many clams on polonix. And you can take my order.

can you sell me 0.00110 on this price   ?

No, why would I do that? Fair price is market price. Also, price will likely go up. It's oversold tremendously due to fear.

i sell my clams and want rebuy
if u have a lot of clams i can do sell of )

[bobboooiie]

What was the point/purpose of that wallet if I may ask ?