Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[Toxic2040]

the afternoon Wall report @11:26am

Good morning.

1h

[600watt]

the fair value of shitcoins is zero. null.
why would you advise bitcoiners to invest in scamcoins?

Although I appreciate the value of tribalism in a competitive environment, that is a very stupid comment if I may say so.

Bitcoin would be nowhere without "sh*coins" because they are the buttressing by which it survives. That "buttressing" provides hedging support, diversification, optimal access for new market participants and generally all round builds an industry in which bitcoin can consolidate roots.

Not least, alts are also a far more effective way of accumulating bitcoin than just buying bitcoin because at any given moment there's always one or more of them outperforming it for gain.

So all in all I wouldn't p*ss on the potato patch that you're growing in if I were you. (I also make the same case in reverse to sh*coin maximalists by the way - for the same reasons).

what is stupid by ALL means are shitcoins. you got it the wrong way around. bitcoin would be in much better shape by all metrics if there were no shitcoins. they provide no utility, they are scamming people, they keep good devs busy because every week there is a new shitcoin that needs to be implemented, they get marketed as "the better, faster, newer" bitcoin. the scamcoin sellers spill out nothing but hate towards bitcoin and its community. shitcoins need to be fought against in every legal way.

and yeah, some use speculating shitcoins to gain more btc. if i want to do that i just go into a casino because the level of scamming is lower there.

There are shitcoins that are trying to do what Bitcoin does, which fit your description.

And then there are some genuinely unique solutions. Not going to shill in the WO thread, but you're missing the bigger picture.


You are essentially suggesting that Amazon & co are worthless shit companies because they are just another shitty money grabbing website during the dot com bubble. The internet would be better off without more websites.

Heck, it's not even just that either. You are also simultaneously suggesting that stocks are useless because the USD would be much better off without them.

If you fail to see the potential value of tokens then you clearly don't know much about traditional markets. Or you got burnt so hard that you're demonizing the entire space now. Or you've literally only seen Beeeeconnneeeeeeeeeeeect etc. Not sure what causes your extremist views but they are not inline with reality.


And your last assertion is strictly false as well. Every single casino is modeled in a way that increases the probability of depleting your money the more games you play. Even with the outright scammy shitcoins you can however outplay the market if you are willing to invest the time and have the skill, something that you won't be able to in a casino by design.

i dont understand why folks cheer those shitcoins. shitcoins are fundamentally different to bitcoin. it is not like comparing different stocks of competing companies. bitcoin is a tech breakthrough. no alt is a tech breakthrough. bitcoin is used by millions of people for almost a decade now. shitcoins are not used for anything. what alt are you actually using (other than gambling)? i am not being extremist here, just very conservative.

bitcoin solves the byzantine generals problem. what problem in computer science is any alt solving? bitcoin has no owner, leader  -  it is decentralised. shitcoins are not decentralized. shitcoins are created by individuals or companies that want to make profit. how to make profit when there is neither a use case nor users? well, the only way to profit is to scam people and try to sell you their u s e l e s s  token. and that is what they do: they run around and tell everyone about their new coin that you should buy.

and my last assertion is not false at all. when i go to a casino i at least know to what degree i get scammed. when buying shitcoins it is not false to assume that the scam level is way higher. in a casino i pay fees and i get entertained and maybe lose or win. when buying useless altcoins the scam level is 100% just to begin with.

bitcoin is a protocol. a standard. there is no need for several thousand protocols. how many "internets" do we have?

[toknormal]

By the logic of some of the idiotic maximalist comments in this thread, once gold nuggets were dug out of the ground there was no further need for diversification - not minted coins, not account based trading, not paper notes and not lightweight metals. Popular music need not have bothered itself further after the Beatles. The sovereign bond didn't need to be hedged by equities, commodities nor currencies, Fine Art investments were all "scams" after Da Vinci.

Don't you nuttheads get markets or what ? The whole point of them is that they're not tyrannies. There is diversity to address everything from taste to hedging requirements to technical deficiencies and vertical sectors.

Without diversification in the crypto-asset market bitcoin would still be in 3 digits.

[VB1001]

https://twitter.com/woonomic/status/1128356259219038208

Grayscale's investor profile is 73% institutional.
So perhaps it's a microcosm of what institutional money will do as it comes in on this bull cycle.

[600watt]

No come on, tell us which shitcoin has done anything.
grin?
(tokens will be done on bitcoin if really desired)

Are you serious ?

The only one which HASN'T done anything is bitcoin. Why t.f. do you think it has a community on a near permanent war footing with itself arguing about technical priorities and forking the chain to Kingdom Come.

this is what you have learned about bitcoin achieving legendary status writing +6000 posts in a bitcoin forum?  

you are really saying that those thousands of shitcoins have achieved anything but bitcoin hasn´t?  

the war you are seeing is the hate of the altcoiners with all their lies trying to scam peopleout of their precious bitcoin.

account sold or hacked? lol.

[jbreher]

One Question

when 5-digits

When 12344? (or was it 12688 or smth?)

12288$ (@that time 10K €....)


Yeah time to update those lists, pffffffff where are they again, deep surge, or does anyone got them close

And why never put in something yourself?

Well, I've gotta say that you're a good sport for running these games. But entering means devoting thought to an arbitrary price level that I would not otherwise care about. Without meaning any offense, given the +ev, I have better things to do with my time.

Or do I need to make a Bcash game (F*** only one player, you would always win)

Only player? Naaah. Those that jump through hoops for a small chance at free money probably don't care about the underlying details.

[jbreher]

I expect a denial of service of bitcointalk.org soon. 

When the site bogs down, it is merely Eternal September. A mere sign that retail FOMO has started.

[600watt]

By the logic of some of the idiotic maximalist comments in this thread, once gold nuggets were dug out of the ground there was no further need for diversification - not minted coins, not account based trading, not paper notes and not lightweight metals. Popular music need not have bothered itself further after the Beatles. The sovereign bond didn't need to be hedged by equities, commodities nor currencies, Fine Art investments were all "scams" after Da Vinci.

Don't you nuttheads get markets or what ? The whole point of them is that they're not tyrannies. There is diversity to address everything from taste to hedging requirements to technical deficiencies and vertical sectors.

Without diversification in the crypto-asset market bitcoin would still be in 3 digits.

jeez. imagine there were no airplanes invented yet. satoshi invents a full functioning modern airplane. it works. provably. and now there are 2 or 3000 others that build "airplanes" that are much cheaper (no wings), much lighter (no engines) or are made out of bamboo. you are saying that people should use those fake airplanes. that is not diversification. just pure scamming of people.    alts offer no use case. they don´t fly. the idiotic comments are yours. amazing.

[PaivanTreidi]

By the logic of some of the idiotic maximalist comments in this thread, once gold nuggets were dug out of the ground there was no further need for diversification - not minted coins, not account based trading, not paper notes and not lightweight metals. Popular music need not have bothered itself further after the Beatles. The sovereign bond didn't need to be hedged by equities, commodities nor currencies, Fine Art investments were all "scams" after Da Vinci.

Don't you nuttheads get markets or what ? The whole point of them is that they're not tyrannies. There is diversity to address everything from taste to hedging requirements to technical deficiencies and vertical sectors.

Without diversification in the crypto-asset market bitcoin would still be in 3 digits.

jeez. imagine there were no airplanes invented yet. satoshi invents a full functioning modern airplane. it works. provably. and now there are 2 or 3000 others that build "airplanes" that are much cheaper (no wings), much lighter (no engines) or are made out of bamboo. you are saying that people should use those fake airplanes. that is not diversification. just pure scamming of people.    alts offer no use case. they don´t fly. the idiotic comments are yours. amazing.

I think he is saying that helicopters can also fly and are not necessarily always 100% sh1t + they have also brought new things to the table like flying just 1 - 3 people a short distance to a city 200miles away that has no airport with a runway...

[serveria.com]

By the logic of some of the idiotic maximalist comments in this thread, once gold nuggets were dug out of the ground there was no further need for diversification - not minted coins, not account based trading, not paper notes and not lightweight metals. Popular music need not have bothered itself further after the Beatles. The sovereign bond didn't need to be hedged by equities, commodities nor currencies, Fine Art investments were all "scams" after Da Vinci.

Don't you nuttheads get markets or what ? The whole point of them is that they're not tyrannies. There is diversity to address everything from taste to hedging requirements to technical deficiencies and vertical sectors.

Without diversification in the crypto-asset market bitcoin would still be in 3 digits.

Pfff another big load of BS... please name any single shitcoin which has done any good to the crypto universe? Anything real, usable (I'm not talking about catchy name or funny icon on the exchange)  

[El duderino_]

Session Day love it

[600watt]

I think he is saying that helicopters can also fly and are not necessarily always 100% sh1t + they have also brought new things to the table like flying just 1 - 3 people a short distance to a city 200miles away that has no airport with a runway...

the problem is that no other coin does fly at all. please give examples for your helicopter. are are none.

[jbreher]

not quite there yet.. but will be nice to start seeing this on a daily basis again...

Top 20 days for Bitcoin

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=138109.1060

First Vegeta is almost top 100.

CreepyOstritchSoon.png

[toknormal]

the problem is that no other coin does fly at all. please give examples for your helicopter. are are none.

What "use case" do you think bitcoin solves out of interest ? (Apart from making coin-grabbing early adopters rich)

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

There are shitcoins that are trying to do what Bitcoin does, which fit your description.

And then there are some genuinely unique solutions. Not going to shill in the WO thread, but you're missing the bigger picture.


You are essentially suggesting that Amazon & co are worthless shit companies because they are just another shitty money grabbing website during the dot com bubble. The internet would be better off without more websites.

Heck, it's not even just that either. You are also simultaneously suggesting that stocks are useless because the USD would be much better off without them.

If you fail to see the potential value of tokens then you clearly don't know much about traditional markets. Or you got burnt so hard that you're demonizing the entire space now. Or you've literally only seen Beeeeconnneeeeeeeeeeeect etc. Not sure what causes your extremist views but they are not inline with reality.


And your last assertion is strictly false as well. Every single casino is modeled in a way that increases the probability of depleting your money the more games you play. Even with the outright scammy shitcoins you can however outplay the market if you are willing to invest the time and have the skill, something that you won't be able to in a casino by design.

i dont understand why folks cheer those shitcoins. shitcoins are fundamentally different to bitcoin. it is not like comparing different stocks of competing companies. bitcoin is a tech breakthrough. no alt is a tech breakthrough. bitcoin is used by millions of people for almost a decade now. shitcoins are not used for anything. what alt are you actually using (other than gambling)? i am not being extremist here, just very conservative.

bitcoin solves the byzantine generals problem. what problem in computer science is any alt solving? bitcoin has no owner, leader  -  it is decentralised. shitcoins are not decentralized. shitcoins are created by individuals or companies that want to make profit. how to make profit when there is neither a use case nor users? well, the only way to profit is to scam people and try to sell you their u s e l e s s  token. and that is what they do: they run around and tell everyone about their new coin that you should buy.

and my last assertion is not false at all. when i go to a casino i at least know to what degree i get scammed. when buying shitcoins it is not false to assume that the scam level is way higher. in a casino i pay fees and i get entertained and maybe lose or win. when buying useless altcoins the scam level is 100% just to begin with.

bitcoin is a protocol. a standard. there is no need for several thousand protocols. how many "internets" do we have?

Again, you seem to be under the impression that out of the thousands of shitcoins every single one is trying to copy Bitcoin and you couldn't be further from the truth.
I have been and will keep saying that most shitcoins (that are around today) will go to zero because they're run by con artists, shitheads, retards, good people with good ideas but lack of experience to see them through and so on.

But there certainly are unique solutions that can and will solve equity in a better way than the stock market does. Which again, you denominate in USD (BTC) while you own stock (shitcoin).
They're also infinitely superior to traditional means of fundraising (thus allowing more people to start businesses as the market matures) and they're better at aligning the interests of the investor with those of the entrepreneur by unlocking "developer tokens" based on success/time. If you locked up Bitcoin they would get free money, if they only have their own shitcoin unlocked then they have to make sure it will work to be profitable.

And who decided that altcoins have to "solve a computer science problem"? You couldn't be any more arbitrary with that point. Just because the sun provides us with life doesn't mean we don't need lamps "because they don't create life", they still glow you know? And in places where the sun doesn't shine.

Yes it is 100% false. In a casino the more games you play the higher the probability becomes that you lose, period. You can absolutely not compare a market where you can freely choose how you interact with it to a casino. The expected value of a casino is STRICTLY NEGATIVE for the player. The expected value for a trader depends on the trader. And again, false assumption that all alts are the same. Do you think all people are the same too?

[_javier_]

...meanwhile we dump.. err.. correct..nah.. retrace.. whatever.. we are at yesterday´s price. HODLer not affected

[BitcoinNewsMagazine]

By the logic of some of the idiotic maximalist comments in this thread, once gold nuggets were dug out of the ground there was no further need for diversification - not minted coins, not account based trading, not paper notes and not lightweight metals. Popular music need not have bothered itself further after the Beatles. The sovereign bond didn't need to be hedged by equities, commodities nor currencies, Fine Art investments were all "scams" after Da Vinci.

Don't you nuttheads get markets or what ? The whole point of them is that they're not tyrannies. There is diversity to address everything from taste to hedging requirements to technical deficiencies and vertical sectors.

Without diversification in the crypto-asset market bitcoin would still be in 3 digits.

Pfff another big load of BS... please name any single shitcoin which has done any good to the crypto universe? Anything real, usable (I'm not talking about catchy name or funny icon on the exchange)  

Monero comes to mind with its opaque blockchain.

[serveria.com]

the problem is that no other coin does fly at all. please give examples for your helicopter. are are none.

What "use case" do you think bitcoin solves out of interest ? (Apart from making coin-grabbing early adopters rich)

Ok, all clear now... you hate Bitcoin because you missed it..  how typical...

[MrFreeRoMan]

...meanwhile we dump.. err.. correct..nah.. retrace.. whatever.. we are at yesterday´s price. HODLer not affected

You look at the growth of HODLer! A lot of believers in it. Hodler greatly affect the price of Bitcoin!

Number of Unspent Transaction Outputs
The number of unspent Bitcoin transactions outputs, also known as the UTXO set size.

Source: blockchain.com

[Last of the V8s]

Equity has been being done perfectly well in Bitcoin since 2011.