Those that are breaking even or winning aren't necessarily all in a rush to cash out their coins.  So after playing, those funds remain in bitcoin instead of at the exchanges looking for buyers.  This creates a fantastic opportunity for bitcoin as now the currency is distributed wider and merchants others than just those who offer more than Anonymous VPN and GPU cards will start to see more bitcoin-related commerce.

Also, for those who have won big generally bet big, meaning they might be interested in buying the higher end goods and services that bitcoin has not yet seen much demand (e.g., travel-related like perhaps hotel, and airfare) or the funds might start being used to speculate and invest (in options, futures or forex -- all of which now can be funded using bitcoins).

What none of these articles mentioned is how the many of the winnings are likely not going to be reported as income for tax purposes.  So not only are some of these Bitcoin online wagering services offer something not available in Vegas or nearly anywhere else ("provable fair") and not only do they offer higher odds of winning (house edge with SatoshiDICE is less than 2%, whereas Vegas is four percent, and sometimes 8% even -- they offer user-definable anonymity for the payouts.

The casino gaming and online gaming industry is so large that even if the bitcoin-based wagering only captured a tiny fraction of that it would provide some decent lift in the bitcoin exchange rate.

Another thread on the article in the Press board:

2013-01-03 businessweek.com - Bitcoin: Making Online Gambling Legal in the U.S.?
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=134575.0

And the two other echo chamber articles:
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=134754.0 (the Ars Technical article mentioned in this thread.)
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=134753.0 (theVerge.com)

Awesome.  I know to keep it simple, you exclude the non-essentials.  But could the be an option to paste a GPG key for receiving the e-mails (which contain the refill card's PIN number)?

Bitcoin mining was at one time a "safer" way to invest in bitcoin.   Your purchase of a mining rig would still have value no matter what direction the future Bitcoin exchange rate goes.  

If the exchange rate goes up:  Of course, you would have been better off buying BTCs in that scenario but at least you didn't lose anything.
If the exchange rate stays about the same: You get both the bitcoins mined and retain the resale value of the hardware at the end.
If the exchange rate drops though, you win big (compared to the investor that bought BTCs): You get the full resale value of the hardware, you get the coins you've mined, and you get a lower difficulty, presumably, as marginal miners drop out.

Another type of investment in mining is a mining bond -- a purchase of shares where you only earn the right to the proceeds of the hashes.  This also would pay off if difficulty were to either drop or to not increase much over a period of time.   For the mining operators who raised funds through investment and used those proceeds to buy ASIC hardware, it is yet to be seen how well that turned out.   Another reason investment in mining is a way to put in coins from one source and getting an amount of coins back, gradually over time -- like a combination mixing service with the potential to profit rather than a guaranteed loss using a fee-based mixing service.

Now with FPGAs and ASICs, your used hardware has limited resale value.  FPGAs had the benefit though of being much more efficient than the technology they are a substitute for (GPUs).   And ASICs have the benefit of being cheaper and being much more efficient than the technology they are a substitute for (FPGAs and GPUs).

So the whole strategy of mining and investments in mining is different going forward than how it looked just six or eight months ago.


Also, each time you buy physical you pay a little over spot, and each time you sell you generally get less than spot.    When holding paper, conversion costs are pretty minimal.  GoldMoney.com, for instance, charges 1% to 2.5% over spot (depending on the amount purchase), but lets you cash out at spot.  They also have a small storage fee/

It can fluctuate.  Lately they've been getting a decent supply of coins so like right now you could buy close to $1,000 worth of coins and not pay much over what you pay at Mt. Gox ($13.50).   When there are aggressive larger buyers, the liquidity isn't that great and it can jump to 6% or more over spot.


Nope.  Just deposit cash into the account number provided -- the exact amount from the deposit slip though.


I'm remembering something to the effect of hours [max, if deposited early in the day], to following morning.  I don't see much in the way of complaints waiting on funds to be credited, except where the person deposited the wrong amount.

You might want to try moving this post to the Gambling board.   There probably aren't enough people around this board who also have a 5dimes account.

Ohh .. bad timing.

- https://bitcoin-app.com   <--  Facebook wallet.

To answer that question, the following factors are relevant:

 - Where are you located (country)?
 - How much are you looking to buy? [Edit: You mention the $800 range]
 - What payment methods do you have available or prefer (e.g., cash, bank transfer, etc.)
 - How soon do you need your bitcoins?
 - Is privacy important?

In the U.S.:

BitMe.com accepts cash deposit at Chase.
 - http://www.BitMe.com

Bank transfers provide the least expensive method, but they aren't necessarily the quickest.

Coinbase, available in the U.S. only, lets you instantly verify your bank account and order bitcoins, but you can't actually withdraw those coins until the bank transfer clears a couple days later. They charge just a 1% fee for buying coins.  The limitation for you might be the $100 per-day limit (the plain to raise that at some point):
 - http://www.Coinbase.com

Dwolla is another method to move funds cheaply from your bank to an exchange, as their fee is just $0.25 per transfer. Then from Dwolla you can purchase coins from:

 - http://www.MtGox.com
 - http://CampBX.com
 - http://BitInstant.com <-- To move Dwolla funds to any of the exchanges they support.

There are cash deposit methods available in about two dozen countries including U.S., Canada (CA VirtEx), Australia (Spend Bitcoins), New Zealand (bitNZ), many in South Asia (ECurrencyZone), Russia (BTC-E, BitInstnat), and a dozen countries that BitInstant now supports.
 - http://www.BitInstant.com

A local trade with cash might be your quickest path:
 - http://www.LocalBitcoins.com

There are a number of options:
 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Buying_bitcoins

Not sure what that is about, but the exchange rate that BitInstant uses when you order coins to an address is the current rate from Mt. Gox.


Ok, so you are mixing terms.  If you chose to send the funds to an exchange, then you are sent dollars.   And if you are sending to an exchange you would send to an account number, not to a Bitcoin address.

So let's back up a step.

What did you use to place the order.  BitInstant.com website, or did you use something like the "Cash" purchase method from Blockchain.info.

The deposit slip will tell you how much you are to deposit and how much (dollars) that ZipZap will send.

Did you receive bitcoins or dollars?   And where did you receive these funds?

Whiere did you make this deposit?  (i.e., was this in the U.S.?)

There are a few risks to be concerned with.

Firstly, any investment has the risk of a drop in value.   Bitcoin is a very volatile asset with price swings in 2012 from as low as $3.87 to as high as $15.40.  Do not invest more than you are willing to lose.

When acquiring the coins from the market -- there may be strategies that will help you obtain coins at the best price. 
Some exchanges will require that you submit identity to purchase coins for that amount -- at least if you try to do it all at once.  That may introduce delays, so keep that into account when planning.

Then you have risks once you have acquired the coins.  Are you planning on hosting them with another party?  There are counterparty risks in doing that.  Or do you wish to store them securely yourself?    For a larger purchase you may wish to consider an offline, cold storage method -- possibly using Armory.

If these concepts aren't already familiar to you, there's a bit of reading ahead of you before you make your full investment.   Since there might not be a significant benefit from doing it all at once, you might wish to go through the motions with a smaller amount of funds and then commit once you know the process based on experience.

VirWoX will take $50 per day so that recommendation doesn't help you much.

Any amounts larger will be problematic finding a trade due to you presumably having no trust history with paying using PayPal without any chargebacks.

Cash works well for buying bitcoins.  With a PayPal debit card you can withdraw at an ATM and buy coins with the cash through something like localbitcoins.com or BitInstant or the half dozen other cash purchase methods.

Or you could send the funds to your bank and use a bank transfer method.  Coin base will pull funds from your bank so that is one approach, if you are in the U.S.  Also in the U.S. is Dwolla, which will pull any amount into the thousands of dollars with a fee of only $0.25.  

If you really want to use PayPal, another approach is to buy something for someone using your PayPal, and then once they have the item you get your coins.  There isn't a whole lot of trade using this method but you might find a trade like this on the bitcoin-OTC marketplace.

  - http://bitcoin-OTC.com

LocalBitcoins seems to be solving the problem for lots of people.

Being in the U.K., you can use Pingit to buy coins from:

 - http://www.Blockchain.info/wallet  
 - http://www.BitcoinFridge.co.uk

You could also send cash (GPB) to Bitcon Nordic.  There are a number of options:
 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Buying_bitcoins

This probably isn't the right thread for these individual support reports.  Here's a better place:

Official Newbie BitInstant Support Thread (Active Customer Support)
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=128314.0  <--- Not just for Newbies

I forgot the condition where you have your account configured with a second password for withdrawals, then the backup is protected with that password as well.   If the attacker obtained the wallet password by malware that does keylogging, then the attacker probably has the second password as well though.

Or help to fund ventures that will facilitate that in their region?

These nations have a lot of imported labor.   These immigrants send money home, sometimes making use of hawala, other times paying the high rates for transferring cash.

If these immigrants could acquire bitcoins easily in these regions, that would help with half of the equation.

The other half is a way for the recipients to spend the bitcoins received.

Both sides are needed, and still way below the level necessary.

Try to buy bitcoins there now.   Your options are a CashU prepaid card (bought with cash at a retail location, and redeemed through Bitcoin Nordic).   Or LocalBitcoins, one seller -- who charges quite a premium:
 - https://localbitcoins.com/country/ae

Then try to spend the bitcoins in Indonesia.   Perhaps the first use will be for paying the mobile phone subscription:
 - http://www.BitcoinWireless.com   <-- Still in limited availability beta.

The TORWallet site is still up and I've asked the operator of the hosting company for status on the takedown requests.

The response indicated that there have been no reports to him [Edit: with supporting evidence] of anyone being scammed (and thus without that, no take-down action is forthcoming).  I've provided the hosting provider's email to multiple people who have inquired via PM, but I cannot say with certainty that any have submitted a report of having been scammed [Edit: or if contacted him, provided evidence].

Should anyone wish report their losses, here's the contact information:


[Edit: I would think all the evidence needed is a screenshot of the "Hot wallet exhausted" message right?]

What good does that do you if most everyone's private keys are wiped as well?

Well, they outnumber us by about an order of magnitude so preferring 50 and 25 versus 64 and 32 is obvious.


There are some people who think that Facebook ($FB) is a better stock than Alcoa ($AA) because a share of Facebook trades at $25 versus $9 for Alcoa.  These same people don't generally trade themselves so a basic understanding of stock prices isn't necessary for them. 

I personally didn't appreciate this until Bitcoin hit parity and suddenly instead of Bitcoin being these fake bits it was now "worth more than a dollar, so it must be somehow legit".   

The benefit of this decision helped bitcoin (in the court of public opinion) when it was critically needed.    What many sites are doing is displaying the amount of bitcoins in one field and right next to it is that amount's value in dollars.    This will ease the concern when we start seeing things priced in mBTCs -- where at one site you are paying 130 millibits for an item and at the next one the price is listed as 0.137 BTC.

From another thread:

I can't see any legal reason a payment processor couldn't pay out in bitcoins.  If there is the same AML/KYC followed as when paying out with a bank payment, then there shouldn't be any reason bitcoins couldn't be paid out instead.

More likely what would happen is that the merchants attracted to this might be the ones who have a higher risk of seeing chargebacks.  It may seem that there would be little difference between a merchant processor paying out for the charges via an ACH and then the merchant immediately sweeping those funds to a bitcoin exchange versus the merchant processor directly paying out for the charges in bitcoin.  Probably a difference is that when simply tossing the proceeds over to the the bank account there is less responsibility for the merchant processor (e.g., doesn't need to register as a money transmitter maybe?)

For the same reason, that's probably why there are no methods to receive other digital currency methods like Liberty Reserve either.

One other possibility is using LiqPay as a credit card merchant processor.  VirWoX and BTC-E, for instance, both use it in exchange for hard money. 

And, from another thread: