BitBay OFFICIAL BITBAY Thread Smart Contracts Decentralized Markets Rolling Peg

[dzimbeck]

Okay I have solved the issue with Mac QT wallet. Please anyone who is on Mac QT switch to the markets wallet until its fixed. Thanks. Please do not deposit to the address it has generated. Apparently it was run once and that wallet is being shared because its a wine build.

I want to stress that I have been developing the markets wallet which is a far superior wallet in terms of security.

The download was taken down until that Mac QT is updated. Thanks.

[Mika92]

I thank you all for your help, guys! I do appreciate it.. great project and great team!

[toknormal]

Okay I have solved the issue with Mac QT wallet.

[KrisCalaBow]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

[dzimbeck]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

Yeah I know what you mean, the USD is a supply of infinity (if you are fed reserve) and otherwise countless trillions.

Marketcap matters not supply. What's will all these new profiles repeating the same banter?

The rolling peg allows us to vote on freezing coins and it effects all users equally. Coins then have unique liquidity so each coin would maintain those properties to everyone who receives it.

This allows us to force the price of liquid coins in a dynamic way allowing us to vote on supply constantly throughout the day.

Totally decentralized market peg. Forcing stability at the same time as allowing price growth

[enhu]

Is there a wallet you can use that will sync quicker?
I'd like to move my XEM out from exchange. I'd send it back later when I can think straight and trade for more. Which wallet can you recommend that works faster?

[dzimbeck]

Also the Mac QT wallet has been updated. So anyone who used the QT wallet (not the markets one) should update to the new one.

Our stats showed almost nobody was using that wallet but please make sure to update. Let me know on slack if you are thinking of importing your old account.

And stay posted guys cause I'm working on a really nice new set of updates to the market wallet. Will update the stake pretty soon. Investigating what other things we might include with it.

[dzimbeck]

Is there a wallet you can use that will sync quicker?
I'd like to move my XEM out from exchange. I'd send it back later when I can think straight and trade for more. Which wallet can you recommend that works faster?

Our wallet downloads the chain but we have a bootstrap that doesn't need to sync most of it so I recommend that.

BitHalo for example is electrum based so it doesn't download the chain. As for altcoins very few have electrum servers. It's for your own security that the chain is downloaded because it verifies the transactions

[fluxer555]

I'm highly skeptical as to whether freezing coins can actually tame the market forces into a predictable/stable token value, especially with voting. Voting takes time, and the market moves instantly. Through what process do stakeholders determine what amount of coins to freeze, and can we trust them to accurately make that determination? Do you have insight on the incentive/game theory behind this, and perhaps investigated if there is any tragedy-of-the-commons scenario to look out for?

If I remember correctly, NuShares tried to do this and failed spectacularly. Let's not make the same mistakes.

[dzimbeck]

I'm highly skeptical as to whether freezing coins can actually tame the market forces into a predictable/stable token value, especially with voting. Voting takes time, and the market moves instantly. Through what process do stakeholders determine what amount of coins to freeze, and can we trust them to accurately make that determination? Do you have insight on the incentive/game theory behind this, and perhaps investigated if there is any tragedy-of-the-commons scenario to look out for?

If I remember correctly, NuShares tried to do this and failed spectacularly. Let's not make the same mistakes.

this is nothing like NuShares. They have a centralized peg. First of all, they are closed source, use custodial wallets and do burning and offer insane interest for parking.

This is nothing like that, this is fully decentralized AND dynamic.

First of all votes are counted a few times per day. The markets client already has voting and we used it to decide on a fork. The ones invested are
the ones who have a vested interest in price, volume, stability.

Also you can do freezing based on an algorithm. It's not opt in like Nubits, its forced.

A person with 100 coins who hasn't moved it since it froze 50% when moving it sets aside 50 as frozen and 50 as liquid. The transfer of the liquid coins is thus immediate. If the coins inflate those 50 become more liquid and his frozen 50 become gradually available 1/50th for each 1% increase.

The amount of times we count the vote will determine how fast the coins freezes and unfreezes. If we count 24 times a day and each movement is 1% then it could be 24% (compound) inflation or deflation. If we only count the votes once per day at a change of 1% it is thus 1% max a day.

You will all get the option to download a "demo" client where we can force the freeze on client side so we can all play with it and get an idea for what is going to be the most reasonable freezing system.

These variables are absolutely critical. Its makes a big difference how often votes are counted, how much it deflates in each step etc.

Also there is a way to bypass the law entirely with frozen funds as they can be moved "slowly" so they are really "slowed funds". The slowed funds can be moved under the condition that they are locked for 1 month. I used to think 3 but am now thinking of making it 1. We should decide on that time span too because everything makes a difference.

[KrisCalaBow]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

Yeah I know what you mean, the USD is a supply of infinity (if you are fed reserve) and otherwise countless trillions.

Marketcap matters not supply. What's will all these new profiles repeating the same banter?

The rolling peg allows us to vote on freezing coins and it effects all users equally. Coins then have unique liquidity so each coin would maintain those properties to everyone who receives it.

This allows us to force the price of liquid coins in a dynamic way allowing us to vote on supply constantly throughout the day.

Totally decentralized market peg. Forcing stability at the same time as allowing price growth

Alright so, marketcap is the share price x amount of shares available yes? In that sense, if this rolling peg is doing what I assume it is doing, then the price now is artificially made  to boast a higher coin price. Then as of this moment the price of BAY is overpriced since this price rise is due to artificial supply restriction and not genuine price appreciation through increased market demand. Please correct me if I am horribly wrong since I am actually not here to FUD like a mofo, I just want someone to point me to the proper direction where I can read up on the rolling peg and how important it is to how BAY works. Since liquid/illiquidity does not make sense to me at all atm... an asset is an asset is an asset.

btw, I miss you dzimbeck <3

[vlom]

wallet download is so slow. could you please offer a fast download option. thank you.
more than two hours for about 300mb.

[ptcgroup10009]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

Yeah I know what you mean, the USD is a supply of infinity (if you are fed reserve) and otherwise countless trillions.

Marketcap matters not supply. What's will all these new profiles repeating the same banter?

The rolling peg allows us to vote on freezing coins and it effects all users equally. Coins then have unique liquidity so each coin would maintain those properties to everyone who receives it.

This allows us to force the price of liquid coins in a dynamic way allowing us to vote on supply constantly throughout the day.

Totally decentralized market peg. Forcing stability at the same time as allowing price growth

Alright so, marketcap is the share price x amount of shares available yes? In that sense, if this rolling peg is doing what I assume it is doing, then the price now is artificially made  to boast a higher coin price. Then as of this moment the price of BAY is overpriced since this price rise is due to artificial supply restriction and not genuine price appreciation through increased market demand. Please correct me if I am horribly wrong since I am actually not here to FUD like a mofo, I just want someone to point me to the proper direction where I can read up on the rolling peg and how important it is to how BAY works. Since liquid/illiquidity does not make sense to me at all atm... an asset is an asset is an asset.

btw, I miss you dzimbeck <3

Marketcap is coins in circulation times the amount the coin cost at the time your looking at it. The price is not artificially high by the pegging system because it is currently not out yet.

The pegging system will work by a voting system. If everyone vote to deflate bitbay by 50 Percent the system would take that percentage of coin in your wallet and put it in a timed account where it can only be move 1 month later (1 month is how long the transaction will validated ).

[toknormal]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up

What exactly is f*cd up about it ?

NxT - which is almost dead has a 1B supply and it trades at nearly 2000 Sats. NEM has a 9 Billion supply and it trades at 2500 Sats. SIA has a 23 Billion supply which would equate to a price of 1380 Sats with Bitbay's 1B supply.

It's just 3 years solid development getting priced in.

[dzimbeck]

wallet download is so slow. could you please offer a fast download option. thank you.
more than two hours for about 300mb.

Are you talking about blockchain or the site?! It's actually not hosted at my server (the site) so I can't really do anything about that.
I'm assuming you are referring to the new Mac QT build?!

If you are talking about the blockchain you can download it precompiled here:
http://bitbay.market/downloads/

[dzimbeck]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

Yeah I know what you mean, the USD is a supply of infinity (if you are fed reserve) and otherwise countless trillions.

Marketcap matters not supply. What's will all these new profiles repeating the same banter?

The rolling peg allows us to vote on freezing coins and it effects all users equally. Coins then have unique liquidity so each coin would maintain those properties to everyone who receives it.

This allows us to force the price of liquid coins in a dynamic way allowing us to vote on supply constantly throughout the day.

Totally decentralized market peg. Forcing stability at the same time as allowing price growth

Alright so, marketcap is the share price x amount of shares available yes? In that sense, if this rolling peg is doing what I assume it is doing, then the price now is artificially made  to boast a higher coin price. Then as of this moment the price of BAY is overpriced since this price rise is due to artificial supply restriction and not genuine price appreciation through increased market demand. Please correct me if I am horribly wrong since I am actually not here to FUD like a mofo, I just want someone to point me to the proper direction where I can read up on the rolling peg and how important it is to how BAY works. Since liquid/illiquidity does not make sense to me at all atm... an asset is an asset is an asset.

btw, I miss you dzimbeck <3

The point you are missing is the liquid amount changes HOURLY or DAILY. So the idea that there is some "fixed" liquidity emulating a large marketcap is totally not true. The liquid coins can certainly inflate and they would to punish any vicious pumpers who try to take advantage of ultra-cheap pumps. The idea is to force harmony between volume (demand) and price (supply).

The frozen assets are quickly available once the volume increases. So only a low volume coin (might) have a lower effective marketcap. And you would definitely want it that way because you don't want supply to so far beyond demand of the target price!

This is the entire problem with Crypto!! They don't have any way to truly EMULATE larger markets. Forcing stability and consumer confidence.

Also, this is a massive benefit over hard pegs that rely on "trading tricks" and insanely unstable voluntary incentives (like parking) not to say we can't offer "bonds" like parking but this is truly the only decentralized free and fair way to do it.

There can certainly be two asset classes within the same "asset" as you call it because of the way I'm going to have miners analyse the coins being spent. They can force the division of the two by looking at prospective outputs and force you to make change on the ones not leaving your account. Although I've put together a very technical 20 page whitepaper, not yet published so its a lot more complex than I'm letting on.

Thus there are two styles of assets on the same chain. The frozen coins and the liquid ones. The frozen coins can thaw and become liquid quite fast if the volume rises and the price rises based on the communities collective wishes. And they would certainly want to freeze some of the supply if price goes too low and that my friend should increase volume!! Why? Because a person buying liquid coins knows a certain amount will be more valuable by watching the voting rate. If hes long on BitBay he will want this.

Also, once it reaches a stable target price volume again will increase because people know when Bitcoin goes down, they have a stable hedge far superior than the broken Tether!! Yes Tether went below a dollar proving yet again 3rd parties cannot be trusted. So it would be wise for an investor to quickly cash out BTC for BitBay because they can wait in BitBay as they watch BTC decline. And even potentially watch Bays value rise because the peg is "rolling" or "moving" and not fixed.

This dynamic system is exactly the same as how governments do it with the caveat that its decentralized and all users are in control (or an algorithm can handle it too). In my opinion its what Bitcoin should have been. Regardless we shall see soon enough! Fun times ahead.

"Rolling peg" is what I used to describe it. But also "moving peg", "user value protection", "freezing/unfreezing", "inflation/deflation" were some of the names tossed around. Let me know if you can think of other names for this as it's never been done before.

[stereotype]

I actually dont know jack shit abt Bay's coin supply.. can any1 elaborate? cuz for me, 800 sats for a 1B coin supply is just fucked up. I just wanna know what this peg thing is alot of people are talking about...

Yeah I know what you mean, the USD is a supply of infinity (if you are fed reserve) and otherwise countless trillions.

Marketcap matters not supply. What's will all these new profiles repeating the same banter?

The rolling peg allows us to vote on freezing coins and it effects all users equally. Coins then have unique liquidity so each coin would maintain those properties to everyone who receives it.

This allows us to force the price of liquid coins in a dynamic way allowing us to vote on supply constantly throughout the day.

Totally decentralized market peg. Forcing stability at the same time as allowing price growth

Alright so, marketcap is the share price x amount of shares available yes? In that sense, if this rolling peg is doing what I assume it is doing, then the price now is artificially made  to boast a higher coin price. Then as of this moment the price of BAY is overpriced since this price rise is due to artificial supply restriction and not genuine price appreciation through increased market demand. Please correct me if I am horribly wrong since I am actually not here to FUD like a mofo, I just want someone to point me to the proper direction where I can read up on the rolling peg and how important it is to how BAY works. Since liquid/illiquidity does not make sense to me at all atm... an asset is an asset is an asset.

btw, I miss you dzimbeck <3

The point you are missing is the liquid amount changes HOURLY or DAILY. So the idea that there is some "fixed" liquidity emulating a large marketcap is totally not true. The liquid coins can certainly inflate and they would to punish any vicious pumpers who try to take advantage of ultra-cheap pumps. The idea is to force harmony between volume (demand) and price (supply).

The frozen assets are quickly available once the volume increases. So only a low volume coin (might) have a lower effective marketcap. And you would definitely want it that way because you don't want supply to so far beyond demand of the target price!

This is the entire problem with Crypto!! They don't have any way to truly EMULATE larger markets. Forcing stability and consumer confidence.

Also, this is a massive benefit over hard pegs that rely on "trading tricks" and insanely unstable voluntary incentives (like parking) not to say we can't offer "bonds" like parking but this is truly the only decentralized free and fair way to do it.

There can certainly be two asset classes within the same "asset" as you call it because of the way I'm going to have miners analyse the coins being spent. They can force the division of the two by looking at prospective outputs and force you to make change on the ones not leaving your account. Although I've put together a very technical 20 page whitepaper, not yet published so its a lot more complex than I'm letting on.

Thus there are two styles of assets on the same chain. The frozen coins and the liquid ones. The frozen coins can thaw and become liquid quite fast if the volume rises and the price rises based on the communities collective wishes. And they would certainly want to freeze some of the supply if price goes too low and that my friend should increase volume!! Why? Because a person buying liquid coins knows a certain amount will be more valuable by watching the voting rate. If hes long on BitBay he will want this.

Also, once it reaches a stable target price volume again will increase because people know when Bitcoin goes down, they have a stable hedge far superior than the broken Tether!! Yes Tether went below a dollar proving yet again 3rd parties cannot be trusted. So it would be wise for an investor to quickly cash out BTC for BitBay because they can wait in BitBay as they watch BTC decline. And even potentially watch Bays value rise because the peg is "rolling" or "moving" and not fixed.

This dynamic system is exactly the same as how governments do it with the caveat that its decentralized and all users are in control (or an algorithm can handle it too). In my opinion its what Bitcoin should have been. Regardless we shall see soon enough! Fun times ahead.

"Rolling peg" is what I used to describe it. But also "moving peg", "user value protection", "freezing/unfreezing", "inflation/deflation" were some of the names tossed around. Let me know if you can think of other names for this as it's never been done before.

Does 'voter-peg' fit? Or maybe 'velocity-peg'.

[toknormal]

And even potentially watch Bays value rise because the peg is "rolling" or "moving" and not fixed.

Ah !

I get it now. So "rolling" in this context means that the peg itself can move ? So it's basically like a regularly freely-traded asset except that the exchange rate moves discretely instead of continuously ?

[btvGainer]

No matter what but the fact is that market perceive low supply coins as a good buy and prefer them.
Almost all coins trading above 10k has maximum supply not more than 150 millions.

[toknormal]

No matter what but the fact is that market perceive low supply coins as a good buy and prefer them.
Almost all coins trading above 10k has maximum supply not more than 150 millions.

Actually, this is incorrect. Market prefers high coin supply.

Of the 178 coins with a sub 5-million supply, only 3 are in the top 30 marketcap