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Gold has a 3 Trillion dollar market cap and it's not stable.
When we start buying and selling things in bitcoin and when we can create entire companies that run on bitcoin, with no dollars needed that's when we may stabilize.
Also, I don't mind volatility if the big trend is upwards!
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Imagine you have a restaurant and you must show the prices at the entrance on that small blackboard....
You probably realize that you're going to hire a guy just to erase and write and recalculate the prices all day!!!
Plus, you ask for a steak at 50k satoshi and when the bill comes its 45k or 55k, I'm sure your customers are going to love that place
This does only apply if you are calculating using dollars. If the whole calculation is being done with satoshis, you would pay the 50k satoshi the steak does cost according to the blackboard. Unfortunately this only works with BTC being able to be used to pay for the restaurant owner's costs. Which would first require BTC to have a lower volatility and be widely accepted. This on the other hand wouldn't create such a big span from 45k to 55k sats though. So actually, this is an issue until we have reached mass adoption. Afterwards these problems will disappear. If you're willing to drive all the way to pinellas county florida. I'll cook and serve you a steak, albeit for 150k sats. This will most definitely cover my costs. If we used bitcoin for pricing this could have a stabilizing effect on the price. For covering the restaurant owner's costs it gets more complicated. If the restaurant owner could pay for the ingredients and then pay his taxes in bitcoin, it's at least theoretically possible. It's more than likely however that the restaurant is going to either have to pay wages and also possibly a mortgage as well as taxes. So there is a lot of adoption needed. Or the restaurant owner will have to already be in the green and simply not care. If the restaurant owner considers bitcoin valuable, he might be willing to accept it even if it doesn't make business sense. |
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That's great! This is very good news for bitcoin of all cryptocurrencies. This means that large companies are beginning to take crypto seriously.
Why do you people not at least skim the thread before posting. It's fake news. Or at the very least ambiguous. You can improve on the conversation by providing links, summaries and perhaps some genuinely new thoughts on this piece of fake news. Who posted it and why? Who benefits? A good enough post will get merited by the community. But posts like the one quoted above are "ignore list" worthy. |
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Bitcointalk Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=68448Post Count: 897 Merit Count: 525 BTC Address: 37qHfWfaN12oxJmz2AmUFrFgm2bRaWXn2S Telegram Username: Constantine N While I'm in a signature campaign already, I prefer the terms of this one and I'm more comfortable with the product. |
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Bitcoin was supposed to be used as a currency, not only a form of investment. However, it's been more successful as a form of investment, a "speculative asset".
Do you guys think that this can change in the long term ?
I completely disagree with the premise. I have used and keep using bitcoin to buy things. Yes, it's not ready for adoption at scale, but like every other technology it needs time to incubate. For the second question. Yes, I think things can change in the long term. Bitcoin could be replaced by a fairer crypto, although life is never fair, and one could argue that the way bitcoin was distributed, is as fair as it can get (as people back then didn't know the potential value) and future projects will have people waiting to try and jump in (thus the first ones being even richer than in the case of good old bitcoin). Bitcoin could be replaced. But I don't think it will be. And I'd like to re-iterate that it works perfectly well as a currency. I don't see how paying a 0.15 cent fee for a transaction is more than trivial. |
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In its rightful place on the trash-heap of history. Bitcoin Cash would already have been dead if it wasn't for a bitcoin developer responsibly and privately sharing a vulnerability with the bitcoin cash team. Watch this video to learn more: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiNm7ZilryERelevant part of video description: "Bitcoin Core team saved Bitcoin Cash from collapse earlier this year. We're discussing what happened and how it went down." -Ivan on Tech YouTube Channel To Bcash or to Btrash. That is the question. The answer is that bcash is btrash. |
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What is more interesting about this thread, is how many people reply without reading any of the posts.
According to the thread this is fake news.
To be on-topic please post an explanation of how this is fake news. Perhaps get the article and archive it on the wayback machine. Then archive the posts that point to it being fake news. Then archive this thread.
Then provide all of the links. I'm not kidding, if you do that and I have sMerit. I'll send you some.
For those who replied without following/reading the thread. Shame on you!
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I'm surprised no-one mentioned syscoin. Damn, the syscoin community needs to shill harder.
Syscoin is very likely to skyrocket in a couple of years with the release of blockmarket web. So you can make some gains. Probably not as much as some of the smallcaps but definitely less risky. Syscoin is still at year long lows.
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There's an ongoing debate in and outside of Bitcoin community regarding the economic nature of Bitcoin: is it a currency or an asset, a store of value, settlement layer and so on. The situation with ETF's also sparked some debates, as some argue that ETF's are bad and Bitcoin should stick to its cypherpunk roots and ignore the mainstream.
I think all sides kinda miss the point of Bitcoin. Bitcoin was created so people can send coins directly to others, without any mandatory middleman. Therefore, every use case is as legit as any other use case, it doesn't violate the freedom of any other user of the network. It doesn't even matter if Satoshi wanted Bitcoin to be a decentralized currency that will kill banks, because one of the principles of Bitcoin is censorship resistance, so if some people want to use centralized services, want regulated environments, speculation and so on, it's their right. All those things have no effect on people who want to use Bitcoin as an alternative currency.
So, I think there is no single answer to whether Bitcoin is an asset or a currency, everyone decides for themselves, because freedom is the ultimate point of Bitcoin.
I agree with you and yet I think that we should voice our opinions on what is going on. An ETF could hurt bitcoin long term. People letting centralized exchanges hold their keys can hurt the ecosystem. There are no rules except for cryptography when it comes to bitcoin. And anyone who wants to use it for any reason should be able to. That doesn't mean we shouldn't go after bad or stupid people, nor does it mean that what's happening in the bitcoin ecosystem can't be bad for everyone. |
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we are measuring it's value in dollars.
and what would you suggest we use to measure its value? it is the 21st century, we measure value of literary everything in fiat, those in US measure it in USD, those in Europe measure it in EUR, those in China measure it in CNY and .... that doesn't mean it relies on fiat. would you like us to go back a thousand years and measure value of things like bitcoin in goods? like saying 50000 satoshi is equal to 1 chicken? Yes good answer I think! every nations have their own fiat currency and always products considering by fiat currency. Actually I've made that argument before. I'd buy that chicken for 50k sats! As long as it's cooked rotisserie chicken. It's a really good deal. I'd personally sell chicken for 125k sats. Bitcoin doesn't depend on the dollar. I think the relationship is inverse. Just like any currency exchange. When you buy bitcoin the dollar's value against bitcoin falls and bitcoin's value against the dollar rises. |
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In short. Yes
The dollar is really struggling to maintain its place and there may be a power vacuum. It seems that no-one really wants to use it as a reserve currency anymore.
Bitcoin could replace it. I don't see why not.
Nobody wants to hold a depreciating asset. Yet, we don't have companies selling stock in bitcoin or oil being bought and sold in bitcoin. And even if governments allowed those things we don't have the capacity right now.
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My experience has been great. Well, except for those two things below:
2 Things.
1. Confirmation anxiety. Will it confirm in the next block. Why has it taken 30 minutes and there is no block yet! ( I understand that difficulty can only make blocks appear on average every ten minutes and not make miners find the next block in exactly 600 seconds)
2. The user interface could be a lot better. I think it has actually improved. But I want to be able to have some help in calculating the fee. Since bitcoin core already does this to an extent I'll put this at number 2
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My experience is similar. I didn't come in here for the money. I came here because I hated inflation. And I was young.
Wanting bitcoin to succeed, I spent most of it supporting merchants. I spent 0.5 BTC on desert!...... I had a freezer full of chocolate pastries bought with bitcoin.
Bitcoin was like $100 when I did that.
Now I look back and I realize that while supporting the merchants was good, maybe I should have been a little greedier. And yet, I don't care about exactly how much my portfolio is worth.
I understand this is still experimental and I want to contribute to it. I just have come to realize how hard life really is and that if I want to escape the worst aspects of everyday life, I need the money to buy myself the freedom to do what I want so I shouldn't just throw money around.
What I have in crypto, I am always prepared to lose. I don't rely on that for everyday expenses. I'm young. I can afford to take wild risks. When bitcoin fell from 20k down to 5k It didn't affect me negatively. I knew that might happen. I didn't feel like I lost money even though on paper I did. I believe in bitcoin and I know that success doesn't lie in the price.
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7 Trillion.
Gold is just a shiny metal. Eventually we'll mine it from asteroids and the price will, like the asteroid gold. Crash all the way to the ground.
Bitcoin is truly deflationary. People that go all in on gold and avoid bitcoin are short-sighted.
What will more likely come first, enough computing power available to a powerful organisation or government to render bitcoins encryption useless or asteroid mining space ships with access to a powerful and cheap enough energy source to make it cost effective. My guess is as good as yours. I think asteroid mining is easier. If we all wanted to prevent mining centralization, and things really did get bad we can always buy the latest mining gear and crank it to 11. If the government really was interesting in destroying bitcoin they could do it, but then we'd just hardfork to an algorithm that ensures we can outpace the government. Meanwhile, space mining is inevitable. The gold will probably just be a by-product of more useful resources that are out there. But as long as you can double the supply of gold and get rich in the process why not? My point was that bitcoin's supply is fixed, while gold can be mined to oblivion. |
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7 Trillion.
Gold is just a shiny metal. Eventually we'll mine it from asteroids and the price will, like the asteroid gold. Crash all the way to the ground.
Bitcoin is truly deflationary. People that go all in on gold and avoid bitcoin are short-sighted.
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I think I had tried martingale just for fun once with tiny amounts of money. It just plain doesn't work unless you have an infinite amount of money.
The problem is exponential growth of bets.
If your first bet is black.... You have a more than 50% chance of losing it right away.
Even if you win 3 times in a row, you can easily lose everything on the 4th time.
Say that you win 3 times.... take profit and then try it all over again. You're still relying on luck. You still haven't won anything unless you remove the winnings from your budget and you still only won because you were lucky against the odds.
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Selling the iphone was insane. The writer is lucky they didn't end up in the hole. I can't imagine myself doing this. Also, this is where I doubt the authenticity of the story.
How did the author get an uber back to the casino without an iphone?
But seriously, I view going to the casino as very expensive entertainment and that's why I wouldn't bet everything all at once like the author.
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Don't even think for a minute the chinese government is doing that to benefit the people. I'm sure that the communist party is benefiting from it. If they ever wanted the gold back they can probably find an excuse to seize it.
Bitcoin can easily escape the country's borders. Bitcoin can also become un-stealable by the government if the person is strong-headed enough or sends them to an unknown third party within China.
I also think that many wealthy party members stand to benefit by selling gold.
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Bitcoin hedead to zero?
The former ceo of paypal Bill harris said that,bitcoin's value will continue to dwindle until it gets "eventually a whole lot closer to zero."and saying that there's just no value in bitcoin and "Bitcoin makes no revenue, no profitability."
he also called the cryptocurrency is a
"colossal pump-and-dump scheme, the likes of which the world has never seen."
I think this is non-sense, what about you?
Source: cnbc
It really doesn't make any sense. Bitcoin is going to set the world free from the banks. Paypal is in bed with the banks and is becoming more and more like them. In many cases they are worse then the banks. It's PayPal's value that will eventually go to 0 as the price of Bitcoin and other crypto keeps going up. The moment that lightning becomes usable paypal becomes useless. and loses its existential purpose. |
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Between 1 and 5. Because I understand that when we hit mass adoption most people will be unable to even get 10 BitCents.
I mean I'd love to have 200 Bitcoins and I don't think there is anything wrong with being a whale. It's just not necessary. If I had lots of money, I'd probably get the most valuable asset there is: Good land.
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