Martin Armstrong Discussion

[altcoinUK]

^^ $50/btc ... gee I wonder who wants to buy in cheaper? gawd do you guys ever give up? you missed the boat, deal with it.

Are you sure?

go away you idiot.

TPTB_need_war is not an idiot. In many ways he is the smartest here. The problem is, he is having the fixation that he can predict the BTC price, so he talks nonsense with regard to that. I pointed out several times in this thread how and why he is wrong about the BTC price, but he is not an idiot, and I am sure you know that.

[sidhujag]

^^ $50/btc ... gee I wonder who wants to buy in cheaper? gawd do you guys ever give up? you missed the boat, deal with it.

Are you sure?

go away you idiot.

TPTB_need_war is not an idiot. In many ways he is the smartest here. The problem is, he is having the fixation that he can predict the BTC price, so he talks nonsense with regard to that. I pointed out several times in this thread how and why he is wrong about the BTC price, but he is not an idiot, and I am sure you know that.

So he created yet another account? We all know he's usually wrong with short term directions just like most ppl.. it's funny reading the predictions I make some money off of them

[altcoinUK]

^^ $50/btc ... gee I wonder who wants to buy in cheaper? gawd do you guys ever give up? you missed the boat, deal with it.

Are you sure?

go away you idiot.

TPTB_need_war is not an idiot. In many ways he is the smartest here. The problem is, he is having the fixation that he can predict the BTC price, so he talks nonsense with regard to that. I pointed out several times in this thread how and why he is wrong about the BTC price, but he is not an idiot, and I am sure you know that.

So he created yet another account? We all know he's usually wrong with short term directions just like most ppl.. it's funny reading the predictions I make some money off of them

I read somewhere that he was banned and using this account for now, but I am not sure. I think that account is TPTB_need_war.

You are quite right and we discussed this several times. Short term predictions from anybody are nothing more than pure speculations. Armstrong and others have no clue about the short term market. To be fair, Armstrong doesn't even try to be specific lately. He says: if this than that, everything is conditional lately. Though the long term view of analysts such as Armstrong or David Stockman still useful. I find David Stockman even more useful than Armstrong is. The man really knows the market. He had been telling with regards to the last 4 rallies that it is nothing more than a dead cat bounce. At the same time others were predicting new highs. He has been saying not after but during the rallies, make no mistake, this is just a dead cat bounce. He was right again, and at DJIA 18K the really was over. There is at least something specific from him. Stockman has been far more accurate and specific than Armstrong is, and his deep understanding about economy and the crocks of Wall Street is really useful in this nonsense casino market.

Tricky week ahead on the market. Now we had 3 consecutive down weeks. There were 4 consecutive down week only 4 times in the last 7 years, and most downside damage had already been completed after the 3rd week. Also, the two previous lows occurred following multiple lower highs, so the panic selling continued following a few highs - so far we had only one. This current downtrend is not convincing at all. In mid term I am with Stockman that it is a bear market.
In longer term, I understand what Armstrong expects that the US market will provide refuge for worldwide money, but I am not sure how Armstrong's super highs can work out in this bearish climate.

[marcus_of_augustus]

... the only person more wrong on BTC than Anonymint is Armstrong.

[sidhujag]

... the only person more wrong on BTC than Anonymint is Armstrong.

My financial astrologer also for casted "no hope for.bitcoin" after being told to look into the ASTRO chart for it... for what it's worth

[trollercoaster]

I think Armstrong will end up being correct about bitcoin (not surviving the other side of 2020) let's see.. 

[sockpuppet1]

... the only person more wrong on BTC than Anonymint is Armstrong.

You and Armstrong are both wrong on the future of BitCON:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1465136.msg14854131#msg14854131

As for the price action I predicted, stay tuned...

I think Armstrong will end up being correct about bitcoin (not surviving the other side of 2020) let's see..  

It is not clear if it will destroyed or merely turned into a tool to confiscate wealth, and a better Paypal for the masses. My bet is the totalitarian variant of the future. Click the link above to find out why. Men need a tyrant.

[...]

I think Armstrong will end up being correct about bitcoin (not surviving the other side of 2020) let's see..  

It is not clear if it will destroyed or merely turned into a tool to confiscate wealth, and a better Paypal for the masses. My bet is the totalitarian variant of the future. Click the link above to find out why. Men need a tyrant.

I very much doubt it becomes a "better" Paypal for the masses for the simple reason that it isn't better.

I would be bet on failure over widespread usage of a coopted system. In fact I'd lay significant odds on that bet. (Though failure is somewhat difficult to define precisely -- let's say significant loss of value and usage.)

I see even an oligarchy controlled Bitcoin as better than Paypal, because:

1. Bitcoin is a global politik; and thus even the Chinese mining oligarchy (cum banksters pulling the strings behind the curtain) can't do anything which isn't politically correct globally.

2. Thus Bitcoin will retain many attributes that Paypal as a corporate offering can't provide such as inability to deny any person in any account equal opportunity to access, inability to enforce holdbacks, block certain industries, and other arbitrary shit Paypal does which make my head want to explode. Bitcoin is a trojan horse launched by the global elite to subvert any localized attempt to block/control the shift to digital currency.

3. Thus I predict enormous adoption for Bitcoin, but just remember it will be owned and controlled by the global elite (aka the banksters). And the global socialism will enforce a global confiscation/expropriation of those with wealth, in the coming years. It will be a bittersweet success.

[...]

3. Thus I predict enormous adoption for Bitcoin, but just remember it will be owned and controlled by the global elite (aka the banksters). And the global socialism will enforce a global confiscation/expropriation of those with wealth, in the coming years. It will be a bittersweet success.

Meh, hardly anybody wants Bitcoin, and the only ones who do will just flee it and use something else if it becomes government controlled. Using Bitcoin now is a pain in the ass and something a relatively small number of people do at great inconvenience and only out of necessity (generally speaking holding it for as short a time as possible). They'll have no trouble switching to Zcash or whatever else if necessary for their purposes. The rest will just stick with actual Paypal and similar products.

The only ones with any real wealth in Bitcoin are speculators who treat Bitcoin like a Wall Street product (and often store it in easily-confiscatable form on exchanges anyway). Well yeah maybe their Bitcoin will get confiscated. Not really any different from any other Wall Street product, and not at all surprising (to me). A few of the smartest ones will probably be able to escape confiscation, again not so different from traditional finance.

For the moment Bitcoin is only a gambler's paradise, but the conversion to instant microtransactions is the key to launching it into mass adoption.

That is why the block chain size debate has been so contentious, because it is a battle over who (Chinese mining cartel + Blockstream, all controlled behind the curtain by the banksters) owns Bitcoin as it is scaled out.

It's pretty evident from the establishment embracing Bitcoin and things like this CME news, that TPTB will use Bitcoin as a golden parachute to escape the death trap fiat system they created.  They know it's extremely hard to do business using gold, and you would need to implode civilization back to the dark ages to make gold work again, so Bitcoin is their go to play to keep the wheels turning at an above caveman level.

Ever since humans stopped being hunter gatherers and settled land, it created abundance.  That's when the predator class arose to skim the abundance.  It's in TPTB' best interests to keep a high level of civilization running in order to skim it instead of having civilization implode back to ancient Babylon.  That would likely just implode their own standard of living as well once the caviar supply lines run out.

Yes, they create catastrophes to benefit from them, but I don't think they want ones so big that they become completely unpredictable and threaten their own power structure.  They always have some type of golden parachutes in mind, and Bitcoin is seemingly the only viable thing around for digital transactions in the coming great reset.  The world supply lines are very intertwined, and if you cannot do digital transactions on an international level because nobody trusts any of the currencies, then you immediately go back to the 1800's.  Do TPTB want to live in the 1800's?  Probably not.  They have to devise something to keep the wheels of the world turning.

Agreed, but they didn't create Bitcoin as the primary escape hatch from fiat collapse (which will instead be the one world currency reserve unit basket), but rather because they want to subvert any one nation's control over the digitalization of currency. They don't want a bastardized fragmentation of the digitalized commerce world. That is all good. The bad part is they control the global politik, and thus they control Bitcoin. They can easily incorporate capital controls and expropriation into the politics of regulation of Bitcoin and then they can easily implement it since they are funding and arranging the Chinese mining cartel and Blockstream's $74 million funding.

Edit: my take on the opportunities ahead:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg14855669#msg14855669

[altcoinUK]

Armstrong is very much spot on with regards to Bitcoin.

There is no future for the Bitcoin concept to which we all subscribed. There will be some Bitcoin, but the global elite will enforce money confiscation and traceability measures on the network. Not that tax and law enforcement authorities need to deploy their brightest agents to trace transactions on the network which by definition stores all transactions in a public blockchain. Still traceability, compliance with money laundering laws will be introduced by new legislations to send a clear message to the libertarian crowd. Governments will strike and change Bitcoin at the moment when the network start to threaten the status quo. Currently a mediocre fucking social network has far more users than Bitcoin has, Bitcoin is a non-factor in the context of global economy, and there is no reason for governments to intervene yet.
Armstrong is correct, there is nothing to do when the elite wants to retain its control over money and society. The servant minded, corrupt and greedy Chinese miners will adopt any forks and any measures of the Troika (EC, ECB, IMF).

[sidhujag]

Armstrong is very much spot on with regards to Bitcoin.

There is no future for the Bitcoin concept to which we all subscribed. There will be some Bitcoin, but the global elite will enforce money confiscation and traceability measures on the network. Not that tax and law enforcement authorities need to deploy their brightest agents to trace transactions on the network which by definition stores all transactions in a public blockchain. Still traceability, compliance with money laundering laws will be introduced by new legislations to send a clear message to the libertarian crowd. Governments will strike and change Bitcoin at the moment when the network start to threaten the status quo. Currently a mediocre fucking social network has far more users than Bitcoin has, Bitcoin is a non-factor in the context of global economy, and there is no reason for governments to intervene yet.
Armstrong is correct, there is nothing to do when the elite wants to retain its control over money and society. The servant minded, corrupt and greedy Chinese miners will adopt any forks and any measures of the Troika (EC, ECB, IMF).

Maybe by then btc core devs will implement measures for anon txs

[altcoinUK]

Armstrong is very much spot on with regards to Bitcoin.

There is no future for the Bitcoin concept to which we all subscribed. There will be some Bitcoin, but the global elite will enforce money confiscation and traceability measures on the network. Not that tax and law enforcement authorities need to deploy their brightest agents to trace transactions on the network which by definition stores all transactions in a public blockchain. Still traceability, compliance with money laundering laws will be introduced by new legislations to send a clear message to the libertarian crowd. Governments will strike and change Bitcoin at the moment when the network start to threaten the status quo. Currently a mediocre fucking social network has far more users than Bitcoin has, Bitcoin is a non-factor in the context of global economy, and there is no reason for governments to intervene yet.
Armstrong is correct, there is nothing to do when the elite wants to retain its control over money and society. The servant minded, corrupt and greedy Chinese miners will adopt any forks and any measures of the Troika (EC, ECB, IMF).

Maybe by then btc core devs will implement measures for anon txs

They might come up with such design, but that won't change the attitude of governments. Armstrong is correct, history indicates the elite is mad when the money is gone and there is no other source but need to collect it from the society. They will make the anonymous BTC an illegal instrument and will enforce the law on operation system or even hardware level. 95% of the users use commercial OS, and therefore it will be a piece of cake for the government to ban all anonym cryptos when the time is right.

[sidhujag]

Armstrong is very much spot on with regards to Bitcoin.

There is no future for the Bitcoin concept to which we all subscribed. There will be some Bitcoin, but the global elite will enforce money confiscation and traceability measures on the network. Not that tax and law enforcement authorities need to deploy their brightest agents to trace transactions on the network which by definition stores all transactions in a public blockchain. Still traceability, compliance with money laundering laws will be introduced by new legislations to send a clear message to the libertarian crowd. Governments will strike and change Bitcoin at the moment when the network start to threaten the status quo. Currently a mediocre fucking social network has far more users than Bitcoin has, Bitcoin is a non-factor in the context of global economy, and there is no reason for governments to intervene yet.
Armstrong is correct, there is nothing to do when the elite wants to retain its control over money and society. The servant minded, corrupt and greedy Chinese miners will adopt any forks and any measures of the Troika (EC, ECB, IMF).

Maybe by then btc core devs will implement measures for anon txs

They might come up with such design, but that won't change the attitude of governments. Armstrong is correct, history indicates the elite is mad when the money is gone and there is no other source but need to collect it from the society. They will make the anonymous BTC an illegal instrument and will enforce the law on operation system or even hardware level. 95% of the users use commercial OS, and therefore it will be a piece of cake for the government to ban all anonym cryptos when the time is right.

kinda agree but market is the market.. if world wants ideal money it will force those in power to change or else they lose power. They are not only lucky but most are also smart in knowing which way economy is going and getting ahead of trend. Lots of ppl in power lose power too.

[marcus_of_augustus]

They might come up with such design, but that won't change the attitude of governments. Armstrong is correct, history indicates the elite is mad when the money is gone and there is no other source but need to collect it from the society. They will make the anonymous BTC an illegal instrument and will enforce the law on operation system or even hardware level. 95% of the users use commercial OS, and therefore it will be a piece of cake for the government to ban all anonym cryptos when the time is right.

You're dreaming, and it's actually a particularly dystopian nightmare too.

There is no technical way these unnamed, shady, all-powerful 'elites' can achieve what you claim. You must not understand how computers or networks work to make such grandiose, rubbish claims about the omnipotence of government. Or it is really is your dream, in which case, fuck right off.

[hdbuck]

They might come up with such design, but that won't change the attitude of governments. Armstrong is correct, history indicates the elite is mad when the money is gone and there is no other source but need to collect it from the society. They will make the anonymous BTC an illegal instrument and will enforce the law on operation system or even hardware level. 95% of the users use commercial OS, and therefore it will be a piece of cake for the government to ban all anonym cryptos when the time is right.

You're dreaming, and it's actually a particularly dystopian nightmare too.

There is no technical way these unnamed, shady, all-powerful 'elites' can achieve what you claim. You must not understand how computers or networks work to make such grandiose, rubbish claims about the omnipotence of government. Or it is really is your dream, in which case, fuck right off.

Gov will ban bitcoin. This is the corollary to bitcoin's success.

[altcoinUK]

They might come up with such design, but that won't change the attitude of governments. Armstrong is correct, history indicates the elite is mad when the money is gone and there is no other source but need to collect it from the society. They will make the anonymous BTC an illegal instrument and will enforce the law on operation system or even hardware level. 95% of the users use commercial OS, and therefore it will be a piece of cake for the government to ban all anonym cryptos when the time is right.

You're dreaming, and it's actually a particularly dystopian nightmare too.

There is no technical way these unnamed, shady, all-powerful 'elites' can achieve what you claim. You must not understand how computers or networks work to make such grandiose, rubbish claims about the omnipotence of government. Or it is really is your dream, in which case, fuck right off.

It seems you are certainly not the sharpest knife in the kitchen, most likely you are a delusional one as well. Therefore no wonder you don't understand the environment in which Bitcoin operates nor you understand that governments can stop Bitcoin in many ways. These are including but not limited to legislations, ecosystem, hardware and application.

The easiest from government standpoint and the most obvious is legislation. Money laundering legislations - yes, that's how the crocks of Wall Street and IMF will play the game by presenting the dick to your delusional and arrogant ass via money laundering legislations - will ban a non compliant Bitcoin, and then 99% of individuals and businesses simply won't touch the thing. That's is the compliance level with financial regulations worldwide and therefore no reason to assume BTC will be any different. All countries on earth, including fucking Vanuatu and Cayman Islands will have to subscribe to the policies of the crocks of Wall Street and IMF.

I doubt it will be necessary at all because the legislation will be more than enough to keep the money away from BTC, but governments can also enforce the control on ecosystem level by pushing a new fork to the miners. Bitcoin is fucked on ecosystem level as the greedy, servant minded Chinese miners (and in fact any miner) will comply with laws and regulations. Yes, Bitcoin will exists, albeit it will be a money laundering legislation compliant type one.

The government can and most likely will act on operation system level. Since 95% of users use proprietary OS a non compliant BTC application will be excluded from all these users' computers.

Hardware. I doubt you know anything about hardware/firmware programming. I started that well before the average 28 years old demographics of this forum was born, and here is a news for you: there are discussions already that for "law enforcement" reasons ARM TrustZone and of course Intel architecture must implement interfaces, so "security measures" can be implemented by device manufacturers. What does that means? Even Linux (which obviously won't be the subject of the OS level measures) is fucked as no PPKI signing nor any other cryptography operations will be able to avoid this gate.

I am not a native English speaker, still, if you don't understand what I am saying, then instead of me, you need to fuck off from a rational conversation. On the other hand, your arrogant and delusional attitude explains very well that after 7 years endless media hype, hundreds of millions VC investment why BTC has less users than a mediocre porn site could attract.

[marcus_of_augustus]

^^just another armchair quarterback who wished he could hack ... yawn, what a pompous piece of govvy-worshipping, ass-licking.

Admit now you haven't got a clue, stop embarrassing yourself with so many puffed-up, empty words.

[hdbuck]

^^just another armchair quarterback who wished he could hack ... yawn, what a pompous piece of govvy-worshipping, ass-licking.

Admit now you haven't got a clue, stop embarrassing yourself with so many puffed-up, empty words.

+1 kids these days.

[altcoinUK]

govvy-worshipping, ass-licking.

Oh dear ... again, no wonder that after 7 years endless media hype, hundreds of millions VC investment why BTC could attract less users than a mediocre porn site has.

If delusional arrogant wankers like this one support a project then a project don't need any enemies.

[marcus_of_augustus]

If delusional arrogant wankers like this one support a project then a project don't need any enemies.

wouldn't think that losers like you hanging around spouting, incessant, misguided FUD has helped matters ... but it seems a broad church that is tolerant of all the lunatics and wannabes. What doesn't kill us makes us stronger ... hard to see what else good that you bring into the world. GCHQ calling?

[OROBTC]

...

As a mere wanker-citizen of Bitcoinistan, my observations below may be of limited value, but certainly are on my mind.

And those are the Entrance Ramps and Exit Ramps.  The only thing I have bought with BTC has been gold (Provident Metals, whose service by the way has been very good).  Provident, like all legit US businesses, has to keep detailed records, especially of things like who they shipped gold to...

Buying BTC quietly (as in no bothersome IDs or KYC issues) is rather hard.  Localbitcoins works fairly poorly in my city.

So, it looks to me like Armstrong may be right.  If the Iron Fist comes down on Bitcoin, especially if done by enough countries, I think they can essentially destroy it as an alternative currency for us "regular folks".  Clamping down on Bitcoin purchases for CA$H (etc.) and clamping down on businesses trying to cash in their BTC for currency (to pay bills, employees, etc.) looks rather easy for .gov to do.  And governments get dangerous when they are under severe pressure, which is coming...

And that's really my biggest problem with BTC.  The arguments (Core vs. Classic, price volatility, etc.), while nettlesome and even a little worrisome, are manageable for me.  Crushing Bitcoin by a malevolent .gov (which, again, Armstrong may be reading correctly) is of greater concern.

[sidhujag]

...

As a mere wanker-citizen of Bitcoinistan, my observations below may be of limited value, but certainly are on my mind.

And those are the Entrance Ramps and Exit Ramps.  The only thing I have bought with BTC has been gold (Provident Metals, whose service by the way has been very good).  Provident, like all legit US businesses, has to keep detailed records, especially of things like who they shipped gold to...

Buying BTC quietly (as in no bothersome IDs or KYC issues) is rather hard.  Localbitcoins works fairly poorly in my city.

So, it looks to me like Armstrong may be right.  If the Iron Fist comes down on Bitcoin, especially if done by enough countries, I think they can essentially destroy it as an alternative currency for us "regular folks".  Clamping down on Bitcoin purchases for CA$H (etc.) and clamping down on businesses trying to cash in their BTC for currency (to pay bills, employees, etc.) looks rather easy for .gov to do.  And governments get dangerous when they are under severe pressure, which is coming...

And that's really my biggest problem with BTC.  The arguments (Core vs. Classic, price volatility, etc.), while nettlesome and even a little worrisome, are manageable for me.  Crushing Bitcoin by a malevolent .gov (which, again, Armstrong may be reading correctly) is of greater concern.

int he short term yes, long term maybe not.. its about what the people believe is the ideal form of currency which the market takes. You can always put lipstick on the pig but sooner or later fundamentals catch up.