Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM.....

[tokeweed]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

I don't think it was that big of a deal to get a penalty.  It was a misstep, sure..  And a dumb one.  But really would Leclerc or Hamilton be given a penalty if they did it?  I don't think so.  They'll be reprimanded like Verstappen was reprimanded but it doesn't deserve a penalty imho.

This an interesting market...  

Group 4:

Gasly, Pierre 3.00
Tsunoda, Yuki 3.00
Zhou, Guanyu 3.00
Schumacher, Mick 5.00

What do you guys think and who would you pick?  Gasly could be the best driver here but he's behind those other drivers.  :/

From those 4 you have chosen in theory yes an odd of 3 should be really generous on Gasly but keep in mind that tomorrow we are racing under race conditions and that is why we see such high odds for all the drivers because of the unknown the rain brings.

If we were in normal conditions between those 4 drivers I think the real odd of Gasly should be something like 1.7 to 1.8 as a maximum.Still from the bets I prefer head 2 head bets in F1,they are much easier to find if the cars do not have failures of any kind.

Seeing how everything in the race panned out right now, it looks like dropping a little coin on Mick Schumacher would've been a good value bet.  Case in point, the rain made it very unpredictable so the best move was to pass and save your money.  And if ever you reeeally wanted to degen it up and still make a bet at these track conditions, just go for the guy that's paying the most value.

Anyway, I'm seeing a counter at the top left corner that has a count down.  It's '1:46:57' rn..  I'll assume that's how long we wait before the FIA decides if the race goes on or not.  :/  Lmao.  Fk this am going back to sleep.

[ILuckyGuyI]

It doesn't feel like this race will start again. I think they should give it a try and see how it goes. Hamilton also seems to be eager to race now as he shared a story on his Instagram. There's nearly one hour left for the end of the maximum time of the race.

I wonder what FIA are planning to do about Gasly's complain. It was really dangerous to put a tractor on the track while the drivers were still racing actively. Gasly could have crashed into it and the consequences would be really worrying. We've lost Bianchi in the past because of a similar reason. However FIA don't seem like they even care about this considering their answer. It's so wrong. 

When it comes to the start I wouldn't be surprised if Verstappen - Leclerc duo had a crash. Because Verstappen took a big risk by pushing to the limit from the outside of Leclerc to get past him again. Leclerc had a really good start there. I'm sad for Sainz as he made a simple mistake and it cost him the race.

[Koal-84]

Hopefully it won't happen in Japan like it did in Belgium last year, with points being handed out here as well. Is there an exact regulation? I would be in favour of it, if the race is no longer started, there should also be no points.

[tokeweed]

Vote GOATIFI NAO!

[coinlocket$]

RBR is just much better, they are faster in any condition.

Easy win for Max, I'm guessing Leclerc is under investigation, just imagine if he gives him 5 seconds now...

[Juggy777]

Pole position for Max but he is under investigation.

He deserves a penalty for impeding to Norris but as we already know, RBR is basically immune and he will keep the 1st position.

I don't think it was that big of a deal to get a penalty.  It was a misstep, sure..  And a dumb one.  But really would Leclerc or Hamilton be given a penalty if they did it?  I don't think so.  They'll be reprimanded like Verstappen was reprimanded but it doesn't deserve a penalty imho.

This an interesting market...  

Group 4:

Gasly, Pierre 3.00
Tsunoda, Yuki 3.00
Zhou, Guanyu 3.00
Schumacher, Mick 5.00

What do you guys think and who would you pick?  Gasly could be the best driver here but he's behind those other drivers.  :/

From those 4 you have chosen in theory yes an odd of 3 should be really generous on Gasly but keep in mind that tomorrow we are racing under race conditions and that is why we see such high odds for all the drivers because of the unknown the rain brings.

If we were in normal conditions between those 4 drivers I think the real odd of Gasly should be something like 1.7 to 1.8 as a maximum.Still from the bets I prefer head 2 head bets in F1,they are much easier to find if the cars do not have failures of any kind.

Seeing how everything in the race panned out right now, it looks like dropping a little coin on Mick Schumacher would've been a good value bet.  Case in point, the rain made it very unpredictable so the best move was to pass and save your money.  And if ever you reeeally wanted to degen it up and still make a bet at these track conditions, just go for the guy that's paying the most value.

Anyway, I'm seeing a counter at the top left corner that has a count down.  It's '1:46:57' rn..  I'll assume that's how long we wait before the FIA decides if the race goes on or not.  :/  Lmao.  Fk this am going back to sleep.

RBR is just much better, they are faster in any condition.

Easy win for Max, I'm guessing Leclerc is under investigation, just imagine if he gives him 5 seconds now...

I can’t believe how messy this race got, but in the end we have a winner in Max who has won the world title and in my opinion which I think I have said it before too that he’s the new Hamilton, and this seems to be the end of the Hamilton era. @coinlocket$ you jinxed him didn’t you, because he got a 5 second penalty and with this Ferrari continues to disappoint despite promising a lot they just can’t seem to deliver.

[LTU_btc]

Easy win for Max and now he won his 2nd champion title is hilarious. But the way they announced it is hilarious. First they announce it on post race interview, later they probably didn't figured out whether full or 50% points will be awarded and in rest room it was said that Max isn't champion yet. And finally after awards were given, here comes Button to announce that Max is champion.
I already thought that race won't happen and we will have another Spa. Fortunately, we saw race. But it's almost impossible to overtake in Suzuka in such conditions and without DRS.
And finally GOATifi gets his first 2 points this season. And he deserved it today.

Easy win for Max, I'm guessing Leclerc is under investigation, just imagine if he gives him 5 seconds now...

It would be something unbeleavable if he wouldn't received penalty for cutting corner and gaining advantage.

[Koal-84]

So again very strange decisions from the FIA, now there are the full points again and not the half points, you don't have to understand everything the FIA does.

But congratulations to Max Verstappen, this year it was a well-deserved world championship title, and Ferrari itself helped a lot with the early world championship title.

[coinlocket$]

It would be something unbeleavable if he wouldn't received penalty for cutting corner and gaining advantage.

The common sense is to give penalty in the following circumstances:

- is not the 1st cut they do during the race
- the opponent is doing an overtake and you gain an advantage doing the cut.

Both of these requirements were missing.

I don't think I can recall a case of a 5-second penalty for a cut while the opponent is not doing an overtake.

[Distraction]

FIA were a huge fiasco today. I really wonder what kind of people are in race control now. This was an important race for Verstappen to announce his second title. I don't know how FIA can't get more prepared for a special race like this. They made really unbelievable mistakes. Some of them were like:

- We saw a tractor coming in before the drivers entered pit lane.
- They finished the race one lap early.
- Gasly got unbelievable penalties like 20-sec time penalty and 2 penalty points for speeding under red flag (But as for FIA's huge mistake about the tractor, there is no problem according to them  ).
- They shouldn't have given full points for this race because it wasn't even a full race.
- They weren't even sure of Verstappen's championship for a while.  

I think Leclerc's penalty was fair because he pushed Perez outside while Perez was trying to overtake him. We see 5-sec penalty being given in this kind of situations actually.

[swogerino]

So again very strange decisions from the FIA, now there are the full points again and not the half points, you don't have to understand everything the FIA does.

But congratulations to Max Verstappen, this year it was a well-deserved world championship title, and Ferrari itself helped a lot with the early world championship title.

Congratulations to Verstappen which showed a huge consistency and a great maturity for a driver of his age,he fully deserved this year to be Champion much different than last year were a lot of polemics decided it.The race was beautiful today but it was early in the morning so I missed it,could not wake up at 6:45 AM but announcing it in a post race interview is not the best way to announce the second title for Verstappen,this was an error especially considering we were at Honda home race and they should have been much more prepared when everybody was expecting the second title.

[coinlocket$]

Congratulations to Verstappen which showed a huge consistency and a great maturity for a driver of his age,he fully deserved this year to be Champion much different than last year were a lot of polemics decided it.The race was beautiful today but it was early in the morning so I missed it,could not wake up at 6:45 AM but announcing it in a post race interview is not the best way to announce the second title for Verstappen,this was an error especially considering we were at Honda home race and they should have been much more prepared when everybody was expecting the second title.

Much different?

He is running for 2 years with a doped car.
They had spent around 5-10 million over the cap, keep in mind the engineering work in 1 car is around 4-5 million here.

We have rules and they are doing what they want every race.

And yes is doping, mechanical doping.

[swogerino]

Congratulations to Verstappen which showed a huge consistency and a great maturity for a driver of his age,he fully deserved this year to be Champion much different than last year were a lot of polemics decided it.The race was beautiful today but it was early in the morning so I missed it,could not wake up at 6:45 AM but announcing it in a post race interview is not the best way to announce the second title for Verstappen,this was an error especially considering we were at Honda home race and they should have been much more prepared when everybody was expecting the second title.

Much different?

He is running for 2 years with a doped car.
They had spent around 5-10 million over the cap, keep in mind the engineering work in 1 car is around 4-5 million here.

We have rules and they are doing what they want every race.

And yes is doping, mechanical doping.

I meant his behavior which showed maturity this year while the last one he was getting every race as it came.I know you are a Ferrari fan and I am no Redbull fan,I am a McLaren fan but the fact is that Ferrari made considerable errors which translated in points lost is well over 100 and if they did not made those errors the Championship would be still wide open.

I think that if they broke any rule they should be penalized for that,for the engineering work but most probably they found some loophole in the contract and rules of that engineering work otherwise if they are doing what they want what is the point of us following the sport when not everyone is following the rules?

[coinlocket$]

Yes for sure he is a strong driver, probably even the better driver at the current moment but.

There is a big but the previous year he was given in the last track the title, they haven't given the possibility to Hamilton to fight for it, they even changed the rule to provide an advantage to Verstappen.

And in these 2 years they got a substantial advantage for going over the budget cup, imagine now to see RBR with 0.5 seconds slower per lap with a consequentlial smaller pressure on opponents.

[LTU_btc]

FIA were a huge fiasco today. I really wonder what kind of people are in race control now. This was an important race for Verstappen to announce his second title. I don't know how FIA can't get more prepared for a special race like this. They made really unbelievable mistakes. Some of them were like:

- We saw a tractor coming in before the drivers entered pit lane.
- They finished the race one lap early.
- Gasly got unbelievable penalties like 20-sec time penalty and 2 penalty points for speeding under red flag (But as for FIA's huge mistake about the tractor, there is no problem according to them  ).
- They shouldn't have given full points for this race because it wasn't even a full race.
- They weren't even sure of Verstappen's championship for a while. 

I think Leclerc's penalty was fair because he pushed Perez outside while Perez was trying to overtake him. We see 5-sec penalty being given in this kind of situations actually.

Indded, that was FIA fiasco. Truck on track immediately bring memories of Bianchi tragedy. Seemst that they haven't learned anything or forgot it. They don't allow to race them during rain and elay race by few hours because of it, but it's not problem to release truck before safety car on wet track without much visibility.
Though, penalty for Gasly is right IMO, he really had to slow down.
F1 gave explanation why full points were given, but rules should be more clear, because even if they themselves don't fully know it and moment when they didn't knew whether Max is champion or no was hilarious.
And I didn't even noticed that they finished one lap early.

The common sense is to give penalty in the following circumstances:

- is not the 1st cut they do during the race
- the opponent is doing an overtake and you gain an advantage doing the cut.

Both of these requirements were missing.

I don't think I can recall a case of a 5-second penalty for a cut while the opponent is not doing an overtake.

I don't agree. Perez maybe didn't tried to overtake, but he chased Leclerc, what provoced his mistake. My memory don't works so good that now I would bring specific cases, but I think it's regular practice to give penalty in such cases, even if there is no overtake attempt.
Ferrari didn't even went to appeal this penalty.

[alegotardo]

Indded, that was FIA fiasco. Truck on track immediately bring memories of Bianchi tragedy. Seemst that they haven't learned anything or forgot it. They don't allow to race them during rain and elay race by few hours because of it, but it's not problem to release truck before safety car on wet track without much visibility.

Indeed, the onboard cameras of several drivers showed several times that the tractor was very close to the cars and with that extremely low visibility it was impossible not to remember the fatal accident of Jules Bianchi on that same track. It even looked like this was a bad joke made on purpose.

Unfortunately, I have not seen any official pronouncement from the FIA about punishments for those responsible for this event.
There is so much talk about increasing car safety and following strict protocols by the teams, but the FIA itself cannot organize this in a minimally safe way or assume its responsibilities.... regrettable.

[Republikcoin.com]

Alvaro Bautista is increasingly being overtaken by his opponents in the WSBK racing event. In race 2 yesterday at the Algarve Portimao circuit, Portugal, Alvaro Bautista managed to win the race with an extraordinary gap even though he had fought with Jonathan Rea and Toprak. But the power of the Ducati Panigale is so great and so extraordinary that Jonathan Rea and Toprak have to settle for second and third positions.

Thus, now Alvaro Bautista, who has collected 448 points, has again succeeded in widening the points gap in the temporary standings with Jonathan Rea and Toprak. Although there are still three more races that are still very possible for Jonathan Rea and Toprak to catch Alvaro Bautista points, but it becomes an increasingly difficult task for Jonathan Rea and Toprak because of the enormous power of Ducati.

[tygeade]

It would be something unbeleavable if he wouldn't received penalty for cutting corner and gaining advantage.

The common sense is to give penalty in the following circumstances:

- is not the 1st cut they do during the race
- the opponent is doing an overtake and you gain an advantage doing the cut.

Both of these requirements were missing.

I don't think I can recall a case of a 5-second penalty for a cut while the opponent is not doing an overtake.

I think it was due to number 2, Perez was right on his tail, this wasn't like some 3+ second gap type of deal, it was right on his tail, and even with the corner cutting perez came so close to passing him but Charles didn't left any gap, I guarantee you if Perez overtook Charles, then there wouldn't be a penalty, but since he protected himself from getting overtaken by using the corner cutting, that was the main reason he was given a 5 second penalty.

Plus, none of this really mattered, because at the end of the day if Max was 5th on this race and Charles was first with fastest lap, Max would just take it next race, and would be champions, so this didn't change the winner of the title, it was just one race earlier thanks to this, that’s all.

[Pulsar77]

Verstappen already earned this title very much so he finished the job in Suzuka while there were four more races left in the season. Maybe it was a debatable race but we have nothing to do about this I'm afraid. FIA is the same FIA. After replacing Michael Masi I was hopeful about FIA to get a more reliable foundation. However they are still messing things up and drawing all the attention to themselves. It shouldn't be too difficult to manage a race properly.

Verstappen is just unlucky to have his titles in this kind of interesting situations due to FIA. But he isn't responsible for any of this in the end so he should be comfortable anyway.

I hope that Ferrari make a big improvement for next season and make us watch a real competition. They were promising at the beginning of the season but now they are a huge disappointment.

[Davian144]

Using the Kalex swingarm, Miller says Honda has lost its way
Honda's move to use a Kalex swingarm was read by Jack Miller as a signal that the manufacturer was in the wrong direction. No wonder Marc Marquez is less than optimal in three MotoGP races. _{Source: motorsport.com}

What Jack Miller said I think is also true because after Honda used the non-carbon swingarm from the Kalex product, Honda still hasn't been able to show good results in the last three races of the season. And so far there has been no confirmation whether Honda will use the Swingarm from its own product, or continue to use the Kalex Swingarm in the three remaining series in MotoGP.